972 réponses à ce sujet

[android654]

Updated photo of the character with much needed lighting. I guess we can rule out a jumpsuit, for those of you trying to argue that it could be that.

[Errationatus]

Here are three things - please correct me if I'm mistaken - that seem to be the biggest concern with this character:

1)  Those who have not read or been exposed to the leak haven't the faintest clue who the hell this character is, since her reveal came first (again, correct me if I'm mistaken) in a vid about the voice actors, and not a character reveal.  It just seems rather odd that that is her debut.  It seems a little sneaky.

2) It seems as if the characters that people have invested a bit of emotional capital in ME2 are being ashcanned to fit these rather inexplicable additions into the plot.  Why give us Jack and Miri and Samara and Jacob and Thane if you're just going to give them 2 minute vignettes and quick demises?  It can look like a case of bad writing, bad plotting and all round "fvck you" to loyal fans. Were those characters just filler - padding the so-called "Dirty Dozen" vibe?  Why make them romancable at all if you simply summarily dismiss them come next chapter? This concern is a valid one, from a storytelling perspective.

3) Why is this character even necessary?  Why was she needed?  What purpose does she serve that could not be served by a codex entry or computer log or a remark by a crew member?  We are supposed to be getting ship banter from the NPCs and other squadmembers, no?  The chief question is really what is the bloody point to her?

Is it justifiable to say that Jack and the others didn't deserve a richer ending to their stories other than a quick, "Oh, hey, yeah, I liked you".  Bang. "Now I'm sad.  Oh, well, the war goes on." - and now game resources are taken up by new characters that do nothing but just mystify people by their rather sudden appearance?  

The galaxy is being assaulted by near-unstoppable eating machines that will usher in the extinction of all technical species in it.  Are people really going to sitting around in the debris (since what we see so far is Reapers munching away on most of the major cities on Earth by the beginning of the game) raptly paying attention to Diana chirping "Hey, survivors!  Well, it's a mondo-cool day out here in deep space, but dontcha all worry none, because hunky man Shepard is on the beam and just making sure to get it done!"  

Really?  C'mon.  Morale boosting?  "At least the vid monitor still works!  Huddle under the giant machines, Jenny, and we'll get inspired!"  "I found thermal clips under the collapsed ruins of Uncle John and Aunt Zelda!"  "To arms!"

Puh-leeze.

Again - what is the exact point to her - story wise?

Just strikes some folks - and myself - as a wee bit dodgy.

[1136342t54_]

android654 wrote...

Updated photo of the character with much needed lighting. I guess we can rule out a jumpsuit, for those of you trying to argue that it could be that.

No one is anymore not from what I'm seeing. I just said it could be a jump suit then said it was a dress afterwards.

[CrutchCricket]

JakeMacDon:
1. Yes we don't know anything about her and her reveal was a bit strange. The first part means nothing except: we don't know. The second is odd, but has Bioware done any character reveal apart from Vega? Clearly they wanted to announce Jessica's involvement but couldn't do so without revealing the character. So really revealing the character could be seen as an unavoidable side effect of marketing Jess' involvement. Still she's out now and has potential.

2. Not related to Diana but yes it seems all ME2 characters will be sidelined with no plausible explanation. However I don't believe they are being "pushed" aside by the new characters and certainly not by non-squad characters like Diana. After all that would be a plausible explanation.

3. I can't answer this fully without knowing what she does (and I won't know that till I play the game). But since she's comparable to Kelly, what was Kelly's purpose? Well for one, she was a crew NPC you could regularly interact with so at least it broke up the drone nature of non-combat crew. Diana's character could have similar uses in ME3. As for the character's role aboard the ship, check the OP. I think that's the best we've got right now.

Regarding the rest of your post:

No, the ME2 sidelining isn't justified by anything thus far. But nor is there any concrete evidence that it is caused by new characters and certainly not by non-squad ones like Diana.

The Reapers don't trash every planet instantly (if they did that it wouldn't be much of a war. Even when they come out the Citadel it still takes a century for them to completely wipe out all civilization). So people aren't sitting in debris watching Diana. But they may very well be sitting in their homes scared to death of the advancing meance and perhaps gaining a small measure of reassurance by watching Shepard's fight through Diana's efforts.

I don't know where those quotes are from but if they're from the leak can you please remove them? They're meaningless without context but better safe than sorry.

Modifié par CrutchCricket, 02 février 2012 - 02:23 .

[slimgrin]

Seems like an odd suit for a war time reporter. At first I thought it was a sports bra. I guess it's a tube skirt. If she taps the Alliance symbol on her left boob can she acces the ship's computer?

Modifié par slimgrin, 02 février 2012 - 02:41 .

[CrutchCricket]

I'm not sure what to make of the outfit. The more I think about it (and look at the picture) the more I start agreeing with android that it doesn't really make sense in any setting...
Maybe they've implemented alternate non-squad outfits? Or this is just a rough draft? Who knows?

Modifié par CrutchCricket, 02 février 2012 - 02:31 .

[Cossack72]

CrutchCricket wrote...

I'm not sure what to make of the outfit. The more I think about it (and look at the picture) the more I start agreeing with android that it doesn't really make sense in any setting...
Maybe they've implemented alternate non-squad outfits? Or this is just a rough draft? Who knows?

Maybe, but the game does come out in a month. That's gotta say something. I dunno what, but it says something

[Errationatus]

CrutchCricket wrote...

JakeMacDon:
1. Yes we don't know anything about her and her reveal was a bit strange. The first part means nothing except: we don't know. The second is odd, but has Bioware done any character reveal apart from Vega?
 

 

Technically?  Garrus, Tali, Liara, Ash, Anderson, Wrex, and Mordin could all be considered reveals.  They were revealed in context, whereas Diana was just kinda "Oh, her too, by the way".  Fishy.

 
Clearly they wanted to announce Jessica's involvement but couldn't do so without revealing the character. So really revealing the character could be seen as an unavoidable side effect of marketing Jess' involvement. Still she's out now and has potential.

Potential for what?  Why her, when we can't get decent arc-endings to the ones we're already in?  Not all of us are friggin' Talislobberers.  <_<
 

 
2. Not related to Diana but yes it seems all ME2 characters will be sidelined with no plausible explanation.

 

Do we not deserve one? Because if the addition of superfluous and technically unnecessary characters (Vega and Allers, IMO) is it, I'm not frelling impressed.

 
However I don't believe they are being "pushed" aside by the new characters and certainly not by non-squad characters like Diana. After all that would be a plausible explanation.

 

Don't buy it myself, I'm afraid.  There's only so much space to accomplish telling your story.  In good storytelling, you don't add characters that can have profound impacts on the main character's life in the second act of a trilogy and then just sh!tcan them in the last act. It invalidates why they were there at all.  It makes the story shallow and all the people who went "oh, I spaced her cause she was ugly" justified.  Who cares about the characters then?  Why should we?  Why did I waste forty hours and a hundred bucks giving a damn, then?  

Frankly, I think we've been and are being had, and we just have to suck on it if we want to see how it ends.

 
3. I can't answer this fully without knowing what she does (and I won't know that till I play the game). But since she's comparable to Kelly, what was Kelly's purpose? Well for one, she was a crew NPC you could regularly interact with so at least it broke up the drone nature of non-combat crew. Diana's character could have similar uses in ME3. As for the character's role aboard the ship, check the OP. I think that's the best we've got right now.

 

That just beggars the question of what was wrong with Kelly?  What was wrong with, for example, bringing Miri back as a consultant that knows all about Cerebrus? We can continue the romance.  We get actual valuable insight into combatting the enemy.  So she's not a squadmate, but she stays relevant.  Why do we need this reporter?  What possible purpose does she serve storywise other than padding?

 
Regarding the rest of your post:

No, the ME2 sidelining isn't justified by anything thus far. But nor is there any concrete evidence that it is caused by new characters and certainly not by non-squad ones like Diana.

 

As I said, you have to find the space somewhere.  

 
The Reapers don't trash every planet instantly (if they did that it wouldn't be much of a war. Even when they come out the Citadel it still takes a century for them to completely wipe out all civilization).

 

True, but Diana is an ANN reporter.  She is showing Humanity what's up.  However, at the beginning of the game, Reapers are everywhere on Earth.  They are everywhere.  They are smashing ships and crushing cities, and slurping up tasty, tasty humans.  Just who are the intended recipients of her morale-boosting cleavaged, round-cheeked news?The colonies?  The asari?  By all ME2 intimations, the Reapers are primarily after humans this time around.  Whose morale is she to be boosting?  A smashed and powerless Earth's?  Yeah, that'll help.

 
So people aren't sitting in debris watching Diana. But they may very well be sitting in their homes scared to death of the advancing meance and perhaps gaining a small measure of reassurance by watching Shepard's fight through Diana's efforts.

  

Well, if from what we've seen, sitting watching TV is the last thing most sane people would doing with two km high ships smashing everything in sight.  Maybe that's just me, though.  I mean, the folks on the coastlines in Japan weren't sitting and watching telly when that tsunami was blowing in, were they?  These are Reapers, ferfvck'ssake - not some measly killer waves.

Again, I have to ask - what's the point to this reporter? Sudden thought: Is she there to chronicle it for the endgame? Is she ME3's Varric?  Jeeesus Ker-iced.

  
I don't know where those quotes are from but if they're from the leak can you please remove them? They're meaningless without context but better safe than sorry.

They're my own and they're meant to be ironic/sarcastic.  I think they illustrate what I was saying rather well, and not all that meaningless in context.

Modifié par JakeMacDon, 02 février 2012 - 03:11 .

[HolyJellyfish]

android654 wrote...

Updated photo of the character with much needed lighting. I guess we can rule out a jumpsuit, for those of you trying to argue that it could be that.

Her body looks fantastic. But her face could use some work. Another really weird point about this character.

[Golden Owl]

JakeMacDon wrote...
-snip-


That just beggars the question of what was wrong with Kelly?  What was wrong with, for example, bringing Miri back as a consultant that knows all about Cerebrus? We can continue the romance.  We get actual valuable i
The Reapers don't trash every planet instantly (if they did that it wouldn't be much of a war. Even when they come
So people aren't sitting in debris watching Diana. But they may very well be sitting in their homes scared to death of the advancing meance and perhaps gaining a small measure of reassurance by watching Shepard's fight through Diana's efforts.

Well, if from what we've seen, sitting watching TV is the last thing most sane people would doing with two km high ships smashing everything in sight.  Maybe that's just me, though.  I mean, the folks on the coastlines in Japan weren't sitting and watching telly when that tsunami was blowing in, were they?  These are Reapers, ferfvck'ssake - not some measly killer waves.

Again, I have to ask - what's the point to this reporter? Sudden thought: Is she there to chronicle it for the endgame? Is she ME3's Varric?  Jeeesus Ker-iced.

Have you seen 'Terminator Salvation'?....In an all out Earth is being annihilated war...survivors wouldn't be crowding around TV's in their living rooms, but hiding out with battery powered radio communication (even one way frontline war updates) would be invaluable and 'yes' a morale booster....that makes sense...silence from the frontline would be the worst possible thing to go through, not knowing if your species stands a chance at survival or not.

Modifié par Golden Owl, 02 février 2012 - 03:37 .

[Asenza]

Allers looks like they stuffed apples under her skin >_>... please tell me she won't look like that in a month...

[Die Varieties]

android654 wrote...

Updated photo of the character with much needed lighting. I guess we can rule out a jumpsuit, for those of you trying to argue that it could be that.

@android:  No big deal but it's always appropriate to make sure to provide proper credit on that particular screenshot.  I took that screenshot from the BW Voice Acting video and uploaded to my server at www.dvnmagazine.com.  Ok?  Thanks.

Die Varieties

[Errationatus]

Golden Owl wrote...

Have you seen 'Terminator Salvation'?....In an all out Earth is being annihilated war...survivors wouldn't be crowding around TV's in their living rooms, but hiding out with battery powered radio communication (even one way frontline war updates) would be invaluable and 'yes' a morale booster....that makes sense...silence from the frontline would be the worst possible thing to go through, not knowing if your species stands a chance at survival or not.

Personally, I'd rather hear that from Shepard.

Now - Dispatches from the Front:

"Ladies and Gentlemen, this is Commander Shepard.  I won't lie to you, things are not going as well as you might hope, but I can assure you - as I stopped Saren and Sovereign, as I stopped the Collectors, I will stop the Reapers.  It looks hopeless.  It. Is. Not.  With the races of the galaxy rallying to our side, we will prevail.  Stay strong,  we are human, and this is what we do best: we prevail.  We triumph in the end.  Everyone fight in your own way, as you can, even if it is just by standing up and keeping each other safe, helping each other out.  I'll fight for you out here - you fight for me, at home. This is Commander Shepard, and I will never stop."

Yay!!  Shepard!!  Fvck those Reaper douches!  This means more. 

...

The reporter chick, is, IMO, unnecessary, and her inclusion smells of ..something.

Modifié par JakeMacDon, 02 février 2012 - 04:13 .

[Cossack72]

JakeMacDon wrote...

Golden Owl wrote...

Have you seen 'Terminator Salvation'?....In an all out Earth is being annihilated war...survivors wouldn't be crowding around TV's in their living rooms, but hiding out with battery powered radio communication (even one way frontline war updates) would be invaluable and 'yes' a morale booster....that makes sense...silence from the frontline would be the worst possible thing to go through, not knowing if your species stands a chance at survival or not.

Personally, I'd rather hear that from Shepard.

Now - Dispatches from the Front:

"Ladies and Gentlemen, this is Commander Shepard.  I won't lie to you, things are not going as well as you might hope, but I can assure you - as I stopped Saren and Sovereign, as I stopped the Collectors, I will stop the Reapers.  It looks hopeless.  It. Is. Not.  With the races of the galaxy rallying to our side, we will prevail.  Stay strong,  we are human, and this is what we do best: we prevail.  We triumph in the end.  Everyone fight in your own way, as you can, even if it is just by standing up and keeping each other safe, helping each other out.  I'll fight for you out here - you fight for me, at home. This is Commander Shepard, and I will never stop."

Yay!!  Shepard!!  Fvck those Reaper douches!  This means more. 

...

The reporter chick, is, IMO, unnecessary, and her inclusion smells of ..something.

I'll probably boot her ass off first chance because I'm convinced she's a spy.

Modifié par Cossack72, 02 février 2012 - 04:16 .

[Golden Owl]

JakeMacDon wrote...

Golden Owl wrote...

Have you seen 'Terminator Salvation'?....In an all out Earth is being annihilated war...survivors wouldn't be crowding around TV's in their living rooms, but hiding out with battery powered radio communication (even one way frontline war updates) would be invaluable and 'yes' a morale booster....that makes sense...silence from the frontline would be the worst possible thing to go through, not knowing if your species stands a chance at survival or not.

Personally, I'd rather hear that from Shepard.

Now - Dispatches from the Front:

"Ladies and Gentlemen, this is Commander Shepard.  I won't lie to you, things are not going as well as you might hope, but I can assure you - as I stopped Saren and Sovereign, as I stopped the Collectors, I will stop the Reapers.  It looks hopeless.  It. Is. Not.  With the races of the galaxy rallying to our side, we will prevail.  Stay strong,  we are human, and this is what we do best: we prevail.  We triumph in the end.  Everyone fight in your own way, as you can, even if it is just by standing up and keeping each other safe, helping each other out.  I'll fight for you out here - you fight for me, at home. This is Commander Shepard, and I will never stop."

Yay!!  Shepard!!  Fvck those Reaper douches!  This means more. 

...

The reporter chick, is, IMO, unnecessary, and her inclusion smells of ..something.

Yes I agree, hearing it from Shep him/herself would be the optimal option...though this Diana is the one with the equipment to do so,or so I would hazard a guess....I also agree with you in regards to Diana's inclusion, an Alliance reporter being placed aboard the Normandy is very suspect...with the attack on Earth, the Alliance and Council can not deny the reality of the Reapers anymore, so what more does Shep have to prove, why does s/he need a reporter, I wasn't thrilled when I read a reporter will be onboard the Normandy, but am reserving judgement in the hopes of possibly a great character....my fingers are crossed.

[PrinceLionheart]

JakeMacDon wrote...

2) It seems as if the characters that people have invested a bit of emotional capital in ME2 are being ashcanned to fit these rather inexplicable additions into the plot.  Why give us Jack and Miri and Samara and Jacob and Thane if you're just going to give them 2 minute vignettes and quick demises?  It can look like a case of bad writing, bad plotting and all round "fvck you" to loyal fans. Were those characters just filler - padding the so-called "Dirty Dozen" vibe?  Why make them romancable at all if you simply summarily dismiss them come next chapter? This concern is a valid one, from a storytelling perspective.

ME2 was absolutely filler. As much as people kept insisting to the contrary, Bioware wrote themselves into a corner with the suicide mission. In the long run, ME2 in it's entirety was padding. Sure, there was some developments with the Krogan and Geth/Quarian conflict, but the game ended with Shepard literally back to where he was at the end of ME1. It took "The Arrival" for the plot to actually move forward.

That rant aside, I don't think Bioware demoted them out of apathy, it's just an unfortunate side-effect of the import feature. The Import-Feature really is a Catch-22; writing and developing-wise, it creates limitations.

Modifié par PrinceLionheart, 02 février 2012 - 04:46 .

[HolyJellyfish]

PrinceLionheart wrote...

JakeMacDon wrote...

2) It seems as if the characters that people have invested a bit of emotional capital in ME2 are being ashcanned to fit these rather inexplicable additions into the plot.  Why give us Jack and Miri and Samara and Jacob and Thane if you're just going to give them 2 minute vignettes and quick demises?  It can look like a case of bad writing, bad plotting and all round "fvck you" to loyal fans. Were those characters just filler - padding the so-called "Dirty Dozen" vibe?  Why make them romancable at all if you simply summarily dismiss them come next chapter? This concern is a valid one, from a storytelling perspective.

ME2 was absolutely filler. As much as people kept insisting to the contrary, Bioware wrote themselves into a corner with the suicide mission. In the long run, ME2 in it's entirety was padding. Sure, there was some developments with the Krogan and Geth/Quarian conflict, but the game ended with Shepard literally back to where he was at the end of ME1. It took "The Arrival" for the plot to actually move forward.

I'm not sure about Filler. If anything, I enjoyed ME2's expediency, suicide mission vibes, characters about to die, and its very simple, flatline approach.

It had just as many important plot decisions as ME1, really. (Which was like... Three decisions?)

I just hope ME3 holds no bars. If its the last game, show that you mean it. Hell, give us Chrono Trigger level alternative endings if need be. This is your opportunity. Do eeeeeet.

[PrinceLionheart]

HolyJellyfish wrote...

PrinceLionheart wrote...

JakeMacDon wrote...

2) It seems as if the characters that people have invested a bit of emotional capital in ME2 are being ashcanned to fit these rather inexplicable additions into the plot.  Why give us Jack and Miri and Samara and Jacob and Thane if you're just going to give them 2 minute vignettes and quick demises?  It can look like a case of bad writing, bad plotting and all round "fvck you" to loyal fans. Were those characters just filler - padding the so-called "Dirty Dozen" vibe?  Why make them romancable at all if you simply summarily dismiss them come next chapter? This concern is a valid one, from a storytelling perspective.

ME2 was absolutely filler. As much as people kept insisting to the contrary, Bioware wrote themselves into a corner with the suicide mission. In the long run, ME2 in it's entirety was padding. Sure, there was some developments with the Krogan and Geth/Quarian conflict, but the game ended with Shepard literally back to where he was at the end of ME1. It took "The Arrival" for the plot to actually move forward.

I'm not sure about Filler. If anything, I enjoyed ME2's expediency, suicide mission vibes, characters about to die, and its very simple, flatline approach.

It had just as many important plot decisions as ME1, really. (Which was like... Three decisions?)

I just hope ME3 holds no bars. If its the last game, show that you mean it. Hell, give us Chrono Trigger level alternative endings if need be. This is your opportunity. Do eeeeeet.

Yes, ME2 had some nice side missions, but the actual plot hardly moved forward at all. That's why I call it filler.

[BioWareM0d13]

Can I send  Allers on a ride through Zaeed's trash compactor? Pretty please. The more I read about this character the more I want her to be spaced.

[CrutchCricket]

JakeMacDon, I don't agree with some of your points but you ask very good questions. However I don't know the answers and I doubt anyone currently in this thread does. It is also beyond the scope of this thread to seek these answers. I would suggest you (and anyone else who needs to know) ask the devs directly. If you find anything out I'm sure people will be interested in knowing.

[Golden Owl]

Question:

How does everyone here feel about Diane's inclusion?...I'm concerned, it was obvious after the inclusion of Vega that there was a new female LI niche to fill, I was hoping and praying that place would go to Kasumi.....I am remaining nuetral about Diana at this point, disappointed (due to wanting Kasumi to get that niche) but admittedly curious about this new character....She is no Kasumi, but if she is a lighter, funnier, more upbeat character than the current LI offerings and more Kasumi like, I will remain dissappointed that it's not Kasumi, but would at least give my Shep a chance not to end ME3 alone....What do others think?

[PMC65]

android654 wrote...

Updated photo of the character with much needed lighting. I guess we can rule out a jumpsuit, for those of you trying to argue that it could be that.

At $70.00 a pop for the CE people on the Normandy better look mucho better then what I see when I look in the mirror or shopping at Wal-Mart/Target. She can stay on the Normandy unless Ashley or Liara start to say otherwise in regards to their respective Shepards ... If they yell too much then those Shepards might have to ask her to leave.

My single female Shepard if Ash isn't an option might be going to her for *ahem* comfort! 

I wonder if she flirts with Vega if they both are non-romanced? Hmmmm.
  

[Pockles]

android654 wrote...
Updated photo of the character with much needed lighting. I guess we can rule out a jumpsuit, for those of you trying to argue that it could be that.

Whenever I look at this picture, all I can think about are her boobs and that incredibly sexy clavicle.

I like to admire those awesome looking wrinkles in her dress once I manage to cover her upper half with my hand, though.

Modifié par Pockles, 02 février 2012 - 08:37 .

[Yakko77]

PMC65 wrote...

android654 wrote...

Updated photo of the character with much needed lighting. I guess we can rule out a jumpsuit, for those of you trying to argue that it could be that.

At $70.00 a pop for the CE people on the Normandy better look mucho better then what I see when I look in the mirror or shopping at Wal-Mart/Target. She can stay on the Normandy unless Ashley or Liara start to say otherwise in regards to their respective Shepards ... If they yell too much then those Shepards might have to ask her to leave.

My single female Shepard if Ash isn't an option might be going to her for *ahem* comfort! 

I wonder if she flirts with Vega if they both are non-romanced? Hmmmm.
  

It's a tight outfit with moderate cleavage at best.  There is so much worse in so many games.  Why so many are having a fit about it is beyond me....

Give the freakin' voice actress and the game writers afreakin' chance....

Sheesh!!!!

<_<

Modifié par Yakko77, 02 février 2012 - 09:00 .