151 réponses à ce sujet

[suprhomre]

I support this.

[Icinix]

True Zarken wrote...
So from an early Australian point of view, you're talking out of your arse.  

lol! You know it! 
I found the quote - its from Atomic PC magazine about the Paragon and Renegade decisions "I think the best way to put it telemetry informs our decisions, not decides our decisions."

But I think it probably also applies here as well.

But that's completely understandable if true. However if they supported the PC version more PC users would be interested in purchasing it. 

Yep, there was a good post in another thread that summed up what developers and consumers needed to do to bring PC gaming back to the front of the industry - and it summed up greatly a lot of what has been lacking in the development process.

Modifié par Icinix, 13 février 2012 - 09:56 .

[CenturyCrow]

Finis Valorum wrote...
So, the long and short of it is that PC users *will* get stuck with a bad console port again, despite them claiming it *won't* be a port.

I'm inclined to agree with your assessment. 

BioWare hasn't turned a deaf ear to the criticisms players had for Dragon Age II. In a recent interview, BioWare's CEO Dr. Ray Muzyka stated that in addition to addressing those problems in the next Dragon Age, the studio is also drawing inspiration from other popular titles on the market, including Bethesda's dominating RPG, Skyrim.

Let hope they didn't just look at shooters like Call of Duty for multiplayer or Uncharted for co-op. Maybe they've been listening to some of these criticisms about ME 2 and looking at Skyrim or other games to draw inspiration for the final act of Mass Effect, as well.

Modifié par CenturyCrow, 13 février 2012 - 09:59 .

[SKiLLYWiLLY2]

I support this too.

Honestly, if you're going to charge the same price across all 3 platforms, you shouldn't really "snub" any of them. You should take into the account the strengths of these platforms and develop with this in mind, within reason of course. I'm not saying make the PC version DX11 with top notch features etc. because that's just not feasible if they want to release it at the same time. However, surely things like menu shortcuts and high-res textures takes little to no time to do? Especially, the menu shortcuts...

If developers were to develop PC versions with more thought, no one would be skeptical on whether or not they're going to get a decent product and would be far more likely to support the company and actually buy the game. It's win win for everyone in this case.

[True Zarken]

Icinix wrote...

Yep, there was a good post in another thread that summed up what developers and consumers needed to do to bring PC gaming back to the front of the industry - and it summed up greatly a lot of what has been lacking in the development process.

Hmm, I gotta find this thread then. There will be a slow adoption rate during the next console gen so it'll mean that the PC will be the main focus of developers for a short period of time so we should get some of these features back. 

I like to be optimistic. :innocent:

[PSUHammer]

I find it interesting that the people who posted early in this thread, complaining about the OP, don't have any recent Bioware games registered on BSN? Telling?

[Loreshield]

DiegoRaphael wrote...

1) Lack of proper usage of Keyboard and Mouse:

I've always enjoyed PC gaming way more than console gaming, mostly because of the controls, so I agree. Every now and then, I still get the sudden urge to use the scroll wheel in a menu...

2) No High Textures/Only small tweaks to graphics are alllowed.

To be fair, I've never perceived the ME series as one that makes a good visual impression by setting a high technical standard for graphics. To me, it's the old "graphics / aesthetics" debate. The visuals in this series have been immersive and satisfying to me without being HD all the time.

But your point, I believe, is that the PC as a platform has the capabilities to expand on that and I agree. But we'll probably get one of those outrageous HQ texture packs from someone in the community, so I'm not too worried.

3) Control Pads support.

Heh, kinda ironic after your first point.  To clarify, is it actually confirmed that there will be no pad support in the game?

4) Mod Tools.

I might be totally wrong here, but didn't ME2 have the same problem when it first came out? This series never struck me as a particularly modder-friendly one, sadly quite common, nowadays. Once again, though, the community pulled through, which actually surprised me quite a bit.

Modifié par Loreshield, 13 février 2012 - 10:20 .

[Sith_exar_kun]

I support this thread!

[DiegoRaphael]

Loreshield wrote...

DiegoRaphael wrote...

1) Lack of proper usage of Keyboard and Mouse:

I've always enjoyed PC gaming way more than console gaming, mostly because of the controls, so I agree. Every now and then, I still get the sudden urge to use the scroll wheel in a menu...

2) No High Textures/Only small tweaks to graphics are alllowed.

To be fair, I've never perceived the ME series as one that makes a good visual impression by setting a high technical standard for graphics. To me, it's the old "graphics / aesthetics" debate. The visuals in this series have been immersive and satisfying to me without being HD all the time.

But your point, I believe, is that the PC as a platform has the capabilities to expand on that and I agree. But we'll probably get one of those outrageous HQ texture packs from someone in the community, so I'm not too worried.

3) Control Pads support.

Heh, kinda ironic after your first point.  To clarify, is it actually confirmed that there will be no pad support in the game?

4) Mod Tools.

I might be totally wrong here, but didn't ME2 have the same problem when it first came out? This series never struck me as a particularly modder-friendly one, sadly quite common, nowadays. Once again, though, the community pulled through, which actually surprised me quite a bit.

1) same!
2) Some close up looks terrible, but like you said, is not what they advertise for, but still, if you plan to release something on PC, get to know the audience, we expect things to be a little better then the normal in consoles, we expect to able to tweak things a little more.
3) yes it is! But there ppl there are ppl who prefer this way (i don't) and this number is increasing. And yes it's been confirmed:

Chris Priestly wrote...

The PC version does not support controllers. They may or may not work, but they are unsupported by the game.

4) Only DA:O had mod tools recently on Bioware Games. But like it was said, although the modders can pull it of good things, the way that the ME engine is build makes it very, very hard, and so it takes a lot of time.

Modifié par DiegoRaphael, 13 février 2012 - 10:46 .

[Unbannable]

Several Bioware devs have posted on the forum today, but they've all ignored this thread so thats pretty telling I think.

There is no high rez texture pack, and no menu shortcuts.

[Massefeckt]

Big companies like EA want to force you away from PC gaming. PC gamers used to get more bang for their buck with mods and extra's from a well put together game with mod tools. EA don't want you playing mods instead of buying DLC. PC gaming is or at least used to be one fo the last places where the customer had all the power, big companies hate that. They want you locked into a console where they have complete control of everything you do and you have no option but to go along with it.

You have to pay the same price as consoles on most big titles now despite it being cheaper to release a game on the PC(no MS charge), there has been big effort to kill off the modding community by big companies by withdrawing all support and mod tools, keyboard controls and interfaces are becoming worse and worse. Expect this to get worse no one wants the customer to have the power.

[Demigod]

I may be remembering wrong but aren't UE3 textures backed/embedded into each level? I aren't sure about character textures but I'm fairly sure "level" textures are so a high Q texture pack wont work, they would have to repack each level with higher quality textures in other words the whole game. I could be wrong - Its a while since I played around with UE3.

It would be nice to see a bioware dev comment on this as they are a nice bunch to talk to generaly, but I cant see it. Their support of pc has slid considerably since the highs of NWN, probably a money thing At least we still get a game.

Modifié par Demigod, 13 février 2012 - 10:59 .

[PSUHammer]

Demigod wrote...

I may be remembering wrong but aren't UE3 textures backed/embedded into each level? I aren't sure about character textures but I'm fairly sure "level" textures are so a high Q texture pack wont work, they would have to repack each level with higher quality textures in other words the whole game. I could be wrong - Its a while since I played around with UE3.

It would be nice to see a bioware dev comment on this as they are a nice bunch to talk to generaly, but I cant see it. Their support of pc has slid considerably since the highs of NWN, probably a money thing At least we still get a game.

I think the textures most people had an issue with on ME2 were the armor/clothes of Shep and NPCs.  The Texmod "mod" for ME2 showed what a huge difference high res textures could make in the game.

[Unbannable]

Massefeckt wrote...

Big companies like EA want to force you away from PC gaming. PC gamers used to get more bang for their buck with mods and extra's from a well put together game with mod tools. EA don't want you playing mods instead of buying DLC. PC gaming is or at least used to be one fo the last places where the customer had all the power, big companies hate that. They want you locked into a console where they have complete control of everything you do and you have no option but to go along with it.

Stupid crap like this really ticks me off.  The first thing this guy does is blame EA, which is a bunch of B.S!  EA has always been pro multiplatform.  In fact, if it wasn't for EA, Mass Effect would never have been on the PC at all. 

The blame for this lies squarely on the shoulders of Bioware.  They are a lazy developer, and do not optimize gameplay or features for the strengths of each platform unlike other AAA developers.  They tend to focus only on one platform it seems, at the expense of others..

It's a recurrent problem with them, and unless we do something drastic, they aren't likely to change their ways.

[SNascimento]

The Origin boycott won't help this.

[ColdRiver]

How can we not get an official answer from anyone on this? It's pretty frustrating.

[devSin]

Demigod wrote...

I may be remembering wrong but aren't UE3 textures backed/embedded into each level? I aren't sure about character textures but I'm fairly sure "level" textures are so a high Q texture pack wont work, they would have to repack each level with higher quality textures in other words the whole game. I could be wrong - Its a while since I played around with UE3.

I believe so.

But I'm not sure if they're unable to switch between the two sets of resources (meaning they could just put both on the installation discs—the ME2 PC DVDs were positively barren from what I remember) to allow a hi-res toggle.

If they had to overwrite the base levels instead (or ask the player to choose between the two at install time), then no, it won't ever happen. But it's not going to happen anyway, so I guess it's just a discussion for its own sake at this point.

Modifié par devSin, 13 février 2012 - 11:28 .

[robarcool]

Never mind

Modifié par robarcool, 13 février 2012 - 11:15 .

[streamlock]

I'm going to rant a bit here....

I am absolutely sick and tired of being told "It's not a port, all 3 versions are being developed simultaneously for their respected platforms" and watching all versions of a game getting reduced to the lowest common denominator. How ignorant do these people think we are? (Ok, I'm not a game developer, so I am ignorant on some things-but I digress)

And it is not just for the PC version-though it suffers the most. There is absolutely no technical reason PC gamers should get shafted with low rez textures just because console A&B can't handle it. There is no fraking reason that not only is mouse smoothing enabled, but there is no option to turn it off/on in the menu.

There is no damned reason that just because the extra memory the Kinect support takes, that the PS3 and PC versions can't have your character holster your weapon in a combat area.

There is no reason that just because the PS3 has dedicated and non shared memory that persistent bodies/decals can not be enabled for the other two versions.

The list goes on and on and on. Each platform has its quarks and limitations, and by pandering to some back-asswards mentality of cross-platform homogeneity you belittle and punish every player/fan/whatever on their platform of choice by shoving down their throats the limitations of platforms they chose not to game on.

The sad truth of the matter is-that they are probably telling the truth in that one version is not being ported to the other. They have actually worked really really hard to shaft players on platform A and B because platform C's player base would ****.

Gamers on all 3 platforms suffer for this jacked developer mentality-and it's on my top 3 things that needs to change the next console cycle.

[SNascimento]

streamlock wrote...

I'm going to rant a bit here....

I am absolutely sick and tired of being told "It's not a port, all 3 versions are being developed simultaneously for their respected platforms" and watching all versions of a game getting reduced to the lowest common denominator. How ignorant do these people think we are? (Ok, I'm not a game developer, so I am ignorant on some things-but I digress)

And it is not just for the PC version-though it suffers the most. There is absolutely no technical reason PC gamers should get shafted with low rez textures just because console A&B can't handle it. There is no fraking reason that not only is mouse smoothing enabled, but there is no option to turn it off/on in the menu.

There is no damned reason that just because the extra memory the Kinect support takes, that the PS3 and PC versions can't have your character holster your weapon in a combat area.

There is no reason that just because the PS3 has dedicated and non shared memory that persistent bodies/decals can not be enabled for the other two versions.

The list goes on and on and on. Each platform has its quarks and limitations, and by pandering to some back-asswards mentality of cross-platform homogeneity you belittle and punish every player/fan/whatever on their platform of choice by shoving down their throats the limitations of platforms they chose not to game on.

The sad truth of the matter is-that they are probably telling the truth in that one version is not being ported to the other. They have actually worked really really hard to shaft players on platform A and B because platform C's player base would ****.

Gamers on all 3 platforms suffer for this jacked developer mentality-and it's on my top 3 things that needs to change the next console cycle.

.
There is a reason: effort.
.
Effort that Bioware doesn't deem the PC version of the game worth. 

[Leaser Resael]

Sadly, Bioware doesn't care about PC, that's plain simple and if anyone thinks differently, it's just gonna be dissapointed. Giving BASIC support to a platform should be standard, but no double click, no enter, no mouse wheel support, no high rez textures, most of these things just take a few days at most to implement, while I'm sure proper kinect implementation takes a lot more..
It's not that PC players want MORE than console players, we just want what is supposed to be there in the first place, a basic PC interface, like every other AAA game out there.

And the best thing is that now EA charges $60 for PC games instead of $50, so we should expect the games we buy to be properly made. (Where I live games cost like $80 - $85, so I expect even more to receive a game with proper support).

It's not being PC etilists, it's not thinking we deserve more, it's just asking for proper support on our platform of choice.

[tishyw]

I support this thread.

It's a sad day indeed when a supposedly AAA developer like Bioware continually produces a substandard interface for part of the market. This trend has been happening since Bioware were brought by EA, it might be a coincidence but EA seem almost openly antagonistic to PC players these days.

[BounceDK]

1 word; Lazy.

[streamlock]

tishyw wrote...

I support this thread.

It's a sad day indeed when a supposedly AAA developer like Bioware continually produces a substandard interface for part of the market. This trend has been happening since Bioware were brought by EA, it might be a coincidence but EA seem almost openly antagonistic to PC players these days.

I don't know if I fully agree with this.  As I understand it, the original Dragon Age was intended to be a PC only release at some point.  Post the EA aquistion, a cross platform release was forced apon them for that game.  The console versions suffered from a substandard interface and gaming experience originally optimized for the PC.  So the situation was reversed in that case. 

All versions, XBOX, PS3, PC should be have thier graphics/audio/interface/MP whatever optimized to give the best possible experience that the platform of choice can provide for it's players-within reason.  

[DiegoRaphael]

tishyw wrote...

I support this thread.

It's a sad day indeed when a supposedly AAA developer like Bioware continually produces a substandard interface for part of the market. This trend has been happening since Bioware were brought by EA, it might be a coincidence but EA seem almost openly antagonistic to PC players these days.

Actually is kinda weird.

It was because of EA that ME got to PC in the first place. Also, I wouldn't doubt that was also they decision to give the game to Demiurge Studios to port ME1.

It's gets even more weird when we see they forcing us on Origin (to be clear, i have nothing against Origin, and this is not an thread about Origin), but at the same time they don't try to make their games better suited for us.

"Hey we want you to buy or games, on our stores, but we will give the bare minimum ok?"

They don't help themselves.