113 réponses à ce sujet

[General User]

Perhaps Ashley and Kaiden have learned from their failure at Horizon?

I've been through enough with them and seen enough of what they can do that I'm willing to give them another chance.

Modifié par General User, 16 février 2012 - 01:53 .

[Confused-Shepard]

I was very happy Shepard ignored them. They basically abandoned us and behaved as if they caught Shepard cheating on them. Their tirade on Horizon was akin to a serialized high school drama

[CptData]

General User wrote...

Perhaps Ashley and Kaiden have learned from their failure at Horizon? I've been through enough with them and seen enough of what they can do that I'm willing to give them another chance.

This.

Okay, I don't consider it as "another chance" for my playthrough since they didn't waste their "first chance" at all, but hey, that's what others call RP or interpretation

[Eshaye]

Some Dude wrote...

I think its open to interpretation because based off the look Shep gives it could be anything from compliance to apathy. I actually find this scene to be one of the better moments from the demo.

Ditto I felt it was very appropriate considering the pain or annoyance a Shepard would go through with them and vice versa. It's very realistic, I'm sure when they are alone there will be much to be said before the air clears.

[sheppard7]

Dagasi wrote...

PMC65 wrote...

CptData wrote...

Oh, one thing is for sure: Shepard is far more professional that Ash. Neither she nor he is really smiling. Maybe THAT's something that could change: smile for "romance", no smile for "cheated" / "no romance".

True.

But I still can't hear a "eff you", from neither Shepard, and no situation in the intro mission.

Also keep in mind - but that's something we won't see before we can't import a playthrough with romanced Ash / Kaidan: Shepard could still feel frustrated / sad 'cause of Horizon. So s/he'll keep it all professional. After all, it's up to the player to decide if Shepard returns to the VS or show him/her the cold shoulder.

Actually, the entire story revolving around the VS allows the player to play down the full set of emotions: from "still in love / want back" over "still in love / don't give a second chance" to "sheer hate". With proper results.

For a "cheated" intro I would prefer a slight hurt smile. My Shepard still loves Ash despite his stumble and I'm hoping that she still loves him so ... yeah, slight smiles that hint at the pain would be nice.

How would she know Shep "cheated"?  I don't think they have had a chance to talk since he got back to Earth.........that we know of.  Granted, she doesn't know what Shepard did while he was gone working for Cerberus , but I don't think she would automatically assume he hooked up with someone else...

Miranda told TIM and TIM let it be known to discredit Shep's image. Even if Miranda wasn't the one you cheated with, she's enhanced and can hear through walls and floor. So everyone knows Shep cheated.

And don't get started on Liara being the SB and you picked Ash over her. Everyone knows, bro.

Modifié par sheppard7, 16 février 2012 - 02:14 .

[eye basher]

you play as a blank slate on the demo so i wasn't expecting anything.

[LaurenShepard-N7]

CrazyCatDude wrote...

LaurenShepard-N7 wrote...

People are still mad at the VS over what happened on Horizon? I agree the whole scene was pretty bad and it sucked that they turned against Shepard like that, but if you thought your lover was dead for 2 years and they suddenly showed up without explanation working for the ****s or something you probably wouldn't react too well either. The VS would have been an emotional wreck for those 2 years and when Shepard came back they probably thought s/he faked his/her death and cut them out of his/her life. People need to cut them some slack, the fact they were so emotional about it means they cared about Shepard more than anyone (apart from maybe Liara but I wont get into that). Also if they were lovey-dovey towards Shepard all throughout the 3 games we'd probably all be bored of it by now, so this is a good opportunity to build some tension, and I think the scene in the demo reflects that awkwardness really well.

Except it wasn't without explination.  "I was in some kind of coma for the past two years," is a pretty clear explination.  So is "I'm working with Cerberus to invistigate the missing colonies," which, you know, happen to be outside of Alliance and Council jurisdiction.  Besides, Tali and Garrus, who had more reason to be leary of Cerberus than the VS trusted Shepard enough to at least listen to what he/she had to say.

The word Na-zi is censored wtf? The Alliance told the VS that Cerberus was behind the collector attacks so you can't blame them for feeling completely mind-effed when Shepard shows up working for them. How does someone go into a coma for 2 years while everyone else thinks they're dead, and then resurface working for a terrorist organisation?

In that situation it's unrealistic for everyone to just jump on board with Shepard and trust whatever the hell s/he says all the time. Tali and Garrus I can kind of understand because they're not under control of the Alliance and ended up in bad situations, so they were lost and kind of looking for a way out.

Of course the real reason for Horizon is that Bioware needed an excuse to sideline the ME1 LI's so they could usher in new ones, and at the same time keeping them out of the suicide mission so they could bring them back in ME3. Tali and Garrus accepted Shepard right away because they're fan favourites so Bioware didn't want to leave them out.

[CptData]

sheppard7 wrote...

And don't get started on Liara being the SB and you picked Ash over her. Everyone knows, bro.

Speaking of:

Barla Von: Hello Commander Williams.
Ashley: Hello ... you are ...? Guess we know each other?
Barla Von: Barla Von, Intel Broker and contact of the Shadow Broker. Knowing someone like you is part of the business.
Ashley: I see. So what do you need?
Barla Von: The question is more: what do you need? I have informations. And since you did great things to defeat Sovereign, I'll give you this information for free.
Ashley: But I'm not looking for any informations, Barla Von.
Barla Von: Williams of the Earth-Clan, consider this as a gift from the Shadow Broker. He told me it's absolutely important you know this.
Ashley: Okay, tell me then.
Barla Von: The Shadow Broker ordered me to tell you: "Shepard f*cked Miranda before he went through that Omega Four Relay." - and he send this video footage of them.
Ashley: Uh ... huh?!
Barla Von: Under normal circumstances I would take 50.000 Credits for this information, however, I said it's for free. Good bye, Commander.

That's how it happened. That's how Ashley learned Shepard was cheating

Modifié par CptData, 16 février 2012 - 02:30 .

[BatmanPWNS]

I didn't see Shep as ignoring the VS. All I saw was Shep was in a hurry. Plus I think they smile when they see you.

Modifié par BatmanPWNS, 16 février 2012 - 03:53 .

[Eire Icon]

CptData wrote...

However, I don't know if Ashley considers their relationship as "gone". Maybe on "hold", but definitely not "broken" - at least that's what I got from ... yeah, you have three guesses. It's vague at least ... for both, Ash & Kaidan. They're not "together" in that scene, but that relationship isn't really gone too. So guess it's up to you.
That scene IS beautiful in a way that it allows all kind of interpretations.

I think the below statement confirms that for the moment at least, romantically there is no relationship (thats not to say there won't be one again in the future)

James Vega: Do you know the Commander?
Ashley: I used to

The "I used too" comment is something you would say about an ex, not someone your currently involved with

[Jenetic]

I took the Horizon incident as the VS being in shock after seeing someone they were in love with in the flesh after mourning their death for two years. I can't imagine how I would react.

In my own little Mass Effect world, I saw (in my case Ashley) spending time alone in mourning yet again because she thought she had dealt with Shepard's death, yet there he is as she said "pulling me back in".

After reading her e-mail, I got the feeling that she regretted reacting the way she did (we've all been in similar situations where we over react and feel bad because of it).

I'm sure she was confused about how she felt and probably wanted to be angry with Shep but was still in love with him and didn't know how to react. Reopening those old wounds hurt, and she took it out on the man she loved.

That's about as deep as I can get though. So that's how I saw it. (The Horizon part, that is)

The fact that we are even discussing this brief exchange in the demo is a testament to how brilliant it is. Simple, yet very powerful.

Modifié par Dagasi, 16 février 2012 - 05:49 .

[CrazyCatDude]

CptData wrote...

sheppard7 wrote...

And don't get started on Liara being the SB and you picked Ash over her. Everyone knows, bro.

Speaking of:

Barla Von: Hello Commander Williams.
Ashley: Hello ... you are ...? Guess we know each other?
Barla Von: Barla Von, Intel Broker and contact of the Shadow Broker. Knowing someone like you is part of the business.
Ashley: I see. So what do you need?
Barla Von: The question is more: what do you need? I have informations. And since you did great things to defeat Sovereign, I'll give you this information for free.
Ashley: But I'm not looking for any informations, Barla Von.
Barla Von: Williams of the Earth-Clan, consider this as a gift from the Shadow Broker. He told me it's absolutely important you know this.
Ashley: Okay, tell me then.
Barla Von: The Shadow Broker ordered me to tell you: "Shepard f*cked Miranda before he went through that Omega Four Relay." - and he send this video footage of them.
Ashley: Uh ... huh?!
Barla Von: Under normal circumstances I would take 50.000 Credits for this information, however, I said it's for free. Good bye, Commander.

That's how it happened. That's how Ashley learned Shepard was cheating

*thinks*

Barla Von: Hello Commander Alenko.
Kaidan: Hello ... you are ...? Guess we know each other?
Barla Von: Barla Von, Intel Broker and contact of the Shadow Broker. Knowing someone like you is part of the business.
Kaidan: I see. So what do you need?
Barla Von:
The question is more: what do you need? I have informations. And since
you did great things to defeat Sovereign, I'll give you this information
for free.
Kainan: But I'm not looking for any informations, Barla Von.
Barla Von: Alenko of the Earth-Clan, consider this as a gift from the Shadow Broker. He told me it's absolutely important you know this.
Ashley: Okay, tell me then.
Barla Von:
The Shadow Broker ordered me to tell you: "Shepard f*cked Garrus before she went through that Omega Four Relay." - and he send this video
footage of them.
Ashley: Uh ... huh?!
Barla Von:
Under normal circumstances I would take 50.000 Credits for this
information, however, Commander Shepard already paid my fee. Good bye, Commander.

Modifié par CrazyCatDude, 16 février 2012 - 06:24 .

[sheppard7]

CrazyCatDude wrote...

CptData wrote...

sheppard7 wrote...

And don't get started on Liara being the SB and you picked Ash over her. Everyone knows, bro.

Speaking of:

Barla Von: Hello Commander Williams.
Ashley: Hello ... you are ...? Guess we know each other?
Barla Von: Barla Von, Intel Broker and contact of the Shadow Broker. Knowing someone like you is part of the business.
Ashley: I see. So what do you need?
Barla Von: The question is more: what do you need? I have informations. And since you did great things to defeat Sovereign, I'll give you this information for free.
Ashley: But I'm not looking for any informations, Barla Von.
Barla Von: Williams of the Earth-Clan, consider this as a gift from the Shadow Broker. He told me it's absolutely important you know this.
Ashley: Okay, tell me then.
Barla Von: The Shadow Broker ordered me to tell you: "Shepard f*cked Miranda before he went through that Omega Four Relay." - and he send this video footage of them.
Ashley: Uh ... huh?!
Barla Von: Under normal circumstances I would take 50.000 Credits for this information, however, I said it's for free. Good bye, Commander.

That's how it happened. That's how Ashley learned Shepard was cheating

*thinks*

Barla Von: Hello Commander Alenko.
Kaidan: Hello ... you are ...? Guess we know each other?
Barla Von: Barla Von, Intel Broker and contact of the Shadow Broker. Knowing someone like you is part of the business.
Kaidan: I see. So what do you need?
Barla Von:
The question is more: what do you need? I have informations. And since
you did great things to defeat Sovereign, I'll give you this information
for free.
Kainan: But I'm not looking for any informations, Barla Von.
Barla Von: Alenko of the Earth-Clan, consider this as a gift from the Shadow Broker. He told me it's absolutely important you know this.
Ashley: Okay, tell me then.
Barla Von:
The Shadow Broker ordered me to tell you: "Shepard f*cked Garrus before she went through that Omega Four Relay." - and he send this video
footage of them.
Ashley: Uh ... huh?!
Barla Von:
Under normal circumstances I would take 50.000 Credits for this
information, however, Commander Shepard already paid my fee. Good bye, Commander.

What was Ashley and Kaidan doing in there? That's some freaky stuff and Liara might find that interesting information as well.

But that does remind me. There's a video with TIM out there saying he doesn't need Shep and there's a shadowy figure there. I'm wondering if he did the Lazarus Project on the VS which is why he doesn't need Shep anymore as he has a replacement.

Modifié par sheppard7, 16 février 2012 - 06:32 .

[ImportedBox]

Many in this thread speak of the bad reunion in ME2 with either Ashley or Kaidan. My shep had romanced Ashley in ME1, and even though she was mad at "me" at the beginning of the dialogue it seemed to me that I managed to convince her that "I" wasn't an alliance traitor etc, and in the mail that she sends a bit later on gives me the impression that she had trouble accepting it and, I think it read something along the lines of "I cant lose you again" or something.

I just don't think that the romanced reunion in ME2 could make them so...neutral to each other.

[Cazlee]

I think the reaction was fitting given that Shepard was working for an enemy of the Alliance (according to the council in ME2). Ashley or Kaidan's words can be interpreted in many ways. I thought they were being discrete.

Modifié par Cazlee, 16 février 2012 - 06:43 .

[RedWulfi]

I just automatically thought that the reason there wasnt anything but a smile was because of the situation. Anderson and Shepard were kind of in a hurry and I think a hug or kiss would be inappropriate XP

[txalikat]

Dagasi wrote...

I didn't see it as Shep ignoring them. They smiled and nodded and so did Shep as s/he walked past. They didn't exactly have time for a heart-to-heart conversation. I'm sure that will come later.

I think in that brief moment, they didn't need to say anything at all. Just the soft smile and eye contact let each other know they still care. That's how I saw it anyway.

I felt the same way about this.  In fact, the look Kaiden gave my fem-shep (to me at least) looked positively longing and had me squeeing in delight that he still loved me.  Really, my unwavering loyalty to my man had better be rewarded!!!

[Demonhoopa]

knightnblu wrote...

The bond that they "share" is one of mutual distrust. Horizon changed the dynamic between them and Shepard. To the VS, Shepard is a traitor and a terrorist (why the VS didn't attempt to arrest Shepard on Horizon is also beyond me). To Shepard (mine at least) if you didn't know me on Horizon, you never did so why should I waste any more time on you? Others are a bit more masochistic, but to each their own.
 
If you happened to have romanced the VS then you get an emailed semi-apology reminding you that you have changed (treason does that to a person) and that the VS is no longer the bright eyed, ignorant, worshiper that they once were and can now see you for the lying scum that you are. Just how they are able to make this determination based on less than three and one half minutes after the more than two years of not seeing you and presuming that you had died is a mystery, but they managed it never the less.
 
So why be surprised when their greeting is less than that of friends in ME3? Anderson is your friend and he certainly didn't greet you that way. In fact, he even kidded with you and stood up for you when it counted both before and after you killed 300K people. The VS never did that and apparently never would. But the VS apologists will have a vastly different view, I am certain.

 

Nice to see I'm not the only one that sees it this way. 

Also, I watched the demo again on my big screen last night. Shephard did not return Ashley's tentative smile as "she" walked past her.

Just my opinion of course.

Saberchic wrote...

Alixen wrote...

Actually, i've gone through that portion of the demo, and I am semi-certain i've had two smiles from Shepard, but also one where there was just a stony look. Could have been an animation glitch, but i'd appreciate if people could pipe in? It might not be down to interpretation, but actual differences. I also share the view that even with a smile, it was ratehr hesitant, and the follow up remark by the VS showcases that. I just hope they run with it.

I was going to make a new thread, but saw this.

I personally want my Shepard's to stay stony until Horizen is... discussed. If it is just glossed over as if its 'the past' i'll be unhappy. It is, in my eyes, a story point that needs to be resolved face to face.

The only smile I've seen on my playthroughs have been from the VS, never Shep.

Yep same here. Of course I've only done the demo with facecodes from my custom Shepards and she's never smiled. Maybe it looks different with the default sheps.

Modifié par Demonhoopa, 16 février 2012 - 09:13 .

[CptData]

^ Shepard's smile is there. Faint. REALLY faint. But it's there and only for half of a second.
At least for Sheploo. I'm not sure if I saw same smile with a custom face.

[Ryzaki]

Yeah I don't play Sheploo. Looked more like my Shep was going "oh great. It's this person." which was appropriate for my Shep frankly so it worked.

[SolidBeast]

CptData wrote...

^ Shepard's smile is there. Faint. REALLY faint. But it's there and only for half of a second.
At least for Sheploo. I'm not sure if I saw same smile with a custom face.

I've watched that scene over and over again and I could never see a smile from defaultShep. Haven't tried other manSheps. Will do now.

[kareatix]

Not sure if it's a "smile", but unless my eyes deceive me, I can see the corner of Shep's lips moving slightly up & down. And I see that on default and custom ones.

[Eire Icon]

SolidBeast wrote...

CptData wrote...

^ Shepard's smile is there. Faint. REALLY faint. But it's there and only for half of a second.
At least for Sheploo. I'm not sure if I saw same smile with a custom face.

I've watched that scene over and over again and I could never see a smile from defaultShep. Haven't tried other manSheps. Will do now.

Same as me - I'm sorry folks but there is no smile there

[CptData]

I saw one. It's visible when Shepard passes Ash for something of half of a second or even less. Mouth corners -do- move very slightly upwards - easy to miss. Besides that: no reaction, neither here nor later.

Shepard locked his/her emotions out, if there are any.

[sheppard7]

I really think our imports might change that scene a bit. Or I hope. I don't see the reaction Shep gives being changed but when Vega asks the VS and the VS says "I used to." might change. I can see the VS might give a bit more depending on the import flags.