12 réponses à ce sujet

[NekoPanOnline]

unless you just want certain characters.

http://www.bigbadtoy...280&mode=retail

read the description each fig has their own dlc and they remade the first series to have it too :/ wtf

[Stanley Woo]

Lord Aesir wrote...
I'm sorry but the argument that all DLC is stuff ripped from the base game is a bit dated.  These items were never in the game, they were concieved of for promotional purposes.  Why would you worry yourself for a few extra guns anyway?

Generally, it's because people want everything, but don't want to have to work at it or pay for it. I get it, sure, but everyone has to make their own decision to buy or not buy any product, no matter what it is. The fact that DLC, microtransactions, and subscription based content is now forcing people to either make more of those decisions or make them more often.

Trust me. If consumers didn't demonstrate a general enthusiasm for buying content in this fashion, it wouldn't be used so often. But companies do it because it works. And it works because companies offer it. You can feel free to object to the practice by simply choosing not to buy in that way, and if enough people do that, then maybe it would become unpopular and the practice will eventually stop. That's the power you have as a consumer.

[Stanley Woo]

Gatt9 wrote...

1.  The items are in the game.  Study computers for awhile.  They finish these things in parallel with the game,  test it in parallel,  and 5 years ago,  it would've been in the game.  Today they leave it out to charge you more money to get the whole game.

11 years in the industry and shipped 10 major releases and/or expansion packs, and several DLC packages. in fact, Neverwinter Nights was experimenting with DLC-like content with their Live Team and Premium Modules. People seemed to like it quite a lot! And that was 2005 or 2006 (6 or 7 years ago), so I will have to disagree that the same content that would have been in the game 5 years ago is the same content being pushed out in DLC now. The "whole game / whole experience" argument falls flat when you consider that a) there's no such thing, the way you describe it, and people seem to not have the same objection to expansion packs or sequels.

The game is whole upon release. DLC is "extra" content over and above the whole, complete game. Whether it's paid DLC or free DLC or day 1 DLC, it is content that you could complete the entire game without, if you chose to do so. DLC is always optional.

2.  No,  generally it's because you're leaving whole parts out of the game in order to charge consumers more money to get the same thing they previously received.  It's not being "Cheap",  as you insinuate.  Trying to claim I'm cheap because I don't think I should have to pay extra to get the whole game that's available on the day of release is pretty bad form.

I suggested that people "don't want to pay the money," not that they were cheap. there was no insinuation. I meant what I said and I said what I meant. This is an adjunct to your first point, so I have nothing more to say about that.

3.  You can't seriously be trying to claim that there's a huge market clamoring for statues with DLC codes attached to them are you?

Who knows? I haven't seen this kind of thing before, specifically, but people loooooooooove DLC and they looooooooove free things, and they seem to looooooooove Mass Effect. So at least someone in some marketing division believes that there's a potential market out there. Study marketing and economics for awhile.

Know what'll make your studio obsolete faster than leaving out chunks of the game and demanding the consumers pay extra for it?

Insulting them for not buying it.

Not a good way to try and sell your products,  leaving parts of your product out,  demanding extra money for it,  and insulting customers for complaining about it.

Informing you that you still retain the right to choose whether to purchase a game or not isn't insulting anyone, though some folks will take anything I say to be insulting.

Gatt9, I have seen your pessimism, negativity, and general sourpussedness in many threads discussing many different subjects. You've been arguing and raising a fuss for days. So you either believe me or you don't. If you believe me, great, we can disagree like gentlemen. If you don't believe me, then we can't really have any kind of discussion, now, can we? You'd be implying I'm lying and I'd be talking to a stone wall.

But that's ok,  I've found a way for both of us to be happy.  Mass Effect 3 will be the last Bioware product I purchase.  I'll give my money to companies that want to sell me whole games,  and companies that don't insult me.

But if you're buying Mass Effect 3, you're implying very strongly that you will, albeit reluctantly, still give money to companies that will sell you partial games and that insult you... aren't you?

[Stanley Woo]

CannonLars wrote...

 Mr. Woo.
Does this mean you are taking some of the legitimate concerns into account and passing them on to others who might improve the situation, or will they remain here on the boards and statistics, without consideration of customer's expressions, will be the factor used to decide that the business model is good? 

As much as we listen to our fans' concerns, questions, and suggestions, we will not necessarily agree with all of them all the time. We have so many fans, each with different likes and dislikes, tolerances, preferences, biases and experiences, it would be impossible to cater to even a small percentage of them without running into contradictory desires and suggestions.

Remember, if you are making a suggestion, you are accepting that our response could be "no." If you are unwilling or unable to accept a "no" answer, or accept that we may disagree with you, then you are no longer making a suggestion; you are making a demand. And we deal with community "demands" differently than we deal with concerns, suggestions, and constructive criticisms.

I think it is clear that in general, we like DLC. It has also been expressed that the biggest concern is that many of us will never get access to this content or even an option to. The exclusive deals with no information as to whether we will ever have access to other exclusive content is what is bugging many of us.

I see nothing at all wrong with consumers exercising their right to choose and risking disappointment. People have every right to state a preference and ask for consideration, but they do not have the right to never be disappointed.

As someone who loves Mass Effect and has since long before the first game even released, I am not happy with the system of DLC releases, despite appreciating the content itself. I want content, but I don't appreciate being shown lots of exclusives that many of us can not reasonably obtain (like hoping to get all the DLC from the figures). You don't sound like you are considering the fact that we, as fans who do want content, do not have any options of getting the content besides these many exclusive routes. It would be no problem if we knew that in the coming months it would be made available for purchase (as Rockstar Games does, who, frankly gets way less complaints from what I have seen).

It always comes down to the value you place on the DLC content. How much is it worth to you, and are you willing to purchase what is being offered? If you feel the DLC is so important that you must have it, then you may choose to buy the figure you may not necessarily want in order to get that DLC. On the other hand, if you don't feel that DLC is worth the price of the figures and all the trouble you go through to get them, then you may choose to not buy the figures. At this point, such DLC is, as far as I know, exclusive to the figures. Whether the DLC will be made available for sale after the fact, I can not say. But that is the choice before you at this time.

Trying to persuade us with "But I really waaaaaaaant it!" type arguments is not very productive, since the steps to get the DLC have been clearly laid out and the offer is on the table. Your choice is, as always, perfectly clear and entirely up to the individual and the value they place on the DLC.

Thank you for the message, though, and I am glad that you love the Mass Effect franchise that much! I hope you will love Mass Effect 3 as much or even more than our previous games. It's looking incredible!

[Stanley Woo]

MadLaughter wrote...

The 'you can complete the whole game without it if you choose' argument doesn't work either. We could complete ME3 if you only gave us 3 characters with one gun each and no powers, in theory. Someone could complete a fighting game even if it only shipped with one character. You can complete Resident Evil games with pretty much just the knife. That doesn't mean people should just suck it up, Stanley.'

Actually, that's exactly what it means. Assuming a game was made in which there were only three character choices and one gun and no powers, your choice as a consumer would remain exactly the same: to buy it or not buy it. No "sucking it up" required, just the willingness to say no and go without a game that you potentially want and would purchase if your criteria for buying were met.

If a Resident Evil game only provided a knife, then we would soon see whether people thought that was a good design choice or not. If people still bought the game in droves because they loved the Resident Evil franchise, and if it was a good game anyway, then yeah, maybe it was a good design choice. If people bought it and hated it because they really want the same choice in weapons as in previous Resident Evil games, then maybe the developer would think twice about doing the same thing in future products. But none of that removes your right to choose to buy it or not. If you don't wish to buy it, then you have actively chosen to not suck it up. If you choose to buy it, you are, in effect, "sucking it up." But again, you make the choice after the game is complete and is made available for sale, not before development is over and we consult with each gamer to see if they like it.

You can call ANYTHING 'Extra'. You could take thane, grunt, jack, samara and tali out of ME2 and call them extra. You could take all of the good endings out of the game and call them extra. You could take character customization out and call it extra.

Absolutely, we could do pretty much anything we wanted. We could have a blank screen and call graphics "extra." But we don't. We have a very specific product for sale and we think it's pretty awesome. Now, of course, whether you accept that or not is your own business. And whether you choose to purchase it or not is your business. We would like you to, but ultimately, and I can't stress this enough, the choice is yours/

And people DO have issues with DLC and Expansions. Has a game ever sold an equal number of expansions as it's base game? Never. "We sold 5 million copies of our game, and five million copies of Expansion pack A." Never has happened.

No, neither DLC nor expansions sell as well as the base game, but that has nothing to do with what we're talking about here.

[Stanley Woo]

JG The Gamer wrote...

The power simply comes from consumer choice above all else. At my store, I see the power of choice everyday. Do not like? Do not buy. Do like? Do buy. Simple as that.

If you feel so strongly about DLC attached to toys and that it's a good/bad thing, the best thing you can do as your right as a consumer is to choose whether or not you wish to buy the toy and DLC. If you do, it sends a message to the company that it's a good idea. Otherwise, the company gets the message that it's not a good idea. Whining about it gets you nowhere and makes everyone miserable.

To paraphrase a quote: "I like this Gamer. He understands." It really is that simple, and I wish people would stop trying to complicate the issue with extreme hypothetical cases and what-ifs.

[Stanley Woo]

CubbieBlue66 wrote...

Mr. Woo, do you happen to know whether the marketing team has considered a "season pass" type of offer, similar to those seen in the Gears of War and Call of Duty series?

Given the quality of the Mass Effect franchise to this point, I'd gladly pay (essentially pre-pay) $30 or so for an all-inclusive downloadable content pack.

I actually rather like that kind of an idea. Feel free to discuss that and offer it as a suggestion in these discussion threads.

[Stanley Woo]

shakey123 wrote...

I wish people had courage to go through with their convictions and protest against crap like this. Im sick to death of buying £50 games and finding out that little bits of meat have been cut off my product and thrown around.

It is not bits of meat that have been cut off from your product. It is little amuse-bouches that are offered to complement your meal.

This is unethical, fairplay producing significant content for after the game is released, but deliberately holding back content before the game is released is a joke.

No one is "holding back" content. it is being offered openly as "extras" for those players who want them.

This whole DLC debarcle is retarded. Once developers loved their games and poured everything into them (BG2?), now they slowly dissect them and laugh at us as we pick up the pieces. I mean having to buy Dr pepper was a joke, now we have to buy figurines? [inappropriate content removed]

We don't laugh at you. We love you. You can choose to buy whichever products you want. it is always your choice as to which of our offers you take and which you refuse, and we would never take that choice away from you.

[Stanley Woo]

Iamnotahater wrote...

The not holding back content part just isn't true.

In alot cases with DLC content was on the disk and some games in a disgusting practice (imo) have taken to advertising "cut content" ingame.

Test Drive comes to mind. Need for speed is another. As does NWN where you couldn't access your companions inventory and when you tried you were given an advertisement to download DLC.

Dragon age: Orgins was another.

Can't comment on Test Drive or Need for Speed, but I can say that Dragon Age Origins was a special case, if we're talking about Shale. Shale was originally cut because we didn't have time to finish the character and model and everything to fit it into the game. That's cut for good, kaput, no Shale at all in DAO. This is a far cry from it being "held back", It was only when the game was delayed that we decided that the content could be finished in time to put into the game again.

Because it was then intended for DLC, it did not need to be done in time to be put onto the disc, giving us even more time in which to finish the content. And even then, it was offered as free, day 1 DLC on new copies of the game. We cannot count on such happenstance for every DLC package or anything that we cut from the game. Stuff that is actually cut from the game is intended to be cut for good.

As for NWN, i don't remember anything that behaved as you described it. Companion inventory was added, if I recall correctly, in the Hordes of the Underdark expansion, as we only had the NWN Live Team, which I suppose could technically be called a DLC team. An honest to goodness "advertisement to download DLC" in NWN doesn't sound right at all, since we were still experimenting with periodic bonus content at the time. The only "advertisement to download DLC" that I recall is for DAO, where we had an NPc advertising DLC within the party camp. And if I recall, many people in the community didn't like that very much.

[Stanley Woo]

[my own snark removed]

Modifié par Stanley Woo, 25 janvier 2012 - 01:48 .

[Stanley Woo]

Terror_K wrote...

And now there's also this.

Not only do you now have to get the Art Book if you want all the DLC, but you have to get it from a specific place to get it. I'm already getting the book from a local retailer, and have had it on pre-order for months now, but if I want the DLC I have to get it from overseas from a specific place.

This is seriously getting beyond a joke, BioWare.<_<

That's pretty cool. I've given up on being able to get all the DLC for the games I like, but for those interested in such things, I don't think it's a terrible idea.

And ordering products from overseas to get something you really want is nothing new. Special edition DVDs or CDs that have different content in different countries, tour shirts, cars, and many other products that are sold only in certain regions can be difficult and expensive to purchase if you are not in that area.

I'm going to say it again, folks (sorry): if you feel that DLC content is worth the time, effort and money to get, then get it. If you don't, then don't. All of this DLC is geared towards those people interested in Mass Effect-related merchandise like toys and art books; and, to a lesser degree, those interested in being completionist with DLC. None of it should be crucial to the playing or completion of Mass Effect 3 or Shepard's story; it is all extra. Bonus. Supplementary. Superfluous.

Whether you agree or disagree with DLC as a whole is fine. We all learn to sacrifice and do without some of the things we might want. But if you're going to bash these things just because you want the DLC and don't want to have to buy the associated products to get them, then you have two viable options: a) hope that such DLC will be available in a different format later on, or try to get them from someone who wants the product but not the DLC.

[Stanley Woo]

MadLaughter wrote...

Stop being goddamn snarky. You are a professional, and the 'well he started it!" excuse shouldn't fly here. I agree with your points but don't be a jackass, even to people who appear to deserve it.

I thought that was more sarcasm than snark, but very well, if you insist...

Post removed.

[Stanley Woo]

ODST 5723 wrote...

Stanley, is there any time frame you can share regarding when we might be able to expect a full listing of the various DLC cross-promotions and products for ME3? And is it possible to get more detailed descriptions/explanations about this randomization process, what's available and whatnot?

Thanks in advance.

I don't know about a full listing, but I will guess that more information about the various DLC will come out as we get closer to release. Sorry, i am neither in Marketing nor on the Mass Effect 3 project.