748 réponses à ce sujet

[Volus Warlord]

Sorry, but there is only one path. OBEY!

[Calibration Master]

Cyberstrike nTo wrote...

Calibration Master wrote...

Cyberstrike nTo wrote...

Luc0s wrote...

gogman25 wrote...

So, you're having ME2 nostalgia and want to work with the xenophobes again because you're convinced they're the good guys? Maybe there is too much emphasis on them rather than other evil guys, but they're still evil.

*sight*

Here we go again, with the "Cerberus = evil lolololol" bullcrap. ;


Cerberus is not evil. "Evil" is only a matter of perspective. What is evil in the eyes of person X might not be evil in the eyes of person Y.

I could say the same thing about any number of versions of well known villains in pop culture ranging from the Joker, Lex Luther, Cobra Commander, Megatron, Norman Osborne, Dr. Doom, and Magento that still doesn't make them heroes.  

The Joker, Luther, Cobra, Megatron, etc. etc. etc. are all comic-book villians. They are all card-carrying villians.

Is TIM a card-carrying villian? Do you want him to be a card-carrying villian?


Mass Effect is not a comic-book (well there are Mass Effect graphic-novels but that's besides the point). Mass Effect is not black-and-white. It goes deeper than your typical card-carrying villian versus your typical lawful-good hero.

A lot of those evil card carring comic book supervillains are more complex than TIM is.
 
Like Megatron who in the IDW comic book universe has been shown that before he came the leader of the Decepticons he was a miner who was also a political activist who preached non-violence and thought Cybertron's caste system was unjust.He got arrested because a friend of his (who later became an Autobot) got in a bar fight and injured some cops and he was beaten up while in custody.

Orion Pax (who later became Optimus Prime) freed Megatron and arrested the cop that beat him and even agreed with him and even quoted Megatron's speech when he went before the corrupt Cybertronian Senate.

But I lose all support and sympanthy for Meagtron once he killed a senator, became an underground gladiator which allowed him to build his army the Decepticons and then went to kill trillions of aliens so he could win a war that most of them never knew about and millions of humans so he have a new homeworld. 

Sounds like Megatron and Jack Harper (the Illusive Man) aren't so different after all... They actually sound pretty darn similar, if your description of Megatron indeed is correct. 

[Calibration Master]

Exia001 wrote...

Calibration Master wrote...

Exia001 wrote...

No, Shep is, Cerberus are trying to control them, theres a difference

No, there is no difference in the goal itself. Both Shepard and TIM want to stop the reapers. But TIM wants to stop the reapers by controlling them.

It isn't really 'stopping' its replace one tyranny with another

Ah... this argument again... *sigh*

TIM is trying to stop the reapers. There is no question there. What TIM wants after he stopped the reapers is an entire different story, but that story doesn't matter right now.

Listen, you can think of Cerberus what you want, but that opinion doesn't matter right now. The only thing that matters is stopping the reapers and making sure we organics survive. How we're going to do that doesn't matter. Who we work with while doing that doesn't matter. What the potential aftermath might be, doesn't matter. Even a totally screwed-up aftermath is still better than no aftermath at all. When the reapers win, there will be no aftermath at all.

Modifié par Calibration Master, 22 janvier 2012 - 08:56 .

[King Minos]

Difference between Jack and Megatron. Jack's actions are for Humanity to stand above other species, not just for himself.

Got to give the guy credit. He is amazing.

[Calibration Master]

King Minos wrote...

Difference between Jack and Megatron. Jack's actions are for Humanity to stand above other species, not just for himself.

Got to give the guy credit. He is amazing.

Yeah the Illusive Man is pretty awesome.

[Lotion Soronarr]

Exia001 wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...
Oh? How is it "not so" in the game?
Reapers are coming. that's a end of the world scenario.
Cerberus are trying to stop them whatever the cost.

No, Shep is, Cerberus are trying to control them, theres a difference

Controling them is a form of stopping them for destroying everyone.
And Shep doesn't even have the first idea what to do.

[AlexXIV]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Exia001 wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...
Oh? How is it "not so" in the game?
Reapers are coming. that's a end of the world scenario.
Cerberus are trying to stop them whatever the cost.

No, Shep is, Cerberus are trying to control them, theres a difference

Controling them is a form of stopping them for destroying everyone.
And Shep doesn't even have the first idea what to do.

I am really curious how this 'controlling them' plan is supposed to work. Because for me it sounds like a stupid idea. They are an ancient race of machines and TIM is just going to turn the tables. 'Yo Reapers, you tried do indoctrinate us, now we do it to you'. That's lame on so many levels. Yeah Shep's way is probably not much better, I just wish there story would end in a more original way.

Modifié par AlexXIV, 22 janvier 2012 - 09:13 .

[Pygmalin]

 Speculation Speculation. I don't think we will know the outcome of our actions until we play the third installment. 

However, I didn't like Cerberus in One or Two. But I personally played the Paragon route. I didn't give the base to Cerberus. I kinda always thought that if I did give into Cerberus' demands prolly come back to bite me in the end.

I am more interested in seeing how Saving/killing the queen plays out or Rewritting the geth plays out. Not all the Paragon choices will have a happy ending just wondering which one will bite me. :happy:

[Pygmalin]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Exia001 wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...
Oh? How is it "not so" in the game?
Reapers are coming. that's a end of the world scenario.
Cerberus are trying to stop them whatever the cost.

No, Shep is, Cerberus are trying to control them, theres a difference

Controling them is a form of stopping them for destroying everyone.
And Shep doesn't even have the first idea what to do.

Not nessasarily, remember that they once tried to control Rachni too, Cerberus' Need to be superior would still use them to wipe out the other races. One domination for another. 

[Poison_Berrie]

Looking at some of the videos that have come out recently, it seems like Cerberus and TIM have their own plan and it no longer involved Shepard.

Personally I think that as soon as the Illusive Man no longer needs Shepard he sees him more as a threat. Both Paragon and Renegade Shepards are prone to clash with TIM on what he tells them and how he treats them/their crew.

[Dragoonlordz]

I don't really mind if he is good or he is bad, to me if I get the opportunity I will be taking him down/out simply because to me he is a risk whether from what he has done in Mass Effect 2 putting me at risk without giving me all the information he knows to what he may or could do in the future. If the option arises, TiM is going to be no more.



Bringing me back doesn't redeem him enough to save him from his fate if allowed to end him in ME3. Maybe I'll just end him if get choice simply because played god or maybe I just don't like colour of his eyes. Maybe my Shepard isn't a nice guy/lady and that sealed his fate if we get that choice..

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 22 janvier 2012 - 10:10 .

[Lotion Soronarr]

Pygmalin wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Exia001 wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...
Oh? How is it "not so" in the game?
Reapers are coming. that's a end of the world scenario.
Cerberus are trying to stop them whatever the cost.

No, Shep is, Cerberus are trying to control them, theres a difference

Controling them is a form of stopping them for destroying everyone.
And Shep doesn't even have the first idea what to do.

Not nessasarily, remember that they once tried to control Rachni too, Cerberus' Need to be superior would still use them to wipe out the other races. One domination for another.

Oh? Cerberus will enslave everyone theory?
Proof of that statement pls?

[Labrev]

King Minos wrote...

Difference between Jack and Megatron. Jack's actions are for Humanity to stand above other species, not just for himself.

Got to give the guy credit. He is amazing.

You realize that Jack and humanity are in the same boat, by virtue of Jack being human, right?

[KotorEffect3]

If you read the books you get an idea of what cerberus is truly about.

[marstor05]

yeah TIM is pretty awesome, but we all sort of know that there will come a moment when he becomes an obstacle that has to be removed. I suppose its better to do something than nothing, but then again does an evil man consider himself evil? He tries to preserve humanity the only way his narrow minded view will allow - and sod everyone else.

[King Minos]

Hah Yes Reapers wrote...

King Minos wrote...

Difference between Jack and Megatron. Jack's actions are for Humanity to stand above other species, not just for himself.

Got to give the guy credit. He is amazing.

You realize that Jack and humanity are in the same boat, by virtue of Jack being human, right?

I am fully aware.

[Calibration Master]

marstor05 wrote...

yeah TIM is pretty awesome, but we all sort of know that there will come a moment when he becomes an obstacle that has to be removed. I suppose its better to do something than nothing, but then again does an evil man consider himself evil? He tries to preserve humanity the only way his narrow minded view will allow - and sod everyone else.

Narrow minded? Right... you'll see. :innocent:

[Calibration Master]

AlexXIV wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Exia001 wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...
Oh? How is it "not so" in the game?
Reapers are coming. that's a end of the world scenario.
Cerberus are trying to stop them whatever the cost.

No, Shep is, Cerberus are trying to control them, theres a difference

Controling them is a form of stopping them for destroying everyone.
And Shep doesn't even have the first idea what to do.

I am really curious how this 'controlling them' plan is supposed to work. Because for me it sounds like a stupid idea. They are an ancient race of machines and TIM is just going to turn the tables. 'Yo Reapers, you tried do indoctrinate us, now we do it to you'. That's lame on so many levels. Yeah Shep's way is probably not much better, I just wish there story would end in a more original way.

That's where the McGuffin that will be discovered in ME3 comes in.

When it's 9th of March, you'll see. :innocent:

[Eshaye]

Wow just wow, Bioware is writing the story the way they envisioned it, they've given us clues as to what Cerberus is doing but we won't have a 100 percent closure until ME3. And I suspect the pro Cerberus among you will nerd rage to no end...

It's going to be quite the entertainment. *Grabs a truck load of popcorn*

Modifié par Eshaye, 22 janvier 2012 - 11:07 .

[mjh417]

These thread always seem to devolve into nonsense. First off Bioware already gave us a whole game where we worked for Cerberus, ME2. In that game you couldn't choose to not work for them, anymore than people seem to presume you will have to fight them every step of the way, regardless of the decisions you made in either previous game. Now that being said, I think its crazy to think Bioware is choosing to just ignore all the hardcore Renegade players who want to play ultra proCerberus. Yes, everyone will have to fight Cerberus because that what the game's story demands, just like all the super sensitive boy/girl scout Paragon extremists had to work for Cerberus in ME2, but Bioware has promised that because this is the final game, things can and will really branch in this game, and I would think the game has plenty to cater to the pro Cerberus players.

[Merchant2006]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Seboist wrote...

Calibration Master wrote...

Merchant2006 wrote...

Giving TIM the Collector Base is the equivalent of giving Hitler the blueprints to nuclear weapons before the Americans/Russians develop it.

Right, because TIM isn't a pro-human space nartzi, he's 'morally grey'. Bahahaha.

Ahhhh, Godwin's law. I knew this was going to happen sooner or later in this thread.

To be fair, the ME2 docs refer to Cerberus as "space nazis" and ME3 has a line where they make an unsubtle comparison between TIM and everyone's favorite Fuhrer.

Even BioWare succumbed to GoodwinsLaw?

I was hoping that this thread would just fall into pieces of a silly bickering argument and be locked, but as you can see, how can you make a silly bickering argument thread a silly bickering argument thread when it already is a silly bickering argument thread that hasn't been locked yet.

Oh well. May as well watch how this piece of crap thread unfolds! 

Wait... you can unfold pieces of crap? W/e.



As you were, gentlemen. *sits back and observes*

[Eshaye]

mjh417 wrote...
 but Bioware has promised that because this is the final game, things can and will really branch in this game, and I would think the game has plenty to cater to the pro Cerberus players.

Hmmm mayyyyyybe... I would not hold my breath for this concerning Cerberus personally because I see a clear line where the story is heading however, if you are right and they do this then they've got some explaining to do and it COULD make for a very good plot point. 

Whatever happens TIM is an awesome character and I hope they do his story justice. 

[Pygmalin]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Pygmalin wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Exia001 wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...
Oh? How is it "not so" in the game?
Reapers are coming. that's a end of the world scenario.
Cerberus are trying to stop them whatever the cost.

No, Shep is, Cerberus are trying to control them, theres a difference

Controling them is a form of stopping them for destroying everyone.
And Shep doesn't even have the first idea what to do.

Not nessasarily, remember that they once tried to control Rachni too, Cerberus' Need to be superior would still use them to wipe out the other races. One domination for another.

Oh? Cerberus will enslave everyone theory?
Proof of that statement pls?

Mass Effect 1 All side missions involving Cerberus.  Even though Mirianda said they abandoned the projects damage was done. She said they were trying to make "shock troopers"  They tried to make the Thorian Creepers "obidenant" (sp) and enslave them according to the doctor you had the choice to rescue. Oh and so much more proof to be had. 

They killed Koukou(sp) because he involved himself in the Thresher Maw expierments. They do any thing "by any means" to achieve superiority. They say its for the Human race, the bottom line is they would wipe out anyone who got in their way Shepard included.  The Reaper design would give them that Ultimate power. 

[AdmiralCheez]

I'd whine more about TIM going full-on Sith Lord if Cerberus actually did more good deeds without any ulterior motives.

Better schools, cleaner hospitals, and hardier crops help advance humanity, too!