730 réponses à ce sujet

[AlanC9]

Darkfoxz87 wrote...
 Heck I wonder how many of this "DLC" is just a code to unlock it. It is all ready in game just not avaliable to those who didnt pay extra. 

My bet would be zero. Even if the content is ready to go when ME3 goes gold, it's easier for Bio to waste the bandwidth than to deal with all the whining they'd hear if they actually put the DLCs on the disc.

EA is really messing with Bioware and this terrific franchise.

Why do people think Bio wouldn't do this without EA?

[AlanC9]

Felidae_5 wrote...

In the end, this "DLC your way into the complete game so you don't have to watch youtube videos of people playing it for you" strategy will increase piracy. If people have to buy 2 copies of the game, a bunch of day 1 DLC's and soft drinks for the full experience, some will just give up and pirate the full game with all extras. Some people are not stupid, they see when they're being milked for money. Then developers WILL lose pottencial profit if they cause frustration with their product. And don't get me started on Origin, it basically pushes people into piracy in order to retain privacy.

Probably true to some extent. The question is whether the increased piracy more than offsets the DLC revenue. My bet would be no. Pirates are gonna pirate, and the number of people who go from non-pirate to pirate simply because of DLC is not going to be high.

[wirelesstkd]

Yeah, so, everything Stanley said. My thing with DLC is this: the main game that I'm buying for $79 (CE) is PACKED and well worth the cost. Beyond that, when you consider that a SNES game from the early 90s sold for $70, you have to wonder how 16 bit graphics and midi music can compare the 3D graphics and Hollywood a list actors like Martin Sheen. How can Bioware sell the main game for the same cost as an SNES game (and adjusting inflation means its less).

So I think that DLC is one way of offsetting the cost by asking the most loyal fans to subsidize the cost. I think this fine because if BW tried to sell the game for $150 or so it would sell less and would possibly make it non-viable to produce deep games like ME. So if I have to subsidize the cost by buying DLC that is disproportionately priced compared to a similar level in the full game, then so be it.

The bottom line is, if you don't want the DLC, don't buy it. It's still a full experience either way. Oh, and the fact that Bioware is announcing DLC pre release is actually more consumer friendly than if they hadn't because it lets you make and even more informed buying decision.

[PicdiCr80]

AlanC9 wrote...

PicdiCr80 wrote...

Well considering I believe I've finally begun to understand my previous problem, all that worries me now is that DLC is sort of becoming a way to add new canon to the story, i.e a DLC might completely change the story in a twist and it's considered canon, yet it's not in the base game. That makes it hard for a lot of people without the DLC to follow the story and that's now my only gripe, adding story content that changings the base games' story content, such as adding new effects to the endings etc. And although I'm not saying that's a money making scheme, I'm just saying that it makes it difficult to follow the base game's story when you need to buy DLC to do so.

You mean, like Arrival did?

Yeah. Arrival was a GOOD DLC, but the concept of it wasn't, adding canon story through extra content, not because it''s bad, wrong or something of the like, but because it's just not exactly smart to add to the story via extra content.

[AlanC9]

Well, as someone who didn't actually buy Arrival, I probably shouldn't comment about it.

[Il Divo]

AlanC9 wrote...

Well, as someone who didn't actually buy Arrival, I probably shouldn't comment about it.

For real? Out of curiosity, why not? Bad reception?

Modifié par Il Divo, 10 février 2012 - 06:09 .

[AlanC9]

I didn't buy any of the DLCs -- by the time they started coming out I'd uninstalled ME2 because of no HD space -- I've only got 80 gigs on my rig. And for a long time I was hoping that there'd be a GOTY edition like Dragon Age Ultimate.

Modifié par AlanC9, 10 février 2012 - 06:14 .

[Bleachrude]

I have to admit...I'm kind of stunned that people consider Weapons/Costumes essential to the story...

Really, the fact that product X is giving you a gun actually detracts from your ME experience if you don't get it?

I still dont understand in general why people buy those sort of DLCs

[CannonO]

Bleachrude wrote...

I have to admit...I'm kind of stunned that people consider Weapons/Costumes essential to the story...

Really, the fact that product X is giving you a gun actually detracts from your ME experience if you don't get it?

I still dont understand in general why people buy those sort of DLCs

They are essential to fans who enjoy all the content. No one wants to be sold all the Picasso's in the world except this handful that his estate is selling separately because they decided it isn't important for you.

[111987]

Avalanche404 wrote...

But I have grown tired of Bioware (and probably EA) policy about the quantity and quality of downloadable contents.
First of all, there is an unequal balance between the price of DLCs and the quantity and quality of their content, as most of them are skin or weapon packages and 10-minutes-long quests. Talking about additional quests: I think is unfair to expand the story through many single missions, "forcing" fans to spend even more money than the original game, in order to know how the plot continue through a bunch of short missions.

If you are talking about Mass Effect (which I will assume because we are on a Mass Effect forum), the additional quests were not '10 minutes long'. Shadow Broker was about 3 hours, Overlord was over an hour, Kasumi was over an hour plus you got a new squadmate, and Arrival was like 2 hours. The only short quest DLC's were the Firewalker missions...which were free.

By 'expanding the story' missions, I will assume you are talking about the story DLC's, mainly Overlord, Shadow Broker, and Arrival. Those are three fully-fledged missions that were released long after the game was released. So would you rather not have played those missions? They were clearly setting up extra things for Mass Effect 3, so it becomes a choice of whether you would have preffered to play those missions or just hear that they happened in ME3. I'm gonna go with playing those missions.

Avalanche404 wrote...

This brings to the second point: is quite offensive to make and announce DLCs before the release of a game, because is like to say "hey, we are selling you an incomplete product, if you want it all you must spend more".

I think this depends. Announcing DLC's on Day 1 isn't bad. If they tell you on Day 1 that in a month or two they'll have a new mission, that's fine. If Day 1 DLC is free, or for example is the stuff you get for free from pre-orders, that's okay too. The only time I would agree with you is if they launch exclusive DLC on Day 1.

Avalanche404 wrote...

Last but not least: please, stop producing gameplay-ruining DLCs, like over-powered weapons and armors. Sure, there is no reason to buy them if I don't want to, but what if I am a collector and I like to buy limited edition? Am I forced to have a lot of addictional contents which gave me enough power to finish the game without changing equipment? Is like cheating! And again, someone could say "no one force you to use them", but hell, I have spent a lot for a collector's edition and those money cover also that, why I shouldn't use what I've paid for?

You countered your own arguments here, and your rebutals to your own counters were awful. Don't want it? Don't buy it? Have some kind of obsession and unhealthy need to download all a game's contents without planning on using the weapons and armors? Then buy it and don't use it. What about the people that want the cool, powerful weapons and armor? Have you stopped to consider other people's opinions, besides your own?

So basically, I disagree with most everything you just said.

[Ianamus]

I agree completely OP.

Day-one DLC that you can pre-order along with the game really is going too far. It should just be included in the game in the first place.

Modifié par EJ107, 10 février 2012 - 06:29 .

[PD ORTA]

DLC is fine as long as it's value for money ie; fallout 3's DLC's you a good size mission, new armour and weapons.
But things like alternate appearance and crappy one piece armour DLC's are wrong IMO and I don't buy them.
Also agree I hate pre-order DLC.

Modifié par PD ORTA, 10 février 2012 - 06:35 .

[Ice Cold J]

MadLaughter wrote...

Zaeed was created purely to deter people from buying the game secondhand game as he was free with a first hand game, to try and claw back some money, not for any other purpose.

I can understand why they did this. The industry is a lot harder and there's more competition, it's become an industry where Sega nearly became bust, so I can understand why they did that with Zaeed.

Zaeed was created to kick-**** and chew bubblegum in a galaxy devoid of Bazooka Joe.

But, Zaeed + his DLC gave you Paragon/Renegade points, a new heavy weapon, a bonus power (inferno grenade), and the second stongest option for "Holding the Line" in the Collector Base, adding quite a bit to the gameplay and your options in said game.

Stanley Woo wrote...
Expansion packs were a way to keep people interested in a game long after they were finished the main game's
story. Due to the size of expansion pack, they were few and far between. these day, i reckon, in the time it takes for a developer to release a full-on expansion pack, people might already have forgotten your game. DLC is, again, in my opinion, a way to counteract that "forgetfulness." With smaller but more frequent content releases, you keep people interested in your game for a lot longer, which means potential sales of sequels can be bigger and, if actual expansion packs are released, players will still be hankering for them.

DLC pricing is the way it is (seen as more expensive than similar amounts of content in a single expansion pack) to get a better return on a much larger investment than, say, 10 years ago.

For once, I agree with Mr. Woo.

Although I will say that there seems to be a trend these days to force DLC down the consumers throat in an effort to promote sales of "authentic product" as opposed to the more popular (and frugal/prudent) practice of buying video games used.

I'm sure most of you have heard the rumors that the XBOX 720 will have a feature that won't allow "previously owned" games from being played on the console. If THAT happens, then it is counter-productive to the principle of free trade and capitalism upon which this country has it's roots and ideals established in.

Modifié par Ice Cold J, 10 février 2012 - 06:35 .

[Ice Cold J]

Double-post

Modifié par Ice Cold J, 10 février 2012 - 06:35 .

[littlezack]

MadLaughter wrote...



But, Zaeed + his DLC gave you Paragon/Renegade points, a new heavy weapon, a bonus power (inferno grenade), and the second stongest option for "Holding the Line" in the Collector Base, adding quite a bit to the gameplay and your options in said game.
.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I seem to remember Zaeed being a very poor choice for Holding the Line.

Modifié par littlezack, 10 février 2012 - 06:45 .

[Bleachrude]

CannonLars wrote...

Bleachrude wrote...

I have to admit...I'm kind of stunned that people consider Weapons/Costumes essential to the story...

Really, the fact that product X is giving you a gun actually detracts from your ME experience if you don't get it?

I still dont understand in general why people buy those sort of DLCs

They are essential to fans who enjoy all the content. No one wants to be sold all the Picasso's in the world except this handful that his estate is selling separately because they decided it isn't important for you.

Then frankly, there's a problem with the fans.

A gun or an alternate costume appearance should NEVER be considered essential to the experience. 

If fans actuallyt hink those things are essential, then Bioware should charge them for it since they are quite willing to pay for it.

[CannonO]

Bleachrude wrote...

CannonLars wrote...

Bleachrude wrote...

I have to admit...I'm kind of stunned that people consider Weapons/Costumes essential to the story...

Really, the fact that product X is giving you a gun actually detracts from your ME experience if you don't get it?

I still dont understand in general why people buy those sort of DLCs

They are essential to fans who enjoy all the content. No one wants to be sold all the Picasso's in the world except this handful that his estate is selling separately because they decided it isn't important for you.

Then frankly, there's a problem with the fans.

A gun or an alternate costume appearance should NEVER be considered essential to the experience. 

If fans actuallyt hink those things are essential, then Bioware should charge them for it since they are quite willing to pay for it.

Oh, then by that logic we shouldn't have any options at all in the game. The default is really all we need after all. And as you suggest, it is a great plan to charge us for each "extra" gun or costume. I mean really, who needs that stuff in games anyways? They were crazy to include this stuff in ME1 and 2 and most other games...

What the heck is wrong with these *fans* (blegh!)? Why would they get used to having content made during development be in the game like it used to be? Why would they ever get used to being given options by BioWare within the game instead of in tons of separate costly pieces? Stupid fans making their own problems.

Modifié par CannonLars, 10 février 2012 - 07:00 .

[Spectre 007]

Felidae_5 wrote...

In the end, this "DLC your way into the complete game so you don't have to watch youtube videos of people playing it for you" strategy will increase piracy. If people have to buy 2 copies of the game, a bunch of day 1 DLC's and soft drinks for the full experience, some will just give up and pirate the full game with all extras. Some people are not stupid, they see when they're being milked for money. Then developers WILL lose pottencial profit if they cause frustration with their product. And don't get me started on Origin, it basically pushes people into piracy in order to retain privacy.

Nobody is "forcing" anybody into piracy, thats a childish statement. No one is putting a gun to your head and ordering u to purchase anything. Its entertainment, if you dont have the money for it then dont buy it but dont think that stealing something that someone has labored on is justified just because you cant pony up the dough. 

[CannonO]

Spectre 007 wrote...

Felidae_5 wrote...

In the end, this "DLC your way into the complete game so you don't have to watch youtube videos of people playing it for you" strategy will increase piracy. If people have to buy 2 copies of the game, a bunch of day 1 DLC's and soft drinks for the full experience, some will just give up and pirate the full game with all extras. Some people are not stupid, they see when they're being milked for money. Then developers WILL lose pottencial profit if they cause frustration with their product. And don't get me started on Origin, it basically pushes people into piracy in order to retain privacy.

Nobody is "forcing" anybody into piracy, thats a childish statement. No one is putting a gun to your head and ordering u to purchase anything. Its entertainment, if you dont have the money for it then dont buy it but dont think that stealing something that someone has labored on is justified just because you cant pony up the dough. 

Hey! This is a first world problem! People never put guns to our heads to make us pirate. It revolves around a WANT threshold. If you want something very much, but the price is higher than the want, in this first world, people see that as right to pirate.

Don' ever pirate in my opinion. It is a disgusting theft against creators.

[Spectre 007]

CannonLars wrote...

Spectre 007 wrote...

Felidae_5 wrote...

In the end, this "DLC your way into the complete game so you don't have to watch youtube videos of people playing it for you" strategy will increase piracy. If people have to buy 2 copies of the game, a bunch of day 1 DLC's and soft drinks for the full experience, some will just give up and pirate the full game with all extras. Some people are not stupid, they see when they're being milked for money. Then developers WILL lose pottencial profit if they cause frustration with their product. And don't get me started on Origin, it basically pushes people into piracy in order to retain privacy.

Nobody is "forcing" anybody into piracy, thats a childish statement. No one is putting a gun to your head and ordering u to purchase anything. Its entertainment, if you dont have the money for it then dont buy it but dont think that stealing something that someone has labored on is justified just because you cant pony up the dough. 

Hey! This is a first world problem! People never put guns to our heads to make us pirate. It revolves around a WANT threshold. If you want something very much, but the price is higher than the want, in this first world, people see that as right to pirate.

Don' ever pirate in my opinion. It is a disgusting theft against creators.

Thats why as "adults" we have to make certain decisions & learn to excercise restaint, theres alot of cool stuff out there that I would like to own, but on my feeble student/waiter income I simply cannot afford. I can assure you though that I would never resort to theft. The DLC will still be there when I have the money to purchase it.

[Ice Cold J]

littlezack wrote...

Ice Cold J wrote...



But, Zaeed + his DLC gave you Paragon/Renegade points, a new heavy weapon, a bonus power (inferno grenade), and the second stongest option for "Holding the Line" in the Collector Base, adding quite a bit to the gameplay and your options in said game.
.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I seem to remember Zaeed being a very poor choice for Holding the Line.

You're wrong.

He's been confirmed to be the second strongest "defender" behind only Grunt.

Assuming he's loyal, of course.

[H1natachan]

I havent read through the whole thread yet, I for one are against day one dlc.
I just cant forget that shambles of a day one dlc that came with sig ed of DA2 ( Sebastian ),
50 mb download which meant he was already coded in already. I'm expecting E.A. to push the updated map packs as dlc's.
As for M.E.3 - sorry i'm just going to hang back and wait until i read a few unbiased reviews, i dont mean gamespot or ign.

Tldr, The way DA2 was handled around the same time last year has made me think again on all Bioware releases.

[suprhomre]

If you don't want any DLC it's easy don't preeorder and don't buy any DLC now or in the future. problem solved, BioWare shop closed and end of line.

[CannonO]

Spectre 007 wrote...

CannonLars wrote...

Spectre 007 wrote...

Felidae_5 wrote...

In the end, this "DLC your way into the complete game so you don't have to watch youtube videos of people playing it for you" strategy will increase piracy. If people have to buy 2 copies of the game, a bunch of day 1 DLC's and soft drinks for the full experience, some will just give up and pirate the full game with all extras. Some people are not stupid, they see when they're being milked for money. Then developers WILL lose pottencial profit if they cause frustration with their product. And don't get me started on Origin, it basically pushes people into piracy in order to retain privacy.

Nobody is "forcing" anybody into piracy, thats a childish statement. No one is putting a gun to your head and ordering u to purchase anything. Its entertainment, if you dont have the money for it then dont buy it but dont think that stealing something that someone has labored on is justified just because you cant pony up the dough. 

Hey! This is a first world problem! People never put guns to our heads to make us pirate. It revolves around a WANT threshold. If you want something very much, but the price is higher than the want, in this first world, people see that as right to pirate.

Don't ever pirate in my opinion. It is a disgusting theft against creators.

Thats why as "adults" we have to make certain decisions & learn to excercise restaint, theres alot of cool stuff out there that I would like to own, but on my feeble student/waiter income I simply cannot afford. I can assure you though that I would never resort to theft. The DLC will still be there when I have the money to purchase it.

That is overall correct. That doesn't mean it is wrong to voice disapproval with the change in DLC offering strategies. To get all DLC before, it reuired some Dr. Pepper codes and a pre-order code at Gamestop for the CE. This time, it is $300+ in random merchandise. The problem is visible, but it definitely shouldn't lead to anyone thinking they have a right to pirate it.