Saphra Deden wrote...
KotorEffect3 wrote...
Except with the council it is more of a gray area with both good and bad.
If you can see good in the Council then you can see good in Cerberus.
Guest_Luc0s_*
Someone With Mass wrote...
Luc0s wrote...
Nope. Shepard is a strong elite N7 soldier. And even among the N7 soldiers he's strong, since he's either ruthless (gets the job done), or he's a war hero (managed to hold foot against an invasion) or he's a sole survivor (he alone survived the thresher maw attack against all odds). There was a reason why Shepard was chosen to become a Spectre. This reason was because of his history. Shepard is epic.
What do you think a random grunt in an alley somewhere can do against a special-trained elite N7 soldier and Spectre? Nothing.
Renegade Shepard knows his powers and he's willing to use those powers to intimidate his foes. This is a smart and realistic way to get things done from scum that normally wouldn't deal with you if you play mr. niceguy.
Also, playing Renegade 100% of the time is just dumb. My Renegade (well, more like a Renegon) Shepard doesn't flash his ciramic against every single random person he deals with. He only flashes his ciramic when he deals with low-life grunts, criminal scum or people who need to learn their place. But also, when hard and difficult decisions have to be made, my Shepard tries to be realistic and not idealistic. When it comes to "sacrificing the few to save the many", my Shepard would not hesitate to make that sacrifice. That shows that my Shepard indeed is a capable and smart Spectre.
That's why I said that most Renegade, Renegon and Paragade Shepards are smart and capable Spectres. All those Shepards are ready and able to make the difficult Renegade decisions when needed. Most of those are capable of sacrificing the few to save the many. Only Paragon Shepard who also wuss out on such decisions and always go with the Paragon decision are incredibly stupid and not Spectre-worthy.
You're giving Shepard's role and title way too much credit.
Shepard can be shanked, shot, burned and ambushed just as much as everyone else.
Modifié par Luc0s, 24 janvier 2012 - 11:33 .
Guest_Saphra Deden_*
ParagonForLife wrote...
Has anyone ever heard of a Joint Operation you should google it its very common
Guest_Saphra Deden_*
KotorEffect3 wrote...
And I acknowledged that the only good thing they ever did was that they brought Shepard back...
Because he is indoctrinated? I didn't read the book mind you. I can imagine though he sees Cerberus a threat to the war efforts against Reapers. After all it is a bit of a stretch to assume Cerberus can do what the whole rest of the galaxy fails at. I don't really know what the Alliance is doing or not because Shep was out for 2 years and after he/she came back the Alliance didn't exactly brief Shepard on any plans. Not even regarding Ashley/Kaiden. So I can't even judge whether the Alliance is doing something or not because they don't give me any information as long as Shep is associated with Cerberus. Which is, btw., TIM's fault because he spread the rumors that Shep's with Cerberus now. Which doesn't seem to be a particularly smart move unless he is deliberately trying to discredit Shepard with the Alliance.Saphra Deden wrote...
AlexXIV wrote...
Being pro human is fine to the point pro-human turns to anti-alien. Also, you assume you can do that. Sometimes you have to cut off an arm to save the rest of the body. It should especially not be a problem if the said arm can grow back.
WHen did Cerberus become anti-alien?
The real question is: considering that Anderson knows about the Reapers, knows the Council/Alliance aren't doing anything, but knows that Cerberus IS doing something, why was he so eager to try and destroy them?
really now? explain how it wasent because C-Sec has humans in it Cerberus is a Human Group and the alliance opposes them so yea pretty sure its a joint operation seeing as Grayson was being hunted by the alliance....so maybe you should read it agian?Saphra Deden wrote...
ParagonForLife wrote...
Has anyone ever heard of a Joint Operation you should google it its very common
Do you know? 'cause what happened in Retribution wasn't a Joint Operation.
Guest_Saphra Deden_*
AlexXIV wrote...
Because he is indoctrinated? I didn't read the book mind you.
Which is why I asked for examples that show the Council is irrevocably bad for everyone and especially humans.Saphra Deden wrote...
Understanding how bad the Council is helps us understand why Cerberus does what it does. It gives us context.
Guest_Saphra Deden_*
ParagonForLife wrote...
really now? explain how it wasent because C-Sec has humans in it Cerberus is a Human Group and the alliance opposes them so yea pretty sure its a joint operation seeing as Grayson was being hunted by the alliance....so maybe you should read it agian?
Poison_Berrie wrote...
Which is why I asked for examples that show the Council is irrevocably bad for everyone and especially humans.
Modifié par Saphra Deden, 24 janvier 2012 - 11:40 .
Saphra Deden wrote...
KotorEffect3 wrote...
And I acknowledged that the only good thing they ever did was that they brought Shepard back...
Okay... you don't think stopping the Collectors or saving the Council from the batarians was good?
True they did it because it supports their agenda. However here is a real shocker for you: anything that anyone does they do because it supports their agenda.
The Council is the same. So is the Alliance.
Or do you honestly think only Cerberus does things for reasons and that everyone else does things just be nice?
Modifié par KotorEffect3, 24 janvier 2012 - 11:43 .
Guest_Luc0s_*
AlexXIV wrote...
Because he is indoctrinated? I didn't read the book mind you.Saphra Deden wrote...
AlexXIV wrote...
Being pro human is fine to the point pro-human turns to anti-alien. Also, you assume you can do that. Sometimes you have to cut off an arm to save the rest of the body. It should especially not be a problem if the said arm can grow back.
WHen did Cerberus become anti-alien?
The real question is: considering that Anderson knows about the Reapers, knows the Council/Alliance aren't doing anything, but knows that Cerberus IS doing something, why was he so eager to try and destroy them?
Modifié par Luc0s, 24 janvier 2012 - 11:45 .
Guest_Saphra Deden_*
KotorEffect3 wrote...
Shepard and his mutispecies squad stopped the collectors, ceberus only cared about their technology.
I'm thinking I'll know everything about TIM by the end of ME3. After all we will be seeing what happens of his plans. I may read the books afterwards.Saphra Deden wrote...
AlexXIV wrote...
Because he is indoctrinated? I didn't read the book mind you.
I certainly hope Anderson isn't indoctrinated. Though I guess that would better explain his stupid behavior.
Retribution is pretty good. Read it some time. You'll get some insight into the Illusive Man and who he is and what kind of person he is in the process.
Guest_Saphra Deden_*
AlexXIV wrote...
I'm thinking I'll know everything about TIM by the end of ME3. After all we will be seeing what happens of his plans. I may read the books afterwards.
Saphra Deden wrote...
KotorEffect3 wrote...
Shepard and his mutispecies squad stopped the collectors, ceberus only cared about their technology.
You aren't being very fair here.
What's the point in debating this with you?
Your mind is made up. Even when Cerberus obectively does something good you find a reason to hate them for it.
I wonder why they even try. Poor guys. (and gals)
Modifié par KotorEffect3, 24 janvier 2012 - 11:47 .
the alliance works together with the turians to take down cerberus so then the turians got intel on cerberus agents from humans which means....da da daaaaaaaaaaaa Joint Operation...Saphra Deden wrote...
<_<ParagonForLife wrote...
really now? explain how it wasent because C-Sec has humans in it Cerberus is a Human Group and the alliance opposes them so yea pretty sure its a joint operation seeing as Grayson was being hunted by the alliance....so maybe you should read it agian?
Heeey you're improving! Good job, buddy! <3<3<3<3:happy::happy::happy:
It wasn't a joint operation because no humans were involved in any official capacity. It was all under the table. The Alliance didn't know about it until it was over.
Anderson was lucky he didn't trigger a war.Poison_Berrie wrote...
Which is why I asked for examples that show the Council is irrevocably bad for everyone and especially humans.
Go read the wiki.
Modifié par ParagonForLife, 24 janvier 2012 - 11:48 .
Sure you can. The entire organisation is structured in such a way so that the only person who knows what they're up to as a whole is the Illusive Man. The rest are - or such is my understanding - set up into independant cells who report only to him, and are generally unaware as to the details or identities of anyone outside that. Get rid of him, and Cerberus collapses.You can't get rid of Cerberus without also getting rid of supporters who don't wear the Cerberus uniform officially.
To be fair, Cerberus rebuilt the Normandy, rebuilt Shep, helps recruiting the squad (and is actually part of the squad/crew) and funds Shep. So yeah taking down the Collectors is a Cerberus mission, even if Shep's in charge. However Cerberus goal and motivation remain ambigious. But they are doing more than the Alliance to help the colonies. And since my Shep is a colonist she appreciates it. But Cerberus didn't manage to win Shep's trust regardless. And as it looks they won't in ME3 either.Saphra Deden wrote...
KotorEffect3 wrote...
Shepard and his mutispecies squad stopped the collectors, ceberus only cared about their technology.
You aren't being very fair here.
What's the point in debating this with you?
Your mind is made up. Even when Cerberus obectively does something good you find a reason to hate them for it.
I wonder why they even try. Poor guys. (and gals)
Guest_Luc0s_*
Saphra Deden wrote...
KotorEffect3 wrote...
Shepard and his mutispecies squad stopped the collectors, ceberus only cared about their technology.
You aren't being very fair here.
What's the point in debating this with you?
Your mind is made up. Even when Cerberus obectively does something good you find a reason to hate them for it.
I wonder why they even try. Poor guys. (and gals)
Guest_Saphra Deden_*
KotorEffect3 wrote...
Well it's not very hard to see through their crap especially when TIM says he intends to use the base to secure human dominance.
Guest_Saphra Deden_*
Blacklash93 wrote...
Cerberus' worth was spent when they helped Shepard destroy the Collectors. Such a small organization really isn't of much use in full-scale galactic war and considering what they've done to people they need to be done justice.
Well it would be easier if you can force him on the run. Like that he has to leave his safe place where he controlls everything from. But first you need to find him. It's the same issue as with the Shadowbroker.bleetman wrote...
Sure you can. The entire organisation is structured in such a way so that the only person who knows what they're up to as a whole is the Illusive Man. The rest are - or such is my understanding - set up into independant cells who report only to him, and are generally unaware as to the details or identities of anyone outside that. Get rid of him, and Cerberus collapses.You can't get rid of Cerberus without also getting rid of supporters who don't wear the Cerberus uniform officially.
Not that I'm suggesting that'd be remotely easy to accomplish
Modifié par Blacklash93, 24 janvier 2012 - 11:54 .
Guest_Saphra Deden_*
Blacklash93 wrote...
I'm not saying it was my priority, I was just saying that I could understand Anderson wanting to finally get rid of them.
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