122 réponses à ce sujet

[ItsFreakinJesus]

Wait wait wait, maybe--should the Reapers be capable of said ridiculous FTL speed--reaching these speeds is a huge drain on resources. After all, they harvest the galaxy for a reason and they enter a state of hibernation for a reason. Maybe using the Relay network saves them time and energy. Maybe being delayed for 2000 years has gotten them desperate to the point where they'd risk their reserves.

[ParagonForLife]

Han Shot First wrote...

All Dead wrote...

Han Shot First wrote...
If the Reapers could just have just flown at normal FTL speeds to the Milky Way galaxy in a relatively short amount of time, the whole plot of ME1 and ME2 seems rather pointless.

What is "normal" FTL, though? FTL = Faster Than Light. It's not an exact unit of time/space/speed. All it tells us is that it's faster than ~186,000 miles per second.

What I mean by 'normal' FTL speeds, is speeds at or not far exceeding the capabilities of Council ships. If the Reapers are capable of ridiculously fast FTL speeds that allow them to traverse a galaxy without the use of Mass Effect relays, it creates a giant plot hole that makes Mass Effect 1 hard to explain.

What doesn't make ME 1 pointless in the war against the Reapers is the fact that the Reapers' main MO consisted of using the Citadel as both an arrival relay and a central control system for all other relays in the galaxy. From that central control they could reprogram all relays to be useable only by them, cutting off all civilized systems from one another, therefore giving the Reaper invasion an element of surprise, preventing potential resistance from organizing, and making the Reapers' job of, well, reaping--system by system--easier and more organized.

Being able to travel from Dark Space to the Citadel in the blink of an eye (relatively speaking) without the use of a Mass Effect relay, or some new development that explains the ability to get there without a Mass Effect relay, does create a plot hole.
 
At the start of Mass Effect 1, if the Reapers had been capable of simply jumping in to Citadel space without a Mass Effect relay, or of simply driving there at FTL speeds in under two or three years, why did they bother with Saren & Sovereign? Simply jumping in or flying to the nearest Citadel-linked relay would still give them the element of suprise, and they'd be much better poised to overrun and seize the Citadel with the might of the entire Reaper fleet gathered in one place. Mass Effect 1's plot only makes sense if the Reapers were unable to reach the Citadel at FTL speeds, and needed Saren/Sovereign to take control of the Citadel and open that relay.

As noted by the user that posted above me,  it would also invalidate the Rachni Wars. There are strong hints that the Rachni Wars were Sovereign's Plan A, with Saren eventually coming to be Plan B.  If the Reapers were capable of simply flying to the Citadel at FTL speeds in a reasonable amount of time, they didn't need the Rachni either, and could have simply flown in and annihilated the galaxy around the time that Constantine was being crowned Emperor of Rome.

For those reasons I'm hoping for an explanation of how the Reapers get to the Milky Way beyond, "We floored it."

I think the reapers didnt want to have to use all the power to get here but once they had no choice they just did also theres other ways to travel then FTL if your advanced enough you can Bend space (Harbringer likes to talk about how the universe bends to his will) to make the distance shorter
 ________________ 100k light years FTL 
         (Bend Space)
 _____|___|________  100k light years but less distance 
 as light still takes the same time to travel the distance you havent really gone faster but you have made the distance shorter  its possible to do this but you have to have a near infinite power supply and alot of know how. 

Modifié par ParagonForLife, 29 janvier 2012 - 06:30 .

[Darth_Ultima]

As much as I like asking questions and for sci-fi to make sense in a believable way in the end its just fiction. Plus sometimes a little mystery is a good thing. Traveling that distance would take a lot of resources so it is most likely that they use the Citadel relay to avoid using those resources up. We also don't know entirely what the Reapers are or are not capable of doing. We know that the Reapers are the only Dreadnought sized ships that can land on a planet. We have seen Sovereign ram through a Turian cruiser like it was made of paper and even after that withstood the combined barrage of the several fleets including the Destiny Ascension Before finally succumbing. We have seen a Reaper fighting a giant Thresher maw. However beyond those isolated instances we have not seen anything that would indicate there capabilities. Like Harbinger is so fond of saying they would find another way. Well it looks like they found another way.

BTW Han Shot First, your name rocks.

[Reds19]

Han Shot First wrote...

Blacklash93 wrote...

What's so difficult to comprehend about flying through space like a regular ship? It's not like Dark Space is some sort of cosmic barrier sealing them away.

The incredibly vast distances they'd have to travel? All mention of the Reapers in dark space implied that they were far enough out there that they needed Sovereign to open the Citadel relay to get there.

If the Reapers could just have just flown at normal FTL speeds to the Milky Way galaxy in a relatively short amount of time, the whole plot of ME1 and ME2 seems rather pointless. If it was so easy to reach the Milky Way galaxy, why didn't the Reapers just fly there when the Keepers failed to respond? They'd have caught the galaxy unaware in that case, and not telegraphed their next move by fighting and losing a battle at the Citadel.

I'm hoping in ME3 that the Reapers have 'found another way' to reach the Milky Way galaxy besides normal FTL travel. They should figure out how to open a wormhole or something similar without the use of relays, or agents of the Reapers within the Milky Way should have have reconfigured a relay to link with the Dark Space relay that originally linked to the Citadel. Either one would explain how they were able to reach the Milky Way in a relatively short amount of time while not invalidating the plot of the first two games.

I think it's more the distances using "conventional" travel that boggles people's minds.  If youre far enough from the galaxy that you can see it, that is a HUUUUUuuuuuge distance to travel just using ftl.

This.

That cutscene implied that the Reapers were extremely far out of the Milky Way, and deep in Dark Space. It should take them more than two years. Anyone that says otherwise, is underestimating the vastness of space. Even at the speed of light it would take you 100,000 years to fly from one end of the Milky Way galaxy to the other. And the Reapers were far outside the Milky Way.

I completly hope your right. I want to see a new way in ME3 that the Reapers managed to get to the Milky Way. Rather than them just traveling at FTL speeds to get her. I want to see what creative way they managed to get here.

[littlezack]

The way I always understood it, flying here normally was always an option, but it's much, MUCH more convenient to do it the way they intended to. Attacking like this is very inconvenient for them - it allows the galaxy time to prepare or avoid their coming from planet to planet. They have some initial element of surprise, yes, but wiping out life will be much harder than they wanted it to be. If Sovereign's plan worked, they would have able to pretty much shutdown the galaxy. It was about much more than them just being able to get here really fast.

And as someone pointed out, FTL is sort of a vague term. How much faster than the speed of light can they go?

[Dean_the_Young]

Remove 'convenient' and replace it with 'advantageous', and you're closer. There's a strong difference between a decapitation surprise attack that allows the Reapers to instantly divide and cut off most communication between galactic civilization, and an attack from the outside.


While Mass Effect 1 suggested the Reapers would be trapped in Dark Space, that was always far more of an assumption than a supported fact.

[littlezack]

And really, think about it - the Reapers have been doing this for BILLIONS of years, maybe even longer. The entire point of what they do is to stop civilizations from exceeding a certain level of technology, and chances are, this thing with Shepard isn't even the first time they've had this much trouble with it. Would it really make sense for them to position themselves so far outside civilization that getting there under their own power would take thousands of years, thereby nullifying the entire reason they do it?

What seems more likely to me is that - what with being an impossibly advanced species of sentient warships - they're able to travel much, MUCH faster than the speed of light, though not nearly to the point where it beats the instantaneous travel of a relay.

[littlezack]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Remove 'convenient' and replace it with 'advantageous', and you're closer. There's a strong difference between a decapitation surprise attack that allows the Reapers to instantly divide and cut off most communication between galactic civilization, and an attack from the outside.


While Mass Effect 1 suggested the Reapers would be trapped in Dark Space, that was always far more of an assumption than a supported fact.

Hell, even at the end of the Mass Effect 1, Shepard says 'the Reapers are coming'.

[Luigitornado]

Maybe the Rachni Wars was just a buffer to make the incoming invasion an easier one.

[Zakatak757]

And as someone pointed out, FTL is sort of a vague term. How much faster than the speed of light can they go?

Reapers built machines that can fling you 50,000 light years in about 10 seconds. So let me do the math...

159235668789c
c = speed of light

If they have the technology to do that, then even under normal FTL, I estimate it to be approximately ~reallyfukinfast

[N0-Future]

I always wondered how the Reaper fleet discharged their mass effect drive cores in dark space? We a told that if a mass effect core isn't discharged regularly it can damage the ship and kill any organic life on the ship.

[MoltenRock]

They power their engines with A fart of Chuck Norris. This has the chance to overload them so traveling fast is vital.

[searunner]

Is it a assumed that the "Fleet" of reapers started moving at the start or end of ME1? What if the Rachni wars was the first attempt to restart the signal from the Citadel? That could mean that The Reapers left about 2000 years ago from wherever they were and are just now starting to get close enough. That means that they arent going 100000 light years a years but more like a few hundred Even after all that time and getting close to the milky way they would still want to get the drop using the citadel so that would explain the Saren "incident". Is that possible?

[Annihilator27]

searunner wrote...

Is it a assumed that the "Fleet" of reapers started moving at the start or end of ME1? What if the Rachni wars was the first attempt to restart the signal from the Citadel? That could mean that The Reapers left about 2000 years ago from wherever they were and are just now starting to get close enough. That means that they arent going 100000 light years a years but more like a few hundred Even after all that time and getting close to the milky way they would still want to get the drop using the citadel so that would explain the Saren "incident". Is that possible?

Not assumed, The Devs did say they started heading to the Milky Way at FTL speeds at the end of ME.

[ZehnWaters]

Like others, I always assumed it was an option it just required resources and energy that would leave them drained when they first arrived. Also, again, arriving at the Citadel let them arrive at a strategically advantageous location.

[GMagnum]

aye dey gt a cookie n den dey dunked it on da outer part of da galaxy den a portal open up den dey fly in tbh

[ItsFreakinJesus]

searunner wrote...

Is it a assumed that the "Fleet" of reapers started moving at the start or end of ME1? What if the Rachni wars was the first attempt to restart the signal from the Citadel? That could mean that The Reapers left about 2000 years ago from wherever they were and are just now starting to get close enough. That means that they arent going 100000 light years a years but more like a few hundred Even after all that time and getting close to the milky way they would still want to get the drop using the citadel so that would explain the Saren "incident". Is that possible?

What do you mean, 'if"?  That's exactly what it was.

[Anacronian Stryx]

ItsFreakinJesus wrote...

searunner wrote...

Is it a assumed that the "Fleet" of reapers started moving at the start or end of ME1? What if the Rachni wars was the first attempt to restart the signal from the Citadel? That could mean that The Reapers left about 2000 years ago from wherever they were and are just now starting to get close enough. That means that they arent going 100000 light years a years but more like a few hundred Even after all that time and getting close to the milky way they would still want to get the drop using the citadel so that would explain the Saren "incident". Is that possible?

What do you mean, 'if"?  That's exactly what it was.

Except it wasn't - read Chorban's mail which clearly states that the keepers are supposed to respond to a signal around now and not 2000 years ago.

I still wonder why so many think that the rachni wars had anything to do with taking over the citadel.

[ItsCalledAGeth]

Reds19 wrote...

 ok so the Reapers have already tried 3 ways to get out of deep space.... 1. the citidel     2. the collecters rebuilding a Reaper     3. The reapers coming though one of the mass relay's( DLC)
How do you guys think the Reapers will return in ME3?

Well if you want the long explanation: the reapers fly into the the Milky Way, but mid way to Earth. Harbinger realizes he left the radio playing Don't Fear The Reaper from the last invasion and his batteries are dead after destroying a Batarian colony and etching in laser that the humans did it. All the reapers, being good natured stayed with Harbinger and phoned the nearest tow-ship to bring Harbinger to Earth for . . . repairs! However, a dandy frigate of wonderful Batarian extremists stops by and offers to help. Harbinger declines, saying that he can wait for the tow-ship, but the extremists insist. After charging Harbinger's batteries with their space jumper cables, the Batarians are invited to enter Harbinger for a "mental chit chat". Once they realize their ship was just destroyed by a Reaper testing it's laser, the Batarians enter Harbinger, are given a tour by one of the residing husks and then are indoctrinated for the Cannibal army. And then the Reapers go to Earth.

So yeah, that's how the Reapers arrive.

[Anacronian Stryx]

Reds19 wrote...

 ok so the Reapers have already tried 3 ways to get out of deep space.... 1. the citidel     2. the collecters rebuilding a Reaper     3. The reapers coming though one of the mass relay's( DLC)
How do you guys think the Reapers will return in ME3?

I fail to see how option 2 was in any related to the reapers "getting out of dark space" since they were already on their way by the time ME 2 started, Whatever reason the collectors had to build that human-reaper it almost certainly had nothing to do with the reapers trek.

[Armass81]

Han Shot First wrote...

Blacklash93 wrote...

What's so difficult to comprehend about flying through space like a regular ship? It's not like Dark Space is some sort of cosmic barrier sealing them away.

The incredibly vast distances they'd have to travel? All mention of the Reapers in dark space implied that they were far enough out there that they needed Sovereign to open the Citadel relay to get there.

If the Reapers could just have just flown at normal FTL speeds to the Milky Way galaxy in a relatively short amount of time, the whole plot of ME1 and ME2 seems rather pointless. If it was so easy to reach the Milky Way galaxy, why didn't the Reapers just fly there when the Keepers failed to respond? They'd have caught the galaxy unaware in that case, and not telegraphed their next move by fighting and losing a battle at the Citadel.

I'm hoping in ME3 that the Reapers have 'found another way' to reach the Milky Way galaxy besides normal FTL travel. They should figure out how to open a wormhole or something similar without the use of relays, or agents of the Reapers within the Milky Way should have have reconfigured a relay to link with the Dark Space relay that originally linked to the Citadel. Either one would explain how they were able to reach the Milky Way in a relatively short amount of time while not invalidating the plot of the first two games.

I think it's more the distances using "conventional" travel that boggles people's minds.  If youre far enough from the galaxy that you can see it, that is a HUUUUUuuuuuge distance to travel just using ftl.

This.

That cutscene implied that the Reapers were extremely far out of the Milky Way, and deep in Dark Space. It should take them more than two years. Anyone that says otherwise, is underestimating the vastness of space. Even at the speed of light it would take you 100,000 years to fly from one end of the Milky Way galaxy to the other. And the Reapers were far outside the Milky Way.

As to why they wouldnt just start to travel when Sovereigns signal failed, my guess is they were still asleep, they would have continued to hibernate in ignorance if Sovereign wasnt able to send the signal. Sovereing probably managed to send the awakening signal through the Citadel to darkspace manually when he invaded it, but wasnt able to open the portal in time. So the reapers awoke and knew what happened but now had to travel to the galaxy the hard way.

Modifié par Armass81, 30 janvier 2012 - 03:54 .

[ediskrad327]

since the ending of ME1 they started to use FTL, i assume they got here in only 2 or 3 years becaue their FTL is more advanced than anyone in the galaxy

[chaosomegas]

reapers want save some energy to wipe out all advance races so wait on till all back up plans fail and they just far noth outside so they can't be see be any deep space scan. so im call reapers lazy they sleep 50000 years.

[Nobezy]

ItsFreakinJesus wrote...

Wait wait wait, maybe--should the Reapers be capable of said ridiculous FTL speed--reaching these speeds is a huge drain on resources. After all, they harvest the galaxy for a reason and they enter a state of hibernation for a reason. Maybe using the Relay network saves them time and energy. Maybe being delayed for 2000 years has gotten them desperate to the point where they'd risk their reserves.

Unlikely. Desperation born of impatience is not a reaper characteristic. You have to remember time is not of the essence for them, at all.