1482 réponses à ce sujet

[TheCreeper]

Another issue I have with the comparisons, STG isn't pro-salarian, it's a special forces group run by the Salarian military, it's like calling the Navy Seals Pro-american.

[ParagonForLife]

*sigh* I give up you will never change your mind the turians dont destroy them because they have nothing to gain from wiping them out
The Systems Alliance is the representative body of Earth and all human colonies in Citadel space. Backed by Earth's most powerful nations, the Alliance has become humanity's military, exploratory, and economic spearhead= United World.......all people from all nations can join it represents all of humanity you will just ignore this fact so lets move on
Saying oh well they will protect there home first...well no duh that doesnt mean they wont help to retake earth but agian you will ignore this fact by saying that its only cause it benefits them which is the whole concept of cooperation but agian you will ignore sound facts
if we wanted more power we could have let the council die we all know humanity takes over if we do I didnt go oh well iam tell them to protect the council because we will get promotions if we do
how is it Irrelevant? you stated they will never treat us as equals we whould be pets.....okay well I dont give my dog the medal of honor for rolling over
our ships where inferior to turian ships so your point is invaild
The Geth dont think like organics do? lets see they wonder if they have souls and a afterlife they look up to sheppard and even say that sheppard is very similar to them
The genophage was an error because lets see oh the salarians cure it oh and because killing millions just to be safe is right? sure man sure
to sum it up you dont use logic you use fear thats your whole basis on everything Fear Fear Fear

Modifié par ParagonForLife, 23 janvier 2012 - 06:33 .

[DJBare]

MisterJB wrote...
Because we wanted more power for humans, not out of the goodness of our hearts.

Since that decision is left to commander Shepard(you), then the motives are yours, now you may have saved the council for more power, I saved the council because I believe all the races will be needed to fight the reapers, it's the galaxy that's at stake not just humanity.

[Sebbe1337o]

Maybe they are evil, but a necessary evil.

[Gold Dragon]

Sebbe1337o wrote...

Maybe they are evil, but a necessary evil.

As stated earlier, A necessary evil is still EVIL.

I've yet to see anything good that Cerberus has done that also doesn't involve Commander Shepard.

[DJBare]

Sebbe1337o wrote...

Maybe they are evil, but a necessary evil.

Yeah, and we can find a cure for cancer faster if we were willing to sacrifice lives for testing.

[ParagonForLife]

Sebbe1337o wrote...

Maybe they are evil, but a necessary evil.

who gets to decide whats necessary? one man the illusive man he has no rules no law nothing he thinks himself a god that is the sole decider for the entire human race and the whole galaxy 

[LTiberious]

ABCoLD wrote...

LTiberious wrote...

Kid Buu wrote...

LTiberious wrote...

One more thing.

Cerberus is not willing to enslave other races. It wants to make Humans dominant in the galaxy. Which is a great idea.

Great? How?

By any means possible

He was asking how it was a Great Idea.  Expand, explain, defend your position.  Otherwise you be trolling.

Making the decisions, means that if you need - you can get a bigger slice of the cake.

Or - you just can lead the community to where you think is right. And thats good

[Calibration Master]

DJBare wrote...

Skullheart wrote...

So, it was better an attack to a random undefended colony instead? Taking more humans than they did in Horizon.

By making Horizona bait they were ready, and saved half of the colony. Losing half of the colony is better than losing a full and more populated colony.

Accept he forgot to warn the colonists, oops.
Nah, this was not a sacrifice to save other colonies, it's because TIM is after the reaper technology, he threw away lives for his own selfish needs.

Nahhh not his own selfish needs, but the needs of humanity as a whole. TIM knows how the galaxy works. Sacrifice the few to save the many. TIM is a Bryonic Hero.

Modifié par Calibration Master, 23 janvier 2012 - 10:54 .

[Lycidas]

Calibration Master wrote...

DJBare wrote...

Skullheart wrote...

So, it was better an attack to a random undefended colony instead? Taking more humans than they did in Horizon.

By making Horizona bait they were ready, and saved half of the colony. Losing half of the colony is better than losing a full and more populated colony.

Accept he forgot to warn the colonists, oops.
Nah, this was not a sacrifice to save other colonies, it's because TIM is after the reaper technology, he threw away lives for his own selfish needs.

Nahhh not his own selfish needs, but the needs of humanity as a whole. TIM knows how the galaxy works. Sacrifice the few to save the many. TIM is a Bryonic Hero.

TIM would have killed the colonists himself to get his hands on the reaper tech. To believe in anything else is just naive.

[Aimi]

Calibration Master wrote...

Nahhh not his own selfish needs, but the needs of humanity as a whole. TIM knows how the galaxy works. Sacrifice the few to save the many. TIM is a Bryonic Hero.

He's not emo enough to be a Byronic hero. Actually, the closest BioWare character to the Byronic type is probably Anders in his DA2 incarnation.

[Phaedon]

Skullheart wrote...

You know... if Cerberus never existed the whole galaxy will being harvested by the reapers.

No Ceberus = No Normandy (they encouraged the alliance to co-develop the ship with the turians)
No Normandy = No travel to Ilos (any other ship would have been destroyed by the geth ships on orbit).
No Shep traveling to ilos = Saren activates the Citadel, and critical mission failure.

lol consequentialism.

The only set of morals that asserts that running over a cat is as ethically wrong as beating it with a baseball bat and hiding it under the back porch.

Can we actually talk about this?
Powell, the sleeping dock worker was the only one who was able to inform you about the Saren connection.
Without him, we would have been wiped out two years ago.

He has also killed less people than Cerberus, and is probably more succesful in his operations. How is he not infinitely more useful than Cerberus?

Oh, and by the way, due to Cerberus' existance, the whole galaxy may be harvested by the Reapers. Have we been reading the same "Enemies" doc here?

Volus Warlord wrote...
Shaddup you're disrupting my feel-goodie self-righteous paragon high ground.

Can I ever be as hardcore, edgy and rebellious as you, daddy?

[Calibration Master]

Lycidas wrote...

Calibration Master wrote...

DJBare wrote...

Skullheart wrote...

So, it was better an attack to a random undefended colony instead? Taking more humans than they did in Horizon.

By making Horizona bait they were ready, and saved half of the colony. Losing half of the colony is better than losing a full and more populated colony.

Accept he forgot to warn the colonists, oops.
Nah, this was not a sacrifice to save other colonies, it's because TIM is after the reaper technology, he threw away lives for his own selfish needs.

Nahhh not his own selfish needs, but the needs of humanity as a whole. TIM knows how the galaxy works. Sacrifice the few to save the many. TIM is a Bryonic Hero.

TIM would have killed the colonists himself to get his hands on the reaper tech. To believe in anything else is just naive.

Kill the few to save the many.

[Gold Dragon]

Calibration Master wrote...

Kill the few to save the many.

Without the few, or the one, there can be no many.

[Calibration Master]

A Golden Dragon wrote...

Calibration Master wrote...

Kill the few to save the many.

Without the few, or the one, there can be no many.

Without sacrificing the few there is no many, indeed.

Sometimes we need to sacrifice the few in order to save the many.

Modifié par Calibration Master, 23 janvier 2012 - 09:35 .

[BatmanPWNS]

- Revived Shepard.
- Saved Miranda from her father and protected her sister
- Only reason the reapers haven't destroyed the galaxy and collectors haven't taken more colonies.
- Gave Shepard intel to find the Shadow Broker. (The most powerful information broker)
- Without Cerberus, Garrus, Thane and Tali would have died and Jack would have never been freed from her prison.

As much as people hate them, they're times where they have been an asset.

[King Minos]

JGray wrote...

After reading a few threads discussing the pros and cons involving Cerberus, I've decided to post a list of those things I believe Cerberus has done that qualify as a check in the 'evil' column. I encourage a pro-Cerberus player to do the same for the 'positive/good' column.

I am leaving out experiments that might be considered ethically gray such as experimenting on mindlessly rampaging rachni workers/soldiers or Thorian creepers. I'm also leaving out Project Overlord, since the ethics of experimenting on deactivated geth are gray and there's no sign that the Illusive Man or Cerberus were aware of the use of an autistic man in the experiment. One can argue, however, that Cerberus "corporate culture" encouraged the activity that led to both the destruction of Project: Overlord and the destruction of the facility holding Subject Zero. I'm also leaving out the experiments that led to the creation of the Adjutants because we don't know enough about them to know if the subjects were voluntary or not.

* Engineered "accidental" explosions that exposed large groups of humans to element zero in order to create human biotics. This also created a large number of birth defects and quite possibly cancer.

* Kidnapped a newborn baby from her mother and raised her in an isolated, scientific research facility in a manner that cannot, by any stretch of the term, be called nurturing. Other children were also brought to this facility, some rescued from slavers but others kidnapped as well. Note: I am not mentioning the torture, murder, or pit fights that too place at that facility because a case can be made that these acts were beyond Cerberus command's control.

* Experimented on an autistic human child in order to amplify her biotics. The drugs may have heightened her autism, making her incapable of living a normal life.

* Engaged in industrial espionage, sabotage of political candidates, and destructive black ops campaigns within the media.

* Assassinated a Pope with "pro-alien" leanings. Assassinated a System's Alliance MP for similar reasons. Murdered an Alliance Rear Admiral investigating them.

* Kidnapped, tortured, and experimented on Asari to better understand biotics. Very unlikely the Asari were released when experiments were done.

* Provided arms to criminal syndicates. Theoretically to allow human criminal enterprises to overcome Batarian criminal enterprises.

* Destroyed a vessel and killed all hands on board in order to assassinate an important Turian.

* Engaged in the sale and distribution of illegal drugs.

* Lured thresher maws to a human settlement. The settlement was wiped out as was most of the Alliance military unit that responded to it. A captive was taken and tortured/experimented on further.

* The kidnapping, torture, and eventual death of Paul Grayson. Purposefully forcing a drug addict to relapse and then infecting him with Reaper technology.

* The murder of Liselle, the daughter of Aria T'Loak.

It's beneficial, for Science.

To get to the real cool parts of Science, moral lines have to be crossed.

I still don't understand why some people are agaisnt mechanical augmentation or Human hybrid's.

[mitthrawuodo]

LTiberious wrote...

ABCoLD wrote...

LTiberious wrote...

Kid Buu wrote...

LTiberious wrote...

One more thing.

Cerberus is not willing to enslave other races. It wants to make Humans dominant in the galaxy. Which is a great idea.

Great? How?

By any means possible

He was asking how it was a Great Idea.  Expand, explain, defend your position.  Otherwise you be trolling.

Making the decisions, means that if you need - you can get a bigger slice of the cake.

Or - you just can lead the community to where you think is right. And thats good

Except that you may be wrong *gasp* and doing something bad. The opinion of one does not reflect the opinions of the community. Besides, TIM is becoming leader by money and force which is unfair and a leader should be chosen by the community because the majority agrees with him and the minority do not suffer. TIM doesn't do this

[Calibration Master]

I made a topic about whether human augmentation is morally accepted or not.

Not surprisingly, there was an entire anti-augmentation sh*tstorm coming from the same people as the idealistic Paragon anti-Cerberus and anti-Renegade people posting here.

[Virginian]

They turned Shepard into the modern day (their modern day not ours) Jesus, nuff said.

Cerberus = good guys.

[Peer of the Empire]

JGray wrote...
American Indian children being ripped away from their homes and forced into schools to educate the "savage" out of them

You should think harder about what you are taught.  Whatever happened to the importance of non disadvantaged environment and culture?

[King Minos]

Calibration Master wrote...

I made a topic about whether human augmentation is morally accepted or not.

Not surprisingly, there was an entire anti-augmentation sh*tstorm coming from the same people as the idealistic Paragon anti-Cerberus and anti-Renegade people posting here.

What?! Why?!

Augmentation can change lives. It can improve healthy lives, repair damaged lives and cure diseased lives.

If those critics were born crippled, they won't think twice about getting mechanical legs. Seriously, this **** is amazing.

It's just madness going agaisnt it. I'm serious, my goal is to actually get into Biomedical Engineering so i can do this. I 100% support this.

Mechanical augmentation gives normal everyday citizens a second chance or those born with problems a chance to live a normal life.

Modifié par King Minos, 23 janvier 2012 - 09:44 .

[Calibration Master]

mitthrawuodo wrote...

LTiberious wrote...

ABCoLD wrote...

LTiberious wrote...

Kid Buu wrote...

LTiberious wrote...

One more thing.

Cerberus is not willing to enslave other races. It wants to make Humans dominant in the galaxy. Which is a great idea.

Great? How?

By any means possible

He was asking how it was a Great Idea.  Expand, explain, defend your position.  Otherwise you be trolling.

Pcff

Making the decisions, means that if you need - you can get a bigger slice of the cake.

Or - you just can lead the community to where you think is right. And thats good

Except that you may be wrong *gasp* and doing something bad. The opinion of one does not reflect the opinions of the community. Besides, TIM is becoming leader by money and force which is unfair and a leader should be chosen by the community because the majority agrees with him and the minority do not suffer. TIM doesn't do this

Pffff, idealism, right there in your post.

Democracy is the worst idea humanity has ever come up with. It's an idealistic fairytale and it doesn't work very well in real life.