132 réponses à ce sujet

[Elanareon]

Im kinda jealous of some of the peopele here, they can finish The Witcher. I find it hard to get over the, IMHO, boring combat system. Does it get better later on? I know it has a wonderful story and all but still... I tried playing it thrice buy sadly...

[Balkar]

HHHLie wrote...

Everybody's talking about FF7, am I the only one to think FF6 was the best of the lot ?

Gosh, I can't believe it took four pages before FF6 got mentioned. I agree 100% with you there, ff6 was by far the best and most memorable final fantasy. I mean, the opera scene, come on. Does no one still remembers all the opera by heart? Err...not that I do...nope....that would be weird.... 

What!?



You can't prove anything!

Modifié par Balkar, 26 novembre 2009 - 05:05 .

[Baleus]

Yerp, gotta admit Dragon Age has taken the number one slot for me. (Prior it was Baulders Gates series, NwN and Fallout series.. kinda of a three way tie but my answer for number one always varied depending on the day )

Salute, Bioware.. ya did a fine job!

Sidenote: Happy Turkey day!

[dmos0216]

I think that whoever said that FF7 is so hyped is because it was "the game" that got people into the genre. For me, that was FF4, and to this day I still compare every game to that, and every final fantasy game has fallen short to me.



I also really liked FF6, but felt that it fell apart once you got into the World of Ruin where the game lost its direction: it was just gather your party to kill Kefka. Not to mention that I thought Kefka was an absolute horrible character. An insane clown? Really? And what did he want to do? Destroy the world. Why? He is insane. Why is he insane? He went insane from being experimented on with Magitek. Why is his goal to destroy the world? Who knows. If someone can tell me where in the actual game it explains WHY his goal is to destroy the world, it would be appreciated, and "he is insane" is not a reason, it is just poor writing. I guess the open world of the World of Ruin, which is half of the game, also explains why I am not a huge fan of games like Morrowind and Oblivion: I like some kind've direction.



Final Fantasy 7 was revolutionary for its time, as has been said. It was basically the first big RPG on the next generation of consoles, and it was the first rpg that a lot of people played, and that probably has a lot to do with the amount of marketing Square did to sell the game. I personally felt it was overrated, and as someone else put it, after playing Crisis Core, I liked Zack a HELLUVA lot more than Cloud.



Final Fantasy 8, I agree with whoever said that they tried too many new things that it fell apart. The story was ridiculous if you pay attention to it, and the battle system was atrocious.



Final Fantasy 10..... I hated the characters in it, and how absolutely railroaded that game was. It was basically watching a movie where you had to run 10-15 minutes between every scene.



I actually liked Final Fantasy 12, but the main story, again, felt railroaded, and I ended up thinking that the villain of the story was in the right in what he was trying to do, just not his means of doing it. I thought that game would've been better if you took up Vayne's quest to remove the angels that have spent millenia manipulating mankind, just without Vayne's decision to take over the world while he was doing it.



As for the original poster, I whole-heartedly agree. I can't justify spending $60+ on a game that will only take me 10-12 hours to beat, and it has been a LONG time since I have found a game that has done that. It really feels that a lot of companies have decided to stop making games and making eye-candy to sell to the masses. Dragon Age took me 62 hours to beat on my first play through, and I immediately wanted to jump right back in and start over. It actually felt like it had some replay value, unlike what a lot of games try to sell as replay value in hidden secrets to find that really don't impact anything, or just different difficulty levels.

[danbosko]

link?

[Sinfulvannila]

Kefka = Dark Knight's Joker

He just wants to watch the world burn. I probably would too if I were Kefka and couldn't relate to anyone else and I truly felt they were lesser, worthless annoyances. I think that is some subtext that gets lost in translation.

I can see someone disliking FF6 Word of Ruin. I loved it because every character got some development time, it was non-linear which was way ahead of it's time and I thought the WoR monster designs were spectacular. My problem with the game was that it was so buggy, that vanish/x-zone combo was ridiculous. Still my favorite though.

Modifié par Sinfulvannila, 26 novembre 2009 - 05:49 .

[Murphys_Law]

Sakiradesu wrote...

All the games mentioned were probably great for their generation.

Those who fell in love with FF7 are in their early to late 20s. FF7 was the game of your childhood, and you will always remember it as such. It was one of the games that created a lot of the RPG players today. There were few RPGs before FF7 that appealed to non-RPG players. Chrono Trigger was one of them (if I don't put this, people will kill me). And I do believe FF7 is overrated. I absolutely love it. It is my favorite childhood game, but you have to admit the FF7 craze could be toned down a bit.

As for those who find FF7 decent or worse, they're probably a slightly older crowd (not disgustingly older, just older and more mature with refined tastes) who experienced roleplaying as it was intended to be in the west. D&D, Warhammer, table top games, and the like. You created your character and lived as your character.

There are exceptions, of course. People who tried both. But we tend to fall in love with our respective favorites due partly to the nostalgia of our childhood.

In a few years, none of these games will be known to the new generation of RPGer. lol

The ridiculous assertion that WRPGs are a more "mature" or "refined taste" is laughable beyond belief.  People talk like all JRPGs are all excatly the same, which is just as idiotic as if someone tried to say all WRPGs are the same.  It amazes me to no end how so many gamers pigeonhole themselves into a group (console gamer/PC gamer, WRPGs/JRPGs) then defend their selected group like a zealot.  Of course, their group is full of handsome, rich, mature, super intelligent human beings and the group(s) that are different from them are full of 12 year pimple-faced virgin nerds.  Of course I exagerrate, but it doesn't surprise me why gaming isn't totally mainstream yet....due to self-created division.  I play most genres and play on PC and console and it really disappoints me to see posts/information that leds me to believe I am in the minority.  The amount of elistism is sometimes disguisting on these forums.

/end rant

[Kevin Lynch]

This is off-topic enough to be in...Off Topic!

[Critical Miss]

ValentineHeart82 wrote...

FF7 had a decent story, not great, but decent.

7 had a great story. It was an alchemical journey a la Kabbalah. 

[Shappy1010]

Murphys_Law wrote...

Sakiradesu wrote...

All the games mentioned were probably great for their generation.

Those who fell in love with FF7 are in their early to late 20s. FF7 was the game of your childhood, and you will always remember it as such. It was one of the games that created a lot of the RPG players today. There were few RPGs before FF7 that appealed to non-RPG players. Chrono Trigger was one of them (if I don't put this, people will kill me). And I do believe FF7 is overrated. I absolutely love it. It is my favorite childhood game, but you have to admit the FF7 craze could be toned down a bit.

As for those who find FF7 decent or worse, they're probably a slightly older crowd (not disgustingly older, just older and more mature with refined tastes) who experienced roleplaying as it was intended to be in the west. D&D, Warhammer, table top games, and the like. You created your character and lived as your character.

There are exceptions, of course. People who tried both. But we tend to fall in love with our respective favorites due partly to the nostalgia of our childhood.

In a few years, none of these games will be known to the new generation of RPGer. lol

The ridiculous assertion that WRPGs are a more "mature" or "refined taste" is laughable beyond belief.  People talk like all JRPGs are all excatly the same, which is just as idiotic as if someone tried to say all WRPGs are the same.  It amazes me to no end how so many gamers pigeonhole themselves into a group (console gamer/PC gamer, WRPGs/JRPGs) then defend their selected group like a zealot.  Of course, their group is full of handsome, rich, mature, super intelligent human beings and the group(s) that are different from them are full of 12 year pimple-faced virgin nerds.  Of course I exagerrate, but it doesn't surprise me why gaming isn't totally mainstream yet....due to self-created division.  I play most genres and play on PC and console and it really disappoints me to see posts/information that leds me to believe I am in the minority.  The amount of elistism is sometimes disguisting on these forums.

/end rant

I think you are a bit out of line here. I think gaming IS maturing (for better or worse) for the very same reasons you are mentioning here. In music it's quite simular, during the 90s most music lovers tended to draw back into specific genres, whilst today for example anything remotely commercial or anything which does not comply to very strict standards and rules is doomed to instant non-coolness by the alternative rock crowd. Whilst in reality anyone who likes music as a WHOLE shouldn't bash any attempt, but keep an open mind to every genre or stream.

Sure I consider myself a hardcore PC gamer, and as I'm 33 I hear myself say more and more that everything was better in the old days. Nevertheless I took a deep dive in JRPGs over the past couple of years. No one can argue that the writing and dialogs in most of these are notrocious, but this is mostly because the western (european) world has a much richer history in poetry and literature. When is the last time a Japanese writer was on the top 10 US or European book sales? Japanese Popculture today is mostly known (and well deserved) for it's Manga and Animé, which I love experiencing in a decent JRPG, nonetheless some of the themes can be childish or silly to us western folk (I think someone from Square Enix once said the Japanese have a higher tolerance for cuteness). I also find the lack of general interactive experience in some JRPGs annoying, if half the game consists of non-interactive cutscenes, I'm wondering how much of a game it can be called, I believe developers should put the gamer as their central subject, not shove their own fantasies and stories in your face the way some do, if you want to do that, make a movie. Nevertheless I try to keep an open mind and am playing these games to voice my opinion, which I think everyone is entitled to.

Modifié par Shappy1010, 27 novembre 2009 - 10:38 .

[Andarthiel_Demigod]

Bored Games wrote...

I've had more fun playing a few hours of the origin stories in DAO than  the entire play time of Fallout 3, and it's only the beginning.  Take note Bethesda, running around an empty world with nothing of significance to do does not make a game.

What has happened to RPGs/adventure in the last few years?  I mean FF7-9, Ocarina of Time , Shenmue, KOTOR, all classics.  What is there now?  Elder Scrolls, Fallout, both of which are boring  when it comes down to it, and various well rated graphical showcases/set piece "games" (*cough*MGS4*cough*Uncharted*cough*).  

It's been bleak if you're a PS3 owner.

Say what you want about Uncharted but MGS4 is by no means overrated. It's just that good:P

Both Bethesda and Bioware have a specific style and Bethesda games just might not be your thing. I personally enjoyed both DA and Fallout 3.

As for FFVII, I never understood the hype myself. I found it to be lacking,gameplay-wise despite it's story and I could never bring myself to play any of the main series FF games for more than 20 mins. I didn't like any of them(with the exception FFXII which I loved and I'm still trying to pass it to this day).

[Shappy1010]

Andarthiel_Demigod wrote...



Say what you want about Uncharted but MGS4 is by no means overrated.

I consider it amongs my worst games ever played in my life, and I've been playing games on all formats for 20 years, plus played all Metal Gears as far back as the MSX. MGS4 is sitting through 15 hours of absolute torture. Hero Kajima manages to dump the most incomprehensible and disjointed crap over the player, and mixes it with a game which neither works as a stealth game nor shooter. The whole game through I felt I was playing Kajima's own ego project and at the end I felt absolutely drained.  I think it's a prime example of a game which totally forgets about the person behind the screen.

Modifié par Shappy1010, 27 novembre 2009 - 04:03 .

[Maddyn Malweed]

Red-Cell wrote...

The Witcher happened, check it out. Talk about a masterpiece RPG there.

I agree,it's a great game.

Also their is a game out their that is similar to Dragon Age Origins but for me i think it's better in a lot of ways.

It shares more in common with Baldur's Gate than DAO does. Dragon Age Origins feels like a movie,it is a good game but that's all it is for me i am afraid.

I can't really say i had a deep meaningful RPG experience.I think BioWare have lost a bit of the RPG magic in their quests for perfect story or what they feel is a great story(lord of the rings anyone).


This game is not really known in north America and it's one of them RPG that fall of the radar . It shares the party aspect with DAO and the same type of controls and camera view,the world is less linear and the graphics are better IMO.

The voice over in DAO are better because it's fully voiced,the rule set is not D&D,instead the game is based on the german Das Schwarze Auge (The Black Eye) rpg which feels quite different than D&D right from the beginning of the game.

Don't expect the fast pace of DAO,nope you will find yourself truly lost in this world and not like the cameras are rolling.

It's skill system is fantastic and is sandbox ,meaning you can be anything..

Just to give you an idea on how this game works..
www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/326.67558

If you want to try the demo out and come back and tell me what you think of it.

www.videogamer.com/pc/drakensang_the_dark_eye/download/demo.html#

[KoRnAh]

Well, to be honest... DAO is the best RPG i've played so far... already completed 5 runs (2 Human noble, 1 Dalish elf, 1 Urban Elf and 1 Noble Dwarf) and i'm not bored of it!!!!

I mean... SERIOUSLY... Finaly Fantasy... it has a very good story.. but the gameplay... ugh... i HATE with all my heart.. turn based combat... seriously.. it's just f***ed up... it has no sense of action whatsoever...

BUT i was just talking about it's gameplay.. but the game itself is good, i like the characters, the story, etc... but i never played it myself because of the gameplay, i always watched others play it and watched the movies.

Then... Oblivion...... i have just one single comment about this game....

It's a good game to smoke some illegal herbs and go wonder around and loose yourself in a forest or a cave. It's too big and too empty....

So.. in the end... No matter how big a game's world is... No matter how freaking good the graphics are... Quality, Story and Characters make the game. Not the graphics, not the size of the world (and definetly not if it's half empty).. nothing of that matters when making a game.

I can play the first Nintendo's Mario for freaking hours and have more fun that i could ever have with games like Fallout, Oblivion, Final Fantasy.. and naming other non-rpg's.. crysis, lost planet and many.. MANY more. Gaming as of today is f***ed up.. and BAD. All designers care about today is graphics, graphics and more graphics. That's dumb.

Bioware did an awesome job with this game. It doesn't have the best graphics in the world.. it isn't an endless world, but it has an awesome story, awesome characters (MORRIGAANNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN T_T) and good quality dungeons = FUN.

Games aren't about graphics, they're all about having FUN. Seems the market already forgot about that. This days we get countless trash games that should be banned.

Another thing... now that we're talking about games.

I don't know you guys, but as to sequels... i already banned Blizzard from my mind. I'm not even gonna try freaking Diablo 3 (i LOVE Diablo game.) or Starcraft 2 (Loved Starcraft 1.). We all like to see what comes next once in a while, who doesn't... but.. enough is enough... This days we don't get nothing NEW, and that's where Bioware succeeded with DAO. Diablo 3? Starcraft 2? GTA IV? Fallout 3?... what's next? Warcraft 4? The new adventures of Prince of Persia? (i have nothing against prince of persia, just so you know..)

Seriously..

What i'm trying to say (and this became long enough already) is... good job Bioware. Try not to make more than one or MAX tow sequels to DAO... a good idea is to develop DLC's once in a while continuing whatever story that follows Origins...

Anyways, that's it for now, this got too long.

Peace!


P.S: The Witcher was another awesome game.

Modifié par KoRnAh, 27 novembre 2009 - 09:16 .

[Andarthiel_Demigod]

Shappy1010 wrote...

Andarthiel_Demigod wrote...



Say what you want about Uncharted but MGS4 is by no means overrated.

I consider it amongs my worst games ever played in my life, and I've been playing games on all formats for 20 years, plus played all Metal Gears as far back as the MSX. MGS4 is sitting through 15 hours of absolute torture. Hero Kajima manages to dump the most incomprehensible and disjointed crap over the player, and mixes it with a game which neither works as a stealth game nor shooter. The whole game through I felt I was playing Kajima's own ego project and at the end I felt absolutely drained.  I think it's a prime example of a game which totally forgets about the person behind the screen.

Fair enough, just out of curiousity have you played the original MGS1 on the Playstation. If so, what did you think of it?
Because that one is a classic and if you bad mouth that one then I will lose all respect for you.

Also I'm going to have to add that I too loved the Witcher, it was one of the deepest Action RPG experiences I've ever had.

Modifié par Andarthiel_Demigod, 27 novembre 2009 - 11:39 .

[stevej713]

I loved Oblivion. In fact, I find it more fun than DA. And no, I'm not trying to start a flame war, I'm stating my opinion.

[Sinfulvannila]

Maddyn Malweed wrote...

Red-Cell wrote...

The Witcher happened, check it out. Talk about a masterpiece RPG there.

I agree,it's a great game.

Also their is a game out their that is similar to Dragon Age Origins but for me i think it's better in a lot of ways.

It shares more in common with Baldur's Gate than DAO does. Dragon Age Origins feels like a movie,it is a good game but that's all it is for me i am afraid.

I can't really say i had a deep meaningful RPG experience.I think BioWare have lost a bit of the RPG magic in their quests for perfect story or what they feel is a great story(lord of the rings anyone).


This game is not really known in north America and it's one of them RPG that fall of the radar . It shares the party aspect with DAO and the same type of controls and camera view,the world is less linear and the graphics are better IMO.

The voice over in DAO are better because it's fully voiced,the rule set is not D&D,instead the game is based on the german Das Schwarze Auge (The Black Eye) rpg which feels quite different than D&D right from the beginning of the game.

Don't expect the fast pace of DAO,nope you will find yourself truly lost in this world and not like the cameras are rolling.

It's skill system is fantastic and is sandbox ,meaning you can be anything..

Just to give you an idea on how this game works..
www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/326.67558

If you want to try the demo out and come back and tell me what you think of it.

www.videogamer.com/pc/drakensang_the_dark_eye/download/demo.html#

Yeah it's called Drakensang in the US and it's quite good. I think it's $30 on Steam.

[Few87]

I cant understand why people like the witcher. I gave it a go and managed to play about 4 hours but after that i felt like crying after wasting my money on it. Everything seems so stiff, the voice acting is at best poor, the story is very very weak and the characters feel so one dimensional its untrue. (gets on soapbox) And worst of all whats the deal with giving people cards of the women you slept with, whats that trying to say!

[stragonar]

completely agree with you about FF series dmos. FFIV still takes top slot for me, as for FF12, i think more effort into the gambits would have been nice..the tactics/ai system in DAO is similar but done much, much better imo..except for the whole ranger pet tactics reset crap.

I did like oblivion, but i kinda expected the a few more things to be tweaked coming from morrowind.

As for the NWN series, great concept especially with the overland map in SOZ but the constantly awkward camera got too frustrating, on that note.. camera in DOA was done extremely well.

[Sinfulvannila]

Few87 wrote...

I cant understand why people like the witcher. I gave it a go and managed to play about 4 hours but after that i felt like crying after wasting my money on it. Everything seems so stiff, the voice acting is at best poor, the story is very very weak and the characters feel so one dimensional its untrue. (gets on soapbox) And worst of all whats the deal with giving people cards of the women you slept with, whats that trying to say!

Have you played the enhanced edition yet? The translation and voices are much better. I don't see how you can possibly judge the story and characters yet since you're only about 5% through the game...

[Sinfulvannila]

Shappy1010 wrote...

Murphys_Law wrote...

Sakiradesu wrote...

All the games mentioned were probably great for their generation.

Those who fell in love with FF7 are in their early to late 20s. FF7 was the game of your childhood, and you will always remember it as such. It was one of the games that created a lot of the RPG players today. There were few RPGs before FF7 that appealed to non-RPG players. Chrono Trigger was one of them (if I don't put this, people will kill me). And I do believe FF7 is overrated. I absolutely love it. It is my favorite childhood game, but you have to admit the FF7 craze could be toned down a bit.

As for those who find FF7 decent or worse, they're probably a slightly older crowd (not disgustingly older, just older and more mature with refined tastes) who experienced roleplaying as it was intended to be in the west. D&D, Warhammer, table top games, and the like. You created your character and lived as your character.

There are exceptions, of course. People who tried both. But we tend to fall in love with our respective favorites due partly to the nostalgia of our childhood.

In a few years, none of these games will be known to the new generation of RPGer. lol

The ridiculous assertion that WRPGs are a more "mature" or "refined taste" is laughable beyond belief.  People talk like all JRPGs are all excatly the same, which is just as idiotic as if someone tried to say all WRPGs are the same.  It amazes me to no end how so many gamers pigeonhole themselves into a group (console gamer/PC gamer, WRPGs/JRPGs) then defend their selected group like a zealot.  Of course, their group is full of handsome, rich, mature, super intelligent human beings and the group(s) that are different from them are full of 12 year pimple-faced virgin nerds.  Of course I exagerrate, but it doesn't surprise me why gaming isn't totally mainstream yet....due to self-created division.  I play most genres and play on PC and console and it really disappoints me to see posts/information that leds me to believe I am in the minority.  The amount of elistism is sometimes disguisting on these forums.

/end rant

I think you are a bit out of line here. I think gaming IS maturing (for better or worse) for the very same reasons you are mentioning here. In music it's quite simular, during the 90s most music lovers tended to draw back into specific genres, whilst today for example anything remotely commercial or anything which does not comply to very strict standards and rules is doomed to instant non-coolness by the alternative rock crowd. Whilst in reality anyone who likes music as a WHOLE shouldn't bash any attempt, but keep an open mind to every genre or stream.

Sure I consider myself a hardcore PC gamer, and as I'm 33 I hear myself say more and more that everything was better in the old days. Nevertheless I took a deep dive in JRPGs over the past couple of years. No one can argue that the writing and dialogs in most of these are notrocious, but this is mostly because the western (european) world has a much richer history in poetry and literature. When is the last time a Japanese writer was on the top 10 US or European book sales? Japanese Popculture today is mostly known (and well deserved) for it's Manga and Animé, which I love experiencing in a decent JRPG, nonetheless some of the themes can be childish or silly to us western folk (I think someone from Square Enix once said the Japanese have a higher tolerance for cuteness). I also find the lack of general interactive experience in some JRPGs annoying, if half the game consists of non-interactive cutscenes, I'm wondering how much of a game it can be called, I believe developers should put the gamer as their central subject, not shove their own fantasies and stories in your face the way some do, if you want to do that, make a movie. Nevertheless I try to keep an open mind and am playing these games to voice my opinion, which I think everyone is entitled to.

I think it's more that the Japanese culture is so alien. That's what happens when a culture develops on an island. Your assertion that Japanese literary arts are less mature is very inacurate, Japanese poems predate European poems(due to the Dark Ages) and the first novel, Tale of Genji, was written in Japan. Another thing is that Japanese storytelling, at least in video games, is much different from Western storytelling. Western storytelling focuses more on actions than anything else while Japanese storytelling focuses more on themes, the subtlety of which is usually lost in translation. 

In my opinion, at it's peak Japanese storytelling in RPGs(DQ5, the Mother series, Xenogears for the most part, the Chrono games and Radical Dreamers, Vagrant Story Final Fantasy 6, 7 and Tactics) was far more deep and mature than the storytelling in most Western RPGs. Other than a couple sterling examples(Ultima 4, Planescape: Torment), Western RPGs stories have offer very little. Usually the best part of the story isn't even something that happens in the game, rather it is generally the party members backstory.

[Shappy1010]

Andarthiel_Demigod wrote...

Shappy1010 wrote...

Andarthiel_Demigod wrote...



Say what you want about Uncharted but MGS4 is by no means overrated.

I consider it amongs my worst games ever played in my life, and I've been playing games on all formats for 20 years, plus played all Metal Gears as far back as the MSX. MGS4 is sitting through 15 hours of absolute torture. Hero Kajima manages to dump the most incomprehensible and disjointed crap over the player, and mixes it with a game which neither works as a stealth game nor shooter. The whole game through I felt I was playing Kajima's own ego project and at the end I felt absolutely drained.  I think it's a prime example of a game which totally forgets about the person behind the screen.

Fair enough, just out of curiousity have you played the original MGS1 on the Playstation. If so, what did you think of it?
Because that one is a classic and if you bad mouth that one then I will lose all respect for you.

Also I'm going to have to add that I too loved the Witcher, it was one of the deepest Action RPG experiences I've ever had.

No, I like part 1, didn't love it, but liked it, I think it was one of the first games that brought a real cinematic feel to games, though it was a little short. I even liked part II, though all the intercom conversations were getting really annoying after a while. And then Kojima falls into the trap many movie directors and such often do, they get an unlimited budget and a cart blanche to do whatever the hell they want. - that's when things turn bad. 

Modifié par Shappy1010, 28 novembre 2009 - 06:48 .

[kraidy1117]

Bethesda in my mind is one of the worse dev teams out there. I love TES games, but they could be more story driven.I find that Bioware and the Zelda team are realy the only RPG devs to realy care about stories anymore.


I will however challnge you on MGS4. That was a fantastic game, it ended Solid Snakes story very well and was very emotonal for die hard fans. The story was well-writen, it had well-writen music, fantastic VOI performances and the gaemplay was solid.

[Shappy1010]

I think it's more that the Japanese culture is so alien. That's what happens when a culture develops on an island. Your assertion that Japanese literary arts are less mature is very inacurate, Japanese poems predate European poems(due to the Dark Ages) and the first novel, Tale of Genji, was written in Japan. Another thing is that Japanese storytelling, at least in video games, is much different from Western storytelling. Western storytelling focuses more on actions than anything else while Japanese storytelling focuses more on themes, the subtlety of which is usually lost in translation. 

In my opinion, at it's peak Japanese storytelling in RPGs(DQ5, the Mother series, Xenogears for the most part, the Chrono games and Radical Dreamers, Vagrant Story Final Fantasy 6, 7 and Tactics) was far more deep and mature than the storytelling in most Western RPGs. Other than a couple sterling examples(Ultima 4, Planescape: Torment), Western RPGs stories have offer very little. Usually the best part of the story isn't even something that happens in the game, rather it is generally the party members backstory.

I know of the tales of Genji, I seen them in a museum in Ireland, very impressive. I'm not really saying the Japanese have no rich poetry or literary culture, but they are not "known" for it. The Dutch are known for their famous painters, the Germans for their classical musical influence etc. Maybe this is a very western perspective, but I don't really hear any literary circles mentioning Japanese work.

Out of all the RPGs you mentioned I only played FF 7. I also played X, XII, Eternal Sonata and a few others, most of the writing was terrible in my opinion, and really not on par with some of the better, more mature Animé out there. By now I'm getting a bit wary of trying things like Chrono Trigger, because, like Final Fantasy, ppl tell me that's it's good, - I'm not so sure I'll like it anymore. Point is JRPGs are so littered with cliché characters and (in my eyes) dumb things. www.youtube.com/watch which has nothing to do with translation, which some fanboys might claim, this is just simple slapstick comedy and bad writing of Japanese gamedevelopers.

Modifié par Shappy1010, 30 novembre 2009 - 02:36 .

[Sinfulvannila]

Well, you're free to have your own opinion. I play pretty much every RPG I can get my hand on, western or japanese and IMO, WRPGs are far more cliched than JRPGs. I mean, come on, the most popular western sub-genre is the diablo-CLONE. Honestly I don't really care, cliches are basically literary archetypes that fill every part of pop culture. And the laughing scene looks funny when taken out of context, but they are suppose to be sounding silly. It is fake laughter after all.  I got one better for you, pay attention to 1:30-1:45.

P.S. Play Chrono Trigger. It is THAT good...

Modifié par Sinfulvannila, 01 décembre 2009 - 01:35 .