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Thank you for Dragon Age, Bioware <3


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#101
alex90c

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Atakuma wrote...

alex90c wrote...

TS2Aggie wrote...

Nah, he was saying that if the detractors try stifling the words of thanks with their bitterness again, bans will be handed out...just as they would be if the roles were reversed.


So basically a contrary vew.

Posting things like "DA2 sucks", is what he means.


Well what's the point in explaining why I dislike a game when Bioware have heard the reason people may dislike DA2 a gazillion times already?

#102
Xewaka

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alex90c wrote...
Well what's the point in explaining why I dislike a game when Bioware have heard the reason people may dislike DA2 a gazillion times already?

It weighs in in the percentage calculation of each issue.
I.e. "A percentage of the critics liked A and B while disliked X and Y, for C and Z reasons."
It is more likely they address issues that are more broadly seen as negative.

Modifié par Xewaka, 24 janvier 2012 - 11:05 .


#103
Morroian

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alex90c wrote...

Atakuma wrote...

Posting things like "DA2 sucks", is what he means.


Well what's the point in explaining why I dislike a game when Bioware have heard the reason people may dislike DA2 a gazillion times already?

Whats the point in saying DA2 sucks a gazillion times? BW have got the message. 

#104
DreamwareStudio

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JohnEpler wrote...

If you're civil in your disagreement, please, feel free to continue disagreeing. We've never banned someone for simple criticism or disagreement because, hey, that's what the forums are for - sharing your opinion in a respectful manner that contributes to a positive environment for discussion.

If you decide that the rules of civil discourse do not apply to you then, yes, you will probably be banned. Life is unfair. I suggest acceptance.


Indeed.  You and I recently got into a good discussion of ideas because of some constructive criticism and idea swapping.

#105
Andraste_Reborn

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The problem is not people telling BioWare what they don't like about the game. The problem is that whenever someone makes a thread saying 'I love DA2 because of X,Y and Z' a bunch of people reply saying 'DA2 sucks' with no constructive comment. This is tedious, repetative and does not make for interesting discussion. (Especially since it is generally followed by people complaining about complaining, as I am doing now.)

#106
LPPrince

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Y'all do realize you're talking about what not to do while doing something you probably shouldn't be doing? Hah.

Anyway, sorry about unintentionally derailing your thread, katiebour.

And as far as putting the train back on track,

actually I already said thanks. Well, thanks again Bioware!

Modifié par LPPrince, 25 janvier 2012 - 02:12 .


#107
DreamwareStudio

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Andrastee wrote...

The problem is not people telling BioWare what they don't like about the game. The problem is that whenever someone makes a thread saying 'I love DA2 because of X,Y and Z' a bunch of people reply saying 'DA2 sucks' with no constructive comment. This is tedious, repetative and does not make for interesting discussion. (Especially since it is generally followed by people complaining about complaining, as I am doing now.)


It's unlikely people who simply post "this game sucks" with no constructive argument will be swayed into doing otherwise.  You can simply ignore them, which is what I do.  On the other side, I equally ignore those who hail any game without giving cause as to why.  It works both ways.

#108
alex90c

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Morroian wrote...

alex90c wrote...

Atakuma wrote...

Posting things like "DA2 sucks", is what he means.


Well what's the point in explaining why I dislike a game when Bioware have heard the reason people may dislike DA2 a gazillion times already?

Whats the point in saying DA2 sucks a gazillion times? BW have got the message. 


Because I like expressing my disappointment with the game.

#109
The Uncanny

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YakFace wrote...

I have to agree with the OP that Dragon Age 2 is a good game, I don't understand all the hate for it, but don't worry, just play and enjoy your game ;)


Well said.

And my thanks to the OP as well. I may not agree with every single word but it's really great to see some positivity and enthusiasm poke its head above the parapet once in a while. ^_^

#110
Guest_PresidentCowboy_*

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alex90c wrote...

Because I like expressing my disappointment with the game.


Has any other game disappointed you so much that you complained about it on the developers' forums for a year?

Not being sarky, genuine question! If I had the internet when the fourth Spyro game was released I would have done the same.

#111
alex90c

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PresidentCowboy wrote...

alex90c wrote...

Because I like expressing my disappointment with the game.


Has any other game disappointed you so much that you complained about it on the developers' forums for a year?

Not being sarky, genuine question! If I had the internet when the fourth Spyro game was released I would have done the same.


When I play games, I either like them, or I just get bored of them and don't bother with them. With DA2, I was buoyed up on my love of DA:O, so I went in to it thinking "hell yeah, a continuation of the DA story!", y'know, expecting something great like Origins was.

Played DA2 (three times in fact, for each "personality"), thought it was pretty good at first (funnily enough, I actually told myself toward the end of my first playthrough to treasure this experience because it won't be repeated, oh how true that turned out to be), but then through starting to frequent BSN and reading peoples' views on it, and my enjoyment of Origins starting to fade (since I hadn't played it for a bit, so I wasn't as smitten as I was before), people would bring up some flaws and I'd think "hey, I agree with this", and I found that just happening constantly, and that these negative things regarding the game just built up, and I reflected on the positives and negatives of the game itself and found that it just had such an overwhelming number of negatives that my resentment of the game began to manifest itself (the motives behind the changes Bioware made in DA2 and thinking about what DA2 could have been were two huge factors behind this), and just grow

and grow

and grow

and grow

and grow

To the point that I have an almost psychotic hatred of DA2. I'm not even going to bother with saying that it's dumb because it's "just a game", because games can affect people quite strongly all the time.

#112
John Epler

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alex90c wrote...

Morroian wrote...

alex90c wrote...

Atakuma wrote...

Posting things like "DA2 sucks", is what he means.


Well what's the point in explaining why I dislike a game when Bioware have heard the reason people may dislike DA2 a gazillion times already?

Whats the point in saying DA2 sucks a gazillion times? BW have got the message. 


Because I like expressing my disappointment with the game.


And if you add more than just 'DA2 sucks', you can continue to post, unencumbered!

But if you feel that what we've already outlined as acceptable forum behaviour doesn't apply to you please, continue down that road.  You may think you're making some grand point. You aren't. We deal with people in a fashion commensurate with how they deal with us. Respectful and constructive criticism will be met with respectful and constructive discussion. 'DA2 sucks' is neither of these things, and we've made it very clear what the consequences will be from this point forward.

#113
Pzykozis

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alex90c wrote...

When I play games, I either like them, or I just get bored of them and don't bother with them. With DA2, I was buoyed up on my love of DA:O, so I went in to it thinking "hell yeah, a continuation of the DA story!", y'know, expecting something great like Origins was.

Played DA2 (three times in fact, for each "personality"), thought it was pretty good at first (funnily enough, I actually told myself toward the end of my first playthrough to treasure this experience because it won't be repeated, oh how true that turned out to be), but then through starting to frequent BSN and reading peoples' views on it, and my enjoyment of Origins starting to fade (since I hadn't played it for a bit, so I wasn't as smitten as I was before), people would bring up some flaws and I'd think "hey, I agree with this", and I found that just happening constantly, and that these negative things regarding the game just built up, and I reflected on the positives and negatives of the game itself and found that it just had such an overwhelming number of negatives that my resentment of the game began to manifest itself (the motives behind the changes Bioware made in DA2 and thinking about what DA2 could have been were two huge factors behind this), and just grow


To the point that I have an almost psychotic hatred of DA2. I'm not even going to bother with saying that it's dumb because it's "just a game", because games can affect people quite strongly all the time.


I have got to say this is the weirdest reason to dislike a game I've ever seen, I really can't even begin to understand you.. I mean you enjoyed the game enough to play three times.. you had your misgivings with it (I think we all do) but because other people with the same misgivings hated it and didn't enjoy it... you yourself now hate it and don't enjoy it?

Fair enough, but.. well I dunno, I figure if you enjoy something you enjoy it and everyone else be damned.

Anyway, I like this thread, I 've seen too many forums (basically all of the ones I've seen and not excluding BSN) become breeding grounds for vitriol and holier than thou ness and it makes a nice change ("cough") so I tip my top hat to you OP (yes I have a top hat I'm English :whistle:).

Modifié par Pzykozis, 25 janvier 2012 - 06:04 .


#114
Zjarcal

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alex90c wrote...

To the point that I have an almost psychotic hatred of DA2.


Oh you don't say... at least you are aware of how much of a psycho you come across all the time.

#115
alex90c

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Pzykozis wrote...

alex90c wrote...

When I play games, I either like them, or I just get bored of them and don't bother with them. With DA2, I was buoyed up on my love of DA:O, so I went in to it thinking "hell yeah, a continuation of the DA story!", y'know, expecting something great like Origins was.

Played DA2 (three times in fact, for each "personality"), thought it was pretty good at first (funnily enough, I actually told myself toward the end of my first playthrough to treasure this experience because it won't be repeated, oh how true that turned out to be), but then through starting to frequent BSN and reading peoples' views on it, and my enjoyment of Origins starting to fade (since I hadn't played it for a bit, so I wasn't as smitten as I was before), people would bring up some flaws and I'd think "hey, I agree with this", and I found that just happening constantly, and that these negative things regarding the game just built up, and I reflected on the positives and negatives of the game itself and found that it just had such an overwhelming number of negatives that my resentment of the game began to manifest itself (the motives behind the changes Bioware made in DA2 and thinking about what DA2 could have been were two huge factors behind this), and just grow


To the point that I have an almost psychotic hatred of DA2. I'm not even going to bother with saying that it's dumb because it's "just a game", because games can affect people quite strongly all the time.


I have got to say this is the weirdest reason to dislike a game I've ever seen, I really can't even begin to understand you.. I mean you enjoyed the game enough to play three times.. you had your misgivings with it (I think we all do) but because other people with the same misgivings hated it and didn't enjoy it... you yourself now hate it and don't enjoy it?

Fair enough, but.. well I dunno, I figure if you enjoy something you enjoy it and everyone else be damned.

Anyway, I like this thread, I 've seen too many forums (basically all of the ones I've seen and not excluding BSN) become breeding grounds for vitriol and holier than thou ness and it makes a nice so I tip my top hat to you OP (yes I have a top hat I'm English :whistle:).


I'd hardly say eventually being able to open my eyes to the faults in DA2 is a weird reason for hating the game. I did my two later playthroughs because I was hoping that things would change if I made different "decisions", but nothing did whatsoever. I was just playing along the storyline in my first playthrough, but then later I realised how Hawke is just manipulated by absolutely everyone, becoming everyone's b*tch and doesn't bother to try and include himself in affairs unless he is absolutely forced to, say I dunno, the entire city goes to sh*t (more than it currently is) with a Qunari invasion or a mage rebellion, I found the companions just one-dimensional and/or annoying, being forced down three personalities was annoying since there were times I just found the tones available inappropriate for a situation, and well when it comes to the combat, I didn't like that from the moment I played the demo.

#116
alex90c

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Zjarcal wrote...

alex90c wrote...

To the point that I have an almost psychotic hatred of DA2.


Oh you don't say... at least you are aware of how much of a psycho you come across all the time.


"all the time"?

Regarding DA2 sure, but not for anything else. DA2 just did so many things wrong in my eyes that it deserves nothing more than my never-ending hatred.

#117
Guest_Puddi III_*

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I would suggest that "opening one's eyes" goes both ways, so when people say "no one's going to look back at DA2 and say it wasn't as bad as the monster they've made it to be" that's just as invalid as suggesting your own experience was wrong.

#118
Dormiglione

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Its long time ago since i posted on this forums, but let me just add a few things to this discussion.

@OP
Yes, im also grateful that Bioware made Dragon Age. I love Dragon Age Origins (10+ Playthroughs). Still love it and made two full playthrough after i played DA2.

IMO Dragon Age 2 is a mediocre Game, not more compared to DAO. I really dislike DA2. Just my opinion.

@John Epler
Thank you that you still take time and visit the forums. Its an inestimable value when Developers take their time to answer on their forum.

@to all other
Let DA2 be what it is. It has his great moments and it has a lot of negative features, parts however you want to call it. I think that everyone has the freedom to express  his opinion, as long that you remain civil. It doesnt need harsh statement to make clear, that you dislike something.

Remain civil and educated and you will be heared. Just my 2 cents.

#119
Galadreal

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Katiebour,  thank you for having such a wonderful post here.  I agree with most of what you said and I think you put it excellently. 

I had alot more written out, a couple of paragraphs, but my computer froze and I did not feel like rewriting it, so just in short.  Thanks!Posted Image

#120
TEWR

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alex90c wrote...


I'd hardly say eventually being able to open my eyes to the faults in DA2 is a weird reason for hating the game. I did my two later playthroughs because I was hoping that things would change if I made different "decisions", but nothing did whatsoever. I was just playing along the storyline in my first playthrough, but then later I realised how Hawke is just manipulated by absolutely everyone, becoming everyone's b*tch and doesn't bother to try and include himself in affairs unless he is absolutely forced to, say I dunno, the entire city goes to sh*t (more than it currently is) with a Qunari invasion or a mage rebellion, I found the companions just one-dimensional and/or annoying, being forced down three personalities was annoying since there were times I just found the tones available inappropriate for a situation, and well when it comes to the combat, I didn't like that from the moment I played the demo.


Same. At first I liked DAII but after a few playthroughs I saw how bad it really was.

I think part of why I hate DAII is that it's the Cliffnotes version of what DAII should've been. Instead of getting the real experience from the story, we only played a shortened and very nonsensical version.

#121
DreamwareStudio

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Zanallen wrote...

google_calasade wrote...

The fact is there are people who've just tried the game and want to put in their two cents as well.  You can't fault them for that.  Had the game been better received, then you would have been exposed to less negative feedback.


Ha, that's a laugh. ME2 is Bioware's highest rated game of all time and people are still whining about things. The same things. Over and over and over again. Things that Bioware has flat out said are going to remain the same for ME3. Things that aren't going to change no matter how much they post about it.

No, the BSN is just filled with people who like to complain about stuff.


I cannot speak of ME2 as I have not played it, but I think anytime you have change within a franchise you will see resentment if the first game was especially loved by some.  That is understandable.  That does not mean, however, the complaints are without value and should be cast to the wayside.  Ignore the posts that give no reason, but pay attention to those who do because the reasoning goes beyond the blind reaction to change.  There is thought behind those posts.  The same logic can and should be applied to posts where someone states, "I LOVE THIS GAME!" in big, bold letters with nothing else vs. ones that do hail a game but also provide a reasoning for why.

The people who continue to complain in the face of no change are most likely folks who cannot walk away from Bioware/EA just yet.  I would imagine a majority are longtime Bioware (pre 2007) fans who fill abandoned.  There will come a day when those customers will finally realize whatever it is that they loved is no more and leave.

With all of that said, BSN is no different than other gaming threads.  You have the fans who can see no wrong, you have the haters who can see no right, and then you have those in between.  BSN is not just filled with people who like to complain.  Saying what you did is just an enabler to ignore legitimate complaints.

Modifié par google_calasade, 26 janvier 2012 - 07:48 .


#122
Plaintiff

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alex90c wrote...

PresidentCowboy wrote...

alex90c wrote...

Because I like expressing my disappointment with the game.


Has any other game disappointed you so much that you complained about it on the developers' forums for a year?

Not being sarky, genuine question! If I had the internet when the fourth Spyro game was released I would have done the same.


When I play games, I either like them, or I just get bored of them and don't bother with them. With DA2, I was buoyed up on my love of DA:O, so I went in to it thinking "hell yeah, a continuation of the DA story!", y'know, expecting something great like Origins was.

Played DA2 (three times in fact, for each "personality"), thought it was pretty good at first (funnily enough, I actually told myself toward the end of my first playthrough to treasure this experience because it won't be repeated, oh how true that turned out to be), but then through starting to frequent BSN and reading peoples' views on it, and my enjoyment of Origins starting to fade (since I hadn't played it for a bit, so I wasn't as smitten as I was before), people would bring up some flaws and I'd think "hey, I agree with this", and I found that just happening constantly, and that these negative things regarding the game just built up, and I reflected on the positives and negatives of the game itself and found that it just had such an overwhelming number of negatives that my resentment of the game began to manifest itself (the motives behind the changes Bioware made in DA2 and thinking about what DA2 could have been were two huge factors behind this), and just grow

and grow

and grow

and grow

and grow

To the point that I have an almost psychotic hatred of DA2. I'm not even going to bother with saying that it's dumb because it's "just a game", because games can affect people quite strongly all the time.

So basically you hate DA2 because other people told you to.

That's rational.

#123
Ponendus

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The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

I think part of why I hate DAII is that it's the Cliffnotes version of what DAII should've been.


Heh, that's a good analogy.

+1

Modifié par Ponendus, 26 janvier 2012 - 10:15 .


#124
The Uncanny

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google_calasade wrote...
Ignore the posts that give no reason, but pay attention to those who do because the reasoning goes beyond the blind reaction to change.  There is thought behind those posts.  The same logic can and should be applied to posts where someone states, "I LOVE THIS GAME!" in big, bold letters with nothing else vs. ones that do hail a game but also provide a reasoning for why.


Whilst not disagreeing with you, I did want to make a couple of comments. Giving reasons does not necessarily validate opinion. Just because someone throws up a wall of text listing their reasons why Mass Age 7 is the worst game of all time doesn’t mean that any of those reasons will be valid or cogent.

To be clear, I’m not saying ‘ignore people when it suits you’. I’m just saying that lengthy ‘explanations’ can serve obfuscation just as easily as furthering debate.

Whilst I don’t disagree that simple ‘this is excellent’ or ‘this is awful’ comments can be meaningless, it can depend on context. For instance the OP of this thread was attempting to elucidate her thoughts on one game which happen to be upbeat. Posters who make ‘this is excellent’ comments are in this context expressing support for - and thereby are reiterating - that original statement.

Modifié par The Uncanny, 26 janvier 2012 - 12:28 .


#125
ladyshamen

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I just wanted to say I agree with the OP. I love the Dragon Age games. Yes, some things could have been better in them, but I feel that to be true about most games I play. Everyone likes different things, so it's impossible to make everyone happy. If you don't like it, don't play. And stop complaining.

Thank you Bioware!