421 réponses à ce sujet

[izmirtheastarach]

Shepard is and has always been a Lieutenant Commander. Do you think he managed to get promoted while he was 1. Dead 2. Working for Cerberus 3. Under arrest for mass murder. Answer: No.

Modifié par izmirtheastarach, 12 février 2012 - 08:47 .

[What a Succulent Ass]

Shepard is a lieutenant commander. S/he's the same rank as Ashley.

[CerberusSoldier]

EternalAmbiguity wrote...

izmirtheastarach wrote...

That's such a pathetic BS cop-out response. Why is that always the asnwer? Can games never be anything more then what they are? That whole phrase really ticks me off.

So because it's a game we can't expect anything out of it? No thank you.

And how do you know whether any of the devteam has served in the military. Geez.

Chill out, pal. If you knew my "history" on here you'd see that I don't excuse things by saying "it's a game." I think there need to be tougher choices. I think people need to die. I think ME3 should be more realistic than it will be.


But the fact is, it isn't. I wasn't saying "it's a game" as a reason why it SHOULDN'T be accurate, but as the reason WHY it's not that accurate. Because the devs didn't put that much thought into it.

Again, I'm not saying that's okay, just that that's the way it is.

   




If Shepard was just refereed to as Shepard in the game I would not have any issue at all with Bioware but in Mass Effect 1 they addressed him or her as Commander well then they dam well better follow proper miliatry ranks for its officers in the game and failure to do so is stupid .

[FeralEwok]

In regards to Ash going from a NCO to an officer: It's completely possible and it happens.

The first instance is when a NCO performs with exceptional leadership abilities in the line of duty and recieves a battlefield commision. It doesn't happen very often, at least not now days. If they are not right in the middle of an operation usually the NCO would get pulled from the unit and recieve the rank of 2nd LT or whatever branch equivilant may be.

The other instance is much more boring. A NCO reaches near the end of their enlistment. At that time they are given the option to either re-up and continue serving, or quit and resume life as a civilian. Alot of the time as incentive for re-uping, a soldier can negotiate their re-enlistment with a career councilor by either receiving a signing bonus, a specific duty station, job reassignment, OR school they wish to attend. In this instance all the NCO would have to do is request to go to Officer Candidate School and then upon completion would be granted an officer's commision.

As for Kaidan it's a bit iffy on how he could jump that high that quickly other than the Alliance boosting him up because of his prior service record.

But for anyone who doesn't believe you cannot be promoted quickly and even reach officer status, just look up Audie Murphy. Went from buck private to officer in 4 years time....granted he had to do a bunch of outrageous stuff to get it...BUT it happens.

[ObserverStatus]

Tom Lehrer wrote...

Shep is a LT. Commander? I always thought he was a Staff Commander since noone I can recall ever calls him lieutant like others of that rank.

You're both wrong, he's a...

wait for it...

Shepherd Commander!

[CerberusSoldier]

Random Jerkface wrote...

Shepard is a lieutenant commander. S/he's the same rank as Ashley.

   


then Bioware has no f**king idea on what military ranks are . 

[Juha81FIN]

makenzieshepard wrote...

The difference between the rank of Captain and the billet of Captain.  As there is  a Star Trek quote for eveything lets have O'Brien explain.

"It's an old naval tradition. Whoever's in command of a ship, regardless of rank, is referred to as 'captain.' "
"You mean if I had to take command, I would be called 'captain,' too?"
"Cadet, by the time you took command, there'd be nobody left to call you anything."

– O'Brien and Nog

Hehe, reminds me of Star Trek next gen episode when Councilor Deanna Troi ended up commanding Enterprise .

[izmirtheastarach]

FeralEwok wrote...

In regards to Ash going from a NCO to an officer: It's completely possible and it happens.

The first instance is when a NCO performs with exceptional leadership abilities in the line of duty and recieves a battlefield commision. It doesn't happen very often, at least not now days. If they are not right in the middle of an operation usually the NCO would get pulled from the unit and recieve the rank of 2nd LT or whatever branch equivilant may be.

The other instance is much more boring. A NCO reaches near the end of their enlistment. At that time they are given the option to either re-up and continue serving, or quit and resume life as a civilian. Alot of the time as incentive for re-uping, a soldier can negotiate their re-enlistment with a career councilor by either receiving a signing bonus, a specific duty station, job reassignment, OR school they wish to attend. In this instance all the NCO would have to do is request to go to Officer Candidate School and then upon completion would be granted an officer's commision.

As for Kaidan it's a bit iffy on how he could jump that high that quickly other than the Alliance boosting him up because of his prior service record.

But for anyone who doesn't believe you cannot be promoted quickly and even reach officer status, just look up Audie Murphy. Went from buck private to officer in 4 years time....granted he had to do a bunch of outrageous stuff to get it...BUT it happens.

There's also the fact that extremely high ranking NCOs would be very unlikely to recieve a battlefield commision, because they are too valuable in their current posts. In ME2, Ash seems to be hold the highest NCO ranks, so it's pretty odd.

Kaidan's rank is much less problematic, because of how old he is, and how long he's served. He's been an officer for 12 or 13 years at the time of ME2. Ash seems to have been one for an incredibly short amount of time.

Modifié par izmirtheastarach, 12 février 2012 - 08:52 .

[Mr. Gogeta34]

Prom001 wrote...

So I wonder. In 2,5 to 3 years people get promoted pretty fast.

Kadian gets promoted from Staff Lieutenant, 3 ranks to Major.

Ash is even better going from the NCO rank Gunnery Chief, 5 ranks up to Lieutenant Commander, some rank as Shep.

I know i know but got nothing better to do at the moment and yes I know the alliance millitary is not the US Navy/USMC.

p.s.: Worst example of this is  the new awful so called "star trek" movie where 3 year cadet Kirk get promoted to Captain.

Through outstanding action, a person can be promoted quickly.  Like being instrumental in the saving of an entire universe.

Modifié par Mr. Gogeta34, 12 février 2012 - 08:52 .

[LetMeW1n]

ADLegend21 wrote...

Prom001 wrote...

So I wonder. In 2,5 to 3 years people get promoted pretty fast.

Kadian gets promoted from Staff Lieutenant, 3 ranks to Major.

Ash is even better going from the NCO rank Gunnery Chief, 5 ranks up to Lieutenant Commander, some rank as Shep.

I know i know but got nothing better to do at the moment and yes I know the alliance millitary is not the US Navy/USMC.

p.s.: Worst example of this is  the new awful so called "star trek" movie where 3 year cadet Kirk get promoted to Captain.

well when you're part of a team that saves the entire galaxy, have a friend in a really high place that gives you the oppourtunity to succeeed and you do You get really awesome promotions. You forget Ashley's technical scores were incredible, and the 212 adored her as squad leader but her grandfathers FCW antics held her back unjustly. She could have been the same rank as Kaidan in ME1 if not for that and be Major Ashley Williams.

Kaidan's also a career serviceman and a biotic. The only reason Shepard gets to commander at 29 before Kaidan is because of either Elysium, Torfan, or Akuze. Kaidan doesn't have a high profile mision until being on teh hunt for saren which earns him Staff Commander

tl;dr? Doing Spectacular thing gets you Spectacular rewards.

[FeralEwok]

izmirtheastarach wrote...



There's also the fact that extremely high ranking NCOs would be very unlikely to recieve a battlefield commision, because they are too valuable in their current posts. In ME2, Ash seems to be hold the highest NCO ranks, so it's pretty odd.

Kaidan's rank is much less problematic, because of how old he is, and how long he's served.

None of that matters because Ash is being pulled away from whatever post she was serving by becoming a Spectre. It was spec ops (and solo from the way it appeared) So an NCOIC isn't what would stop her from being promoted.

[Prom001]

Well it is just. a bit of research, like 5 minutes on the internet, shows that that those promotion are just not possible.
Look I am in no way a perfectionist, it is just I notice such small things and they annoy me.

[izmirtheastarach]

Mr. Gogeta34 wrote...

Through outstanding action, a person can be promoted quickly.  Like being instrumental in the saving of an entire universe.

So..Ash/Kaidan was bumped up two or three ranks for completely failing to protect Horizon? Hmmmm.

[GIJooTheWarHero]

CerberusSoldier wrote...

Random Jerkface wrote...

Shepard is a lieutenant commander. S/he's the same rank as Ashley.

   


then Bioware has no f**king idea on what military ranks are . 

Except for the fact that Lieutenant Commander is a real rank in the US Navy right now. But you'd be thrown off the ship (figuratively) if you ever called an Lt. Commander a "Lieutenant" instead of "Commander. Same basic rule applies to the General ranks. Brigadier, Lieutenant, Major, General, all called "General".

And just because Shepard and Ashley are the same rank doesn't mean she has any authority equal to him. He is the acting CO of the Normandy and has the most in-rate time for that rank. Senior officer gets priority.

Shepard did the same thing as Ashley. Started as enlisted and worked up into officer. That seems to be something pretty common in the Alliance Navy.

Also, the Alliance Navy's ranks aren't that odd. 3 junior enlisted, 3 S/NCO ranks, the rest are officers. There are real world militaries with rank structures very similar to it. Most people are just used to the US' way of doing it with 9 enlisted ranks and 10 officer ranks (and warrant officer where it applies).

[J4JOKER]

"Im commander shepard and I been promoted"

[SykoWolf]

Shepard isn't promoted as he worked for cerberus and killed a lot of batarians, he is lucky they didn't jail him, but due to all the good things he did (save the universe . ) He was only dismissed until he was reinstated at old rank.

[incinerator950]

FeralEwok wrote...

In regards to Ash going from a NCO to an officer: It's completely possible and it happens.

The first instance is when a NCO performs with exceptional leadership abilities in the line of duty and recieves a battlefield commision. It doesn't happen very often, at least not now days. If they are not right in the middle of an operation usually the NCO would get pulled from the unit and recieve the rank of 2nd LT or whatever branch equivilant may be.

The other instance is much more boring. A NCO reaches near the end of their enlistment. At that time they are given the option to either re-up and continue serving, or quit and resume life as a civilian. Alot of the time as incentive for re-uping, a soldier can negotiate their re-enlistment with a career councilor by either receiving a signing bonus, a specific duty station, job reassignment, OR school they wish to attend. In this instance all the NCO would have to do is request to go to Officer Candidate School and then upon completion would be granted an officer's commision.

As for Kaidan it's a bit iffy on how he could jump that high that quickly other than the Alliance boosting him up because of his prior service record.

But for anyone who doesn't believe you cannot be promoted quickly and even reach officer status, just look up Audie Murphy. Went from buck private to officer in 4 years time....granted he had to do a bunch of outrageous stuff to get it...BUT it happens.

Yes, similarities there too.  She goes from the top Enlisted Rank, to an Officer's comission and four officer ranks...in six months.  The problem was Anderson listed her rank as Operations Chief in ME 2.  ME 3 she goes to Lt. Commander.  
She obviously wasn't going to resign or retire, but still.

Kaiden heads off the 1st Special Operations Biotic Company, or its training.  I figure thats were his promotion to Major comes in.

[izmirtheastarach]

Well, at least my universe makes more sense. The one were Ashley is dead. Kaidan was a Staff Lieutenant in ME1. I assume he was promoted after the Battle of the Citadel. Then he makes Staff Commander after his next tour and gets sent to Horizon. Still kind of fuzzy on how he managed to turn losing a third of the colony while spending half his time paralyzed be seeker swarms into a promotion to Major. But whatever. The Alliance brass is dumb.

[Tom Lehrer]

If the Alliance is anything like the militaries of today they certinaly are not above promoting individuals higher and faster then normal if they become public figures.

[GIJooTheWarHero]

izmirtheastarach wrote...

Well, at least my universe makes more sense. The one were Ashley is dead. Kaidan was a Staff Lieutenant in ME1. I assume he was promoted after the Battle of the Citadel. Then he makes Staff Commander after his next tour and gets sent to Horizon. Still kind of fuzzy on how he managed to turn losing a third of the colony while spending half his time paralyzed be seeker swarms into a promotion to Major. But whatever. The Alliance brass is dumb.

"Shepard, you were completely right about Saren and the Collectors. Wait...what are you saying now? Reapers? PFFFFHHFHFHT, you so silly! We discharge you!"
-Alliance Brass

Also, I just thought of this...maybe Ashley/Kaiden's promotions were because of their new Spectre status? Or something.

Modifié par GIJooTheWarHero, 12 février 2012 - 09:02 .

[Han Shot First]

SykoWolf wrote...

Shepard isn't promoted as he left alliance in ME2 to work for cerberus and as such, when he is re instated into alliance, they aint gunna promote him, even if he did stop collectors. As for ME1 promotion for stopping saren and doing all those N7 missions, they didn't get around to promoting him as he was out fighting geth, they never had the chance to promote him.

What doesn't make sense 'in universe,' is that Shepard wasn't posthumously promototed to Captain. Posthumous promotions are not unheard of it for war heroes who are killed in action, and Shepard certainly earned it during the Battle of the Citadel. Hell, he earned it when the Normandy was destroyed as well. He (or she) was absolutely heroic in getting every suriving member of the crew of the Normandy first, and went down with his own ship because of it. 

The 'out of universe' explanation of course is that 'Commander Shepard' has become too iconic, that they developers didn't want to promote him. He didn't get promoted for the same reason that Master Chief doesn't get an officer's commission.

Yeah, I don't know what people are talking about. Kaidan outranks Shepard. I wonder if there is going to be some friction there.

The controversy over Kaidan outranking Shepard began when it was revealed that Kaidan would be a Staff Commander, which in the Alliance chain of command is one step higher than Lt Commander. If I'm not mistaken Bioware has fixed that now, and he is now a Major.

If so he is basically the same rank as Shepard, and Shepard would be considered the superior officer because he has more time in grade. In the real world a Major is basically the groundside (Army or Marine) equivalent of a Lt Commander. (Navy) It is the same rank.

Modifié par Han Shot First, 12 février 2012 - 09:08 .

[ObserverStatus]

izmirtheastarach wrote...
There's also the fact that extremely high ranking NCOs would be very unlikely to recieve a battlefield commision, because they are too valuable in their current posts. In ME2, Ash seems to be hold the highest NCO ranks, so it's pretty odd.
Kaidan's rank is much less problematic, because of how old he is, and how long he's served. He's been an officer for 12 or 13 years at the time of ME2. Ash seems to have been one for an incredibly short amount of time.

What difference does age make? Celes Chere is only 18 years old, but she's a general of the Gestahlian Empire!

[CerberusSoldier]

GIJooTheWarHero wrote...

CerberusSoldier wrote...

Random Jerkface wrote...

Shepard is a lieutenant commander. S/he's the same rank as Ashley.

   


then Bioware has no f**king idea on what military ranks are . 

Except for the fact that Lieutenant Commander is a real rank in the US Navy right now. But you'd be thrown off the ship (figuratively) if you ever called an Lt. Commander a "Lieutenant" instead of "Commander. Same basic rule applies to the General ranks. Brigadier, Lieutenant, Major, General, all called "General".

And just because Shepard and Ashley are the same rank doesn't mean she has any authority equal to him. He is the acting CO of the Normandy and has the most in-rate time for that rank. Senior officer gets priority.

Shepard did the same thing as Ashley. Started as enlisted and worked up into officer. That seems to be something pretty common in the Alliance Navy.

Also, the Alliance Navy's ranks aren't that odd. 3 junior enlisted, 3 S/NCO ranks, the rest are officers. There are real world militaries with rank structures very similar to it. Most people are just used to the US' way of doing it with 9 enlisted ranks and 10 officer ranks (and warrant officer where it applies).

   


They should not be the same rank that is what I am saying how can they be the same . when Shepard is her superior and commanding officer . oh please trying to explain this with the in game garbage is wrong . Bioware made a huge mistake in Shepard's military rank . because no way in hell Shepard and Ashley are the same as in rank .

[izmirtheastarach]

GIJooTheWarHero wrote...

Also, I just thought of this...maybe Ashley/Kaiden's promotions were because of their new Spectre status? Or something.

Shepard didn't recieve a promotion when he became a Spectre.

bobobo878 wrote...

What difference does age make? Celes Chere is only 18 years old, but she's a general of the Gestahlian Empire!

I see what you did there.

Modifié par izmirtheastarach, 12 février 2012 - 09:04 .