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***ME3 SPOILERS*** EDI in Mass Effect 3 Support and Discussion Thread! "I love the sight of humans on their knees."


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#451
Shifty-looking Chicken

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Ryzaki wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...


It's a little late for that considering she was working at Cerberus at least as long as Grayson. His defection was only in the last year and a half, remember?

You aren't making your case, SMW.


Okay, you're just missing the point. It's either because you're just that incredibly stupid or you're just doing it to annoy me.

Let me spell it out for you in the most simple way possible, with Caps Lock.

IF SHE NEVER HAD ACCESS TO THAT INFORMATION TO BEGIN WITH, IT DOESN'T MATTER HOW LONG SHE'S BEEN WITH CERBERUS, AND THERE'S ABSOLUTELY NO REASON TO BELIEVE THAT SHE EVER DID, REGARDLESS OF HOW CLOSE TO TIM'S BALLS SHE WAS.


She was his second in command. <_<

I don't see the issue either way. If Miranda has such important information on Cerberus, she could just email it to Shepard anyway. Her actual presence wouldn't be required.

Modifié par Shifty-looking Chicken, 27 janvier 2012 - 11:14 .


#452
GodWood

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cgrimm54 wrote...
I'm not sure if that's the only reason they chose to do this sort of thing.  The whole retex issue from ME1 was because they lacked the tech for multiple looks.

Or maybe they didn't want multiple, 'unique' outfits.

I vastly prefer the uniformity and practical outfits over what they keep tossing out now.

#453
1136342t54_

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Ryzaki wrote...
She was his second in command. <_<


Eh never struck me to have much more information on Cerberus than EDI did.

#454
DiebytheSword

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Saphra Deden wrote...
Yet you're still arguing with me like you've got something to prove.


You lend yourself entirely too much credit.

I argue with you because it entertains me to do so, nothing less, nothing more.  On your finer days, you are intellegent and thought provoking, on other days you're a boorish insult slinger who stoops to potty humor. 

Bravo, you showed me who I am. [/sarcasm]

#455
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bleetman wrote...

And here I thought the power structure of Cerberus boiled down to TIM > Everyone else.


It does, but that doesn't mean all his people walk around with bilndfolds on.

Come on, did you even read Retribution?

#456
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Shifty-looking Chicken wrote...

I don't see the issue either way. If Miranda has such important information on Cerberus, she could just email it to Shepard anyway. Her actual presence wouldn't be required.


Yeah, let's have more emails.

Amazing.

#457
Ryzaki

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Shifty-looking Chicken wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...


It's a little late for that considering she was working at Cerberus at least as long as Grayson. His defection was only in the last year and a half, remember?

You aren't making your case, SMW.


Okay, you're just missing the point. It's either because you're just that incredibly stupid or you're just doing it to annoy me.

Let me spell it out for you in the most simple way possible, with Caps Lock.

IF SHE NEVER HAD ACCESS TO THAT INFORMATION TO BEGIN WITH, IT DOESN'T MATTER HOW LONG SHE'S BEEN WITH CERBERUS, AND THERE'S ABSOLUTELY NO REASON TO BELIEVE THAT SHE EVER DID, REGARDLESS OF HOW CLOSE TO TIM'S BALLS SHE WAS.


She was his second in command. <_<

I don't see the issue either way. If Miranda has such important information on Cerberus, she could just email it to Shepard anyway. Her actual presence wouldn't be required.


emailing could be dangerous (interception and what not). Makes more sense to meet him in person.

1136342t54 wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...
She was his second in command. [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/angry.png[/smilie]


Eh never struck me to have much more information on Cerberus than EDI did.


Well in ME3 she flat out says she was his second in command. So retcon or whatever. Via ME3 Miranda was TIM's second in command before she resigned.

Spoilers Below highlight


<position>58294</position>
        <data>A visit by the former Cerberus second-in-command would have been disastrous.</data>
    </string>
    <string>
        <id>640616</id>
        <position>58295</position>
        <data>Any kind of secret communication would have looked even worse. </data>
    </string>
    <string>
        <id>640617</id>
        <position>58296</position>
        <data>I had to play it safe. For both of us.</data>

Modifié par Ryzaki, 27 janvier 2012 - 11:16 .


#458
Someone With Mass

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DiebytheSword wrote...

You keep defining EDI by the body she is in, you deep, heavy thinker you.  Lets not forget that I already said that the living star ship with the mind of its own should have been explored, (oh wait, that would be inconvenient for your pointless personal attacks, a truer sign of maturity).  That's not even addressing the point that EDI is still the living starship, which undercuts any indignant rage you managed to build up for yourself.

I'll enjoy the game, and it will be money well spent for me, unlike you who will find something to hate in every corner of it.  At the end of the day, that's going to burn your ass more than anything I could say to you to attack you personally, so good day.


Not to mention that there's absolutely nothing lost in the so mature aspect of EDI being a part of the ship, since she'll stay that way during the whole game. Her body is just another way for her to process new information and to help in more ways than one.

Like if...there's a Reaper cannon that needs to be disabled and EDI is your only tech expert. Knowing how Reaper tech works would give her an advantage in that case.

#459
nitefyre410

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yukidama wrote...

cgrimm54 wrote...

What I don't get is why the entire idea of good-looking squadmates is being torn to shreds here. What would it take to make everyone here happy? A squad made up of Vorcha, Krogan, and Batarians? Oh yeah, and a horribly disfigured human who grouches his way through missions. Unless that's pandering to the human crowd. God, who do these people think they are loving humans? Just think! The only romanceable squadmate could be a Batarian! Then we wouldn't have 'pandering' and 'sexiness'.

I can agree that their character designs are a bit... sexualized, but the alternative being the generic retex armors from ME1? I'm happier now. Oh, and yes, this is a straw man. I'm just a little peeved that every single bit of news we get is met with "BUT THIS ISN'T WHAT I WANTED BIOWARE"


The problem isn't attractiveness. I really hate the whole counterpoint that if people find the designs problematic they must hate attractive people (because we know they are oh so oppressed!!). Read what people are saying. The issue is when it is this pervasive and the devs themselves essentially say "Well, of course we had to make her sexy". Why, though? Why does she (and "she" is pretty much any female character) have to be sexy? There isn't anything wrong with sexiness, what bothers people is the way it is being done and the reasons for it. I actually really like the idea of giving EDI a body and story-wise there could be so so so many interesting things done with it. I am not even saying EDI needs to look like a LOKI mech or anything.

I love unique looks. Love them. I would rather die than go back to the one-size-fits-all of ME1 or DAO. But there's unique looks and then there's... what they're doing. There is a middle ground between the generic armor and sexualized unique looks for everyone. It's a false dichotomy. It doesn't have to be either/or, look at DA2.

And I am giving them my money. I am not asking them to change anything as much as to take a step back and realize that their entire consumer base isn't made up of people who want to see ONLY conventionally sexy women and gruff dudes. It is the norm in so many other forms of media, I don't think it is unreasonable to ask for something different just once, or to be disappointed when a company you love to pieces that makes games you love to pieces insults parts of their customer and fan base in so many ways. 

 

 You are correct  it is a completely false dichotomy but  look at as soon as you see anything with a hint of attractiveness the first thing that comes out of anyones mouth is ...  sexism.   Which is just a convient arguement some use to voice their  dissapproval or what some truely lonely men uses because they think it would get some attention from "Gamer Girlz" . While very few actually give a rat ass about how the characters are actually protayed. 

Really   thing  I find distrubing  is this notion  that...

Attractive =/= smart, strong  and capable  and the reverse..

Smart, Strong and Capable =/= attractive. 

I personally find extremes to completely off base.
  

#460
1136342t54_

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Ryzaki wrote...

Well
in ME3 she flat out says she was his second in command. So retcon or
whatever. Via ME3 Miranda was TIM's second in command before she
resigned.


Remember Paul Grayson already sold out Cerberus and pretty much forced TIM to change locations of operations, his home base and resources. By this point most of Miranda's info is likely useless after what the Turians did.

#461
Shifty-looking Chicken

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Saphra Deden wrote...

Shifty-looking Chicken wrote...

I don't see the issue either way. If Miranda has such important information on Cerberus, she could just email it to Shepard anyway. Her actual presence wouldn't be required.


Yeah, let's have more emails.

Amazing.

That wasn't the point; the point was that she's not so important that she would need to be on the squad.

If you prefer, they could meet up and share the information in person, then go their separate ways.

#462
AdmiralCheez

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I keep reading this script and I'm just...

... Aw, man. EDI. EDI, why are you such a sweet, funny, clever girl? Why do you make it impossible to hate you?

STILL NOT ON BOARD WITH THE BODY DECISION.

Modifié par AdmiralCheez, 27 janvier 2012 - 11:18 .


#463
Ryzaki

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1136342t54 wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Well in ME3 she flat out says she was his second in command. So retcon or whatever. Via ME3 Miranda was TIM's second in command before she resigned.


Remember Paul Grayson already sold out Cerberus and pretty much forced TIM to change locations of operations, his home base and resources. By this point most of Miranda's info is likely useless after what the Turians did.



...why on earth would it be useless? Didn't Grayson happen *before* ME2? She would've gotten the updated info.

#464
Guest_Saphra Deden_*

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Shifty-looking Chicken wrote...

That wasn't the point; the point was that she's not so important that she would need to be on the squad.


You aren't as clever as you think you are.

Clearly you don't know what I was talking about when it brought it up or what point I was making.

I never said this MUST HAPPEN. Just that it was better than EDI in some retarded sex robot.

#465
TMA LIVE

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What I don't understand (and maybe someone already said this, but whatever), is how is she in control of an avatar away from the Normandy, while still being the AI for the Normandy? Is Joker working without her when she's gone?

#466
AVPen

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AdmiralCheez wrote...

I keep reading this script and I'm just...

... Aw, man. EDI. EDI, why are you such a sweet, funny, clever girl? Why do you make it impossible to hate you?

STILL NOT ON BOARD WITH THE BODY DECISION.

Give in, Cheez, you know you want to. =]

#467
1136342t54_

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Ryzaki wrote...

1136342t54 wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Well in ME3 she flat out says she was his second in command. So retcon or whatever. Via ME3 Miranda was TIM's second in command before she resigned.


Remember Paul Grayson already sold out Cerberus and pretty much forced TIM to change locations of operations, his home base and resources. By this point most of Miranda's info is likely useless after what the Turians did.



...why on earth would it be useless? Didn't Grayson happen *before* ME2? She would've gotten the updated info.

No Grayson went rogue before ME2. Retribution happens after the SM.

#468
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Modifié par Hello Man, 22 avril 2012 - 05:30 .


#469
Guest_Saphra Deden_*

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AVPen wrote...

AdmiralCheez wrote...

I keep reading this script and I'm just...

... Aw, man. EDI. EDI, why are you such a sweet, funny, clever girl? Why do you make it impossible to hate you?

STILL NOT ON BOARD WITH THE BODY DECISION.

Give in, Cheez, you know you want to. =]


No, show some integrity and maintain an intelligent opinion.

#470
nitefyre410

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AdmiralCheez wrote...

I keep reading this script and I'm just...

... Aw, man. EDI. EDI, why are you such a sweet, funny, clever girl? Why do you make it impossible to hate you?

STILL NOT ON BOARD WITH THE BODY DECISION.

 

well at least you  not  blowing her up... god that was bit extreme. 

Modifié par nitefyre410, 27 janvier 2012 - 11:22 .


#471
Someone With Mass

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AdmiralCheez wrote...

I keep reading this script and I'm just...

... Aw, man. EDI. EDI, why are you such a sweet, funny, clever girl? Why do you make it impossible to hate you?

STILL NOT ON BOARD WITH THE BODY DECISION.


That's how BioWare rolls. :P

#472
1136342t54_

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TMA LIVE wrote...

What I don't understand (and maybe someone already said this, but whatever), is how is she in control of an avatar away from the Normandy, while still being the AI for the Normandy? Is Joker working without her when she's gone?


She is still in control of the Normandy but also can control the Android body at the same time. Similar to Rommie.

#473
mellifera

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cgrimm54 wrote...

yukidama wrote...
The problem isn't attractiveness. I really hate the whole counterpoint that if people find the designs problematic they must hate attractive people. Read what people are saying. The issue is when it is this pervasive and the devs themselves essentially say "Well, of course we had to make her sexy". Why, though? Why does she have to be sexy? There isn't anything wrong with sexiness, what bothers people is the way it is being done and the reasons for it.


I see the point there.  The 'sexiness' is apparently due to the intended use of the body, meaning as TIM's sexbot/infiltrator.  Aside from that, their reasoning for all the character changes being 'sexy' is something that grates with me.

I love unique looks. Love them. I would rather die than go back to the one-size-fits-all of ME1 or DAO. But there's unique looks and then there's... what they're doing. There is a middle ground between the generic armor and sexualized unique looks for everyone. It's a false dichotomy. It doesn't have to be either/or, look at DA2.


I do agree that the outfits don't need to be sexy, and that ties back to the previous point.  They don't need to.  But they are.  What I don't get is the group of people who refer to (example) Ashley's non-combat clothing as a 'stripper' outfit.  Which simply isn't true.  Sure, she could be wearing the generic jumpsuit thing that the rest of the ship wears, but does the sexiness, warranted or no, detract from the character underneath?  I try to look beyond design choices and instead look at the changes they make to actual characterization.  It's a coping mechanism.

And I am giving them my money. I am not asking them to change anything as much as to take a step back and realize that their entire consumer base isn't made up of people who want to see ONLY conventionally sexy women and gruff dudes. It is the norm in so many other forms of media, I don't think it is unreasonable to ask for something different just once, or to be disappointed when a company you love to pieces that makes games you love to pieces insults parts of their customer and fan base in so many ways. 

I'm not sure if that's the only reason they chose to do this sort of thing.  The whole retex issue from ME1 was because they lacked the tech for multiple looks, and now they can give each squaddie their own design.  From the amount of posting they do (or used to do) on these boards, they know what the BSN wants.  But they also have to pull in new fans.  I agree that they appear to view these new fans as the CoD type, and that that view is misplaced, but I choose to believe that the intent also wasn't to insult the huge fans like us on the BSN.  

tl;dr I agree, but the sexiness can be offset by real character growth, which is what I hope to see.


See, the thing is I LOVE all these characters. My criticism isn't really lobbied at them as much as at the designers and marketers. I still enjoy these characters, I still enjoy this series. But as much as I can look past a design that is gratuitous, it does still bother me because it speaks to a much larger trend in media and society. These games don't exist in a vacuum. I don't buy for a second that practically every woman is conventionally attractive (compare the female aliens that are allowed to be onscreen vs the male aliens) isn't done for marketing purposes and to pander to the least common denominator. They are perpetuating these shallow heteronormative standards when it comes to appearances because it WILL sell. Women will just have to deal with objectification because hey, at least their personalities are well developed (and sadly that is more than can be said for most media). Those in the majority will never be asked to "deal with it" the way those in minority groups have to when it comes to, well, almost anything. BioWare is a lot better in this regard than most game companies, but it is still disappointing.

That being said, I do love EDI and I am really damn interested in what they do with her but sometimes the choices BioWare makes and their reasoning for it makes me facepalm. There pretty much isn't a single thing I have heard of when it comes to gameplay or writing that I have been angry about (okay, except the preponderance of husks of all sorts because they freak me out).

#474
Ryzaki

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1136342t54 wrote...
No Grayson went rogue before ME2. Retribution happens after the SM.


So why wouldn't TIM give his second in command his future plans? If I recall anything he was pretty sure Miranda would obey any of his commands. Hell she was his watchdog for Shepard.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 27 janvier 2012 - 11:23 .


#475
AdmiralCheez

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Saphra Deden wrote...

I never said this MUST HAPPEN. Just that it was better than EDI in some retarded sex robot.

You know, sexbot aside (which is GOD DAMN IT BIOWARE RUINED FOREVER PRE-ORDER CANCELLED), the writing for her is really well done.  Thoughtful, sweet, and funny as hell.

So long as the camera doesn't do the Miranda thing, I might actually be okay with her.