352 réponses à ce sujet

[KotorEffect3]

Saphra Deden wrote...

KotorEffect3 wrote...

That doesn't mean we shouldn't try to build alliances

Indeed!

Good thing I never said or implied that we shouldn't try to build alliances.

Did you just agree with me?

[Volus Warlord]

Bah. Your allies of today are your enemies of tomorrow. They may be useful for a time, but soon there will be inevitable conflict.

[Chuvvy]

incinerator950 wrote...

Just yesterday I watched a barely teenaged girl get eaten by a T-rex, and half a family ripped apart in a tunnel by Venemous Dinosaurs, which name escapes me because of Holy **** Dinosaurs. 

Edit: Troodons, little bastards.

I was going to come in here and complain about the bad endings in ME3. Now I just think ME3 needs more dinosaurs.

[KotorEffect3]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Volus Warlord wrote...

Bah. Your allies of today are your enemies of tomorrow. They may be useful for a time, but soon there will be inevitable conflict.

Always be prepared to make war on them if you have to. Alliances are of convenience and nothing more.

Well I'd say it would be pretty damn convenient and nice to have allies when going up against the reapers.

[Heimdall]

Saphra Deden wrote...

KotorEffect3 wrote...


Well I'd say it would be pretty damn convenient and nice to have allies when going up against the reapers.

Right. Who said we should go up against them alone? Is certainly wasn't me. So who?

You being the one that tends to peddle the renegade Shepard as pragmatic?  The renegade Shepard that is exceptionally good at alienating people and burning bridges between allies?  <_<

[KotorEffect3]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...

You being the one that tends to peddle the renegade Shepard as pragmatic?

When does Renegade Shepard turn down allies?

He still works with Legion.

He is still friendly with the quarians.

He maintains good relations with Cerberus.

His relationship with the Council/Alliance is the same as Paragon Shepard's.

The only ally he really turns away is the rachni queen.


So what bridges has Renegade Shepard burned?

He could have sold Legion to Cerberus in ME 1

He could have refused to hand over the geth data to tali in ME 1 and he could have handed Veetor to cerberus for interrogation

Even after he hands TIM the base renegade Shepard still indicates he doesn't trust TIM in the dialog.

[Heimdall]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...

You being the one that tends to peddle the renegade Shepard as pragmatic?

When does Renegade Shepard turn down allies?

He still works with Legion.

He is still friendly with the quarians.

He maintains good relations with Cerberus.

His relationship with the Council/Alliance is the same as Paragon Shepard's.

The only ally he really turns away is the rachni queen.


So what bridges has Renegade Shepard burned?

Being a jerk to everyone he meets?  Snubbing the most powerful government body in the galaxy?

A truly pragmatic Shepard is Paragon, diplomatic, in interactions with others and capable of being renegade when confronted with difficult situations.

Modifié par Lord Aesir, 05 février 2012 - 02:46 .

[Heimdall]

Saphra Deden wrote...

KotorEffect3 wrote...

He could have sold Legion to Cerberus in ME 1

He could have, but he doesn't have to.

The other things you listed are the same. Could have, but doesn't have to.

You'd think Paragon would get into trouble for playing both sides of a conflict, like empowering the geth while trying to be friendly with the quarians.

If you save the base Shepard has an attitude with TIM but he doesn't break off their partnership.

Paragon Shepard burns a bridge there, or tries to, but not Renegade.

One relationship.

One

With an avowed enemy of the Council and the Alliance, though I realize that is a positive point in your eyes.

[Volus Warlord]

Lord Aesir wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...

You being the one that tends to peddle the renegade Shepard as pragmatic?

When does Renegade Shepard turn down allies?

He still works with Legion.

He is still friendly with the quarians.

He maintains good relations with Cerberus.

His relationship with the Council/Alliance is the same as Paragon Shepard's.

The only ally he really turns away is the rachni queen.


So what bridges has Renegade Shepard burned?

Being a jerk to everyone he meets?  Snubbing the most powerful government body in the galaxy?

A truly pragmatic Shepard is Paragon, diplomatic, in interactions with others and capable of being renegade when confronted with difficult situations.

Lol. Paragon is not pragmatic.

If you play Paragon you

-****** off Garrus

-****** off Zaeed

-Put Oriana at risk

-Get Tali booted from the Migrant fleet (there's some effective diplomacy!)

And so forth. 

[GodWood]

I really wish it'd just be collective knowledge that in discussions of paragon and renegade we are referring to the MAJOR choices.

Going off the logic some of you people use it's apparently paragon to be a womanizing jerk.

[Heimdall]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...

Being a jerk to everyone he meets?  Snubbing the most powerful government body in the galaxy?

You don't have to do all of that to be Renegade.

Frankly, a Renegade doesn't get the chance to snub the Council in ME2.

Lord Aesir wrote...

A truly pragmatic Shepard is Paragon, diplomatic, in interactions with others and capable of being renegade when confronted with difficult situations.

Pragmatic and Paragon? As if.

As I said Paragon Shepard stands to alienate everybody by trying to play nice with every side. Of-course I'm sure this won't bite Paragon Shepard in the ass because nothing does.

Actually the renegade refuses to be reinstated as a Spectre.  How does that fit into your vision of renegade Shepard being pragmatic and not burning bridges?

The Paragon alienates nobody.  I guess you'll keep trying to see things that aren't there.

Good Night

[KotorEffect3]

Volus Warlord wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...

You being the one that tends to peddle the renegade Shepard as pragmatic?

When does Renegade Shepard turn down allies?

He still works with Legion.

He is still friendly with the quarians.

He maintains good relations with Cerberus.

His relationship with the Council/Alliance is the same as Paragon Shepard's.

The only ally he really turns away is the rachni queen.


So what bridges has Renegade Shepard burned?

Being a jerk to everyone he meets?  Snubbing the most powerful government body in the galaxy?

A truly pragmatic Shepard is Paragon, diplomatic, in interactions with others and capable of being renegade when confronted with difficult situations.

Lol. Paragon is not pragmatic.

If you play Paragon you

-****** off Garrus

No just get him to change his mind


-****** off Zaeed

Zaeed put his own selfish needs ahead of the mission.  The mission wasn't to kill Vido.  The mission was to free the workers

-Put Oriana at risk

How?

-Get Tali booted from the Migrant fleet (there's some effective diplomacy!)

No you can paragon get a not guilty verdict


And so forth. 

[Volus Warlord]

Killing Vido should be priority over the refinery workers. Vido would kill a hell of lot more if let escape than a handful of refinery workers.

[KotorEffect3]

Volus Warlord wrote...

Killing Vido should be priority over the refinery workers. Vido would kill a hell of lot more if let escape than a handful of refinery workers.

No because the next guy in line would just take over the Blue Suns and still be doing the same thing.

[GodWood]

Saphra Deden wrote...
I can go either way on Zaeed and his LM.

I saw an interesting take on his LM a while ago.

I would not destroy the factory of one of humanity's most important corporations and industries, when I am aiming for human hegemony politically and economically, to kill one man. I do not care about the workers.

[It's] a resource rich planet, that can cost Eldfell-Ashland Energy millions of credits if completely destroyed. Not to mention that it would look worse for humanity if they completely failed to protect their investments and workers abroad.

[Volus Warlord]

KotorEffect3 wrote...

Volus Warlord wrote...

Killing Vido should be priority over the refinery workers. Vido would kill a hell of lot more if let escape than a handful of refinery workers.

No because the next guy in line would just take over the Blue Suns and still be doing the same thing.

But it would set them back. It would weaken the Blue Suns. The loss of a leader is not something you blow off. The Blue Suns could dissolve into several smaller, weaker bands. They could have infighting for leadership. And much more. You could potentially cripple or destroy a major enemy... or do nothing with any lasting effects. 

I think the choice is pretty obvious.