329 réponses à ce sujet

[Mike Shepard]

Sovereign was a silent/unheard/background antagonist with the exception of Virmire when you talk to him and learn what he is.
Harbinger is constantly telling you how much what he's doing hurts you.
it's enough to drive a guy insane!

[Yuoaman]

ADLegend21 wrote...

Sovereign was meh. He was also a fool for putting all of his eggs in Saren's basket, at least Harbinger was smart enought to use an avatar at a distance instead of while it was being bombarded by a fleet.

Yeah, Sovereign didn't seem to have a clue what he was doing when ASSUMED DIRECT CONTROL, I guess practice makes perfect.

[Pedro Costa]

Omega-202 wrote...

Its all in the voice. Sovereign was completely emotionless and menacing. Harbinger was too condescending and actually addressed Shepard and crew as something that deserved attention. From Sovereign's conversation in ME1, the fact that Harbinger takes that tone with Shepard is completely illogical. It would be like a human talking to an ant with a condescending tone.

They're beyond our comprehension and understanding and therefore they should sound like it. Sovereign did, Harbinger didn't.

This is pretty spot on, imo.

Sovereign felt as something above us, a "god", for all intents and purposes, from its age, its power, its demeanor, and the way it talked to/treated organics.
Harbinger felt like another Mercenary gang leader. Hell, even the DEAD Reaper felt more menacing than Harbinger.

Oh, and Harbinger is stupid as a brick wall, too.
Honestly, after Horizon it should have been pretty damn obvious that attempting to kill Shepard via possession of random Collector #2856917 wasn't going to cut it. If Harbinger had no better alternative, then, perhaps, it would have been a better idea to retreat back to the Omega-4 Relay, saving its Collector army for their imminent Arrival and keeping what it already had of the Reaper Larva safe. Perhaps it wouldn't have made a difference in the end, but damn, at least it was more tactically sound than going around the Galaxy as if Shep hadn't been revived.

[WizenSlinky0]

Yuoaman wrote...

ADLegend21 wrote...

Sovereign was meh. He was also a fool for putting all of his eggs in Saren's basket, at least Harbinger was smart enought to use an avatar at a distance instead of while it was being bombarded by a fleet.

Yeah, Sovereign didn't seem to have a clue what he was doing when ASSUMED DIRECT CONTROL, I guess practice makes perfect.

It's like when they were teaching the class on it he skirted by with a D, and when it came to actually doing it, he was like "****, anyone in this machine brain remember where I put the manual? Possession...Possession, I think this is how you do it."

But it might also be compatibility. Even though Saren was under Soveriegns control, he was a strong-willed individual, and it probably took more to keep him under control. Whereas the collectors have likely had most of their personality breeded out as mindless slaves and therefore require very little effort to control fully.

[nitefyre410]

Sovereign... dude sounded like Soundwave and that is a win in my book

[D4rkSektor]

Sovereign sounded evil and menacing and was a pain to kill. Harbinger, given how many times you kick his ass in combat, sounds increasingly self-assuring.That will probably change when he actually arrives in ME3, but for the time being, he sounds kinda lame.

Modifié par D4rkSektor, 06 février 2012 - 04:38 .

[Yuoaman]

WizenSlinky0 wrote...

Yuoaman wrote...

ADLegend21 wrote...

Sovereign was meh. He was also a fool for putting all of his eggs in Saren's basket, at least Harbinger was smart enought to use an avatar at a distance instead of while it was being bombarded by a fleet.

Yeah, Sovereign didn't seem to have a clue what he was doing when ASSUMED DIRECT CONTROL, I guess practice makes perfect.

It's like when they were teaching the class on it he skirted by with a D, and when it came to actually doing it, he was like "****, anyone in this machine brain remember where I put the manual? Possession...Possession, I think this is how you do it."

But it might also be compatibility. Even though Saren was under Soveriegns control, he was a strong-willed individual, and it probably took more to keep him under control. Whereas the collectors have likely had most of their personality breeded out as mindless slaves and therefore require very little effort to control fully.

Saren was also a corpse, which probably complicated things. "Oh crap, what did the prof say about possessing corpses...? Oh, you skipped that day. Crap. Oh, I'm sure it'll be fine."

[Haasth]

D3MON-SOVER3IGN wrote...

ADLegend21 wrote...

Sovereign was meh. He was also a fool for putting all of his eggs in Saren's basket, at least Harbinger was smart enought to use an avatar at a distance instead of while it was being bombarded by a fleet.

At least Sovereign actually accomplished something.

I suppose the only thing Sovereign accomplished more was turning the Geth against one another and the rest of the universe. But that would have inevitably happened with any other Reaper anyway. 

In the end Sovereign destroyed much of the Citadel and Eden Prime. But Harbinger is behind much if not all of the Collector's actions which probably gave the Reapers much if not most of their insight into the civilizations around at the time. Plus kidnapping multiple colonies and turning them into reaper-smoothies was nothing, right? 

They both failed. But I think in the end Harbinger managed to achieve more (through knowledge gained) than they lost. Whereas Sovereign had a failed attempt, increased Geth awareness and possibly through reverse-engineering of debris gave them more technology (Though there's no real proof of this and one could argue that the Collector Base, when intact, would give more) 

Modifié par Haasth, 06 février 2012 - 04:40 .

[Vez04]

''ASSUMING DIRECT CONTROL''

''ASSUMING CONTROL''

''I KNOW YOU FEEL THIS''

''This hurts you''

that is why i like harbringer abit, but between them both.

It's ONLY Sovereign!

''Confidence born of ignorance, the cycle cannot be broken.''

Modifié par Vez04, 06 février 2012 - 04:39 .

[HTTP 404]

Sovereign had better background music when he talked

[AlanC9]

DarkLord_PT wrote...

Honestly, after Horizon it should have been pretty damn obvious that attempting to kill Shepard via possession of random Collector #2856917 wasn't going to cut it. If Harbinger had no better alternative, then, perhaps, it would have been a better idea to retreat back to the Omega-4 Relay, saving its Collector army for their imminent Arrival and keeping what it already had of the Reaper Larva safe. Perhaps it wouldn't have made a difference in the end, but damn, at least it was more tactically sound than going around the Galaxy as if Shep hadn't been revived.

I don't see it. This means cancelling the Collector Ship mission and boarding the Normandy. The latter attack was a partial success, and the former almost worked -- both would have worked if Harbinger hadn't underestimated EDI and Joker.

And if they don't go running around the Galaxy, they can't finish the Reaper.

[AlanC9]

D3MON-SOVER3IGN wrote...
Yeah they both failed but this is what I mean when I say Sovereign accomplished something.
Instead of hiding out in dark space he physically got a geth fleet to attack the Citadel and he came into contact with fleets. That's much more intimdating and keeps you on your toes more than Harbinger who basically taunted you and abducted colonist.. Sovereign was literally getting ready to open up the way for all reapers to come pouring through the citadel. He was endangering ALL life. Harbinger just went after humans...

Quite true. In ME2 we're doing better than we were in ME1. We get to stop Harbinger's plan before it really gets off the ground, as opposed to how we were only able to foil Sovereign's plan at the very last minute.

[WizenSlinky0]

Yuoaman wrote...

Saren was also a corpse, which probably complicated things. "Oh crap, what did the prof say about possessing corpses...? Oh, you skipped that day. Crap. Oh, I'm sure it'll be fine."

Good point. If we assume the reapers control the *minds* of their victims then the victim itself moves the body, but if it's a corpse, they have to directly control the body itself which may place additional strain on their processing power.

[HTTP 404]

AlanC9 wrote...

DarkLord_PT wrote...

Honestly, after Horizon it should have been pretty damn obvious that attempting to kill Shepard via possession of random Collector #2856917 wasn't going to cut it. If Harbinger had no better alternative, then, perhaps, it would have been a better idea to retreat back to the Omega-4 Relay, saving its Collector army for their imminent Arrival and keeping what it already had of the Reaper Larva safe. Perhaps it wouldn't have made a difference in the end, but damn, at least it was more tactically sound than going around the Galaxy as if Shep hadn't been revived.

I don't see it. This means cancelling the Collector Ship mission and boarding the Normandy. The latter attack was a partial success, and the former almost worked -- both would have worked if Harbinger hadn't underestimated EDI and Joker.

And if they don't go running around the Galaxy, they can't finish the Reaper.

this pretty much true.  I also want to add that the collectors are most likely disposable in the Reaper's eyes.  they are just one ship that is less than a reaper while an armada of reaper ships are soon to arrive from dark space.  Harbinger probably thought the worst that could happen was that the collector ship be destroyed and the collector base would still be hidden and inaccesible.  Harbinger underestimated EDI's ability to figure out a way to get through the Omega Relay.

[BatmanPWNS]

Sovereign really was boring and I don't see the hype. He only talks to you once in ME1 and that isn't even a good scene.

[HTTP 404]

BatmanPWNS wrote...

Sovereign really was boring and I don't see the hype. He only talks to you once in ME1 and that isn't even a good scene.

haha there's a hype?  I took sovereign at face value.  I took harbinger as an idiot.

[Epsilon330]

Because Sovereign took fire from practically every allied ship in Council/Alliance space, and it still took Shepard's sabotage to even drop its shields. That, and it literally biatchslapped two Turian frigates out of the way by slamming into them, without even slowing or turning. Considering Turian ships are the toughest out of the Council race fleets, then that's impressive.

[incinerator950]

For 40k Fans, it would be comparing the Nightbringer to the Deceiver.

[Yuoaman]

WizenSlinky0 wrote...

Yuoaman wrote...

Saren was also a corpse, which probably complicated things. "Oh crap, what did the prof say about possessing corpses...? Oh, you skipped that day. Crap. Oh, I'm sure it'll be fine."

Good point. If we assume the reapers control the *minds* of their victims then the victim itself moves the body, but if it's a corpse, they have to directly control the body itself which may place additional strain on their processing power.

Yeah, having to run all the different systems in Saren's body to keep it going probably made Sovereign far too invested when it died, probably causing him to basically be knocked out.

[Labrev]

 I played ME2 first. My opinion on the Reapers...

ME2: LOL! Who the hell are these guys?
ME1: WTF??? WHO THE HELL ARE THESE GUYS?!

[DiebytheSword]

The confrontation on Vermire was more memorable than the confrontation at the project at the Alpha Relay. People liked Sovereign's dialogue more than they liked Harbingers, I think that's the only realy difference.