20761 réponses à ce sujet

[CrazyRah]

Seeing the crew caring about Shepard and being concerned for her is one of the best parts of ME3 by far for me. Seeing Joker lash out but still being so very concerned for his Commander and friend was awesome, hearing Garrus almost ordering Shepard to bed was perfect. I guess this is the reward that Shepard and the player get for playing Dr. Phil in ME2 ^^

Modifié par CrazyRah, 24 mars 2012 - 08:36 .

[ADLegend21]

@Sable: You missed my point entirely and the part about ahving control over the majority of Kallen's doing and story and how , during gameplay where I have complete control over her I was nervous about how she was going to fare.

Also "Hack Walters" was onto something there. He also said in pre release that the characters in Mass effect had become real people and were being treated like real people and that Shepard was going to become more human in the game since we complained our asses off about shepard being a "brick" in Mass Effect 2. We get that and now we're complaining again I see. Granted we all have our own charactarizations of our canon and uncanon Shepard's and it won't fit for everyone but we got our emotional and not Brick Shepard's (no offense to anyone who named their Shepard Brick)

Modifié par ADLegend21, 24 mars 2012 - 08:35 .

[Sable Phoenix]

sagequeen wrote...

Honestly, i think now that things actually went wrong as far back as ME2. because we spent so much time off on a red herring suicide mission instead of investigating genuine ways to stop the reapers, the only way we were going to wrap things up in ME3 was with a giant deus ex machina. when the reapers hit, we had no weapons, no intel, nothing really. i think this is why the ending goodbyes hurt me so much. i was like, 'aaa'h! we have NOTHING to bring to this fight but a crazy-@ss weapon named 'The Test' does no one else find this totally crazy? jsut me? huh."

while me2 did give us a full mission with a beginning, middle, and end, i sort of think we needed more resources going in to me3. i mean, sorry, but diana allers is not a resource. a big frickin' gun and a heap of explosives? THAT'S a resource.

sorry, don't mind me. kyrie's pyromaniac tendencies sometimes co-opt my headspace. 

Oh look at that... the problems started when Hack Walters took over the Mass Effect universe.  Who would have anticipated such a thing.

I completely agree with you, Sage.  ME2 did a LOT wrong, and the reason you cite was not the least of it.  I was hoping that ME3 would redeem it as the second chapter of the saga, but from the time they started writing so many of the characters from ME2 out of the series with pathetic cameos, to the lack of impact of most things you do in ME2 have on your war assets (aside from Mordin and Legion's loyalty missions, of course), it completely failed in this respect.  Even if ME3 had gotten a decent ending and succeeded on its own merits, ME2 could basically never have happened and the impact would be minor.

What a waste.

Modifié par Sable Phoenix, 24 mars 2012 - 08:42 .

[Ottemis]

bumpmap, why U NO work?

We could have made beautiful babies together =o

Edit: lol nm, does work, stupid mistake.

Modifié par Ottemis, 24 mars 2012 - 08:47 .

[Gilsa]

A little OT, but on the subject of Joker, I missed this on both of my playthroughs, but it turns out that you can overhear Joker getting medical advice from Mordin about being intimate with Edi if you hang out in the med bay.

[Sable Phoenix]

ADLegend21 wrote...

@Sable: You missed my point entirely and the part about ahving control over the majority of Kallen's doing and story and how , during gameplay where I have complete control over her I was nervous about how she was going to fare.

Also "Hack Walters" was onto something there. He also said in pre release that the characters in Mass effect had become real people and were being treated like real people and that Shepard was going to become more human in the game since we complained our asses off about shepard being a "brick" in Mass Effect 2. We get that and now we're complaining again I see. Granted we all have our own charactarizations of our canon and uncanon Shepard's and it won't fit for everyone but we got our emotional and not Brick Shepard's (no offense to anyone who named their Shepard Brick)

I have no problem with emotional Shepard.  I give full props to Hale for delivering her tour de force performance, her magnum opus.  She was incomparable.

That's a separate issue from interactivity and choice and player agency.  The same emotion could have remained, and they could have given us the detail in the conversations that we had in the previous two games, AND we would have remained in control of our Shepards' characterizations.  It's not an either-or situation, as the illustrious lead writer seems to think.

Modifié par Sable Phoenix, 24 mars 2012 - 08:41 .

[Beba]

 I'm going to re-play ME2 with Kali now. I've got depression from ME3:crying:

[KateM]

Gilsa wrote...

A little OT, but on the subject of Joker, I missed this on both of my playthroughs, but it turns out that you can overhear Joker getting medical advice from Mordin about being intimate with Edi if you hang out in the med bay.

Yeah, you can...

Click

[Yumi50]

CrazyRah wrote...

I'm Femshep. I don't use doors. I break windows! 

[PayneUK]

In an attempt to get my love for ME going again I decided to go back to my original cannon Shep in ME1 and play through the series.

Unfortunately my crew heard about how bad the ending was and Youtubed it, it wasn't pleasant.


Liara's currently locked herself in the med bay storage room and Alyx can't get drunk because that's were Chakwas kept her brandy.

[ADLegend21]

sagequeen wrote...

Honestly, i think now that things actually went wrong as far back as ME2. because we spent so much time off on a red herring suicide mission instead of investigating genuine ways to stop the reapers, the only way we were going to wrap things up in ME3 was with a giant deus ex machina. when the reapers hit, we had no weapons, no intel, nothing really. i think this is why the ending goodbyes hurt me so much. i was like, 'aaa'h! we have NOTHING to bring to this fight but a crazy-@ss weapon named 'The Test' does no one else find this totally crazy? jsut me? huh."

while me2 did give us a full mission with a beginning, middle, and end, i sort of think we needed more resources going in to me3. i mean, sorry, but diana allers is not a resource. a big frickin' gun and a heap of explosives? THAT'S a resource.

I disagree.

It's been said since Mass Effect 1 (pre walters as people have been saying eve though he was writing on that game) that the Reapers are way above our pay grades. When Sovereign hit all those "big guns and heaps of explosives" did nothing to it, it just laughed as the biggest military in the galaxy stood in it's way and it's lackey's almost took out the biggest ship in the galaxy. Even he human fleet that swooped in after it couldnt' scratch the paint. It took killing a corpse being controlled by said ship to cripple it enough to destroy it. Convential war fare did crap in the face of one so said Deus ex machina that hurled dark energy was needed from day one. Mass Effect 2 was key in discovering how the Reapers worked, they didn't wipe out life, they enslaved the biggest and baddes species and left the not so strong ones alone until it was their time.  They were still beyond our paygrade but they weren't complete mystery to us and we found out we'd gotten their attention. With arrival we also realized just how close we were to being taken out than we though and had to destroy a relay through unconventional means to buy us time.

The On Palaven the Turians get taken out by the "overwhelming force" of the Repaers which made evne their most brilliant tactics irrelevant, again proving conventional means were not going to cut it against them. Even in the battle over earth one repaer gets destroy by having several cruisers and dreadnauts firing at it and befor it blows it STILL takes a few ships with it. The destroyer on Rannoch needed an entire fleet to fire down on it from orbit to knock it off it's feet and another destroyer need to be taken out by the biggest and baddes Thresher Maw on Tuchanka, Kalros.

Allers was a resource in giving people details about what Shepard was doing in order to get suport since ME3 is about getting the support of the galaxy to take on the reapers. fro two game we'd been on our own, council needed proof before they did anything in ME1 and in ME2 everyone thought Shepard was a traitor, that's not going to win a war. putting a reporter on the Normandy to tell everyone what was going on should have been done from the get go if so we could have had three years to prepare for the Reapers instead of 6 months, they could have studied sovereigns weapons and mass produced ships with the same caliber of weapons to match the Reapers or something. Knowledge is power, and since there was no knowledge of everything shepard had done we had no power to fight the Repaers as best we could until they were already here.

[ADLegend21]

Sable Phoenix wrote...

ADLegend21 wrote...

@Sable: You missed my point entirely and the part about ahving control over the majority of Kallen's doing and story and how , during gameplay where I have complete control over her I was nervous about how she was going to fare.

Also "Hack Walters" was onto something there. He also said in pre release that the characters in Mass effect had become real people and were being treated like real people and that Shepard was going to become more human in the game since we complained our asses off about shepard being a "brick" in Mass Effect 2. We get that and now we're complaining again I see. Granted we all have our own charactarizations of our canon and uncanon Shepard's and it won't fit for everyone but we got our emotional and not Brick Shepard's (no offense to anyone who named their Shepard Brick)

I have no problem with emotional Shepard.  I give full props to Hale for delivering her tour de force performance, her magnum opus.  She was incomparable.

That's a separate issue from interactivity and choice and player agency.  The same emotion could have remained, and they could have given us the detail in the conversations that we had in the previous two games, AND we would have remained in control of our Shepards' characterizations.  It's not an either-or situation, as the illustrious lead writer seems to think.

but we were never in complete control of our Shepard's There've been paraphrasing disconnects and even one line for all three dialogue choices since ME1. a prevelant example, which I know Ais will punch me for, is the "I want you Thane" choice for his romance. Shepard does not say "I want you Thane" she instead says that she'd be interested to knowing him better but you knew you were going to be initiating the romance, just not the words you were going to use to do it. I could use Jacob's interactions too but I'd rather not sully the good memory I have of him by thinking about it too much. *sigh*

[Sable Phoenix]

The Mass Effect plotline started going wrong with the Lazarus Project. The firepower of fleets has nothing to do with that.

Additionally, my point was not about paraphrasing, but about options.  The conversations in Mass Effect 2 were actually an improvement over 1, you didn't have different options giving the same lines of dialogue, yet you still had plenty of options.  ME3 took that away again.

Modifié par Sable Phoenix, 24 mars 2012 - 08:58 .

[sagefic]

@ AD: true, but there were many places in the codex, as far back as ME1, where we had clues about places in the galaxy where the reapers had been fought in cycles before. i'd been um..researching them (i'm a dork, yes) for my fanfic. i kept thinking these things were going to make an appearance. none of them factored into me3. none. ever.

i just kept thinking, 'why you have crucible?' there was all this stuff left around from the start of me1 that never got referenced or used. i mean, obviously you can go in a different direction, but if you put the gun in the drawer in act 1 and don't use it by act 3... then... o.O

and there are... oh, about 4 or 5 such guns from my reckoning. and speaking of guns. that gun on rannoch? THAT was a war resource. what happened to that nifty targeting thingy? i kept thinking "Holy HELL! let's give a pack of krogans these babies and get the turian and quarian fleets to lock onto targeting. it's a long shot, but a damn sight better than a magic weapon we've don't even know what it does."

[Silver]

The writers obviously never heard of the term "Chekov's Gun"...

[SkaldFish]

Sable Phoenix wrote...

sagequeen wrote...

Honestly, i think now that things actually went wrong as far back as ME2. because we spent so much time off on a red herring suicide mission instead of investigating genuine ways to stop the reapers, the only way we were going to wrap things up in ME3 was with a giant deus ex machina. when the reapers hit, we had no weapons, no intel, nothing really. i think this is why the ending goodbyes hurt me so much. i was like, 'aaa'h! we have NOTHING to bring to this fight but a crazy-@ss weapon named 'The Test' does no one else find this totally crazy? jsut me? huh."

while me2 did give us a full mission with a beginning, middle, and end, i sort of think we needed more resources going in to me3. i mean, sorry, but diana allers is not a resource. a big frickin' gun and a heap of explosives? THAT'S a resource.

sorry, don't mind me. kyrie's pyromaniac tendencies sometimes co-opt my headspace. 

Oh look at that... the problems started when Hack Walters took over the Mass Effect universe.  Who would have anticipated such a thing.

I completely agree with you, Sage.  ME2 did a LOT wrong, and the reason you cite was not the least of it.  I was hoping that ME3 would redeem it as the second chapter of the saga, but from the time they started writing so many of the characters from ME2 out of the series with pathetic cameos, to the lack of impact of most things you do in ME2 have on your war assets (aside from Mordin and Legion's loyalty missions, of course), it completely failed in this respect.  Even if ME3 had gotten a decent ending and succeeded on its own merits, ME2 could basically never have happened and the impact would be minor.

What a waste.

+2 (Sable, please pass one of those back to Sage, please...)

My only reservation, Sage... in spite of ME2, I think there were still quite a few better ways to wrap up the story than what we got. I get your point, though (and really enjoyed your treatment of the ending over on gametourists).

I'm realizing now, after reading some pre-release comments from Walters, that all the gameplay interaction in the last few minutes of ME3 seemed so pointless because he'd have preferred to remove ALL the interaction and just make the whole ending one long cinematic cutscene. We first experienced this "no, let me decide for you" stance at the end of Arrival, and in retrospect I shouldn't have been so shocked to see it fully realized at the end of ME3.

If I want to watch helplessly as nonsense happens, I'll go rent Matrix:Revolutions.

[Sable Phoenix]

silverhammer08 wrote...

The writers obviously never heard of the term "Chekov's Gun"...

Yeah no kidding. From the start of Mass Effect 2 that was obvious. We're kind of wending far afield from the topic of the thread, though...



... have a femShep.

Modifié par Sable Phoenix, 24 mars 2012 - 09:14 .

[sagefic]

wow, i almost didn't recognize jessica with her no hairdo. she looks good though

[Sable Phoenix]

sagequeen wrote...

wow, i almost didn't recognize jessica with her no hairdo. she looks good though

Only in certain angles.

Sometimes I get this, which is satisfactory:



Or this, which I think is the most beautiful ME screenshot I've ever taken:



And then other times I get this.



Eugh.

But even when she looks "good" I'm constantly nagged by small things which are off and build up to a subtle feeling of wrongness.

Modifié par Sable Phoenix, 24 mars 2012 - 09:27 .

[SkaldFish]

silverhammer08 wrote...

The writers obviously never heard of the term "Chekov's Gun"...

^This! ... and a lot of other terms as well.

Not surprising, though, when the lead writer had no formal training, published work, or professional experience of any kind as a writer before coming to BioWare:

Interviewer: Have you ever done any other types of creative or dramatic writing?

Walters: Nothing that I published. But all of my elective courses in university were always around Greek or Latin literature. I took a lot of the 18th century literature. That was was what I enjoyed. I wrote for fun; I've done lots of different things but they've always just been for my own enjoyment prior to this. This is the first time I really went out there and made a job of it.
...
[after university] I ended up working in IT and management for several years before having my own business back east. And lo and behold Ray [Muzyka] and Greg [Zeschuk, co-founders of BioWare] came to talk at a small business conference. I just happened to talk with them, and the thing that struck me most about them was that these were two guys that knew a lot about business. Having come from the business world myself, this was what was so surprising; it wasn't so much -- I knew their games were amazing, but they were also quite savvy in their business acumen. And for me that was it, that was the last barrier.

(excerpt from this interview)

EDIT: OK, didn't mean to swoop in and get the thread more off topic, so I'm done. Sorry...

Modifié par SkaldFish, 24 mars 2012 - 09:28 .

[Sable Phoenix]

SkaldFish wrote...

silverhammer08 wrote...

The writers obviously never heard of the term "Chekov's Gun"...

^This! ... and a lot of other terms as well.

Not surprising, though, when the lead writer had no formal training, published work, or professional experience of any kind as a writer before coming to BioWare:

Interviewer: Have you ever done any other types of creative or dramatic writing?

Walters: Nothing that I published. But all of my elective courses in university were always around Greek or Latin literature. I took a lot of the 18th century literature. That was was what I enjoyed. I wrote for fun; I've done lots of different things but they've always just been for my own enjoyment prior to this. This is the first time I really went out there and made a job of it.
...
[after university] I ended up working in IT and management for several years before having my own business back east. And lo and behold Ray [Muzyka] and Greg [Zeschuk, co-founders of BioWare] came to talk at a small business conference. I just happened to talk with them, and the thing that struck me most about them was that these were two guys that knew a lot about business. Having come from the business world myself, this was what was so surprising; it wasn't so much -- I knew their games were amazing, but they were also quite savvy in their business acumen. And for me that was it, that was the last barrier.

(excerpt from this interview)

Oh goddess.

Mass Effect 2 and 3 were written by an accountant.

[SaturnRing]

sagequeen wrote...


and there are... oh, about 4 or 5 such guns from my reckoning. and speaking of guns. that gun on rannoch? THAT was a war resource. what happened to that nifty targeting thingy? i kept thinking "Holy HELL! let's give a pack of krogans these babies and get the turian and quarian fleets to lock onto targeting. it's a long shot, but a damn sight better than a magic weapon we've don't even know what it does."

The Sync Laser.


I like how you think.

Modifié par SaturnRing, 24 mars 2012 - 09:37 .

[NoxJuked]

Molavetia modded makeup/with pixie hairstyle. Still don't know what to pick but I have time since I won't be playing her until the new endings or whatever, already did like 3 playthroughs with this femshep need to work on my male one later.

[JamieCOTC]

Auto-dialogue - Casey Hudson said that some players felt intimidated by all the choices and wanted to address that issue. Honestly, I thought that's why they created the action mode. I understand a dynamic cutscene like the Thresher Maw vs the Reaper is meant to be watched as it is a reaction to something Shepard did, but when Shepard is talking I should always be both engaged and involved in that process.

UJ made it through relatively unscaved, and a few lines were perfect, but there were a few other lines that were a bit questionable.One thing I did notice in playing both UJ and Erica. Certain follow up lines differed slightly. Even the tone felt different. On launching the missiles at the end, UJ (paragon) sounds like she's about to lose it. "We're down to two missiles and we haven't even made a dent." Erica on the other hand (renegade) says, "We're down to two missiles" and a squadmate finishes her statement. So the tone does change depending on paragon and renegade score, but not as much as it possibly should.

[Happy Beam]

Presenting, Eve Shepard!

ME1


ME2


ME3


Sorry for crap quality, I play on Xbox360. The last one of Eve is using Miranda's hair, even though it doesn't work.
I hope someone can fix Miranda's hair it looks so beautiful on femshep. :c