352 réponses à ce sujet

[P3G4SU5]

Lizardviking wrote...

WizenSlinky0 wrote...
Of course I've seen it, and I found it to be an overhyped rendition of the whole native american thing.

I attempted to connect the dots based on the context. You seemed to imply that they undue'ing presented the natives as "in the right", when the humans actions were justifiable and logical (aka. being realistic).

I was simply using that parallel to identify that logical very rarely factors into human thought processes when determining "who is in the right", which makes it hyper-realism for taking into account natural human reaction to cold-calculated decisions.

If my assumptions on where you were heading were wrong, then sorry? I guess.

I admit I am only making an asumption that the humans goal were reasonable, because the movie never tells why unoptanium is important, which just goes to show that the movie never bothers to explain their side of the conflict. The movie from the get-go pretty much paints the Na'vi as selfless, in-tune-with-nature, peacefull and noble, while the PMC are just a bunch greedy and savage ****s.

I'm not sure it would have mattered if we'd known what the humans used the material for. It comes down to basic morality.

In the film, the Na'vi's planet had a resource that the humans wanted and so they took it. The fact they
were on a planet belonging to another race and had no claim to any of the resources there didn't matter to them.

Further to this they could have extracted the material they wanted from other areas of the planet, but instead they aggessively sought after the unoptanium-rich area directly below the natives' holy site/home with no regard to their rights. Their little mission to get the main protagonist on the inside with the Na'vi was just an extremely expensive and convoluted way to find out whether the natives would surrender their lands before the humans made a move on the unobtanium there.

Back on topic: The worst ending would be that the Normandy and a handful of ships have to fly close to the giant Reapers and drop bombs down small exhaust pipes on the exterior Reaper ships. Then in the victory celebration that follows, Udina reveals to Shepard that he is his biological father. "NOOOoooo!" 

[TheInvicibleCandyBar]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...

I don't want really stupid stuff in my Mass Effect game.

Mass Effect sold itself on having to make hard choices. That implies a certain level of maturity. Stupid and life and death decisions don't mix.

No, Mass Effect sold itself on dancing volus and singing salarians.  Its charm comes from presenting mature themes with extreme real-life significance right alongside boob jokes and driving straight up a vertical cliff.

One minute, you're drunk off your ass in a bar on a space station.  The next, you are fighting your way through hell, guns blazing.  After that, you are laughing your ass off at some guy who just made an unintentionally hilarious comment.  Then you're in love.  Then you're heartbroken.  Then you're winning.  Then you're losing.  Then you're deciding the fate of an entire species.

And you get home in time to feed the fish.  Sometimes.

It's all that stuff together that makes it Mass Effect.

You just summed up why I love mass effect so much!!! Please, marry me
(Disclaimer: I never feed the fish)

[P3G4SU5]

Saphra Deden wrote...

P3G4SU5 wrote...


I'm not sure it would have mattered if we'd known what the humans used the material for. It comes down to basic morality.

Yeah, it does.

Is the propserity and survival of your kin, your family, your ancestors, your descendents, your friends, your society, more important than the welfare of another society?

Only idiot liberals think that it isn't.

As I said before, it is a case of morality. What makes the life of one member of a society more important than that of another? What makes the needs of one race greater than that of another? If the survival of your kin would mean the continued existance of the selfish standpoint you're touting, I'd argue it would be better for all parties if it were to die out. The road from your avenue of thinking leads to all sorts of ugly places. I suppose you think racism or genocide are accepable so long as one people benefit from the act. Variation is strength - and as such it's wrong to believe that one people are inherently more valuable/entitled than another. Regardless, it seems you have an uncurable case of self-entitlement, so I'll end my participation in this exchange and leave you to your misguided belief.

[Diveos]

Holy f. It's like reading the Free republic from Saphra Deden. I'm so confused as to what happened to BSN.

[KotorEffect3]

Saphra Deden wrote...

P3G4SU5 wrote...

As I said before, it is a case of morality. What makes the life of one member of a society more important than that of another? What makes the needs of one race greater than that of another?

You are looking to some higher power as if the universe will judge you. It won't. A species survives or it doesn't. There is no right or wrong in the grand scheme of things.

Though I personally think it is immoral to put the needs of a "they" or "them" or "others" above the needs of your own family/tribe/nation/whatever.

Put it this way: humanity is under no obligation to sit there and die so that another species may live. The reverse is also true; no species is obligated to die for us, nor should they be expected to.

Nobody is asking us to sacrifice our whole damn species.

[incinerator950]

Luc0s wrote...

TexasToast712 wrote...

Haasth wrote...

Worst possible outcome?

No one dies. At all. No casualties, everyone lives and makes it out happily ever after.
Mass Effect 2 style.

I hate people like you. ****ing death obsessed emo.

I hate people like you. ****ing idealistic hippie.

I hate all of you.

[KotorEffect3]

incinerator950 wrote...

Luc0s wrote...

TexasToast712 wrote...

Haasth wrote...

Worst possible outcome?

No one dies. At all. No casualties, everyone lives and makes it out happily ever after.
Mass Effect 2 style.

I hate people like you. ****ing death obsessed emo.

I hate people like you. ****ing idealistic hippie.

I hate all of you.

Kelly Chambers is crying somewhere.

[KotorEffect3]

Saphra Deden wrote...

KotorEffect3 wrote...

Nobody is asking us to sacrifice our whole damn species.

Yes they are doing just that when they're trying to tell us that we have no right to take what we need to survive or flourish.

The universe is mean and unforgiving.

Before we go any further, who is "they"?

[Volus Warlord]

Saphra Deden wrote...

KotorEffect3 wrote...

Nobody is asking us to sacrifice our whole damn species.

Yes they are doing just that when they're trying to tell us that we have no right to take what we need to survive or flourish.

The universe is mean and unforgiving.

Oh cmon. We can all just sit around a campfire, sing and sniff red sand and everything will be O.K. 

[Volus Warlord]

KotorEffect3 wrote...

incinerator950 wrote...

Luc0s wrote...

TexasToast712 wrote...

Haasth wrote...

Worst possible outcome?

No one dies. At all. No casualties, everyone lives and makes it out happily ever after.
Mass Effect 2 style.

I hate people like you. ****ing death obsessed emo.

I hate people like you. ****ing idealistic hippie.

I hate all of you.

Kelly Chambers is crying somewhere.

She got boiled down in a pot. 

[incinerator950]

KotorEffect3 wrote...

incinerator950 wrote...

Luc0s wrote...

TexasToast712 wrote...

Haasth wrote...

Worst possible outcome?

No one dies. At all. No casualties, everyone lives and makes it out happily ever after.
Mass Effect 2 style.

I hate people like you. ****ing death obsessed emo.

I hate people like you. ****ing idealistic hippie.

I hate all of you.

Kelly Chambers is crying somewhere.

Just yesterday I watched a barely teenaged girl get eaten by a T-rex, and half a family ripped apart in a tunnel by Venemous Dinosaurs, which name escapes me because of Holy **** Dinosaurs. 

Edit: Troodons, little bastards.

Modifié par incinerator950, 05 février 2012 - 02:05 .

[TexasToast712]

 *facepalm* Saphra still ranting I see.

[Volus Warlord]

Saphra Deden wrote...

TexasToast712 wrote...

 *facepalm* Saphra still ranting I see.

I'm not ranting, I am speaking very calmly.

Or typing, I should say.

Give up. They are shortsighted. They believe their chronic irresponsibility will have no negative long term consequences. They believe their sacrifices will be remembered and appreciated. They believe one's conscience is more important than the lives of millions. They refuse to acknowledge the cutthroat nature of all that exists.

[I-am-Biwinning]

Luc0s wrote...

Volus Warlord wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...

KotorEffect3 wrote...

Nobody is asking us to sacrifice our whole damn species.

Yes they are doing just that when they're trying to tell us that we have no right to take what we need to survive or flourish.

The universe is mean and unforgiving.

Oh cmon. We can all just sit around a campfire, sing and sniff red sand and everything will be O.K. 

I don't sniff red sand, I roll 'em up and smoke 'em. Didn't you know that smoking red sand is much more awesome than sniffing it?

I prefer to just blast open giant crates of red sand and breath in the massive dust cloud.

[KotorEffect3]

Saphra Deden wrote...

KotorEffect3 wrote...


Before we go any further, who is "they"?

Nobody specific. It depends on the context.

Another family that is not your own.

Another nation that is not your own.

Another species that is not your own.

That doesn't mean we shouldn't try to build alliances

[Volus Warlord]

KotorEffect3 wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...

KotorEffect3 wrote...


Before we go any further, who is "they"?

Nobody specific. It depends on the context.

Another family that is not your own.

Another nation that is not your own.

Another species that is not your own.

That doesn't mean we shouldn't try to build alliances

Alliance are meaningless if you yourself are weak. You then are a mere puppet, not an ally.