678 réponses à ce sujet

[tetrisblock4x1]

****, is that all that people have talked about all of these 26 pages now? Well I don't care about that, and it's nothing but fluff. Mass Effect 2 Lair, Overlord and arrival add ons are worth $5 to me. Even that Kasumi mod purely because it came with grenade physics was a bargain, even if the flash bang ability wasn't as developed as greandes in a proper shooter.

[Funkcase]

I have no problem with all this extra stuff to be honest, none if it's huge but they're some cool little exta's if you want them. Although It is annoying that I miss out on loads becuase I'm from the UK.

[Poison_Berrie]

Gatt9 wrote...

Actually,  if you look through the thread,  you'll find I didn't start sounding off until Bioware started insulting people for complaining about their unparalleled onslaught of DLC.

It's important to read through things in context,  go back through the thread and look at what Bioware posted.

Because if you go back far enough,  you'll find Bioware told us it's "Our problem" if we think their unparalleled onslaught of DLC was overboard,  and Woo told me I'm cheap if I think it's ridiculous to include game content with action figures.

Or your doing that internet thing, where your lack of audio-visual clues makes you see something as a personal attack. 
I'll agree that sometimes they can come of a bit flippant, but I didn't read in it what you did (though I can see that it can be construed that way). 

100k wrote...

Hell, I can't think of any other excuse for wanting fans to spend, what, 180+ for all of the game's extra content.

And can I just reemphasize something? 120 of launch DLC! When was the last time this happened in gaming??????

I have to say that everyone only looks at it from the viewpoint of the DLC. 
It's rather odd, to see people acting like the DLC is the primary item with the content it's attached to being some sort secondary thing. If you look at it like that, then yes it comes off as a money scheme.
But let's look at it the other way. You buy the figurines (who cost the $ 120,-  and are the main product) and for you business you get some small in game extra.

[Raptr569]

hebejebe999 wrote...

I think there's two problems here, one is the dlc itself, I enjoy mass effect, I'd like to be able to get anything I can  that would add to, or improve my game experience. it's worrying to see when before I'd just pre-order a game, and get bonuses, now I can do that in multiple places, can buy additional products and a wide range of things to get hold of all this dlc, it is my choice to want all the trimmings, even if they're not game changing, but lately the amount of hassle it's becoming to get hold of everything, puts me off and has actually made me dread this and other releases.

Since I was little I've grown up with the mentality of collecting everything in a game usually means 100%'ing the game, unlocking costumes, finding new weapons, collecting a full arsenal, are all parts of this, and of late achievements help, for rewarding people with unlocking things, collecting everything or even getting the 100%.

With extras like this, I cant help but feel as though having everything would be the complete collection of all the
stuff in the game, and if I don't have them, rather than having some extras and not others, it feels as though the others are missing from the complete set as a whole.

I know this is different from person to person, some people are fine to go without dlc, some people like having anything possible that would add to their game, there's no right or wrong with this, it is up to people if having all
the dlc makes their game feel more complete.

one other thing I think doesn't help, is the notion of "complete" or "ultimate" or "Game of the year" editions of games, where those words become associated with the game plus all the extra trimmings, surely if the game with all of that is classed as "ultimate" or "complete", then not having those it can surely be understood how some people feel their version of the game isn't "complete" or "ultimate"

the second problem is accessibility, this wouldn't be as bad if everyone was offered the same chance at acquiring the content as everyone else. a lot of the time these days multiple places offer different pre order bonuses, then some offer special editions on top of that, and not always with pre order bonuses, then it also differs with region, I'm a UK resident, I couldn't buy mass effect 2 collectors edition on box and get the Terminus pre order bonus, whereas in the US you could. the same is true of these action figures, sure I can make the effort of importing them, but the dlc is NA region only, so that'd be useless to me. the Dr pepper promotion was US only, so as I wanted it, I had no other option than to pay more than I should have to be able to get the content.

I'd like there to be complete copies of games that come out, like special editions, where you could pay, in one place, and be able to have the game and all the trimmings, not have to buy figures, magazines, art books, drinks or anything like that if you dont want to access all the extras a game has to offer.

Another thing I'd like to see, is game companies having or giving out the information of what exactly extra dlc like this entails, and if it'll be available after release on xbox/pc/ps3?

Agreed, these situations are only made worse by international enterprise level publishers like Electronic Arts failing to publish the DLC world wide. I'm also in the UK, and just because I live in a smaller market place for Bioware/EA products they see it fit that they won't even give me the option to buy DLC let alone go through all the hurdles of buy tacky merchandise. It's not like they even need to supply physical media like in the 90s for additional content, we have a great network of cables connecting the world called the internet, everywhere EA launch this game people will likely have access to the internet, so why region lock it?


On a side note, I've actually bought some of the merchandise from the Bioware store, I bought a Normandy SR-2, the quality of the product is AWFUL! The Normandy replica I received was not as detailed as the pictures seemed to imply and the paint job looked like it had been done by a small child trying to do paint by numbers... Anyways I digress...


What makes it worse in my opinion is that pieces of DLC are going to be 108.0KB (for Xbox 360, at least) so this content is sitting on the disc in front of me but because I don't live America I'll never be able to use it. This is the only industry that feels it is okay to sell a complete product but lock its customers out of certain parts for an extra charge.

Finally, vague DLC information... Maybe this is why the DLC isn't going to be released in the UK, in the UK if a product does not match it's description it's being sold illegally, which I guess means if a product doesn't have a description... It can't be sold?


EA/Bioware, if there is a technical problem with hosting this DLC in the UK I have an FTP server for my website and if you like I'm sure I can fit the whopping 108.0KB on there for you...

[Sir Caradoc]

hebejebe999 wrote...

I'd like there to be complete copies of games that come out, like special editions, where you could pay, in one place, and be able to have the game and all the trimmings, not have to buy figures, magazines, art books, drinks or anything like that if you dont want to access all the extras a game has to offer.

Likewise. I hate that feeling when the game I just bought feels some way incomplete. In the good old days when you purchased a video game, you knew that it was the full package. It contained the developer's orginal and complete vision  Dev-team delivered the best game they could..Nowdays  on the otherhand we have to deal all kind of bs exclusive content etc.

Release day dlcs don't just appear from the thin air magically. They are developped with the main game and are tested that they work flawlessly at the launch. I get that they aren't really essential for the core experience. So yes I can live without  few extra armors and weapons or some minor sidequest, but how soon will they remove something essential from the main game. Is there a line somewhere when the game doesn't anymore feel like it was meant to be?

Modifié par Sir Caradoc, 25 janvier 2012 - 12:24 .

[BounceDK]

Bioware : Let's cut story critical content and release it as DLC!
ROW: ???
Bioware: Yeah awesome! Let's do it! Mix it in between the useless stuff for lols!!

Modifié par BounceDK, 25 janvier 2012 - 12:38 .

[Baldurs Gate]

Double post, sorry.

Modifié par Baldurs Gate, 25 janvier 2012 - 12:56 .

[Baldurs Gate]

Stanley Woo wrote...

Terror_K wrote...

And now there's also this.

Not only do you now have to get the Art Book if you want all the DLC, but you have to get it from a specific place to get it. I'm already getting the book from a local retailer, and have had it on pre-order for months now, but if I want the DLC I have to get it from overseas from a specific place.

This is seriously getting beyond a joke, BioWare.<_<

That's pretty cool. I've given up on being able to get all the DLC for the games I like, but for those interested in such things, I don't think it's a terrible idea.

And ordering products from overseas to get something you really want is nothing new. Special edition DVDs or CDs that have different content in different countries, tour shirts, cars, and many other products that are sold only in certain regions can be difficult and expensive to purchase if you are not in that area.

I'm going to say it again, folks (sorry): if you feel that DLC content is worth the time, effort and money to get, then get it. If you don't, then don't. All of this DLC is geared towards those people interested in Mass Effect-related merchandise like toys and art books; and, to a lesser degree, those interested in being completionist with DLC. None of it should be crucial to the playing or completion of Mass Effect 3 or Shepard's story; it is all extra. Bonus. Supplementary. Superfluous.

Whether you agree or disagree with DLC as a whole is fine. We all learn to sacrifice and do without some of the things we might want. But if you're going to bash these things just because you want the DLC and don't want to have to buy the associated products to get them, then you have two viable options: a) hope that such DLC will be available in a different format later on, or try to get them from someone who wants the product but not the DLC.

Dear Mr. Stanley:

 Is there any chance/possibility that you could consider the idea of making this DLC available to get digitally? Like those of Dragon Age, Mass Effect 2 and Dragon Age 2. I understand, and to a point I agree, with the idea of sacrifice that buying or getting this extras imply. But how much sacrifice do you need me to do?   

 I´m from Argentina and getting all these Figures here would take months. As an example: I haven't even received my copy of SW:TOR yet, which I pre ordered back in November. And that´s if it gets through the aduana, which sometimes this stuff wont. Of course, not even mentioning that I pay 4 times the value of the product (1 dolar = 4,25 pesos). Which is fine, since I realize this are luxury products here. But why is the marketing team making it even harder for me to get those extras now?. Dont you consider my sacrifice enough already?


 I know I´m a minority, a really small one at that.  But please, not asking for much. I dont want Free DLC. Just a reasonable way to get it.


 Would you communicate this feedback to the appropriate team? =)
Thanks for reading Mr Stanley.

Modifié par Baldurs Gate, 25 janvier 2012 - 12:57 .

[Poison_Berrie]

Sir Caradoc wrote...

Release day dlcs don't just appear from the thin air magically. They are developped with the main game and are tested that they work flawlessly at the launch. I get that they aren't really essential for the core experience. So yes I can live without  few extra armors and weapons or some minor sidequest, but how soon will they remove something essential from the main game. Is there a line somewhere when the game doesn't anymore feel like it was meant to be?

Well stuff get's cut all the time, both now as in the past. Except now they can work it into the game afterwards, rather than barely knowing it was gone.
I guess the thing is that a consumer must determine for himself whether to purchase something. 
I don't know if there will come a time where reasonable swats of the game or cut out and offered on day one. If I feel that there is too much essential DLC that's announced in advance I won't buy the product. 
What I do know is that these will never be bundled exclusively with art-books, figurines and other pheriphial products, since the people who will not buy these far outweighs the group that does.

scyphozoa wrote...

Yeah, but this thread is filled with people who don't want the toys, and instead only want the DLC. If you buy a candy bar, throw the bar away and keep the wrapper. Did you just buy the bar or the wrapper?

Should stores sell those wrappers without the candy?

Value is subjective and this thread demonstrates that many people value the DLC much more than any toy, book or accessory.

Perhaps these people do view it that way. I just don't think the people in charge do, however. 
Should be indicative of what the content is going to be. 

Modifié par Poison_Berrie, 25 janvier 2012 - 02:02 .

[ganthet2000]

I can't believe you guys are complaining about this DLC stuff. Why not talk about the game or what maybe in it or your latest lay through of ME1 or 2.

[Raptr569]

ganthet2000 wrote...

I can't believe you guys are complaining about this DLC stuff. Why not talk about the game or what maybe in it or your latest lay through of ME1 or 2.

Probably because you aren't interested in the DLC, for the people that are, we have a right to complain.

[esollus]

From my perspective, I would rather have DLC, because without it all of the extra content which is available would likely not exist. Yes they could make an expansion stead , but consumers are showing devs with their wallet that this model works.

The amount of resources (people, time, infrastructure, required hardware & software) which are invested in production of a game will correlate with projected number of sales/profits.

Towards that end developers will have a fixed budget based around a structured project plan, (itemized list of content and features/systems + which comprise the game long with estimated amount of man hours & additional expenditure required to meet defined delivery dates).

Content required for main story and systems (which are the major selling points will be created first) Anything outside of that is subject to resource management and efficiency, if it doesnt look like deadlines will be met, nonessential content will be cut first and freed up resources reallocated to ensure project meets delivery date.

Similarly if the team comes up with new ideas which they are sure will result in more sales it makes sense to invest resources to see those ideas realized.

I know I will enjoy ME3 and will buy it, for DLC I will read reviews, if I think it worth my time and money I will buy it. Generally I wont bother purchasing weapon and outfit packs, not worth it.

The only time developers are likely to expend resources which cut into profits is unintentionally or if they are new, and trying to make a name for themselves.

[Thoth_Amon]

I'm more appalled at the very low quality of those dolls. It's like they had a kindergarten class clay contest, slapped some paint on the winners and said, "That'll do." Really cheap looking crap.

[Brownfinger]

Forsythia wrote...

Gatt9 wrote...

Actually,  if you look through the thread,  you'll find I didn't start sounding off until Bioware started insulting people for complaining about their unparalleled onslaught of DLC.

It's important to read through things in context,  go back through the thread and look at what Bioware posted.

Because if you go back far enough,  you'll find Bioware told us it's "Our problem" if we think their unparalleled onslaught of DLC was overboard,  and Woo told me I'm cheap if I think it's ridiculous to include game content with action figures.

I have to wonder if they told Kotaku the same thing?

Best post of this thread, probably. BioWare simple doesn't seem to care that their fans think this is a shady practice. Reminds me of a post around the time ME2 PS3 was released: people who had bought the Xbox 360/PC version didn't like that PS3 users could get the Dr. Pepper/Terminus Gear easily on their system, as they had to go through some hoops to get it. The response: "Sometimes, other people get nice things too." While there is truth in that sentence, I read it as "just shove it". To this day people on Xbox 360/PC are asking for the Dr. Pepper/Terminus Gear to be released as DLC. It can't be hard to do, as the files are on the server already. They even released Genesis on these systems, so I cannot fathom why the other items were never released.

To compare it to Activion, you know, the publisher that has taken the crown from EA as most hated publisher? They released a game called 'Transformers: War for Cybertron', which had several pre-order exclusive items too. Because fans asked them to release them as DLC and because prices of these items went up to $100 on eBay, they were made available for purchase for everyone. I know it's not entirely goodwill, but at least the fans got what they want.

I love War for Cybertron.

I think they saw the demand, and that they can't really cash in from these items on the secondary market, so they made them available. Maybe EA will follow suit, here? I'm of the opinion that if something is exclusive, you should jump through the necessary hoops. And if you do, you deserve it, because that's the very definition of exclusive.

But (much) later on, if they need a quick buck. I think it should be fair game. That's not my call, and I'm happy to be rewarded for my investment. Where are the people clamoring for their awesome mech doggy outside of the Collector's Edition? Because that thing has about as much of an impact on your overall game as a few extra guns in multiplayer. What people see as Bioware insulting you in this thread is really a couple dudes trying to shed some enlightenment on the topic and douse some fires. Shocker, angry fans know only one thing. More anger.

No reasoning with people.

Modifié par Brownfinger, 25 janvier 2012 - 04:03 .

[Moondoggie]

Brownfinger wrote...



I think they saw the demand, and that they can't really cash in from these items on the secondary market, so they made them available. Maybe EA will follow suit, here? I'm of the opinion that if something is exclusive, you should jump through the necessary hoops. And if you do, you deserve it, because that's the very definition of exclusive.

But (much) later on, if they need a quick buck. I think it should be fair game. That's not my call, and I'm happy to be rewarded for my investment. Where are the people clamoring for their awesome mech doggy outside of the Collector's Edition? Because that thing has about as much of an impact on your overall game as a few extra guns in multiplayer. What people see as Bioware insulting you in this thread is really a couple dudes trying to shed some enlightenment on the topic and douse some fires. Shocker, angry fans know only one thing. More anger.

No reasoning with people.

Unfortunately not. No matter how many times you try to explain it or how many ways you put it some people will have tunnel vision where all they can see is "i can't have something and now i want it more" and the sad thing is had these DLC been offered as they are for cash those same people would likely be complaining that they are being charged too much for a multiplayer skin. Most of them just want something to complain about and often you will see the same ones on any thread that is complaining about something.

[Brownfinger]

You're right, you're absolutely right.
And I fell into the "bang your head against a wall" trap of trying to show them logic. Easily remedied!

[CannonO]

So. Anyone want to deny that this wouldn't be an issue if all this content was planned for digital release to everyone?

Well. There is the argument that no issue is ever solved on BSN...

[DadeLeviathan]

I think they should just sell all the DLC that is available. If you buy certain things (i.e. perorder, action figure, whatever) you get some free, but offer it all for sale. Boom, solved. Then the people whining about not having that DLC have no excuse (unless they somehow have a mentality that they deserve random things for free).

[Dewart]

yep if the option was there to pay money for just the dlc then I would definatly have no complaints. I don't have a problem with dlc just the availability of said dlc

[AlanC9]

scyphozoa wrote...
Yeah, but this thread is filled with people who don't want the toys, and instead only want the DLC. If you buy a candy bar, throw the bar away and keep the wrapper. Did you just buy the bar or the wrapper?

Value is subjective and this thread demonstrates that many people value the DLC much more than any toy, book or accessory.

AND BIOWARE KNOWS THIS. This is the whole point. Bioware knows this content will be wanted by many people and use it as incentive to buy products people don't want.

Its not a conspiracy, its business. This is a combination of a loyal fanbase, loss aversion and profitability. So is Bioware to blame for putting us, the upset consumers, in a position that we resent? Absolutely. Bioware can and should sell 10 million units based on the quality of their game, like SKYRIM, not cheap promotions that milk the fanbase till the teat is dry and bitter.

I agree with the analysis in part. But note that there are plenty of consumers who are not going to "resent" this position. There are folks like me, for whom it's a DLC we're not interested in tied to an aspect of the game we're not interested in attached to a product we're not interested in. There are also folks who were going to buy the figures anyway, and so the DLC is just a freebie for them.

More importantly for Bio and whoever's making those figurines, there are also folks who are modestly interested in the figurines and who will find a figurine + DLC a worthwhile purchase whereas a figurine without DLC would not be.

And then we have the poor completionists, who don't want the figurines but nevertheless feel bad if they don't have all possible DLC. Yep, they're screwed. But what sort of percentage are we talking about?

[Raptr569]

Moondoggie wrote...

Unfortunately not. No matter how many times you try to explain it or how many ways you put it some people will have tunnel vision where all they can see is "i can't have something and now i want it more" and the sad thing is had these DLC been offered as they are for cash those same people would likely be complaining that they are being charged too much for a multiplayer skin. Most of them just want something to complain about and often you will see the same ones on any thread that is complaining about something.

I would happily pay for them and I'm not one of those people that complained that they were overpriced.

[AlanC9]

CannonLars wrote...

So. Anyone want to deny that this wouldn't be an issue if all this content was planned for digital release to everyone?

Well. There is the argument that no issue is ever solved on BSN...

We wouldn't have an issue here. The guys making the figurines might have one, though. "Free DLC: a $2 value!" isn't quite as compelling a sales pitch as "Free exclusive DLC."

[Brownfinger]

DadeLeviathan wrote...

I think they should just sell all
the DLC that is available. If you buy certain things (i.e. perorder,
action figure, whatever) you get some free, but offer it all for sale.
Boom, solved. 

Then, where is the added incentive to get the stuff on the periphery?

You play the numbers. Sell a pack for a dollar online, you potentially lose out on 18 from a sucker who will begrudgingly buy a Legion toy for items that they can earn by playing the game's multiplayer anyway. After factory costs, distribution, etc. these particular toys don't cost that much to produce. The price is what it is because they're premium items with distribution aimed at specialty stores and online shops. In a regular brick and mortar chain, you're looking at a more competitive pricing tag of maybe 10 or 11 dollars. Tops. Why do you think the listing is ambiguous, this close to release of the game and the figures? Because if people think they're getting something worthwhile to use in their game, they'll hoard every tiny piece of data. The system is in place because it works.

It's cutthroat. That's business. Join us in the real world. Don't get me wrong - Mass Effect is clearly a labor of love for them, but if they can put out a quality product and make a few bucks on the side, who the hell wouldn't take that deal? The toyline was dead and buried, somebody fought to wrest control of the original molds from DC Direct so that they could get them out. They like this nerdy stuff as much as we do, and I'm glad for that. A lot of people would have bought them even without the DLC. So, let us enjoy it. Maybe you'll get yours later. Or maybe you can play the multiplayer game and by then you'll have earned enough of these things that you'll be long past caring.

Smart money is on the latter.

Modifié par Brownfinger, 25 janvier 2012 - 06:12 .

[TwistedComplex]

Edit: Post removed. Since you don't know that Stan is actually a devleoper here at BioWare, I removed this as it made you seem dumb.

Modifié par Chris Priestly, 25 janvier 2012 - 06:15 .