335 réponses à ce sujet

[GhostlyMaiden]

MouseNo4 wrote...

It matters not what is right or wrong, fair or not. Merely what is fact. Men can never be as flexible as women, nor can women aspire to be as tough and strong as men.

If it were possible both could be equal, would such be better? Yes, i do believe it would be.

Say that to Jane Tricker: www.youtube.com/watch

And she's one of the smaller ones I've seen.

FemShep's build is a customization limitation, same as MShep. My soldier and vanguard females would have a body type similar to this if I could so choose, while my male engineer and adept's arms look too big to me.

Edit: Ooh found a good one for male flexibility, too. Say hello to Lazarus Gitu!

www.youtube.com/watch

Modifié par GhostlyMaiden, 11 février 2012 - 03:47 .

[Ice Cold J]

siriusstardodger wrote...

StElmo wrote...

koopaonfire wrote...

Ice Cold J wrote...
Cause, even though she is a marine and all that you mentioned, I just don't like the idea of promoting cross-gender violence.
I've never been in the armed services, but I believe that, in sparring exercises, they match women with women.
Regardless, in something like this, where younger viewers could see it, I'd just as soon there not be a depiction of a woman getting hit by a man, ESPECIALLY in a friendly atmosphere. This could, possibly in the wrong boy's mind, make it seem like women are OK to hit, as long as it's a friendly competition.
Besides, the same point could be gotten across or even make FemShep look better if she dodges all his attacks and lands a right cross to him. Dontcha think?

So you're okay with younger viewers hearing swearing, engaging in sex and innuendo, murdering a plethora of people, and so on and so forth, yet when Shepard and Vega get into a little friendly sparring match, you're suddenly embracing chivalristic moralism? I can't imagine the extent of the cognitive dissonance your mind must face on a daily basis if you can't see any substantial flaws in your logic.

ZING.

I have always had the firm belief that women and men should be treated equally. Sports should be cross gender, armed forces should be cross gender.

I like how femshep is sparring with vega. I hope they don't use the same animations though, because she has a smaller frame and I imagine agility is more her forte - just for realism sake.

That said, female/male I don't really care, women can be strong, men can be sensitive - treat everyone equally I say. Why can't femshep be strong enough to beat down vega?

I think it's wrong to hit anyone who is weak, be that a woman or man.

Given that commander shepard is a badass, it's not as bad seeing vega and her duke it out, because she is qualified.

We need to get over these male/female generalizations and focus on WHY it is wrong.

Why is it reprehensible to hit a woman? Because they are generally weaker...

Thus... the rule should be, it is reprehensible to hit anyone weaker then you.

I heartly agree. Also about the agility thing. Let's see femShep do some smooth moves!

If y'all would take the time, you would see that I suggested this as an alternative.

I don't have a problem with them sparring, I have a problem with a 230 lb. guy bare-knuckle punching a woman.

I would think it not too difficult to have a scene for FemShep where she dodges his strikes and takes him down. They're still sparring, she still competes and even comes out on top. But, in this instance, Vega doesn't connect with a right hook like he does with male Shepard.

What is wrong with this? It's not making women out to be weak. The only thing it is doing is not depicting a man punching a woman in the face. Honestly, if he got her in a submission hold, I'd be fine with that. It's just the image of a woman getting straight snuffed in the grill that's got me a little uneasy.

[FOZ289]

What, so female Shepard is all fast and skilled, and male Shepard is just a big oaf who takes punches? You're not making any sense. They're sparring. It's not like Vega jumped around a corner and clocked Shepard. She's not "a woman," she's Shepard, and she's sparring. You're supposed to see past that. Also Bioware isn't going to reanimate the scene for such a weak reason.

Does anyone else think "It's not about tactics or strategy, it's about survival" is one of the dumbest things Shepard has ever said?

Modifié par FOZ289, 11 février 2012 - 04:58 .

[pfhorlorn]

Ice Cold J wrote...

If y'all would take the time, you would see that I suggested this as an alternative.

I don't have a problem with them sparring, I have a problem with a 230 lb. guy bare-knuckle punching a woman.

I would think it not too difficult to have a scene for FemShep where she dodges his strikes and takes him down. They're still sparring, she still competes and even comes out on top. But, in this instance, Vega doesn't connect with a right hook like he does with male Shepard.

What is wrong with this? It's not making women out to be weak. The only thing it is doing is not depicting a man punching a woman in the face. Honestly, if he got her in a submission hold, I'd be fine with that. It's just the image of a woman getting straight snuffed in the grill that's got me a little uneasy.

I'll be sure to never ask you to spar with me, then.

Anyway, I already explained why this logic is silly. It doesn't matter if Vega is a beefcake or scrawny—Shepard's a trained N7 marine and a [former] Spectre. If you really want to change this scene in the instance that Shepard is female, that's obviously sexism. I'm not trying to buzzword you or anything, but it is. You can call it what you like, but wanting to treat the sexes different because they're inherently different sexes IS sexism. It may be fictional, but seriously, come on.

I said in my post that it's a mutual agreement to fight each other. If Shepard enters into that, knowing how large Vega is, s/he should expect to be walloped a few times.

Regardless, Shepard will most likely come out on top anyway (regardless of gender), because s/he's better trained than Vega. In the event that s/he doesn't, however, there'd probably be a pretty neat scene reflecting on the Commander's humanity, reminding him/her that s/he's not invincible. Or something... idk.

What I'm trying to say is that your opposition, while an opinion, is a fast dying way of thinking, so I'd imagine that in almost two hundred years from now, trained soldiers would have absolutely no problem sparring cross-gender. Some countries already train their militaries together anyway.

It's unfortunate that you don't seem to understand how anyone can find fault with what you're saying, since I imagine this post will largely go the way of the others—that is to say, ignored or not taken into account.

FOZ289 wrote...

What, so female Shepard is all fast and skilled, and male Shepard is just a big oaf who takes punches? You're not making any sense. They're sparring. It's not like Vega jumped around a corner and clocked Shepard. She's not "a woman," she's Shepard, and she's sparring. You're supposed to see past that. Also Bioware isn't going to reanimate the scene for such a weak reason.

Agree x100.

FOZ289 wrote...

Does anyone else think "It's not about tactics or strategy, it's about survival" is one of the dumbest things Shepard has ever said?

I dunno if it's as dumb as Shepard's quick jump to believing the Reaper threat in ME1, though (and I don't mean after talking to Benezia / Sovereign / Vigil / Saren, but right at the beginning, when all you know is that Saren is rogue and has a buttload of geth under his command).

I'm still looking forward to ME3 über much. This trailer certainly accentuates that. :]

Modifié par koopaonfire, 11 février 2012 - 05:03 .

[FOZ289]

It's not like the whole game is going to take course over one day. Would make sense to stop and think. Without a strategy, what are they gonna do, shoot the Reapers? I can't think of a proper analogy to illustrate the stupidity, but it's there.

It took me a while to notice how hasty Shepard is in Mass Effect. The player sees Saren shoot Nihlus, but all Shepard sees is some colonist who claims one turian named Saren shot a turian named Nihlus, and suddenly SAREN IS A TRAITOR, YOU FOOLS. That actually is rather odd.

[TieRantaSaurusWrex]

GhostlyMaiden wrote...

MouseNo4 wrote...

It matters not what is right or wrong, fair or not. Merely what is fact. Men can never be as flexible as women, nor can women aspire to be as tough and strong as men.

If it were possible both could be equal, would such be better? Yes, i do believe it would be.

Say that to Jane Tricker: www.youtube.com/watch

And she's one of the smaller ones I've seen.

FemShep's build is a customization limitation, same as MShep. My soldier and vanguard females would have a body type similar to this if I could so choose, while my male engineer and adept's arms look too big to me.

Edit: Ooh found a good one for male flexibility, too. Say hello to Lazarus Gitu!

www.youtube.com/watch

.. hm, I'm not at all trying to offend anyone with this post so I'll try to word it right not to come off as a jerk.

Everyone can find exceptions for anything.. Heck, you can even find a WHITE ,Black person. But to try and and go against a stereotype that was established for thhousands and thousands of years (with reason) Is just trying to prove a point that isnt worth proving.

Yes there we be body building females, and super contortionist males.

But when you put an average and a number value on it its exactly what Mouse was saying. That is fact, it's easy to find one exception to anything, and he just poorly worded what e was actually saying.

But Beastly Femshep, should have been one of those exeption (as a choice) because... um its Commander Freakin' Shephard

[Jonttu1]

publius1000 wrote...

Dat laser at the end with which she blasted the reaper, is that a stolen (or recovered) reaper weapon?
Because that would be sweet.

It's a targeting laser for an air strike or an orbital strike.

[Ice Cold J]

FOZ289 wrote...

What, so female Shepard is all fast and skilled, and male Shepard is just a big oaf who takes punches? You're not making any sense. They're sparring. It's not like Vega jumped around a corner and clocked Shepard. She's not "a woman," she's Shepard, and she's sparring. You're supposed to see past that. Also Bioware isn't going to reanimate the scene for such a weak reason.

Does anyone else think "It's not about tactics or strategy, it's about survival" is one of the dumbest things Shepard has ever said?

And THAT sentence makes sense?

I'm done having people misinterpret what I'm saying and not reading my posts all the way through.

Trailer was great. I loved the last line. New FemShep model is OK, but not a HUGE improvement. Stoked I got to see ME2 squaddies in the trailer.

Goodbye, thread!

[publius1000]

Jonttu1 wrote...

publius1000 wrote...

Dat laser at the end with which she blasted the reaper, is that a stolen (or recovered) reaper weapon?
Because that would be sweet.

It's a targeting laser for an air strike or an orbital strike.

Silly me, of course it is, still, I prefer my theory.:innocent:

[digby69]

Ice Cold J wrote...

siriusstardodger wrote...

StElmo wrote...

koopaonfire wrote...

Ice Cold J wrote...
Cause, even though she is a marine and all that you mentioned, I just don't like the idea of promoting cross-gender violence.
I've never been in the armed services, but I believe that, in sparring exercises, they match women with women.
Regardless, in something like this, where younger viewers could see it, I'd just as soon there not be a depiction of a woman getting hit by a man, ESPECIALLY in a friendly atmosphere. This could, possibly in the wrong boy's mind, make it seem like women are OK to hit, as long as it's a friendly competition.
Besides, the same point could be gotten across or even make FemShep look better if she dodges all his attacks and lands a right cross to him. Dontcha think?

So you're okay with younger viewers hearing swearing, engaging in sex and innuendo, murdering a plethora of people, and so on and so forth, yet when Shepard and Vega get into a little friendly sparring match, you're suddenly embracing chivalristic moralism? I can't imagine the extent of the cognitive dissonance your mind must face on a daily basis if you can't see any substantial flaws in your logic.

ZING.

I have always had the firm belief that women and men should be treated equally. Sports should be cross gender, armed forces should be cross gender.

I like how femshep is sparring with vega. I hope they don't use the same animations though, because she has a smaller frame and I imagine agility is more her forte - just for realism sake.

That said, female/male I don't really care, women can be strong, men can be sensitive - treat everyone equally I say. Why can't femshep be strong enough to beat down vega?

I think it's wrong to hit anyone who is weak, be that a woman or man.

Given that commander shepard is a badass, it's not as bad seeing vega and her duke it out, because she is qualified.

We need to get over these male/female generalizations and focus on WHY it is wrong.

Why is it reprehensible to hit a woman? Because they are generally weaker...

Thus... the rule should be, it is reprehensible to hit anyone weaker then you.

I heartly agree. Also about the agility thing. Let's see femShep do some smooth moves!

If y'all would take the time, you would see that I suggested this as an alternative.

I don't have a problem with them sparring, I have a problem with a 230 lb. guy bare-knuckle punching a woman.

I would think it not too difficult to have a scene for FemShep where she dodges his strikes and takes him down. They're still sparring, she still competes and even comes out on top. But, in this instance, Vega doesn't connect with a right hook like he does with male Shepard.

What is wrong with this? It's not making women out to be weak. The only thing it is doing is not depicting a man punching a woman in the face. Honestly, if he got her in a submission hold, I'd be fine with that. It's just the image of a woman getting straight snuffed in the grill that's got me a little uneasy.

Just get other it!!

[digby69]

PS Excellent video

[Spaghetti_Ninja]

Jotamide wrote...

Jennifer Hale's VA > Mark Meer's VA

Meer does the Vorcha and Volus voices. Meer wins.

Anyway, nice video. Good to see Miranda back as well.

[PretaxAle95]

miranda is the one which appeared in the video?

[Spaghetti_Ninja]

MouseNo4 wrote...

It matters not what is right or wrong, fair or not. Merely what is fact. Men can never be as flexible as women, nor can women aspire to be as tough and strong as men.

Wrong and wrong. Women can take steroids and pump up their bodies to be stronger than the average man, and as for flexibility... where do you get this crap? Never seen a Kung-Fu movie in your life? Never seen the male Judo championships on TV?

Modifié par Spaghetti_Ninja, 11 février 2012 - 11:56 .

[Zaxares]

Hmm, the default Femshep looks different than what I thought she'd be from the winning contest entry, but it's still nice to see her get some screentime at long last. Also, I was pleased to see Miranda's cameo in the video too!

[Nimrodell]

Strange, no one was crying out loud it's not ok to hit a woman while Garrus was telling the story about 'reach and flexibility' in ME2 and femShep had option to offer a sparring match to a turian male, mind you, but now with Vega it's an issue? lol So, bottom line is, it's ok to have your arse kicked by a turian or when turian male is hitting turian female, but if it's human male, then we'll talk about chivalry? Or it's ok if Sheploo hits Al'Jilani, 'cause you know, it's Shep and she had it coming?
Ah, this is really funny. I am a female and my husband treats me as an equal. When I was a student in my country during '90s, fighting for freedom and democracy, police didn't see me as female while beating me. They just saw an enemy. To be honest, not even NATO bombs saw me as a female... Shepard is a marine - she's not a female, not perceived as such, not even by herself while doing her duty. And as femShep, I would be heavily offended to be treated differently than my other fellow marines. Actually, Vega is honoring Shepard as an equal in this situation... one thing is domestic violence, or just plain violence... this is something opposite - when femShep enlisted, she stopped being a woman, she became a soldier - same goes for male version.

[shepisavanguardgetoverit]

siriusstardodger wrote...

StElmo wrote...

koopaonfire wrote...

Ice Cold J wrote...
Cause, even though she is a marine and all that you mentioned, I just don't like the idea of promoting cross-gender violence.
I've never been in the armed services, but I believe that, in sparring exercises, they match women with women.
Regardless, in something like this, where younger viewers could see it, I'd just as soon there not be a depiction of a woman getting hit by a man, ESPECIALLY in a friendly atmosphere. This could, possibly in the wrong boy's mind, make it seem like women are OK to hit, as long as it's a friendly competition.
Besides, the same point could be gotten across or even make FemShep look better if she dodges all his attacks and lands a right cross to him. Dontcha think?

So you're okay with younger viewers hearing swearing, engaging in sex and innuendo, murdering a plethora of people, and so on and so forth, yet when Shepard and Vega get into a little friendly sparring match, you're suddenly embracing chivalristic moralism? I can't imagine the extent of the cognitive dissonance your mind must face on a daily basis if you can't see any substantial flaws in your logic.

ZING.

I have always had the firm belief that women and men should be treated equally. Sports should be cross gender, armed forces should be cross gender.

I like how femshep is sparring with vega. I hope they don't use the same animations though, because she has a smaller frame and I imagine agility is more her forte - just for realism sake.

That said, female/male I don't really care, women can be strong, men can be sensitive - treat everyone equally I say. Why can't femshep be strong enough to beat down vega?

I think it's wrong to hit anyone who is weak, be that a woman or man.

Given that commander shepard is a badass, it's not as bad seeing vega and her duke it out, because she is qualified.

We need to get over these male/female generalizations and focus on WHY it is wrong.

Why is it reprehensible to hit a woman? Because they are generally weaker...

Thus... the rule should be, it is reprehensible to hit anyone weaker then you.

I heartly agree. Also about the agility thing. Let's see femShep do some smooth moves!

koopaonfire wrote...

MouseNo4 wrote...

Kind of irrelevant, but both genders are not on equal footing in regards to body strength and flexibility.

I addressed this in my giant (moderately sized) rant. Quote: "While biological women may traditionally be less endowed with muscle compared to biological men, that doesn't mean a woman can't have the potential to be a lean, mean fighting machine like any of her phallus-having compatriots." Just because the rule of thumb is that men are physically stronger, doesn't mean that every man is stronger than every woman.

And who cares? Shepard is a badass, as previously stated. The service history clearly attests to this regardless of what you choose—Anderson notes in one path that Shepard's a survivor. A bit of friendly sparring between friends is seriously not a big deal, hence why I made my prior post directed at, uh, that one dude.

Ultimately, as I said before, they were engaged in a consensual punching contest. That's what matters here: consent. And even so, in my eyes, a woman being beaten against her will is no worse than the same occurring to a man. They're both terrible, but we must remember that this is fiction, in fact, and focuses a lot on action, so it's inevitable that the protagonist is going to take a few hits in the line of duty, regardless of what gender the player picked.

Everyone here has a point, but your all forgeting about something: Shepards cybernetics. 

Heavy Skin Weave: Strong synthetic fibers can be woven through the skin, dramatically
reducing damage taken from most attacks. These fibers also act as a
medi-gel conduit, improving healing.


Heavy Muscle Weave: Perforating the muscles with micro-fibers increases overall strength and
decreases the potential for muscle damage from exertion.


Heavy Bone Weave: By reinforcing the skeleton with a synthetic weave, bones can be made
almost unbreakable. In the event of bone trauma, medi-gel conduits allow
for bone regenerations in a matter of days.

So the arguments that Femshep would be less stronger than James but more agile, are actually false.  With her cybernetic upgrades as well as her biotic abilities (if applicable of course), she could totally own James if she wanted to. 

Plus she's a redhead, and you don't mess with a readhead

[J4JOKER]

WOW! me like her new hairstyle,looks like we getting new hair dews

[digby69]

Nimrodell wrote...

Strange, no one was crying out loud it's not ok to hit a woman while Garrus was telling the story about 'reach and flexibility' in ME2 and femShep had option to offer a sparring match to a turian male, mind you, but now with Vega it's an issue? lol So, bottom line is, it's ok to have your arse kicked by a turian or when turian male is hitting turian female, but if it's human male, then we'll talk about chivalry? Or it's ok if Sheploo hits Al'Jilani, 'cause you know, it's Shep and she had it coming?
Ah, this is really funny. I am a female and my husband treats me as an equal. When I was a student in my country during '90s, fighting for freedom and democracy, police didn't see me as female while beating me. They just saw an enemy. To be honest, not even NATO bombs saw me as a female... Shepard is a marine - she's not a female, not perceived as such, not even by herself while doing her duty. And as femShep, I would be heavily offended to be treated differently than my other fellow marines. Actually, Vega is honoring Shepard as an equal in this situation... one thing is domestic violence, or just plain violence... this is something opposite - when femShep enlisted, she stopped being a woman, she became a soldier - same goes for male version.

Well said.

[Kainovieno]

Yes! Nice to see a femShep trailer from Bioware.

[Troller79]

why is the FemShep 16 years old