20761 réponses à ce sujet

[Zandilar]

Ottemis wrote...

Hmm synthesis is the way to go for me.

I've considered the following, control being a status quo, you only take the reapers out of the equation, plus Shepard. Risk of the impending war/organic annihilation still existing, but you give it a chance to prove the opposite.

Then there's destroy, where you take the reapers out, but also the Geth and EDI, which for all my Sheps is just not an option, however much I want to see them (my sheps) live, that would be going against what they stoold for since the beginning and the choices they made in regards to synthetic life throughout the game. Risk of the impending war/organic annihilation still existing, but you give it a chance to prove the opposite.

Then there's synthesis, believing the impending war threat exists assuming StarChild is what he claims to be, it's the only one that suggestedly assures to break the cycle in therms of war.

To me the main questions were simple, I asked myself:
1. Do I believe StarChild? Yes.
2. Do I believe war is inevitable, do I believe our annihilation in extension is inevitable? Yes.
3. Do I recognise the Geth and EDI as fullfletched "life"forms? Yes.
4. If not synthetic life, but say Turian life, would I merge to save them (and everyone in effect)? Yes.

Outcome Synthesis every time, I can't get around it.

I have a couple of problems with your logic.

1) Destroy doesn't, actually, destroy all synthetics. How do I know this? If you play it just right, Shepard lives at the end. If synthetics were all killed, Shep would most likely have died right along with them given she's part synthetic herself and probably can't exist without her synthetic parts.

The other thing... Geth are not their platforms, but the programs that run on them - AIs, just like EDI. I suppose the Reapers are too. AIs are just very elaborate programs. VIs are elaborate programs that have the potential to become AIs under the right circumstances (EDI used to be a VI, for example). Does the destroy option distinguish between the sorts of programs it destroys? If not, then wave good bye to computing all together. And while you're waving good bye to computing, you might as well wave good bye to space flight too.

So no, the Destroy ending logically doesn't destroy all synthetics... not even just all reaper based synthetics.

(This does come back to why the ME3 endings suck, because they just don't make any sense.)

2) Synthesis is the "I agree with the StarChild" ending (which you clearly do). The main problem with this ending is - how long does it last for? There are species out there that are slowly climbing out of the mud and evolving. Synthesis would NOT stop evolution, would NOT stop Chaos in the long term. It's a futile act. War would be inevitable between the non-synthesized and the completely organic, for exactly the same reasons the StarChild gave for the inevitable war between synthetic and organic (to stop the inevitable war... ). The ONLY way to break the cycle and ensure it never happens again is to get rid of the StarChild and his Reapers completely (so Control doesn't cut it either).

By the way, war is NOT inevitable between organic and synthetic. Shepard can prove that by working out peace between the Quarians and the Geth. They CAN exist in harmony. If you want inevitable war - take a look at the Salarians and the Krogan, whom you CANNOT work out a peace between (at least, not that I could work out in the game, otherwise I would have done it).

[Syrdeth]

Since we're discussing the choice we... or rather our FemSheps made....

On March 6th, I went internet dark. I didn't read any forums, watch any youtube vids, nothing. I wanted to be spoiler-free. If I screwed up in my 1st playthrough, so what? That's what 2nd, 3rd, 4th, etc playthroughs for were for, right?. Whatever I did, I would suck it up and just soldier on. No reloads on mistakes. And, believe me, I made mistakes. I lost out on a lot of sidequests because I didn't know about the Citadel thing. I was 2/3 through the game before I discovered the thrill of Singularity + Biotic Charge. And that was by pure accident.

What am I getting at? How is this relevant to FemShep? Well, when I finally got to the end and finally had control of my character again... I am proud, damn proud that Kendra didn't believe a word that that little snot had just told her. I don't care what the auto-dialogue made her say. Don't get me started on how she had just proved his circular logic wrong on the Rannoch mission.

After all the crap she had been through during the game... heck, all three games, no way in hell those bastards were gonna live. Now, was part of that because she was Renegade? Because she had the Ruthless background? I can't sit here and deny that it wasn't part of it. But, me, the player sitting in the chair, wasn't gonna have any of it either.

Yeah, sure, I replayed the ending to see the other two options, and then went and searched out forums, vids, etc to see others' reactions.... because, seriously? WTF?

But, my initial gut reaction?

This:



That isn't to say that I wouldn't welcome a fourth option. I would. Gladly. Or the Indoc theory. If Bioware decides to pick up the loose threads and go that route, I would welcome that as well. It's just that given what we have right now, I'm... god, I almost typed "happy" there... I'm... okay with my choice. Just hopefully there's more on the way and this isn't all we ever get.

You know, about 3 weeks ago, red wasn't in the list of colors I liked. It was too bright, too flashy. It just didn't appeal to me. Green was my favorite color. It still is. But red? Red is now a close second.

I guess it's just all matter of....



...perspective.


edit: I'm slowly coming to the realization that I need to get a blog. If nothing else so I don't annoy you people with my constant blabbering.

edit^2: I should add that due to all my mistakes and missed War Assets and the fact that I hadn't played any MP at that point, I did NOT get the little breath movie at the end. You know what? I'm still damn proud of Kendra's choice.

Modifié par Syrdeth, 30 mars 2012 - 06:45 .

[sagefic]

@ Syrdeth: Dooo eeeet! Blog all the things.

Blogs are a wonderful way of saying longwinded stuff that you just need to get off of your chest in a constructive way that people might actually like. I highly recommend them.

[2leggywillow]

Syrdeth wrote...
What am I getting at? How is this relevant to FemShep? Well, when I finally got to the end and finally had control of my character again... I am proud, damn proud that Kendra didn't believe a word that that little snot had just told her. I don't care what the auto-dialogue made her say. Don't get me started on how she had just proved his circular logic wrong on the Rannoch mission.

After all the crap she had been through during the game... heck, all three games, no way in hell those bastards were gonna live. Now, was part of that because she was Renegade? Because she had the Ruthless background? I can't sit here and deny that it wasn't part of it. But, me, the player sitting in the chair, wasn't gonna have any of it either.

Yeah, sure, I replayed the ending to see the other two options, and then went and searched out forums, vids, etc to see others' reactions.... But, my initial gut reaction?

::snip::

That isn't to say that I wouldn't welcome a fourth option. I would. Gladly. Or the Indoc theory. If Bioware decides to pick up the loose threads and go that route, I would welcome that as well. It's just that given what we have right now, I'm... god, I almost typed "happy" there... I'm... okay with my choice. Just hopefully there's more on the way and this isn't all we ever get.

Same here.  I was actually expecting to have some variation in my endings between my Shepards.  "Oh surely one of them will find Option A fitting, another Option B, etc."  But I just can't get behind the logic of control or synthesis.  Any Shepards I get to that point, Paragon or Renegade, are going to go Red all the way.

The thing that confuses me most about the "ALL SYNTHETICS WILL BE DESTROYED" thing is that the Reapers are not entirely synthetic.  They're part organic.  I guess I can follow that all Reaper tech-influenced synthetic life would be destroyed, which would include EDI and I guess the geth after their Reaper-intelligence upgrade... but beyond that?  I don't really see why.  Nor do I see why the Star Kid would phrase it in such an imprecise way.  BLEEEEHHHH.

[Sable Phoenix]

Sage, quit doing that.

I got to the ending very late at night, plus I had a head cold. As a result, after the ghosty kid got done droning on and on and on and on, I literally didn't remember which color was the Anderson choice and which was the Illusive Man option. Despite that, I stood there mulling the choice over indecisively for minutes. Finally I said screw it and walked straight ahead, figuring it seemed to be the most altruistic choice and trying to ignore the sense of wrongess that was gnawing at the back of my skull.

And then, like you, I felt physically sick to my stomach as I watched Jessica disintegrate in the beam.

In retrospect, there were a few reasons for that sense of wrongess. The first was just the entirety of the non-sequiter ending itself. Another was that it was I, not Jessica, that had made that decision. All I knew at the time, though, was that Jessica would not just surrender like that. She is unbreakably stubborn and despises people telling her what to do. She will fight until the end, and the only way to go down fighting is to choose Destroy. Besides which, she wants revenge. Those Reaper bastards are going to pay no matter what it takes.

I was so deflated by the ending that I just turned it off. When I finally came back to it days later, I realized just how much BS the ghosty kid had been spouting, so I simply deleted my my autosave and NG+ save and went back to make the real choice, and respond in classic Jessica fashion by blowing something away. It was her choice this time, and even though the end was still just as crappy, at least it was consistent with her character.

...but dammit, I still feel hollow.

Modifié par Sable Phoenix, 30 mars 2012 - 05:24 .

[sagefic]

See, me? I hold the ending in my hand, and turn it over, as if it were a sculpture. It has many facets and looks like many things, depending upon how you look at it. For example, it could be:

1) A giant bleeding heart - namely mine. i feel all the feels when i play through it
2) A question mark - when i look back at it a moment later, i think, what WAS that?
3) A swiss cheese of confusion - there is something there, but it is riddled with plot holes. why was kaidan on the normandy in his civvies? what planet did they land on? nothing starchild says makes sense. what the heck? what the actual HECK?
4) A black hole of despair - wait. all of the fleet is stuck on earth. the majority of the galaxy is going to DIE THERE - except the krogan, who will eat the rest of us
5) A giant middle finger - this ending sucks and i doubt anyone cares. does anyone care? you got my money already. i'm not sure if you care
6) A ray of hope - a breath and a note about DLC must mean something, right? right??
7) A torn storybook - the last few pages were ripped out and scribbled on. but if we can just find the last pages, we can tape them back in and it will be all good. right? right?? (see # 6)
8) An amputee - there was this really cool story about a person named Shepard. but then they took off the story's head and replaced it with a balloon. if you squint, it *almost* looks like shepard again and you can't tell the difference.

Eh. Don't mind me. I am clearly going crazy from turning the story over and over (and over and over)

Modifié par sagequeen, 30 mars 2012 - 05:30 .

[sagefic]

Sable Phoenix wrote...

Sage, quit doing that.

I got to the ending very late at night, plus I had a head cold. As a result, after the ghosty kid got done droning on and on and on and on, I literally didn't remember which color was the Anderson choice and which was the Illusive Man option. Despite that, I stood there mulling the choice over indecisively for minutes. Finally I said screw it and walked straight ahead, figuring it seemed to be the most altruistic choice and trying to ignore the sense of wrongess that was gnawing at the back of my skull.

And then, like you, I felt physically sick to my stomach as I watched Jessica disintegrate in the beam.

In retrospect, there were a few reasons for that sense of wrongess. The first was just the entirety of the non-sequiter ending itself. Another was that it was I, not Jessica, that had made that decision. All I knew at the time, though, was that Jessica would not just surrender like that. She is unbreakably stubborn and despises people telling her what to do. She will fight until the end, and the only way to go down fighting is to choose Destroy. Besides which, she wants revenge. Those Reaper bastards are going to pay no matter what it takes.

I was so deflated by the ending that I just turned it off. When I finally came back to it days later, I realized just how much BS the ghosty kid had been spouting, so I simply deleted my my autosave and NG+ save and went back to make the real choice, and respond in classic Jessica fashion by blowing something away. It was her choice this time, and even though the end was still just as crappy, at least it was consistent with her character.

...but dammit, I still feel hollow.

Hey, you're clearly in my head back. Not sure if you saw me say that very same thing about a week ago.

[Sable Phoenix]

To me the ending is just a blank wall. There is nothing there. Everything about it, emotions, themes, characters, plotlines, everything... is totally incomplete. Empty.

Like the eyes of a corpse.

Modifié par Sable Phoenix, 30 mars 2012 - 05:41 .

[sagefic]

Sable Phoenix wrote...

To me the ending is just a blank wall. There is nothing there. Everything about it, emotions, themes, characters, plotlines, everything... is totally incomplete. Empty.

Like the eyes of a corpse.

Or James Vega's eyes if you hit spacebar too often in the opening sequence. I did that today and everyone's eyes were rolling into their heads. Sadly, I didn't have fraps up.

but yeah. we can add that one:

9) Blank Wall

or more like 9) Dark Space. I feel like you finish the game and you're out floating in dark space going 'What the ****?" how'd we end up out here? this was a rollercoaster and it threw us off the ride. at least there's company out here, i guess. reapers, other grumpy fans, etc. 

[Syrdeth]

sagequeen wrote...

See, me? I hold the ending in my hand, and turn it over, as if it were a sculpture. It has many facets and looks like many things, depending upon how you look at it. For example, it could be:

1) A giant bleeding heart - namely mine. i feel all the feels when i play through it
2) A question mark - when i look back at it a moment later, i think, what WAS that?
3) A swiss cheese of confusion - there is something there, but it is riddled with plot holes. why was kaidan on the normandy in his civvies? what planet did they land on? nothing starchild says makes sense. what the heck? what the actual HECK?
4) A black hole of despair - wait. all of the fleet is stuck on earth. the majority of the galaxy is going to DIE THERE - except the krogan, who will eat the rest of us
5) A giant middle finger - this ending sucks and i doubt anyone cares. does anyone care? you got my money already. i'm not sure if you care
6) A ray of hope - a breath and a note about DLC must mean something, right? right??
7) A torn storybook - the last few pages were ripped out and scribbled on. but if we can just find the last pages, we can tape them back in and it will be all good. right? right?? (see # 6)
8) An amputee - there was this really cool story about a person named Shepard. but then they took off the story's head and replaced it with a balloon. if you squint, it *almost* looks like shepard again and you can't tell the difference.

Eh. Don't mind me. I am clearly going crazy from turning the story over and over (and over and over)

All very good points, all eight of them. You aren't crazy at all.

I guess in my post I was being too literal. The cynic in me says we got what we got and that's it. I posted and reacted based on that. I so want to be wrong on that. I really do.

I've never been very good at thinking in the abstract. And that's the main reason I haven't started a blog yet. I don't think I'd make a very good writer.

It looks like I am getting close to Off-topic territory and it looks like Maria doesn't approve:

http://cloud.steampo...F53E2FB988BAE7/

[sagefic]

More on topic, I am remembering what wonderful therapy fanfiction is. And fan art. i have not yet gotten to the place where i don't care about mass effect. i really hope that time never comes. so in the mean time, write, write write and art and stuff and yeah. i was writing stuff this evening that had me laughing hysterically. i'm really hoping to have something postable soon.

spring cleaning for the headspace. there is so much good stuff to work with.

Modifié par sagequeen, 30 mars 2012 - 06:02 .

[Gilsa]

I picked synthesis by accident the first time. It was very late and I wanted to finish the game. I remember thinking, wait, what were my choices again? I knew I wanted the path that Anderson took, but damned if I saw the ramps branch out to control and destroy. I rubbed my eyes and just started walking straight, thinking that I'd choose from the conversation wheel once I got there. Was startled when Shepard fell into the beam and disintegrated. I realized I made a mistake so I just watched the ending play out, went aw, cute when Joker and Edi came out all sparkly and happy. Reloaded and found destroy this time. Jaw dropped when I realized it was the exact same ending. Edi not coming out this time was the least of my concerns at this point because RAAAAAGE. =p

Modifié par Gilsa, 30 mars 2012 - 06:06 .

[Cyansomnia]

I've cooled off a bit and I'm back now. Everything is good.

Anyways, the best way to describe the ending of the game for me was essentially this:

By that point, I felt like my character had been stomped on and mangled to a point where I barely recognized her. I had to sit there and really think about the choice she would make.

To be honest, I believe she would have argued with the Star Child. She would bring up the peace she brokered between the Quarians and Geth as proof organics can live with synthetics. She would also bring up the fact she was able to unite the whole galaxy against the Reaper threat. Getting so many different cultures/races working together to fight for their own future is a resounding accomplishment, proving that co-existence is possible.

She would point out that this is not a choice left up to a singular person (or AI, or whatever the hell Star Child is) to make. It is not within their right to decide the future of trillions based on the assumption they would destroy themselves, if not slapped on the hand like a child with a gun. Accept in this case, the slapping involves forced genocide in a cruel and ruthless manner. The sinister way in which the Reapers operate is by no means justified, regardless of intent.

My Shepard is a deep thinker, determined, stubborn and a diplomat to the end. She wouldn't have cowed down to these ridiculous choices. Not after all she's fought for, after all she's lost. It's not about her, it's about giving the people she cares for (and the races of the galaxy) a future.  She would demand this vicious cycle to end, to let life (in all it's forms) make it's own way.

The first time I went through the ending I picked Synthesis, as it seemed the most altruistic choice. It felt incredibly horrible and wrong afterwards. I went back and chose Destroy. That ending DID feel right. I found myself almost smiling as my Shepard stood up straight, a look of defiance on her face as she shot the conduit. The Star Child flickers out of existence behind her, and later I see her draw breath in the rubble. However, it is by no means a satisfying end.

I feel my heart break for her. So much pain and loss, yet so little to gain from it. So many unanswered questions. There just isn't any peace to be found. Not with what happened to Thane, not with that horrible ending. The more I think about it, the more empty and meaningless it all becomes.  What was the point of her sacrifices?  

Modifié par Aislinn Trista, 30 mars 2012 - 07:22 .

[2leggywillow]

Gilsa wrote...

I picked synthesis by accident the first time. It was very late and I wanted to finish the game. I remember thinking, wait, what were my choices again? I knew I wanted the path that Anderson took, but damned if I saw the ramps branch out to control and destroy. I rubbed my eyes and just started walking straight, thinking that I'd choose from the conversation wheel once I got there.

From what I hear this threw a lot of people.  I probably would have done the same thing if I hadn't read the detailed ending spoilers ahead of time and knew that 3 different paths were supposed to open up.  I guess they were trying to prevent people from picking the wrong option through a careless dialogue option by making each choice at the end of a looooong, sloooow walk, but the non-center paths can be hard to see.

[Elorin Silverblade]

sagequeen wrote...

More on topic, I am remembering what wonderful therapy fanfiction is. And fan art. i have not yet gotten to the place where i don't care about mass effect. i really hope that time never comes. so in the mean time, write, write write and art and stuff and yeah. i was writing stuff this evening that had me laughing hysterically. i'm really hoping to have something postable soon.

spring cleaning for the headspace. there is so much good stuff to work with.

Wish I could write fanfiction but the last time I did something like that was in high school, so I'm pretty sure I'd suck at it lol.

[mellifera]

Yeah, I did the same thing. I just ran down and took the synthesis bellyflop because it was late and I was confused as hell about the whole thing. At first I didn't really know what to think. Then it kept creeping up at the back of my mind, the sheer wrongness of it all. Not just synthesis, but of the whole damn ending. So I reloaded and chose destroy too as it was the only choice that even slightly mitigated the clusterf*ck I had just taken part in.

Modifié par yukidama, 30 mars 2012 - 06:40 .

[Sable Phoenix]

I feel pathetic that I'm so morose over a freaking game. Very few events even in real life have affected me this badly. I'm still in what I can only describe as shock, approximately two weeks later. Numb, as if I'm afraid to let myself feel what I'm afraid I'd have to feel if I engaged emotionally. It has affected every other area in my life, from work to leisure... everything feels as if it's wrapped in gauze.

If I didn't have this thread, the femShep community, to see that others are feeling the exact same way, I would... I don't know what I would. Thank you, Aislinn, sagequeen, Chignon, and all the rest.

Modifié par Sable Phoenix, 30 mars 2012 - 06:31 .

[nranola]

I'm with the "beat the game in a braindead state and had to listen to Space God one more time" crowd. xD I was so drained from the battles prior to reaching the conduit that I couldn't make sense of what was happening the first time around (not that it would have been any different otherwise harhar). I tried to approach Space God to see if I could get a refresher.


"Could... you run that by me again?"

Durr nope. So I just settled with doing the scene over (thank BioWare for convenient autosaves), and picked Destroy.

It made the most sense to me, and by extension, it made most sense to Jennelyn. Other two choices sounded mighty shady. And you die whichever way you choose; might as well take the Reapers down with you. It did feel very very conflicted throwing the Geth in there, especially after Legion's sacrifice, after they'd finally won their freedom and their sense of individuality. Mass genocide. But if that's what it took to end the Reaper threat once and for all... it had to be done.



It wasn't an easy decision.

Okay, random question amidst the rambling: If destroying the Reapers also meant destroying the entire human race, would your Shepard be willing to make that sacrifice?

[Syrdeth]

Sable Phoenix wrote...

If I didn't have this thread, the femShep community, to see that others are feeling the exact same way, I would... I don't know what I would. Thank you, Aislinn, sagequeen, Chignon, and all the rest.

Yeah, this thread and the Femshep.com chat, total catharsis for me. Thanks, guys. You are awesome. (I really need to find better words.)

And because I'm a fan of shameless self-promotion, pointing out that I added this to my post above:

Syrdeth wrote...
edit^2: I should add that due to all my mistakes and missed War Assets and the fact that I hadn't played any MP at that point, I did NOT get the little breath movie at the end. You know what? I'm still damn proud of Kendra's choice.

Modifié par Syrdeth, 30 mars 2012 - 06:47 .

[Fraevar]

Heather Cline wrote...

My analysis of the endings for my FemShep.

Do I believe the AI child? No
Do I believe it's circular logic? No again
Do I believe that war with synthetics where they want to destroy all organic life is inevitable? No
Do I believe that the Geth and EDI are fully realized individuals and synthetic life forms deserving of life? Yes
Should I sacrifice myself based on circular logic which cannot be proven, can always be broken and defeated? No

Final analysis... I take the fourth option and tell the AI child to screw himself and find another way to defeat the reapers using the crucible and the citadel.

So much this. It is so intensely frustrating to be railroaded into these choices, when you have the ability to completely disprove everything StarChild says through your actions in this series. The only reason you cannot actually do so? The designers literally took out any kind of choice at the end. Lia was always a diplomat, she went out of her way to broker alliances, help others, and it resulted in peace between the krogan and the turians as well as the quarians and the geth. StarChild logic is disproven. Period.
The whole setup is just so contrived, illogical and out of place with the rest of the series it's just...gahr!

But yeah, ouf of the three - I went straight for Destroy. Control and Synthesis both involve somehow following the Reapers' logic, and I just was having none of it. They deserve to be erased from the cosmos, along with StarChild...now if only BioWare would actually follow through on that in DLC.

[Elorin Silverblade]

Here's another pic

Someone told her about the endings apparently

[Syrdeth]

Elorin Silverblade wrote...

Here's another pic

Someone told her about the endings apparently

Awww man, she looks like she needs a hug, bad.

She looks great, though.

[raziel1980]

Syrdeth wrote...

Elorin Silverblade wrote...

Here's another pic

Someone told her about the endings apparently

Awww man, she looks like she needs a hug, bad.

She looks great, though.

This...

And yet, another cute redhead shep has joined the ranks  

[Tup3x]

This thread has lot of win in these few latest pages. I can so relate to peoples views about the ending.

[Sinapus]

Delerius_Jedi wrote...

But yeah, ouf of the three - I went straight for Destroy. Control and Synthesis both involve somehow following the Reapers' logic, and I just was having none of it. They deserve to be erased from the cosmos, along with StarChild...now if only BioWare would actually follow through on that in DLC.

Control's only appeal is that cartoon showing a Reaper w/N7 markings lounging on a chair w/a drink and telling Harbinger to get back to work. "THIS HURTS ME."

Otherwise... "Is there a fourth?" -Jack O'Neill.