2915 réponses à ce sujet

[ElitePinecone]

CDRSkyShepard wrote...

I just think there's not enough connection between the beginning of ME3 and ME2. The space between ME1 and ME2 is well-accounted for: the text scroll says that a few weeks after your fight with Saren, you're going around the galaxy wiping out the last pockets of resistance. Then you die. Then you wake up in a Cerberus facility two years later. That all makes sense. But as far as the space between ME2 and ME3...you know Shepard's going back to Earth, but then it's six months later, trial has happened, suddenly everyone trusts Shepard again even though he's grounded and been stripped of his rank (for what reason? For the Alpha relay incident? None of that is specified). It feels like a big jump, and we feel like we're missing a lot between 2 and 3.

I think that's where a lot of us are coming from, Chris. We were told Shepard was coming back to Earth to be on trial, that it was a big deal because of what we were forced to do in Arrival. Now it's like everyone shrugged it off and it was no biggie. To those that didn't play Arrival, the fact that Shepard is on Earth itself is probably quite confusing, and there's no clear allusions to the Alpha relay incident. In the leaked beta, Anderson addressed it specifically, saying, "When you blew up the batarian relay, hundreds of thousands of batarians died." In the final release, he says, "The **** you've done, any other soldier would have been tried, court-martialed, and discharged." That is a great line, don't get me wrong...but it takes the scene more out of context, and thus makes the whole point of Shepard being on Earth a bit vague.

I hope I summed that up well enough for you.

I think the '*** you pulled" line is *only* there for new players, imported saves with Arrival completed will have a reference to Arrival. The demo only allowed a 'new player to the series' style Shep.

That said, completely agree.

The introduction seems hurried and a jarring dislocation from the end of ME2, or even Arrival. 

[izmirtheastarach]

EternalAmbiguity wrote...

HolyAvenger wrote...

How is that any different to Shepard waitinf for trial and then Reapers come. Pew-pew-pew.

I thought we were told the Reapers come while the trial is occuring. Or were we not?

That's what we were told. But that's not what was in the demo.

[AxisEvolve]

Hunter of Legends wrote...
And again I don't want the pacing of ME1 back.

I don't need to be hand lead around the city. You are all intelligent people figure out why Sheps on Earth. I don't need to sit on Earth for 5 hours figuring out what you all already know.

I'm not sure what pacing you are referring to but Mass Effect 1 had the best story so far.  Some people play video games for more than explosions and symphonies.

We know why Shepard is there but we want to experience it. 

If they skipped straight to The Reapers being destroyed and started the game off after that you wouldn't say "Oh you know why they were destroyed. Didn't you read that 5 page comic."

Now before you say how much of a bigger deal that would be, all these things are pieces to the same story, however big or small. Every detail is important and they're all needed to keep the timeline consistent and the story feasible.

[spirosz]

CDRSkyShepard wrote...

Now it's like everyone shrugged it off and it was no biggie.

That's basically what the trial ends up being. 

[Gabey5]

Alex Arterius wrote...

Gabey5 wrote...

The trial is not a trial but a hearing

the hearing is interrupted

Butttttttttt

Sheppo says something like "IS THAT WHY THEY GROUNDED ME?! TOOK AWAY MY SHIP?!" So obviously that was the outcome of the trial there.

Shame we didn't get to see it.

... .......>_>

yeah it seems like a cop out.


i personally wanted to defend my actions, like have the tribunal question my actions etc

Rather than the 30 second hearing then BAM '


the reapers are here

[Alex Arterius]

spiros9110 wrote...

Alex Arterius wrote...

[SNIP]

Let me try to put this fairly.

Fans are disappointed beacuse one of the man points that came up in every magazine, every web based article and every interview etc was that: "The game will start with Shepard on trial on earth, following the events of Arrival" we were all confused as why this what not in the game during the opening/demo whatever as it has been something that has been promised all along.

Fans are upset beacuse we all wanted a shot to defend our Shepards actions. The pacing now feels very off, and the Reapers just seem to come out of nowhere, also much has been pre-established before we actually enter the game (Shepards left the SR2 crew, he's met Vega, the trails happened etc) these are major plot points. It would have been nice to see them in action. Particularly the trial.

However this isn't game breaking and I will still be buying the game. What is there during the opening is very, very good, exceptional infact. It would have just been nice to have the trial to aid the pacing and allow us to defend Shepards actions

Well said, basically how I feel. The bold part is what is annoying me with the intro - Why don't we get to talk to any of our squadmates before hand and see how they feel about it? "It's like Hey, yeah I'll see you again when you're completely different, thanks for coming along the Suicide Mission" Also, that's a pretty short trial considering what he's being accused of, don't you think? I was actually expecting something similar to Kotor and the trial about the giant fish thing I had to kill (if any of you remember that reference), I understand that we're supposed to get the feeling of "surprise" from the invasion, but it feels a bit rushed to me. Plus the dialogue as well, I remember quite a few conversations in Eden Prime and the Lazarus Station, but here during the trial... not so much. Maybe, 2-3 short segments and the rest is just Shepard talking without us (the player) giving any input towards if we want to say those specific things.

Thank you sir

And yes I agree with all of that! Also twigged on your KOTOR reference, I forgot about that section! But it was pretty cool tbh, a nice change in gameplay

Yeah it's gonna be weird just randomly bumping into to charcters like Mordin again now when the last in game interaction we had was him singing a song to me.

That's gonna be awkward.

Shame we couldn't have said goodbye

[lobi]

I retract my earlier statement because this.

Modifié par lobi, 13 février 2012 - 05:42 .

[Kaiser Arian XVII]

I want the trial and to tell them to STFU!

[Blacklash93]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Did ME team hire the DA team by any chance or replaced by them? Because it's not far off the bad form used in DA2 where the writers and team basically told the fans "don't worry about plot, your character or your companions... Just replace it with imagination of what you think happened between the years of nothingness separated by those horrible 'Acts'".

Surely you learned your lesson about the backlash of disconnect in story progression from when that title was released, so why have you repeated it with ME3 (the disconnect) from plot and story right at the offset of the game. *sigh*

At least the lack of exposition in the time-skips for DA2 made sense for the type of narrative structure. Too much expostition on what has happended between the Acts would be awkward and forced. DA2 was also rushed and obviously the devs weren't able to fill in as much detail as they would have liked.

What I'm basically saying is that the DA team at least had an understandable excuse.

Modifié par Blacklash93, 13 février 2012 - 05:48 .

[MrDizazta]

I was under the impression that Shepard was grounded on Earth and was under house arrest.

[Hunter of Legends]

Weskerr wrote...

AxisEvolve wrote...

I don't want to be "that guy". But what this is really about is putting action before story. "Let's jump straight into the Reapers F---ing things up. Yeah!!!"

They are marketing the game at a more general audience and despite having the "Action, RPG, and story" elements, they still don't include the trial which should have been one of the most important decision points of the whole game.

They dropped the ball on this. Suffice it to say, they'll pay for it in the game reviews.

How?

The response would be the same

"I did what I had to do".

Terrific. Time spent fixing other issues and improvements to the game were spent on some really unimportant conversations that would just restate what was said at the end of Arrival.

Man you people are dense.

[Weskerr]

Alex Arterius wrote...


Thank you sir



Yeah it's gonna be weird just randomly bumping into to charcters like Mordin again now when the last in game interaction we had was him singing a song to me.

That's gonna be awkward.

Shame we couldn't have said goodbye

And it's not even going to be the same Mordin, not exactly.

[Hunter of Legends]

AxisEvolve wrote...

Hunter of Legends wrote...
And again I don't want the pacing of ME1 back.

I don't need to be hand lead around the city. You are all intelligent people figure out why Sheps on Earth. I don't need to sit on Earth for 5 hours figuring out what you all already know.

I'm not sure what pacing you are referring to but Mass Effect 1 had the best story so far.  Some people play video games for more than explosions and symphonies.

We know why Shepard is there but we want to experience it. 

If they skipped straight to The Reapers being destroyed and started the game off after that you wouldn't say "Oh you know why they were destroyed. Didn't you read that 5 page comic."

Now before you say how much of a bigger deal that would be, all these things are pieces to the same story, however big or small. Every detail is important and they're all needed to keep the timeline consistent and the story feasible.

No, sitting there restating what Arrival did is not good story telling.

I'm also here for the story and I think you are all children ****ing for the most insane of reasons.

[Homey C-Dawg]

I don't feel strongly on the matter myself, but it seems pretty clear that people were expecting an actual trial, like Tali's loyalty mission, where Shepard has to argue his reasoning and motivations. I suspect people also wanted to actually see Shepard get relieved from duty.

As I said, I don't feel strongly about it, but I can understand the argument.

Modifié par Homey C-Dawg, 13 février 2012 - 05:45 .

[ElitePinecone]

Gabey5 wrote...

Rather than the 30 second hearing then BAM '


the reapers are here

Thing is, it isn't even a hearing.

They don't even mention the batarians, or working for Cerberus.

The Defence Council thingy calls Shepard to them *SOLELY* because they lost contact with deep space bases, or whatever Hackett was babbling about to Anderson in the pretty intro cinematic.

There is no trial in ME3, and the player's previous actions aren't even mentioned by the tribunal. 

[Geraro]

 OK stepping back from what we have seen in the demo and some fairly opaque statements made by Mr Priestly, think about how Bioware opened ME1 and ME2:

- ME1 had commentary from Udina, Hackett and Anderson (although we didn't know who they were at the time) about who Shepherd was and what was in store. We then have an in game sequence on the Normandy where we are brought up to speed on where (Eden Prime) and why (secure alien technology) Shepherd is going. THEN we get the combat tutorial after approximately 10-15 minutes of exposition.

- ME2 had commentary from TIM and Miranda (again we don't know these people at this stage) explaining who Shepherd was, what he has done and where he is now - followed by an in-game sequence of Shepherd getting taken out providing a lead in to the Lazarus project information, and THEN we get the combat tutorial. Again approx. 10-15 minutes of exposition prior to getting into how to shoot/burn/warp stuff.

I'm willing to give BW the benefit of the doubt in this case, I think what we have seen is certainly FROM the start of the game but is not ALL of the start of the game - if you get my meaning.

Anyway just my 2 cents and like many of the other people commenting, if BW has dropped the initial exposition to what we have seen in the demo I will be surprised and disappointed but it's certainly not a case of "PREORDER CANCELLED!!!!"

[Mr. MannlyMan]

ElitePinecone wrote...

The introduction just seems awfully abrupt and rushed, Chris - it's a few minutes of dialogue with a character we know nothing about, and then - suddenly Reapers!

There's no exposition, no recapping of previous events, no opportunity to see what the Alliance thinks of Shepard's particular actions.

No opportunity to discuss Cerberus with, y'know, the high command of the military force we've been enlisted in for ten years.

This.

Plus, where did Chris get that ME3 starts at the end of Shepard's trial? The intro starts with what looks like an emergency security briefing with Shepard acting as an advisor. There isn't any sort of exposition that tells us that Shepard even underwent a trial... the only hint we get is when Anderson says, "Any other soldier would've been tried, court-marshalled and discharged." No explicit mention of one, as far as I can tell.

Here's hoping that this is all sorted out later in the story...

[Eragondragonrider]

spiros9110 wrote...

Alex Arterius wrote...

[SNIP]

Let me try to put this fairly.

Fans are disappointed beacuse one of the man points that came up in every magazine, every web based article and every interview etc was that: "The game will start with Shepard on trial on earth, following the events of Arrival" we were all confused as why this what not in the game during the opening/demo whatever as it has been something that has been promised all along.

Fans are upset beacuse we all wanted a shot to defend our Shepards actions. The pacing now feels very off, and the Reapers just seem to come out of nowhere, also much has been pre-established before we actually enter the game (Shepards left the SR2 crew, he's met Vega, the trails happened etc) these are major plot points. It would have been nice to see them in action. Particularly the trial.

However this isn't game breaking and I will still be buying the game. What is there during the opening is very, very good, exceptional infact. It would have just been nice to have the trial to aid the pacing and allow us to defend Shepards actions

Well said, basically how I feel. The bold part is what is annoying me with the intro - Why don't we get to talk to any of our squadmates before hand and see how they feel about it? "It's like Hey, yeah I'll see you again when you're completely different, thanks for coming along the Suicide Mission" Also, that's a pretty short trial considering what he's being accused of, don't you think? I was actually expecting something similar to Kotor and the trial about the giant fish thing I had to kill (if any of you remember that reference), I understand that we're supposed to get the feeling of "surprise" from the invasion, but it feels a bit rushed to me. Plus the dialogue as well, I remember quite a few conversations in Eden Prime and the Lazarus Station, but here during the trial... not so much. Maybe, 2-3 short segments and the rest is just Shepard talking without us (the player) giving any input towards if we want to say those specific things.

Pretty much sums up how I feel after playing the demo. Think Helo had a better intro, I can understand this is the demo and BioWare wants to show how the game plays to get more people to order it. I am hoping the demo is the starting point after the big trail. Maybe the trail is the Genises Comic like ME2 had for PS3, for those that haven't played 1 and 2. Still going to be an awsome game can't wait.

[Hunter of Legends]

Homey C-Dawg wrote...

I don't feel strongly on the matter myself, but it seems pretty clear that people were expecting an actual trial, like Tali's loyalty mission, where Shepard has to argue his reasoning and motivations. I suspect people also wanted to actually see Shepard get relieved from duty.

As I said, I don't feel strongly about it, but I can understand the argument.

I don't need 5 hours taken away from the whole game to do what we knew was gonna happen from the get go.

Pointless storytelling.

[lobi]

DayusMakhina wrote...

Hello Man wrote...

MadLaughter wrote...

I looked through Mac Walter's twitter through last year, couldn't find it. Anyone have the link?

twitter.com/#!/macwalterslives/status/119125334833631232

To be fair, that does say most, rather than all /clutching at straws.

I did not read the first page before posting either.

Modifié par lobi, 13 février 2012 - 05:47 .

[Weskerr]

Hunter of Legends wrote...

Weskerr wrote...

AxisEvolve wrote...

I don't want to be "that guy". But what this is really about is putting action before story. "Let's jump straight into the Reapers F---ing things up. Yeah!!!"

They are marketing the game at a more general audience and despite having the "Action, RPG, and story" elements, they still don't include the trial which should have been one of the most important decision points of the whole game.

They dropped the ball on this. Suffice it to say, they'll pay for it in the game reviews.

How?

The response would be the same

"I did what I had to do".

Terrific. Time spent fixing other issues and improvements to the game were spent on some really unimportant conversations that would just restate what was said at the end of Arrival.

Man you people are dense.

Because story and exposition and conversations aren't nearly as important as changing how the sound of your gun fires. Especially not in Mass Effect. lol.