37 réponses à ce sujet

[pcf43]

Ok so this got into my mind after seeing a trailer for Mass Effect 3, don't know which of them actually in which Liara points a gun to a hologram of the Illusive Man. Assuming that, I believe that at some point during the game we or one of our companions, like Liara to be more precise will shoot him, the thing that concerns me right now is if we get or not the option to shoot him/spear him or is it just a linear cutscene. Anyways, if we do have that option to either keep him alive(this being the paragon choice) in other words spare him or kill him(being the renegade way or whatever), which would you choose? I believe both choices may have advantages and disadvantages and heres a short list of each of them:
Advantages:
Illusive Man is the leader of the Cerberus group, if we spare him we might be able to convince him to get the Cerberus troops off us and instead, help us fight the Reapers and join the side of the Alliance and the other alien civilizations, now I know what some may say that Cerberus is an anti-alien group, but this is a critical situation, so they might do it at least to save themselves if nothing else. Yes even if you gave them the base there is an entire fleet of sentient ships coming to kill everyone so this pretty much means the base can't give them enough power anyway they will still need allies if they want to survive. Also by helping the other species Cerberuses image would be at least a little changed in the Councils eyes meaning that they, through this, have a chance to redeem themselves.
Disatvantages:
If we spare the Illusive Man well, we all know who he is, what he is capable of, and all that sort of thing. He could fairly well send a whole army of troops after Shepard and his team right after he escapes. Don't know why is he trying to attack Shepard in the first place assuming he payed a fortune to bring him back to life, anyway. We risk by keeping him alive to let him  keep sending its troops across the galaxy to attack everyone, on short, to add extra problems to our main one being the Reapers. I hope I posted this in the right forum if not I'd like for the topic to be moved to the right place.

[Legion4ever]

I would go and drop his smug self onto the Turian homeworld

[Dave of Canada]

Can't save somebody from poor writing, I'm afraid.

[BatmanPWNS]

Does saving include trying to headshot him?

[KotorEffect3]

If by saving him you mean his salvation through his destruction. Sure. Maybe the same why my Shepard's unit was "saved" on Akuze, or the way Jack was "saved" and dragged off to Pragia,or how David was "saved" in project Overlord, or the way Paul Grayson was "saved". In fact I think Jack and Toombs should "save" TIM together.

[KotorEffect3]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Can't save somebody from poor writing, I'm afraid.

WAAAAHHH  THE WRITING TEAM DIDN'T BEND TO MY WHIMS WAAAAH

[khordlambert]

If by "save" you mean strap to the front of the Normandy as part of operation human shield, then yes. We should be able to "save" him.

[Dean_the_Young]

KotorEffect3 wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

Can't save somebody from poor writing, I'm afraid.

WAAAAHHH  THE WRITING TEAM DIDN'T BEND TO MY WHIMS WAAAAH

You think over-the-top evil and reliance on indoctrination is good writing design?

[khordlambert]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

KotorEffect3 wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

Can't save somebody from poor writing, I'm afraid.

WAAAAHHH  THE WRITING TEAM DIDN'T BEND TO MY WHIMS WAAAAH

You think over-the-top evil and reliance on indoctrination is good writing design?

I'd call it more, something I saw coming a fragging mile away.

Honestly, if you weren't thinking "He's indoctrinated" the very second you saw the Saren eyes then i don't know what to tell you.

As for over-the-top-evil, oh yes, because luring people in to be attacked by Threasher Maws, injecting people with Threasher Maw acid, breeding giant violent bugs, and kidnapping children for experiments that would make certain unethical scientists swoon, are the signs of such a SUBTLEY written organization.

[Provo_101]

^ this guy.

[Dave of Canada]

khordlambert wrote...

I'd call it more, something I saw coming a fragging mile away.

Ignoring how you see the world in black-and-white, you saw it coming from a mile away because Bioware writers are obvious with their intent and any hope they might do something interesting is quickly dashed because it's easier to appeal to the masses, no matter how poor the writing is.

Can't go around pushing moral ambiguity, rewarding questionable methods and the like. Such conflicts and people totally don't exist in the real world, everybody must be mustache twirling villains or saints with angel wings.

[khordlambert]

Dave of Canada wrote...

khordlambert wrote...

I'd call it more, something I saw coming a fragging mile away.

Ignoring how you see the world in black-and-white, you saw it coming from a mile away because Bioware writers are obvious with their intent and any hope they might do something interesting is quickly dashed because it's easier to appeal to the masses, no matter how poor the writing is.

Can't go around pushing moral ambiguity, rewarding questionable methods and the like. Such conflicts and people totally don't exist in the real world, everybody must be mustache twirling villains or saints with angel wings.

I'd love to know how you figure I see the world in Black and White due to the fact I hate Cerberus. The organization has no real oversight,  would have ended up destroying all life before the Reapers even got here if I didn't keep cleaning up their messes, and are led by a smug little twit with a God complex.

The only thing I've seen them do with ANY sucess was ressurecting Shepard, and rebulding the Normandy, and Shepard's ressurection STILL resulted in the deaths of nearly everyone involved because one guy, who had nothing in his job description based in security detail, managed to circumvent the stations sercurity and drive the mechs nuts.

I hate Cerberus not because of some "Black and White" viewpoint you've decided to place on me, but because the entire thing, from top to bottom, could be improved if they replaced most of the organization with freaking COBRA Command! Their incompetance is awe inspiring!

[GodWood]

khordlambert wrote...
I'd call it more, something I saw coming a fragging mile away.

Honestly, if you weren't thinking "He's indoctrinated" the very second you saw the Saren eyes then i don't know what to tell you.

inorite?

It's not like that completely contradicts his actions over the series nor does it contradict past books and other external media.

Plus having TIM be a morally grey antagonist that isn't just 'pure evulzzzz'?

Who the **** would want that?!

[Ieldra]

I think ME3's story will be open to interpreting TIM as a tragic figure instead of a "for-the-evulz" villain.

However, that doesn't excuse the over-the-top presentation of Cerberus' atrocities, paired with an incompetence usually only the villains and politicians are allowed to show. I've said it countless times: if your evil doesn't have a point, players who think about things instead of just being in for the ride will cease to take it seriously. Also invoking evil by association (presenting things people tend to associate with evil without there being any justification for it, in order to make things appear evil which aren't and morally invalidate technologies) has the same effect. Both has been done with awful regularity in Cerberus-related writing.

IMO TIM will be beyond saving in ME3, for reasons unrelated to any decision we make. He may, however, not be beyond redemption. His main merit remains: without him, Shepard would be dead, and who knows if there would've been another one to take up Shepard's mantle. Wherever he ends up in ME3, he made a decisive contribution to saving the galaxy.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 12 février 2012 - 09:25 .

[Inquisitor Recon]

GodWood wrote...
inorite?

It's not like that completely contradicts his actions over the series nor does it contradict past books and other external media.

Plus having TIM be a morally grey antagonist that isn't just 'pure evulzzzz'?

Who the **** would want that?!

^
This

Plus it contradicts the entire organization layout of Cerberus which is supposed to prevent the whole organization from going down the tiolet if some ****** stares at a reaper device for too long.

[Costin_Razvan]

Most people who TIM are pure Paragons, let's face it. I find it amusing however that the option to kill TIM, if Shepard even gets the possibility that is, will be Renegade rather then Paragon. Paragon Shepard NEVER kills someone in cold blood.

[VarrenSoldier]

I think I'll feed TIM to a thresher maw, give him a taste of his own medicine.

[Dean_the_Young]

khordlambert wrote...

I'd call it more, something I saw coming a fragging mile away.

You saw that the single group that actually acknowledged and moved against the Reaper threat and assisted Shepard in such would work for the Reapers?

Honestly, if you weren't thinking "He's indoctrinated" the very second you saw the Saren eyes then i don't know what to tell you.

Well, let's start with the fact that Shepard has similar eyes.

And then let's go with that TIM isn't indoctrinated until later on in ME3, while he's had the eyes for decades.

As for over-the-top-evil, oh yes, because luring people in to be attacked by Threasher Maws, injecting people with Threasher Maw acid, breeding giant violent bugs, and kidnapping children for experiments that would make certain unethical scientists swoon, are the signs of such a SUBTLEY written organization.

How many people in the galaxy knew about them? Akuze doesn't even get considered unless you have two witnesses, one of them a Cerberus scientist participant. Nor was Cerberus breeding Rachni. Nor was Teltin sanctioned in its extent.

Besides that you don't know the motivations or context behind half of what you cite, of course.

[Ranicus56]

BatmanPWNS wrote...

Does saving include trying to headshot him?

This

[khordlambert]

Costin_Razvan wrote...

Most people who TIM are pure Paragons, let's face it. I find it amusing however that the option to kill TIM, if Shepard even gets the possibility that is, will be Renegade rather then Paragon. Paragon Shepard NEVER kills someone in cold blood.

And that's why I play Paragade. Sure I'm an understanding guy, but i have limits.