730 réponses à ce sujet

[ArkkAngel007]

izmirtheastarach wrote...

Steam moves a ludicrous amount of content and games with their crazy sales. It's a good model.

That's down the line though.  And it all depends on what EA does.  I don't want to see a 66% sale on ME3 where EA still gets the lion's share (for a downloadable game, what a joke) and BioWare employees receive a pathetic amount.  

After the marketing, development, production, and hiring costs are all paid off, the games should go down in price by $20 at least (assuming $60 product).  Same goes for the larger DLC items (missions, characters, maps, cut by 1/3 of the price).

[izmirtheastarach]

atheelogos wrote...

again I'm refering to the extra mission and squatmate, but as some have said this point is moot if they give that dlc to us upon release.

With that said I haven't seen a post by a bioware official that confirms they will release it on release. Does anyone have a link to that?

What would be the point of having story DLC like that if you wern't going to sell it? Seems like a weird move, to spend all that time and money creating content that few people are going to get the chance to see.

There has been no official announcement, but there have been unconfirmed reports of it being day-1.

[ArkkAngel007]

Yuoaman wrote...

ArkkAngel007 wrote...

Did we just break the entire BioWare forum temporarily? Too much nerd rage. Tone this down a bit.

Anyways, so, Polite, Day 1 DLC isn't because of restraints on dev time. It's planned from the beginning as DLC. The team does their primary work on the main game and, time willing, will move on to the DLC and try to haul it out by launch. That's why you're being charged for it, as it took additional work and resources to develops and produce. Same goes for all additional DLC that you see post-launch. Sometimes devs will release stuff for free, but you shouldn't expect it all the time.

However, items that were pre-order only should be made free down the line if they are (read: should be) released, as that was provided free of charge to the game purchase.

I think they just did some quick maintenance, I don't think we broke it.

I knew this, I can read 

Was just trying to break up the dart throwing with some humor.

[NOD-INFORMER37]

  I agree with the OP(to an extent) and I understand why some
DLC is DLC in the first place and why some are launched from day 1 but I’m still
not seeing the justification for ALL this dlc at once.(not that I blame Woo, if he
said anything against this some media outlet will go crazy and run with it xP) But just the amount of Pre-launch DLC in ME3 ALONE is very disturbing. 

Yeah theres the expected DLC confirmed before launch such as
the collectors editions or pre order bonuses from certain retailers, (which is
already somewhat numerous) but on top of that we have:

- Little bits of random DLC’s included with each $20 action
figure - http://www.gameinfor...fect-3-dlc.aspx

- DLC included with a limited edition Xbox 360 case

- DLC included with a limited edition PS3 case

- DLC from Pre-ordering the art book from Barnes/Noble  

- DLC from one (possibly both) IOS games soon to come out (Infiltrator
and Datapad)

- Anything else I missed

- Anything else they haven’t Pre-DLC’d yet

This is just WAY too much, someone else made a post that narrowed down all the prices to $500+! And that probably wasnt even covering all of them. ME3 has become overwhelmed with pricey
DLC-tacked products and the game’s not even out yet.  Its extremely unnecessary, if I wanted to buy
a certain product, I’d buy it. If I wanted to buy those DLC’s in a pack later,
I’d buy it. Mixing the two this much overcomplicates things and makes in seem like
someone (*cough EA*) doesn’t care about the consumer at all and is just trying
to squeeze every last penny out of the game.  

Modifié par NOD-INFORMER37, 09 février 2012 - 04:22 .

[Mike Shepard]

PDesign wrote...

iOS Game - 8$

Well I didn't know the iOS game was $8. Most iOS games I know of cost $2, maybe $3. If it's really good it costs $4. Galaxy was $1

[izmirtheastarach]

NOD-INFORMER37 wrote...

This is just WAY too much, someone else made a post that narrowed down all the prices to $500+! And that probably wasnt even covering all of them. ME3 has become overwhelmed with pricey
DLC-tacked products and the game’s not even out yet.  Its extremely unnecessary, if I wanted to buy
a certain product, I’d buy it. If I wanted to buy those DLC’s in a pack later,
I’d buy it. Mixing the two this much overcomplicates things and makes in seem like
someone (*cough EA*) doesn’t care about the consumer at all and is just trying
to squeeze every last penny out of the game.  

All the DLC you listed there has been pretty much confirmed to be multi-player content packs. Probably just stuff you can either buy yourself day-1 or unlock simply by playing the game. There's no indication that any of it is substantive content. It's just a silly idea someone in marketing came up with. It's nothing anyone is going to need.

[AlanC9]

ArkkAngel007 wrote...
That's down the line though.  And it all depends on what EA does.  I don't want to see a 66% sale on ME3 where EA still gets the lion's share (for a downloadable game, what a joke) and BioWare employees receive a pathetic amount.  

You'd prefer to see the game sold at full price with EA getting the lion's share and BioWare employees receiving a pathetic amount?

Actually, I imagine Bio employees are on salary anyway, so we should change "pathetic amount" to "nothing whatsoever." Though I wouldn't be surprised if EA's got some sort of profit-related bonus program.

Modifié par AlanC9, 09 février 2012 - 04:25 .

[TheJiveDJ]

Ultimately Mr. Woo, I think the unified theme of this entire thread is, "Less is more. Less is definitely more." Oversaturation of DLC, exclusive promotions, and hyper-exploitation is killing BioWare's loyal consumer base, and confusing the hell out of your hardcore and casual fan base. EA is simply shooting bullets in every direction hoping something hits, but in the process are also hitting themselves.

If you can take anything away from this thread and relay it to your superiors, may I suggest that it be this: Quality over quantity is not just some axiom; it is a mantra every company should live by. Ultimately quality as well as quantity is what your goal should be. Most big publishers have proven recently however, that they are incapable of achieving such a lofty goal without rapid and aggressive restructuring of their marketing practices.

One could cite all the analytical data he or she wishes. Market analysis cannot predict a crash. The data will show positive return up to the point the market decides to fight back; then the video game industry tanks under it's own bloated self. Back in '83 every company saw the same opportunity EA sees now (in a different context of course). So EVERYONE started doing what everyone else was doing. "Hey, they're making money putting out the same crap every month, why not us?" The data implied it was fiscally beneficial to do so. Well the data didn't help them when they all went bankrupt. I am being a little more dramatic to get my point across in regard to your previous argument, but my point remains the same.

I'm not upset at what EA has been doing with it's current marketing to be honest. To each their own. I will simply pick and choose what I wish to purchase. My main concern is, literally, the direction of the video game industry. Like I mentioned in my earlier post, I believe oversaturation is going to kill the market and it will only be stopped if each relevant individual looks at what part they are playing in this farce.  Each company must take responsiblity.  I don't know if this is over your head, or if its within your reach, but I implore you to relay this information to whomever you report to. Thank you.

Modifié par TheJiveDJ, 09 février 2012 - 04:36 .

[AtreiyaN7]

Hey BioWare...please continue with the good DLCs with story content, etc. And for those who are upset by the other stuff...don't buy it?

[AlanC9]

PoliteAssasin wrote...
But for story content, content that was cut, according to Mr. Woo due to time constraints, it should be given free of charge because it should have been in game.

This makes no sense.

It's cut due to time constraints, right? Well, that means that it shouldn't have been in the game, because the game didn't have infinite development time. That's what "time constraint" means. Sure, it sucks that the game didn't have infinite development time, but that's the way the world works.

You want more development time assigned to the game? Well, someone needs to pay for that time. Hence, charging for the DLC.

[NOD-INFORMER37]

izmirtheastarach wrote...

NOD-INFORMER37 wrote...

This is just WAY too much, someone else made a post that narrowed down all the prices to $500+! And that probably wasnt even covering all of them. ME3 has become overwhelmed with pricey
DLC-tacked products and the game’s not even out yet.  Its extremely unnecessary, if I wanted to buy
a certain product, I’d buy it. If I wanted to buy those DLC’s in a pack later,
I’d buy it. Mixing the two this much overcomplicates things and makes in seem like
someone (*cough EA*) doesn’t care about the consumer at all and is just trying
to squeeze every last penny out of the game.  

All the DLC you listed there has been pretty much confirmed to be multi-player content packs. Probably just stuff you can either buy yourself day-1 or unlock simply by playing the game. There's no indication that any of it is substantive content. It's just a silly idea someone in marketing came up with. It's nothing anyone is going to need.

I really
hope you're right and thats actually another thing that’s really bugging me, the
utter lack of information. We don’t have the remotest clue what ANY of this DLC
is other than a random “weapon” or “power” or if any of those DLC’s will be
made available to the public later. They probably could be yeah, but still,
just look at how complicated ME2’s DLC was. If it is stictly multi content, that would put my mind at ease but they should really make an official announcement on what we're actually getting in turn of spending our money on these DLC-tacked products lol. 

[ArkkAngel007]

Alan, sorry if i wasnt clear. I want to see such sales, but EA needs to put in place a more dev friendly profit flow system once all the major payments are said and done for so that devs arent putting their necessary income at risk.

[izmirtheastarach]

NOD-INFORMER37 wrote...

I really
hope you're right and thats actually another thing that’s really bugging me, the utter lack of information. We don’t have the remotest clue what ANY of this DLC is other than a random “weapon” or “power” or if any of those DLC’s will be made available to the public later. They probably could be yeah, but still, just look at how complicated ME2’s DLC was. If it is stictly multi content, that would put my mind at ease but they should really make an official announcement on what we're actually getting in turn of spending our money on these DLC-tacked products lol. 

Honestly, when we started seeing the listings for those DLCs, I don't think Bioware even knew what they would be. I think someone from marketing set up a bunch of deals and left the dev-team to figure out how to provide some sort of DLC promo code. There are a couple of reaponses from Devs that make it seems like they didn't even know what these offers were.

As to it being multiplayer content, that seems to be a solid fact at least. From the Bioware store:

These products contain a code that can be redeemed for bonus content for
Mass Effect 3 multi-player . The pack could include character boosters,
weapons, weapon modifications and upgrades to make your multi-player
squad stronger.

This is where I'm drawing my conclusions from.

Modifié par izmirtheastarach, 09 février 2012 - 04:37 .

[Bostur]

How about a guidebook for DLCs? Modestly priced at $30. ;-)

It is very confusing, and the media hype surrounding a release like this pushes me away instead of making me interested. It feels like the game isn't good enough to sell itself, so it needs to hyped. The sad part is that it probably is good enough that it could sell without the excess hype. I think the marketing is doing the game a disservice, but I wouldn't know I don't have the magic numbers.

Maybe there also is a bit of culture gap involved. US marketing often makes me nauseous. ;-) I prefer the conservative approach of companies like Paradox, or the good old MicroProse. They made me feel like a valued customer and not like a cow to be milked.

[K Le Blanc]

I do find it interesting that made an epilogue of DA origin with Morrigan then did the prequel with Leliana, guess after reading the forum comments they realized people were miffed by the ending, but then thought can't make the Leliana fans mad so we'll make a not very accurate storyline for her about what led her to the chantery, did like it, though I thought it was to short,but the writers should get together so that they don't do inconsistant storyline

[Jaron Oberyn]

AlanC9 wrote...

PoliteAssasin wrote...
But for story content, content that was cut, according to Mr. Woo due to time constraints, it should be given free of charge because it should have been in game.

This makes no sense.

It's cut due to time constraints, right? Well, that means that it shouldn't have been in the game, because the game didn't have infinite development time. That's what "time constraint" means. Sure, it sucks that the game didn't have infinite development time, but that's the way the world works.

You want more development time assigned to the game? Well, someone needs to pay for that time. Hence, charging for the DLC.

I find your condescendence amusing. According to Mr. Woo the content doesn't make it into game because they have to ship it off for certification about 4-8 weeks before release. It was still being developed alongside the game. By your logic, we should have to pay for patches as well. I do in fact think games should cost more than $60 dollars, but 10 dollars for these little DLCs sprinkled here and there that should have been in game isn't justifiable. If it was developed during game dev time, it should be included, or for free on release date. If it was developed late in the development cycle or after release date, then fine charge for it.


-Polite

[AlanC9]

aLucidMind wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

ArkkAngel007 wrote...
That's down the line though.  And it all depends on what EA does.  I don't want to see a 66% sale on ME3 where EA still gets the lion's share (for a downloadable game, what a joke) and BioWare employees receive a pathetic amount.  

You'd prefer to see the game sold at full price with EA getting the lion's share and BioWare employees receiving a pathetic amount?

Actually, I imagine Bio employees are on salary anyway, so we should change "pathetic amount" to "nothing whatsoever." Though I wouldn't be surprised if EA's got some sort of profit-related bonus program.

If they got no share or too little share, they can't afford to pay their employees' salary; meaning they'll have to dip into game development coffers and, thus, less money to spend on making the game. EA prospers and BioWare gets stuck in a vicious cycle and risk going the way of Interplay if nothing is done about it. Worst-case scenario, of course.

ArkkAngel007 specified BioWare employees, rather than Bioware. Different issue.

[Yuoaman]

PoliteAssasin wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

PoliteAssasin wrote...
But for story content, content that was cut, according to Mr. Woo due to time constraints, it should be given free of charge because it should have been in game.

This makes no sense.

It's cut due to time constraints, right? Well, that means that it shouldn't have been in the game, because the game didn't have infinite development time. That's what "time constraint" means. Sure, it sucks that the game didn't have infinite development time, but that's the way the world works.

You want more development time assigned to the game? Well, someone needs to pay for that time. Hence, charging for the DLC.

I find your condescendence amusing. According to Mr. Woo the content doesn't make it into game because they have to ship it off for certification about 4-8 weeks before release. It was still being developed alongside the game. By your logic, we should have to pay for patches as well. I do in fact think games should cost more than $60 dollars, but 10 dollars for these little DLCs sprinkled here and there that should have been in game isn't justifiable. If it was developed during game dev time, it should be included, or for free on release date. If it was developed late in the development cycle or after release date, then fine charge for it.


-Polite

Just because you feel entitled to more content doesn't mean you should get it - you're already getting a full game.

[shumworld]

I have nothing against DLC, but what does grind my gears is having to pay for access on stuff that already is in the game disc to begin with.

Capcom's Super Street Fighter 4 is the best example I can think of that screws people over on the concept of exclusive content. The alternate costumes were in the game disc itself, but you had to pay for it in order to gain access.

[AlanC9]

PoliteAssasin wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...
It's cut due to time constraints, right? Well, that means that it shouldn't have been in the game, because the game didn't have infinite development time. That's what "time constraint" means. Sure, it sucks that the game didn't have infinite development time, but that's the way the world works.

You want more development time assigned to the game? Well, someone needs to pay for that time. Hence, charging for the DLC.

I find your condescendence amusing. According to Mr. Woo the content doesn't make it into game because they have to ship it off for certification about 4-8 weeks before release. It was still being developed alongside the game. By your logic, we should have to pay for patches as well. I do in fact think games should cost more than $60 dollars, but 10 dollars for these little DLCs sprinkled here and there that should have been in game isn't justifiable. If it was developed during game dev time, it should be included, or for free on release date. If it was developed late in the development cycle or after release date, then fine charge for it.

That's "condescension." Since you find it amusing I figure I can throw a little more in.

By your logic, we've always been cheated. Before DLC the cut content was never finished at all. Now it gets finished, but you gotta pay for it.

Sure, it's nice to dream about some fantasy universe where companies finish this stuff and give it to us for free because someone high-up read a PoliteAssassin post and was shamed into doing it. I don't think that's the universe we're living in.

Modifié par AlanC9, 09 février 2012 - 04:48 .

[lobi]

As long as the main meal is up to scratch I don't really care if there's gravy at another table.
Some Icecream for after would be nice though.

Modifié par lobi, 09 février 2012 - 04:55 .

[izmirtheastarach]

shumworld wrote...

I have nothing against DLC, but what does grind my gears is having to pay for access on stuff that already is in the game disc to begin with.

Capcom's Super Street Fighter 4 is the best example I can think of that screws people over on the concept of exclusive content. The alternate costumes were in the game disc itself, but you had to pay for it in order to gain access.

I do understand this slightly more then the alternative. But Bioware has not done this. All of their DLC has been large enough to demonstrate that they aren't just unlocks.

Modifié par izmirtheastarach, 09 février 2012 - 05:00 .