405 réponses à ce sujet

[Wulfram]

ME1 armour at least looks like it was designed to look practical as well as sexy. Which the ME3 outfit doesn't

But I'm guessing/hoping that it won't be too bad in actual play rather than in a zoomed in screenshot. And we should be able to have her in proper armour soon enough.

[JeffZero]

incinerator950 wrote...

JeffZero wrote...

bleetman wrote...

Sure, it's visually not all that different. I do, however, have a hard time looking at armour like that and thinking "yep, that was designed to be sexy". Maybe I'm wrong? It wouldn't be the first time.

What's getting people riled up over ME3 outfits isn't so much that they're sexy. It's the 'character X needed to be sexy, so we sexed them up' isn't even community speculation. It's literally described as being the justification for character design. So when stuff like this comes out, yeah, people're going to get annoyed by it.

A lot of people seem to be in general agreement with you regarding not seeing the 'designed to be sexy' with Ash's initial armor, so I'd say it isn't just you, at least. I just... I've never felt that way. It's always looked pretty ridiculous to me. /shrug

As for the rest of your post, yeah, that's what made me do a bit of a double-take. The art book is just... facepalm. So is that GameInformer interview with one of the designers from last year that gets mentioned from time to time, when he explained that the relative lack of female aliens was due to not knowing what to do to make them attractive.

The problem is because so many fans want them to be attractive.  I've heard so many people say "Can we have sex with _____ in ME 3" that were not actually joking.  

Well I can't argue with you on that one.

[DJBare]

Shifty-looking Chicken wrote...
And now s/s romance has been brought into the thread. Things are about to get unpleasant, I think.

Perhaps I should have explained, I'm not against SS, I role them myself, I'm against changing established characters.

[SurelyForth]

EternalAmbiguity wrote...

Anarya wrote...
When I look at the difference between Bioware's two major original IPs with regard to respect for female (and homosexual) characters it just blows me away. Dragon Age is not perfect in this respect but it's lightyears ahead of Mass Effect. 
 

*ahem*

I'd like to introduce you to Isabel.

Mass Effect is light years ahead of DA.

Isabela is one of the best female characters I have ever encountered in my life. I mean it. She owns her image, it's part of who she is and what she does, how she is treated by others in the game and how those relationships evolve. Her existence in the game exposes common attitudes that society holds towards women who enjoy sex and who refuse to be shamed into putting pants on when she doesn't want to put pants on. Plus, she has depth beyond that pantslessness and liking sex.

Plus plus, and more importantly, I have never heard a BW person claim that Isabela's designed was informed by any desire to make her sexier. That is what I find most abhorent about these character designs- this notion that what Ashley was in ME, which was kickass and feminine in a way that isn't exactly what we're told to find sexy, was unsexy. And now, in the process of amping that sexy up, we're hitting the edge of caricature. It's not enough that ME2 attempted to define Miranda by her ass, or Samara by her boobs, when they didn't need to. It's not enough that the only female aliens we see are gorgeous, humanoid, bisexual, all-seem-to-have-a-stripper-phase Asari and the curvy (and "vulnerable"!) quarian. No. We have all of that happening, and the team had  to turn Ashley into a standard issue "babe" and didn't even have the creativity, or the courtesy, to make up a less insulting excuse than "she was too dumpy in ME."

[G3rman]

I don't care anymore, the thing is its in the game and isn't going anywhere. Be disappointed in the company if you want, its marketing and it works. Result of society yatta yatta, appealing to teenage masses yatta yatta, complaining doesn't get you anywhere.

[TheKillerAngel]

DJBare wrote...

Obvakhi wrote...

No, it's just another over-sexualized women complaint thread. Nothing new here.

It's more than that, it changes Ashley's nature, shes not a prude but she is obviously the type of woman considers sex has it's place and a uniform is not the place.

What's even more worrying is that they will make her and Kaidan SS relationships for Shepard.

That is not true.

Modifié par TheKillerAngel, 05 février 2012 - 12:13 .

[JeffZero]

G3rman wrote...

I don't care anymore, the thing is its in the game and isn't going anywhere. Be disappointed in the company if you want, its marketing and it works. Result of society yatta yatta, appealing to teenage masses yatta yatta, complaining doesn't get you anywhere.

Technically, if Ash's outfit has been revised, complaining got people somewhere indeed.

[mellifera]

Ah yes, the GOSH WHY CAN'T WOMEN BE SEXY? ATTRACTIVE PEOPLE ARE SO OPPRESSED stuff has already started. Learn to read.

Modifié par yukidama, 05 février 2012 - 12:14 .

[Annihilator27]

MissMaster wrote...

And if Ash had a mustache and was ugly people would still be pissed.

I found this in the Twitter thread a couple of days ago.

[kareatix]

bleetman wrote...

What's getting people - or me, at least - riled up over ME3 outfits isn't so much that they're sexy. It's the 'character X needed to be sexy, so we sexed them up' isn't even community speculation. It's literally described as being the justification for character design. So when stuff like this comes out, yeah, people're going to get annoyed by it.

This, a hundred times this. Oh Bioware, what were you thinking...

[Shifty-looking Chicken]

DJBare wrote...

Shifty-looking Chicken wrote...
And now s/s romance has been brought into the thread. Things are about to get unpleasant, I think.

Perhaps I should have explained, I'm not against SS, I role them myself, I'm against changing established characters.

There have been large threads full of flaming on exactly that subject, with people arguing over whether characters' sexualities have actually been "established" or not. They can get pretty brutal. Personally, I'm neutral on the matter.

[Shadowrun1177]

This same old thread popping up repeatedly is getting really stupid. People getting up in arms about an edited screen shot that focuses on one thing without any real context of what's going on around it is just as stupid as people judging Jessica Chobot's character off of a few seconds of in game video footage and short interview with her.

Modifié par Shadowrun1177, 05 février 2012 - 12:16 .

[Dasher1010]

Adugan wrote...

I DEMAND ARSELESS CHAPS FOR RACHNI QUEEN IN ME3

/thread

[incinerator950]

JeffZero wrote...

incinerator950 wrote...

JeffZero wrote...

bleetman wrote...

Sure, it's visually not all that different. I do, however, have a hard time looking at armour like that and thinking "yep, that was designed to be sexy". Maybe I'm wrong? It wouldn't be the first time.

What's getting people riled up over ME3 outfits isn't so much that they're sexy. It's the 'character X needed to be sexy, so we sexed them up' isn't even community speculation. It's literally described as being the justification for character design. So when stuff like this comes out, yeah, people're going to get annoyed by it.

A lot of people seem to be in general agreement with you regarding not seeing the 'designed to be sexy' with Ash's initial armor, so I'd say it isn't just you, at least. I just... I've never felt that way. It's always looked pretty ridiculous to me. /shrug

As for the rest of your post, yeah, that's what made me do a bit of a double-take. The art book is just... facepalm. So is that GameInformer interview with one of the designers from last year that gets mentioned from time to time, when he explained that the relative lack of female aliens was due to not knowing what to do to make them attractive.

The problem is because so many fans want them to be attractive.  I've heard so many people say "Can we have sex with _____ in ME 3" that were not actually joking.  

Well I can't argue with you on that one.

I'm more ashamed I had to remember that one to put it into the topic were the big discussion is about changing established characters because it makes them more attractive to the large audience that doesn't post here. 

[bleetman]

JeffZero wrote...

As for the rest of your post, yeah, that's what made me do a bit of a double-take. The art book is just... facepalm. So is that GameInformer interview with one of the designers from last year that gets mentioned from time to time, when he explained that the relative lack of female aliens was due to not knowing what to do to make them attractive.

Mmm. I hadn't even seen that. I suspect it's probably a good thing that I didn't.

Also, I was talking about the ME1 armour before. Not sure if that did or didn't come across clearly, so I'll just mention it.

incinerator950 wrote...

Bioware's IP, not theirs.  They don't like it, then can shove off.  I hear Star Wars or the pre FO3 Fallout Community is looking for more useless fans.

Oh good. I was afraid you might have something useful to contribute.

Modifié par bleetman, 05 février 2012 - 12:17 .

[Spaghetti_Ninja]

At least this way Ash serves some kind of purpose, the character is worthless in all other regards. Maybe this will make the one playthrough where I didn't let this poetry-reading, angsty, religious little bigot die at least bearable.

Still looking forward to having her freak out when she finds out Shepard banged Jack.

[Gabey5]

a zoom in on her ass?

i don't get it

women have asses

as do men

or so i am told

also it is the future

people wear crazy stuff

Modifié par Gabey5, 05 février 2012 - 12:18 .

[Flashflame58]

annihilator27 wrote...

MissMaster wrote...

And if Ash had a mustache and was ugly people would still be pissed.

*snip*
I found this in the Twitter thread a couple of days ago.

I am officially scarred for life. Thank you for that.

[G3rman]

JeffZero wrote...

G3rman wrote...

I don't care anymore, the thing is its in the game and isn't going anywhere. Be disappointed in the company if you want, its marketing and it works. Result of society yatta yatta, appealing to teenage masses yatta yatta, complaining doesn't get you anywhere.

Technically, if Ash's outfit has been revised, complaining got people somewhere indeed.

Technically if BioWare took into account how much flak the outfit got in the first place, they would have removed it entirely for something conservative.

[Elvis_Mazur]

Dragon Age is best at such? Only if you are talking about Origins. Do you know Isabella and the moments where parts of her clothes clip with her ass?

[Russalka]

Would forcing male characters into tight latex outfits put things into perspective?