659 réponses à ce sujet

[Arppis]

robarcool wrote...

sackyhack wrote...

Eclipse_9990 wrote...

Juromaro wrote...

I don't see a problem with EDI's new body, don't like it don't use her?

But I like EDI's personality, and I want to see what she's like on the field, but not in that body! Imagine how embarrasing it would be to go out in public with EDI looking like that.

"Is that Commander Shepard? And did he really bring his sex toy out in public!?"
"Oh my God! What a freak!"

Oh the shame!

Shepard in ME3?

Oh the horror!

Hah, the doll looks pretty realistic if you bring it to California.

[Nohvarr]

Well, as interesting as the Artbook shots are, I'll need to see this body 'in-game' before I dismiss it as silly.

[Gabey5]

edi has a body now?

pics?

[Gabey5]

nvm it still beats the talking vagina

when someone first pointed it out to me it could not be unseen

[Nohvarr]

On The Protheans.

It always occured to me that those tentacles we saw on their face weren't a part of their biology, but an element of technology. The 'Space Jockey' from alien appears to have a trunk, but it was actually meant to be something like an air hose.

[Someone With Mass]

Terror_K wrote...

Riiiiiight...

So when you have the "Protheans" as we've seen them before in a vision doing the exact same pose as a Collector in a later vision, we aren't supposed to be lead to believe that these are the Protheans that became The Collectors? You're essentially saying the whole point of that near-on identical vision that was pretty much there to directly say "The Protheans became The Collectors" is complete bullpies.

It's pretty clear that BioWare has either decided to retcon the Protheans' physical appearance entirely or intended to mislead us from the start and make us really think this species who are, as the MEWiki puts it, " humanoid in appearance, but with extremely long tentacle-like fingers, toes and "beards"" are Protheans when they're not. But if that's the case, the beacon visions don't really make much sense any more at all.

Have you seen the individual frames? They're not very consistent with themselves. Some of the statues or people are fused to the walls. It's pretty surreal.

Also, the visions were supposed to point towards Ilos, not give the viewer a biology lesson.

Not to mention that they're basing the wiki description of the image of a damn statue, which could represent anything or it could be a fictional figure in the Prothean culture, just like how gargoyles are in some of the human cultures.

Just because they're doing a similar pose doesn't mean that they're the same thing either. That would be pretty dumb to believe to, since I doubt the Collectors were flash-forged out of Protheans in an instant.

[Terror_K]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Have you seen the individual frames? They're not very consistent with themselves. Some of the statues or people are fused to the walls. It's pretty surreal.

Also, the visions were supposed to point towards Ilos, not give the viewer a biology lesson.

Yeah, but all the beings in them seem to have the same consistent look: lanky limbs, smoothed-round smallish head and tentacle/beard-esque somethings running from the lower face down the chest region.

Not to mention that they're basing the wiki description of the image of a damn statue, which could represent anything or it could be a fictional figure in the Prothean culture, just like how gargoyles are in some of the human cultures.

The codex image in ME2 for "Prothean" also uses these figures in it. Given that the other species show images of their species for their entries, it would be safe to assume that this is also the case for "Prothean" as well. I'm sure you'll point out that as in-universe information that this is also due to the interpretation of those within the Mass Effect world, but not many in the universe know what The Collectors or TIM looks like either, and yet they're represented with accurate images in their codex entries too.

Just because they're doing a similar pose doesn't mean that they're the same thing either. That would be pretty dumb to believe to, since I doubt the Collectors were flash-forged out of Protheans in an instant.

Except that was the whole point of that vision in ME2: it was literally a message saying, "We, The Protheans, are the Collectors." It's literally a case of simply going "Us = Them." That doesn't really work as a message if you have "Picture of Another Species Entirely = Them."

Sorry, but to me it's like you're trying to argue that Bruce Wayne isn't Batman, despite all evidence to the contrary. I mean, did you honestly think that what we've been seeing up until this point weren't Protheans prior to seeing the Prothean in that image?

Modifié par Terror_K, 29 janvier 2012 - 11:44 .

[LTiberious]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Terror_K wrote...

Riiiiiight...

So when you have the "Protheans" as we've seen them before in a vision doing the exact same pose as a Collector in a later vision, we aren't supposed to be lead to believe that these are the Protheans that became The Collectors? You're essentially saying the whole point of that near-on identical vision that was pretty much there to directly say "The Protheans became The Collectors" is complete bullpies.

It's pretty clear that BioWare has either decided to retcon the Protheans' physical appearance entirely or intended to mislead us from the start and make us really think this species who are, as the MEWiki puts it, " humanoid in appearance, but with extremely long tentacle-like fingers, toes and "beards"" are Protheans when they're not. But if that's the case, the beacon visions don't really make much sense any more at all.

Have you seen the individual frames? They're not very consistent with themselves. Some of the statues or people are fused to the walls. It's pretty surreal.

Also, the visions were supposed to point towards Ilos, not give the viewer a biology lesson.

Not to mention that they're basing the wiki description of the image of a damn statue, which could represent anything or it could be a fictional figure in the Prothean culture, just like how gargoyles are in some of the human cultures.

Just because they're doing a similar pose doesn't mean that they're the same thing either. That would be pretty dumb to believe to, since I doubt the Collectors were flash-forged out of Protheans in an instant.

Also, as i said - Tentacles are not renegadish, so for the development of Prothy they needed something more "renegady". Thus - collectors were used as base for that

[Someone With Mass]

If we don't know the message or the purpose of that vision in ME2, then I don't think anything from its images should be taken as canon or hard facts, since those visions were usually jumbled messes, both in ME1 and ME2.

[Terror_K]

Someone With Mass wrote...

If we don't know the message or the purpose of that vision in ME2, then I don't think anything from its images should be taken as canon or hard facts, since those visions were usually jumbled messes, both in ME1 and ME2.

We do though. The only reason you're claiming it's "so vague" now is because BioWare has suddenly updated the Prothean look inconsistently and you want it to fit.

Read this thread... seriously:- social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/105/index/1102166/7

This post basically nails my point:-

GnusmasTHX wrote...

There are images of Protheans on Ilos, in the form of statues. There's an image of a Husk-ified Prothean in the Codex. We KNOW what Protheans looklike.

Protheans were turned into Collectors by Reapers.

The UPDATED vision on the N7 mission CLEARLY shows PROTHEANS, being turned into COLLECTORS.

Here's the low-down: IN THE UPDATED VISION ON THE N7 MISSION, IT SHOWS A DYING PROTHEAN, WHICH IS QUICKLY REPLACED BY AN OBVIOUS IMAGE OF A COLLECTOR. LIKE LITERALLY JUXTAPOSED RIGHT ABOVE THE ORIGINAL PROTHEAN IMAGE.

Why, you ask? Because Collector's used to look like Prothean's. The entire point of the vision is to warn Protheans what the Reapers were doing to captured and indoctrinated Protheans.

And a little later...

The Shelf wrote...

Guys, this is getting ridiculous. Here is the old vision from ME1:


And here is the new vision from ME2:


CLEARLY, the Protheans looked like the statues on Ilos and were transformed into what we know as the Collectors. They did not look the same.

Also, the Collectors were supposed to be the result of massive amounts of genetic toying by The Reapers, so it doesn't make much sense that they'd look so close to the original Protheans given that. About the only reason that this Prothean squaddie (or whoever it is) would make sense with an appearance like that is if he were some mid-stage genetic experiment somewhere between a pure Prothean and a full-on Collector.

Modifié par Terror_K, 29 janvier 2012 - 12:09 .

[TheOtherTheoG]

The protheans were multiple species'. There, argument solved without retconning the lore at all.

[Terror_K]

TheOtherTheoG wrote...

The protheans were multiple species'. There, argument solved without retconning the lore at all.

Except that it's already been stated by official sources that they aren't.

[LTiberious]

Terror_K wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

If we don't know the message or the purpose of that vision in ME2, then I don't think anything from its images should be taken as canon or hard facts, since those visions were usually jumbled messes, both in ME1 and ME2.

We do though. The only reason you're claiming it's "so vague" now is because BioWare has suddenly updated the Prothean look inconsistently and you want it to fit.

Read this thread... seriously:- social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/105/index/1102166/7

This post basically nails my point:-

GnusmasTHX wrote...

There
are images of Protheans on Ilos, in the form of statues. There's an
image of a Husk-ified Prothean in the Codex. We KNOW what Protheans look
like.

Protheans were turned into Collectors by Reapers.

The UPDATED vision on the N7 mission CLEARLY shows PROTHEANS, being turned into COLLECTORS.

Here's
the low-down: IN THE UPDATED VISION ON THE N7 MISSION, IT SHOWS A DYING
PROTHEAN, WHICH IS QUICKLY REPLACED BY AN OBVIOUS IMAGE OF A COLLECTOR.
LIKE LITERALLY JUXTAPOSED RIGHT ABOVE THE ORIGINAL PROTHEAN IMAGE.

Why,
you ask? Because Collector's used to look like Prothean's. The entire
point of the vision is to warn Protheans what the Reapers were doing to
captured and indoctrinated Protheans.

And a little later...

The Shelf wrote...

Guys, this is getting ridiculous. Here is the old vision from ME1:


And here is the new vision from ME2:


CLEARLY,
the Protheans looked like the statues on Ilos and were transformed into
what we know as the Collectors. They did not look the same.

Also, the Collectors were supposed to be the result of massive amounts of genetic toying by The Reapers, so it doesn't make much sense that they'd look so close to the original Protheans given that. About the only reason that this Prothean squaddie (or whoever it is) would make sense with an appearance like that is if he were some mid-stage genetic experiment somewhere between a pure Prothean and a full-on Collector.

I shall repeat myself.

Statues on Ilos - with tentacles.

Tentacles are not renegadish (im still ooking for someone to understand this). Thus design should be altered.
Genetical toying doesnt always affect appearance you know. And "another dna strain"  wouldnt in 100% change the appearance.

Ha! )

[LTiberious]

Terror_K wrote...

TheOtherTheoG wrote...

The protheans were multiple species'. There, argument solved without retconning the lore at all.

Except that it's already been stated by official sources that they aren't.

They.are.

And join the discussion in my sig. We're over this already.

[Terror_K]

LTiberious wrote...

Terror_K wrote...

TheOtherTheoG wrote...

The protheans were multiple species'. There, argument solved without retconning the lore at all.

Except that it's already been stated by official sources that they aren't.

They.are.

And join the discussion in my sig. We're over this already.

After looking through the last few pages of posts in that thread, I'm not sure I want to read the spoilers though. Trying to avoid too much of those. I think I already read something not hidden I didn't want to know as it was.

If I'm reading behind the lines right though, it seems to make the original visions and the updated ME2 vision seem... rather silly, actually.

Modifié par Terror_K, 29 janvier 2012 - 12:27 .

[incinerator950]

Terror_K wrote...

LTiberious wrote...

Terror_K wrote...

TheOtherTheoG wrote...

The protheans were multiple species'. There, argument solved without retconning the lore at all.

Except that it's already been stated by official sources that they aren't.

They.are.

And join the discussion in my sig. We're over this already.

After looking through the last few pages of posts in that thread, I'm not sure I want to read the spoilers though. Trying to avoid too much of those. I think I already read something not hidden I didn't want to know as it was.

If I'm reading behind the lines right though, it seems to make the original visions and the updated ME2 vision seem... rather silly, actually.

I stay away from the Character discussion board with a pinch of napalm and a metal pole. 

[Someone With Mass]

Terror_K wrote...


We do though. The only reason you're claiming it's "so vague" now is because BioWare has suddenly updated the Prothean look inconsistently and you want it to fit.

Read this thread... seriously:- social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/105/index/1102166/7

This post basically nails my point:-

You know what you're doing? You're basing facts on statues that you have no idea if the Protheans constructed or not.

Those statues could have just been there for decoration purposes as well.

That's pretty stupid.

[Terror_K]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Terror_K wrote...


We do though. The only reason you're claiming it's "so vague" now is because BioWare has suddenly updated the Prothean look inconsistently and you want it to fit.

Read this thread... seriously:- social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/105/index/1102166/7

This post basically nails my point:-

You know what you're doing? You're basing facts on statues that you have no idea if the Protheans constructed or not.

Those statues could have just been there for decoration purposes as well.

That's pretty stupid.

No. I was basing it more on the visions themselves than the statues. It just so happens that the beings depicted in the statues largely resembled those in the visions. A vision that was updated in ME2 to outright illustrate that "these beings were being turned into The Collectors" in a game where we were outright told that the Protheans were being turned into The Collectors.

I'd be willing to accept that the Prothean depicted in the leaked image is a Prothean part the way through the transformation. Vigil, after all, said that what The Reapers did to them was a slow process taking decades upon decades.

However, after reading some comments in the thread LTiberious linked to me I'm not sure quite what to think. It seems to indicate that those statues and the creatures in the visions were perhaps not the Protheans at all, but then I question what the point of the visions even was, particularly the updated one in ME2. Without looking at spoilers or seeing it for myself come March, I'm not sure what do think. Was this clever planning from BioWare from the very start and I've yet to see all the pieces, or a retcon with some clumsy holes?

Modifié par Terror_K, 29 janvier 2012 - 12:42 .

[GnusmasTHX]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Terror_K wrote...


We do though. The only reason you're claiming it's "so vague" now is because BioWare has suddenly updated the Prothean look inconsistently and you want it to fit.

Read this thread... seriously:- social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/105/index/1102166/7

This post basically nails my point:-

You know what you're doing? You're basing facts on statues that you have no idea if the Protheans constructed or not.

Those statues could have just been there for decoration purposes as well.

That's pretty stupid.

Shepard encounters three Prothean beacons over the course of the Mass Effect games. All of them basically tell you, the player, that the statues on Ilos are Protheans and that they were being converted into Collector's. If that's not conclusive enough Shepard even hunted down a one-of-a-kind alien for the knowledge to understand these visions correctly and concluded just the same.

No more grasping at straws and just deal with it. The statues on Ilos are, or were at one point representative of Protheans. BioWare either retconned it, or has come some sort of explanation as to why the squadmate looks unlike the Prothean's we've seen so far.

I'm guessing either the Prothean's have different forms throughout stages of life or the squadmate himself is anomalous compared to the rest of his kind.

[incinerator950]

I don't have the art book, and I'm lazy to go look at the scans, does the art piece say anything in the description? Rough idea, final product, concept stage?

Modifié par incinerator950, 29 janvier 2012 - 12:55 .

[Someone With Mass]

Where is the fact that those statues are modeled after Protheans, besides the Codex which is written from the in-universe perspective, exactly?

Not even those creatures in the visions are consistent in shape or form.

It's all a bunch of theories.

[Terror_K]

incinerator950 wrote...

I don't have the art book, and I'm lazy to go look at the scans, does the art piece say anything in the description? Rough idea, final product, concept stage?

There's two shots of the Prothean's head from different angles that are noted as being "final" in the bottom right corner of the image. The notes also seem to suggest (to me anyway) that the design of the Protheans came after The Collectors indirectly, in so much as they say the Prothean design had to have certain design features in common with that of The Collectors. This suggests that we either have a retcon or they planned the species we see in the statues and visions to never be Protheans, and didn't even design the look of them until after their Reaper-altered latter forms.

[Someone With Mass]

It says "Above is the final modeled head for a Prothean, showing off the shell- *blurs out* -that was a key feature of the Collectors. We added multiple pupils to the- *blurs out again* -and secondary nostrils off the upper lip for a very alien feel."

[Homebound]

look at the bright side, we now have someone who wears less clothes than Jack.

[GnusmasTHX]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Where is the fact that those statues are modeled after Protheans, besides the Codex which is written from the in-universe perspective, exactly?

Not even those creatures in the visions are consistent in shape or form.

It's all a bunch of theories.

Are you blind? Look at them. Their shapes, sizes and features are consistent throughout visions and match the statues themselves.

Go and actually play Mass Effect 2. It clearly shows Prothean's being turned into Collector's. 

So what, you're saying the beings in the visions which match the statues aren't Prothean? Then why would they (them being the Protheans) create a message to show to other Protheans that Species X are being turned into Collector's, which are Prothean's themselves? Does that make sense to you? 

"Let's warn our fellow survivors of what the Reapers are doing to their captives by showing them this sequence of a cow being turned into a Collector".

Modifié par GnusmasTHX, 29 janvier 2012 - 01:15 .