1833 réponses à ce sujet

[Yuoaman]

AVPen wrote...

How is that that we went for 400+ pages in the last thread with not a single person defending Deception or its flaws, but now that Bioware and Del Ray have officially appologized for the novel being so damn poor, they've started coming out of the wood-work? 

I know, it's bizarre as hell - the book is **** no matter how you slice it.

[izmirtheastarach]

Oh sure, now you all show up. Leave me all alone to bang my head against a wall, why don't you.

Modifié par izmirtheastarach, 05 février 2012 - 07:07 .

[Obrusnine]

Chris Priestly wrote...

Mass Effect fans have been asking for a comment on recent concerns over Mass Effect: Deception. We have been listening and have the below response on the issue.

The teams at Del Rey and BioWare would like to extend our sincerest apologies to the Mass Effect fans for any errors and oversights made in the recent novel Mass Effect: Deception.  We are currently working on a number of changes that will appear in future editions of the novel. 

We would like to thank all Mass Effect fans for their passion and dedication to this ever-growing world, and assure them that we are listening and taking this matter very seriously.

They needed to make calibrations to this novel.

[AVPen]

didymos1120 wrote...

AVPen wrote...

How is that that we went for 400+ pages in the last thread with not a single person defending Deception or its flaws, but now that Bioware and Del Ray have officially appologized for the novel being so damn poor, they've started coming out of the wood-work? 

Well, there was that Luigitornado guy who dropped in every so often.

Hmmm, true.... was he really defending Deception, though, or was he just being an ass****?
(can't remember.... my memory of trolls is kinda short, for the most part)

Modifié par AVPen, 05 février 2012 - 07:06 .

[izmirtheastarach]

AVPen wrote...

Hmmm, true.... was he really defending Deception, though, or was he just being an ass****?
(my memory of trolls is kinda short, for the most part)

I kind of felt like he genuinely thought it was good enough. Some people just have low standards, I guess.

Modifié par izmirtheastarach, 05 février 2012 - 07:07 .

[dreman9999]

izmirtheastarach wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Reguardless of what you say , I have a point. You can go on and needlessly attack me but it won't change the facts and info I brought up that  put this "argument" in my favor.

No one is attacking you. But you don't get to "win" an argument just because you decide to. Other people disagree with you. You presented no information of any kind. I saw no studies on high-functioning Autism. You just said a bunch of things that amounted to your own opinion. Well congratulations on having an opinion.

And I made my counter point to it and other agree with me. You also have yet to counter my counter points. I'm not trying to be antagonistic here. I just wanted to bring up to issues.
And yes I have put  up example of people who have autisum and live normal lives. I can link you to agein if you like.
I never said Deception is a good book or even handled Gillians autisum well. Just that it is possible that she can deal with it and be a normal person. For the thrid time,I'm just say they need to refenceto it in some way in the book, at lease show how she handle herself when she is overwhelmed.
 Also, with Kai leng's killing of Graysons girlfriend was not a thing of racisum, even if Kai lang is a rasist, he would of killed her anyway if she was human.

[dreman9999]

izmirtheastarach wrote...

Gokuthegrate wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Gokuthegrate wrote...

Im hoping that the revision of the book is done by Drew Karpyshyn.

They should make Dietz rewrite the book with Drew standing behing him the whole time with a ruler in hand to be use to "correct" Dietz for any mistake.

Hed screw it up even with Drew's help.
Im hoping that he is never brought into another ME project again.

Since he already got paid, I doubt there is much incentive for him to try and do anything to fix it now.

Then I demade they charge him for every mistake he made that need to be fixed. That will get him back.

[izmirtheastarach]

dreman9999 wrote...

And I made my counter point to it and other agree with me. You also have yet to counter my counter points. I'm not trying to be antagonistic here. I just wanted to bring up to issues.
And yes I have put  up example of people who have autisum and live normal lives. I can link you to agein if you like.
I never said Deception is a good book or even handled Gillians autisum well. Just that it is possible that she can deal with it and be a normal person. For the thrid time,I'm just say they need to refenceto it in some way in the book, at lease show how she handle herself when she is overwhelmed.
 Also, with Kai leng's killing of Graysons girlfriend was not a thing of racisum, even if Kai lang is a rasist, he would of killed her anyway if she was human.

No one agreed with you. Man, your posts are hard to read. I do love how you to continue to argue points that are completely irrelevent. It's quirky. Shine on, you crazy diamond.

Modifié par izmirtheastarach, 05 février 2012 - 07:13 .

[BentOrgy]

AVPen wrote...

How is that that we went for 400+ pages in the last thread with not a single person defending Deception or its flaws, but now that Bioware and Del Ray have officially appologized for the novel being so damn poor, they've started coming out of the wood-work? 

...... Mass Effect Fields?

[ZehnWaters]

AVPen wrote...

How is that that we went for 400+ pages in the last thread with not a single person defending Deception or its flaws, but now that Bioware and Del Ray have officially appologized for the novel being so damn poor, they've started coming out of the wood-work? 

Oh, I wasn't trying to defend it, I'm just saying there's at least a reasonable explanation for *one* of his litany of mistakes.

[MissOuJ]

dreman9999 wrote...
And I made my counter point to it and other agree with me. You also have yet to counter my counter points. I'm not trying to be antagonistic here. I just wanted to bring up to issues.
And yes I have put  up example of people who have autisum and live normal lives. I can link you to agein if you like.
I never said Deception is a good book or even handled Gillians autisum well. Just that it is possible that she can deal with it and be a normal person.

Seriously, this is my main problem with how Gillian's autism is handled. Coping with autism can be incredibly challenging, and people with autism have many different coping mechanisms/ways to deal with their disability. To handwave this by claiming autism is just a childhood phrase she got over is incredibly insulting. You don't really get over the fact your brain and nervous system function differently from the rest of the population (and the problem for most high-functioning autistics is to learn to live in a world that has been built by neurotypical people for neurotypical people so they have to learn to live in it by trial and error).

Having autistic characters is awesome. Displaying them as individuals who have learned to live among neurotypical population and discussing the different way they see the world isn't a problem. It's handwaving the disability in the first place that makes my blood boil.

[BentOrgy]

And Dreman, honestly; what the hell are you trying to achieve here? Gillian's no longer autistic, that's a massive problem. What is there to debate? Its not that it "Wasn't handled well," its that it wasn't handled AT ALL.

And the people that "Live normal lives," in your "Examples," are probably not biotic test-beds who had extreme social issues to the point where they freaked out by just being touched, and unleashed singularities from being teased, and they probably didn't endure the hell that Gillian did.

There's no real comparison here, and again, its a moot point because ITS NEVER COVERED. Ever, not once. So this entire discussion was doomed from the beginning.

[izmirtheastarach]

ZehnWaters wrote...

AVPen wrote...

How is that that we went for 400+ pages in the last thread with not a single person defending Deception or its flaws, but now that Bioware and Del Ray have officially appologized for the novel being so damn poor, they've started coming out of the wood-work? 

Oh, I wasn't trying to defend it, I'm just saying there's at least a reasonable explanation for *one* of his litany of mistakes.

I tire of saying this, but there are reasonable explanations for a great many of this issues. The problem is that none of the explanations are actually in the book.

[Xannerz]

Hey, everyone, just curious: has the author released his own statement yet?

[izmirtheastarach]

Xannerz wrote...

Hey, everyone, just curious: has the author released his own statement yet?

I've not seen anything since his initial response to our concerns last week.

[BentOrgy]

izmirtheastarach wrote...

Xannerz wrote...

Hey, everyone, just curious: has the author released his own statement yet?

I've not seen anything since his initial response to our concerns last week.

I hear he's hiding out somwhere in Antartica, trading his books with the local illiterate penguins for half eaten fish until this whole mess dies down.

Modifié par BentOrgy, 05 février 2012 - 07:35 .

[Yuoaman]

dreman9999 wrote...

izmirtheastarach wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Reguardless of what you say , I have a point. You can go on and needlessly attack me but it won't change the facts and info I brought up that  put this "argument" in my favor.

No one is attacking you. But you don't get to "win" an argument just because you decide to. Other people disagree with you. You presented no information of any kind. I saw no studies on high-functioning Autism. You just said a bunch of things that amounted to your own opinion. Well congratulations on having an opinion.

And I made my counter point to it and other agree with me. You also have yet to counter my counter points. I'm not trying to be antagonistic here. I just wanted to bring up to issues.
And yes I have put  up example of people who have autisum and live normal lives. I can link you to agein if you like.
I never said Deception is a good book or even handled Gillians autisum well. Just that it is possible that she can deal with it and be a normal person. For the thrid time,I'm just say they need to refenceto it in some way in the book, at lease show how she handle herself when she is overwhelmed.
 Also, with Kai leng's killing of Graysons girlfriend was not a thing of racisum, even if Kai lang is a rasist, he would of killed her anyway if she was human.

The problem is that Gillian is one of our viewpoint characters, and never once is there any indication that she has to 'cope' with her condition.

[Pinatu]

Chris Priestly wrote...

We are currently working on a number of changes that will appear in future editions of the novel.

Well, well... Good to know !
Thanks from Polish ME fans !

Modifié par pinatu, 05 février 2012 - 07:53 .

[dreman9999]

BentOrgy wrote...

And Dreman, honestly; what the hell are you trying to achieve here? Gillian's no longer autistic, that's a massive problem. What is there to debate? Its not that it "Wasn't handled well," its that it wasn't handled AT ALL.

And the people that "Live normal lives," in your "Examples," are probably not biotic test-beds who had extreme social issues to the point where they freaked out by just being touched, and unleashed singularities from being teased, and they probably didn't endure the hell that Gillian did.

There's no real comparison here, and again, its a moot point because ITS NEVER COVERED. Ever, not once. So this entire discussion was doomed from the beginning.

Again,the experiments on her is a factor to this. It's still possible to cope with it if she is in the right conditions and she was in the right conditions.
I'm not say her autisum should be gone, just that it's possible that she can cope with it.

[dreman9999]

Yuoaman wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

izmirtheastarach wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Reguardless of what you say , I have a point. You can go on and needlessly attack me but it won't change the facts and info I brought up that  put this "argument" in my favor.

No one is attacking you. But you don't get to "win" an argument just because you decide to. Other people disagree with you. You presented no information of any kind. I saw no studies on high-functioning Autism. You just said a bunch of things that amounted to your own opinion. Well congratulations on having an opinion.

And I made my counter point to it and other agree with me. You also have yet to counter my counter points. I'm not trying to be antagonistic here. I just wanted to bring up to issues.
And yes I have put  up example of people who have autisum and live normal lives. I can link you to agein if you like.
I never said Deception is a good book or even handled Gillians autisum well. Just that it is possible that she can deal with it and be a normal person. For the thrid time,I'm just say they need to refenceto it in some way in the book, at lease show how she handle herself when she is overwhelmed.
 Also, with Kai leng's killing of Graysons girlfriend was not a thing of racisum, even if Kai lang is a rasist, he would of killed her anyway if she was human.

The problem is that Gillian is one of our viewpoint characters, and never once is there any indication that she has to 'cope' with her condition.

Which is why I said it was handled badly.

[Yuoaman]

The fact that it wasn't handled at all is the problem - if Dietz had read Ascension at all he never would have written Gillian's POV the way he did. And the drugs that Cerberus were pumping her full of only served to exacerbate her condition, they didn't create it.

[izmirtheastarach]

Drew Karpyshan just tweeted:

Still haven't read #Deception, but here's proof BioWare's reputation for listening to fans is well earned: http://social.biowar...-9150901-1.html #MassEffect

[Destroydacre]

While I am glad that the ridiculous amount of errors contained in this "novel" were acknowledged, I share concerns that others have already listed that this book is beyond saving. There's so much wrong with the entire story that a few fixes here and there aren't gonna cut it. I don't see how this story can be at all salvaged without completely striking it out and starting over. JMO

[BentOrgy]

dreman9999 wrote...

BentOrgy wrote...

And Dreman, honestly; what the hell are you trying to achieve here? Gillian's no longer autistic, that's a massive problem. What is there to debate? Its not that it "Wasn't handled well," its that it wasn't handled AT ALL.

And the people that "Live normal lives," in your "Examples," are probably not biotic test-beds who had extreme social issues to the point where they freaked out by just being touched, and unleashed singularities from being teased, and they probably didn't endure the hell that Gillian did.

There's no real comparison here, and again, its a moot point because ITS NEVER COVERED. Ever, not once. So this entire discussion was doomed from the beginning.

Again,the experiments on her is a factor to this. It's still possible to cope with it if she is in the right conditions and she was in the right conditions.
I'm not say her autisum should be gone, just that it's possible that she can cope with it.

*Sigh*

That's not the point. That's never been the point; ever since i posted on the subject, it was in regards to the fact that she had apparently "Recovered from autism," because she's no longer autistic. I was being sarcastic. The idea (Idea, not fact.) that Gillian could have coped with her condition to the level Dietz potrayed (Again, highly unlikely.) is not the issue, its the fact that he made it possible because she's now just another teen with a troubled past. That's. Not. Okay. No matter how you look at it.

Modifié par BentOrgy, 05 février 2012 - 08:44 .

[XXIceColdXX]

izmirtheastarach wrote...

Drew Karpyshan just tweeted:

Still haven't read #Deception, but here's proof BioWare's reputation for listening to fans is well earned: http://social.biowar...-9150901-1.html #MassEffect

He may or may not have read it, but id put money on it that he has checked out the googledocs list of errors.