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OMG a real game... it can't be...


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#26
ItsToofy

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afroyarou wrote...

marshalleck wrote...

Red-Cell wrote...

The Witcher happened, check it out. Talk about a masterpiece RPG there.


Every time I think about buying that game, they announce a new version of it coming soon. Consequentially, I've never purchased it.


And all those "new versions" are absolutely free for download from official site for all owners of any edition of the game.


The best part was that it didn't seem like they were doing this for the money, they did it for the love of the game and the love of their story, you're not going to see that very much in the future....they can afford to push out the free content updates with newer versions and such because they are such a small developer, and the good news is, there will be a Witcher 2!

#27
Auraad

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Once in a while "real games" happen, yeah ... DA:O is a real game, that's 4 sure.

#28
marshalleck

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Bored Games wrote...

marshalleck wrote...

The best thing that can be said of FF7 was that it was better than every FF which followed. Take that as you will.


 Jaded adult gamers who hate the FF series... it's been done.Image IPB  


You know what else has been done? Holding up FF7 as some sort of pinnacle of RPG gaming. It's been done to death.  You know what I think? I think if someone says FF7 is one of if not the best RPG they've played, it means they haven't played many RPGs.

Xenogears was a much better game for that time period and that platform, but it still pales in comparison to most CRPGs.

Modifié par marshalleck, 24 novembre 2009 - 08:36 .


#29
Gen-An

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Oblivion and Fallout are very good games... you know.. there was fallout 1,2 and fallout tactics, do not generalize,..

#30
Tryggen

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Well, Oblivion & Fallout 3 are both great games if you like exploring stuff like me ;)

I've never played any of the FF games, think it's because i don't like Anime/mange or whatever it is called now days.

#31
Vodrath

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Xenogears hat GREAT story, and possibly the best soundtrack for RPGs in the Playstation One era, bar perhaps Star Ocean. And thats about it. Exploration was painful, the sprites in combat looked ugly, and combat was pressing the button sequence of your most advanced combo, over and over, with every character in your party. FF7 had much deeper gameplay... for a JRPG, that is.



I am joining the crowd who says that FF7 was a fantastic game, without being able to point exactly to where the reasons lie. That in itself is an achievment. It has not been done often ever since, and I believe not even the Devs know how they have pulled it off.



Dragon Age and Mass Effect, both masterpieces imho, have something in common that sets them apart from the typical JRPG: Adult heroes.



That means, unlike in FF-series, where you spend most of the time and plot finding the place of your hero in the world (and saving it in the process), botch Bioware games give that to you right at the start: You become a grey warden/spectre very early in the game. There is no mysterious emo-past to your character that gets unfolded over the course of the story. You are there to make a difference, not to cover the weakness of the overall plot with piano music supported flashbacks that show how the puppy of your nemesis is run over by a car, turning him from your best friend into your foe. Also, beware of older siblings and fathers and mentors. They are deadly in most cases. Only underage heroes and heroines can save the day. Yay for realism. I love 9 year old space ship commanders (I am poking at you, Xenosaga!).



BTW: Emo-hairstyle and ridicilous clothing/oversized swords in an age of guns just try to make the hero character less bland. They are bland, until you work through the numerous flashbacks. You know the character you play at the end of the game instead from the beginning... Thank god for western RPGs!

#32
marshalleck

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Might as well play my hand. Deus Ex is probably the single greatest overall RPG experience I've ever had. That game deeply affected me.

#33
Shappy1010

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marshalleck wrote...

Might as well play my hand. Deus Ex is probably the single greatest overall RPG experience I've ever had. That game deeply affected me.


I agree with you there buddy. Although Baldur's Gate II comes second in my top 10 list of all time, up there with Planescape Torment and what not, Deus Ex is my number #1, it nailed the immersion of RPG within a total experience, it's not really about the stats and builds, heck it may not be the best RPG ever, but I think it's the best GAME ever, it's RPG elements are meant to serve the amazing story and overall experience, which imho has not been matched to this very day.  

#34
Terwox_

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Rainen89 wrote...

I will never understand the specific obsession with FF-7? Seriously it was good. It was not THAT good.


Tifa, nuff said.

#35
marshalleck

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Shappy1010 wrote...

marshalleck wrote...

Might as well play my hand. Deus Ex is probably the single greatest overall RPG experience I've ever had. That game deeply affected me.


I agree with you there buddy. Although Baldur's Gate II comes second in my top 10 list of all time, up there with Planescape Torment and what not, Deus Ex is my number #1, it nailed the immersion of RPG within a total experience, it's not really about the stats and builds, heck it may not be the best RPG ever, but I think it's the best GAME ever, it's RPG elements are meant to serve the amazing story and overall experience, which imho has not been matched to this very day.  

it was a masterpiece of emergent gameplay, hasn't been topped since though many have tried

Modifié par marshalleck, 24 novembre 2009 - 09:26 .


#36
KalDurenik

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Morrowind = fun

Oblivion = not so fun :P



Anyway im overall happy with the game ;) quiet alot of bugs to be fixed but hey what game don't have bugs? aslong as they try to fix them i will be happy.

#37
Sinfulvannila

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Final Fantasy 7 pretty much brought RPGs out of the 2D era. It was also the first RPG where the developers didn't feel limited by the tech, so they could feel free to do whatever they wanted with the production, so of course it left a lasting impression. For better or worse it has also influenced pretty much every RPG to follow it. I played through it again objectively a few years back and I was actually surprised at how well everything except the graphics holds up.

#38
Shappy1010

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Sinfulvannila wrote...

Final Fantasy 7 pretty much brought RPGs out of the 2D era. It was also the first RPG where the developers didn't feel limited by the tech, so they could feel free to do whatever they wanted with the production, so of course it left a lasting impression. For better or worse it has also influenced pretty much every RPG to follow it. I played through it again objectively a few years back and I was actually surprised at how well everything except the graphics holds up.


I still think it's terribly overrated, possibly due to nostalgia by many or love of Japanese pop culture. I played it first 2 years ago, I had no idea what I had done after completing it. Didn't understand nor cared for the story, the dialog was terrible, the translation even worse. I was playing FFX before I started DAO, although it's still plagued by some terrible dialog in certain scenes, I'm far more enjoying the story and combat system.

Modifié par Shappy1010, 24 novembre 2009 - 09:47 .


#39
Sinfulvannila

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Deifinitely overated, Yeah, that was before japanese games were translated well...

#40
Guest_jynthor_*

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Oh look more Oblivion haters.

And what's this Fallout 3 haters too.



Hate hate hate...





Dao, Oblivion and fallout 3 are all awesome.

#41
Guest_Oddshrub_*

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Fallout and Baldurs Gate were diferent games, so are Fallout 3 and Dragon Age. One tells you a story, the other gives you the freedom to create your own.



Naturally the narrative is going to be more interesting and solid when you're on a set path decided upon by the game writers. But the price for a good story is freedom. There is very little freedom in games like Dragon Age and KOTOR, and the origin stories are the perfect example of this. No matter what actions you chose in your origin story you're going to end up a gray warden. There are no consequences and no real choice, and that is fine. It's fine because it would be impossible to tell the kind of story Dragon Age does without it.



Sandbox games are very different, and while it's certainly up for discussion how much of a sandbox game Fallout 3 truely is it still contains a lot more freedom and consequences than Dragon Age does and at no time are you forced to do anything you might not want to.



Personally I like both game types and I think it would be tragic if one of them dissapeared.

#42
Sinfulvannila

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I think Bethesda should just stop bothering to put a plot in their games and only have sidequests. I know that the story is not the point of these games, but Bethesda's stories are just insulting...

#43
Lughsan35

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Oddshrub wrote...

Fallout and Baldurs Gate were diferent games, so are Fallout 3 and Dragon Age. One tells you a story, the other gives you the freedom to create your own.

Naturally the narrative is going to be more interesting and solid when you're on a set path decided upon by the game writers. But the price for a good story is freedom. There is very little freedom in games like Dragon Age and KOTOR, and the origin stories are the perfect example of this. No matter what actions you chose in your origin story you're going to end up a gray warden. There are no consequences and no real choice, and that is fine. It's fine because it would be impossible to tell the kind of story Dragon Age does without it.

Sandbox games are very different, and while it's certainly up for discussion how much of a sandbox game Fallout 3 truely is it still contains a lot more freedom and consequences than Dragon Age does and at no time are you forced to do anything you might not want to.

Personally I like both game types and I think it would be tragic if one of them dissapeared.


I still haven't finished Fallout 3 ..I just got so distracted wandering the wastes to see what was there...

#44
Guest_jynthor_*

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Sinfulvannila wrote...

I think Bethesda should just stop bothering to put a plot in their games and only have sidequests. I know that the story is not the point of these games, but Bethesda's stories are just insulting...


Go sit in a corner, now!

#45
Silensfurtim

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i really dont consider JRPGs RPG. for me theyre just interactive adventure games. its just like watching Anime and controlling the characters.

#46
StuartMarshall

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FF7 had characters and settings that players became emotionally attached to. This can make up for many shortcomings in games. But remember that FF7 was developed in 1996 so the developers had limitations that they wouldn't now and it still turned out to be a memorable game.

In general, Japanese RPGs are better at creating emotional attachments between the player and character. Western RPGs tend to have more openness and options but the characters often lack a certain something to attach us. The day when someone combines the best of both is perhaps the day RPGs move to the next level. Because while I loved DA:O and consider it one of the better RPGs of the decade, I still didn't get as attached to the characters as I did to Cloud, Aerith, Barret, etc., and no setting has remained in my mind like Midgar did.

Modifié par StuartMarshall, 24 novembre 2009 - 10:18 .


#47
Martin E

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One fo the best RPG's for me was System Shock - well maybe not an RPG per se, but character development was part and parcel of the game - and is still the benchmark I use for comparing games.



I enjoyed The Witcher a lot.



I would probably put Planescape ahead of BG2 (only just).



DA:O is certainly up there for me at the moment, maybe it will move to the top by the time I've finished.



Martin

#48
darkwolf79

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The witcher was, in the more recent past, the only rpg with a story that really drew me in. The world was believable and, int its dirty, dark middle age feeling absolutely wonderful and enjoyable. In some ways it felt even better then the one in Dragonage. Why? Because it was down to earth, it didn't hold back and it did not try to be epic. At no point it felt like you were on your generic save the world quest. You were simply that witcher that happened to get drawn into that mess. Great. First game that made me buy the books which I also enjoyed very much. I can only recommend those, even though only some have been translated into english so far.



Having said all that, I really enjoy dragonage. It's great, even though the world in itself is more of a "traditional" fantasy world. Not that I mind, I enjoy it! And it's all I was hoping for so far.



Final Fantasy and other jrpg's I never played. I hear a lot of talk about how awesome they are but for some reason jrpg's have always and will always been unaccessible for me. Well, tastes differ I guess... Anyways... enough talk...

#49
Sinfulvannila

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I really love how DA and The Witcher provide a good sense of freedeom while still focusing on making a great plot that draws you in. That is no easy feat.

#50
darkwolf79

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True, both games are great. And both games are in no way open world games like oblivion or fallout 3 (which i personally, as a fan of the fallout beginnings, found a bit disappointing). Not that I did not enjoy them, yes, I played and liked them. However, I enjoy the focus on story much more then on an open world.