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A sincere question: how the heck did Mac Walters become head writer?


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#51
Iakus

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Isn't stopping the Reapers and solving the Reaper problem the same thing? Yes, your goal is the same throughout the whole Trilogy.

 

Not if there is no problem to begin with.

Geth fit the pattern just fine. The pattern is about organic/synthetic conflict, not about wiping out organic life. Wiping out is the end result, the one that the Reapers try to prevent from happening. It's their programming, they can't just give up on that and say that "look, organics can handle their own, let's not harvest them this time"

So instead we have to play along with their delusions?



#52
Calders

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Isn't stopping the Reapers and solving the Reaper problem the same thing? Yes, your goal is the same throughout the whole Trilogy.

 

No I don't think it is the same thing, one puts me in conflict with them, the other doesn't

 

Geth fit the pattern just fine. The pattern is about organic/synthetic conflict, not about wiping out organic life. Wiping out is the end result, the one that the Reapers try to prevent from happening. It's their programming, they can't just give up on that and say that "look, organics can handle their own, let's not harvest them this time"

 

I'm not going to argue if Geth fit the pattern or not because its not the point... the sub-plots need to be made to fit the underlying story not the other way around.  If the sub plots suggest the Reapers are right then change them but keep the Reapers as the force I am in conflict with.



#53
Vazgen

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So instead we have to play along with their delusions?

No, you fight them and stop them



#54
Iakus

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No, you fight them and stop them

I've seen what happens if you rty that.

 

Rocks fall, everyone dies.



#55
Vazgen

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I've seen what happens if you rty that.

 

Rocks fall, everyone dies.

I've seen Reaper destruction. You were too soft to accept that sacrifices are necessary. 


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#56
GalacticWolf5

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No I don't think it is the same thing, one puts me in conflict with them, the other doesn't

 

You were in conflict with them because in ME1, ME2 and the beginning of ME3 you didn't know why they were doing this. Everyone believed the only way to stop them was to kill them all. You found the Crucible blue prints and started building it because you knew it could stop them (but you didn't know it was by solving the problem that gives them purpose). It's finally when you get up their and the Catalyst explains everything to you that you learn the only way to stop them is to solve their problem.

 

So yes you are stopping the Reapers, just not the way you thought you would.


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#57
RoboticWater

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It made perfect sense to me... Shepard dies at the end. Whats so hard about that to understand? Best way to stop people asking for a comeback? Kill of the main character.  People tried to complicate the issue by bringing out videos that Shepard had been indoctrinated. Maybe the writers dont tell you that for a reason. Maybe your left to make up your own mind about the whole thing. Look at the end of Lost as a great example of writing. not everything was explained sometimes you can leave the viewer/player to make up their own minds about what happened at the end. In my version he dies.

 

People are angry about not getting the happy ending. Tough crap. Thats how writing goes sometimes. To those of us who read things that dont contain pictures , sometimes the hero dies at the end. Now maybe if you want to find fault with biowares writing skill for repeatedly killing off likeable characters then thats another matter entirely. But its a way of envoking a response. Any response. I literally sat there with tears rolling down my cheeks at the end of 3 and I have NEVER creid over a video game. I was crying because it was the end of an adventure. No more Shepard. No more Garrus. No more of any of the characters I have come to love and know. Thats how you write a video game story.

 

I vowed never to pick up the game series again after that yet what did I do the other day? Bought the trilogy. I know whats going to happen and the end wont be a shock but I believe in Biowares writing skills.  The fact is we dont always get the ending we want in a book or a game or even a film, but if the writer can evoke anger, tears or laughter at the end of it then he has done his job properly.

 

The fact that there was such outlash because the writers didnt point everything out and tie up every loose end makes me even sadder. People have lost their imagination these days and that is the real crime.

I was never annoyed that Shepard died. In fact, I wanted him to die.

 

I'm sure there are plenty of people disappointed Shepard's death, but that's not the problem. The problem is that the ending didn't make much sense to a lot of people, many of whom were (and still are despite our disappointment) devout fans.

 

Yes, evoking an emotional response is the goal of writing, but we have to distinguish between good and bad emotional responses.

Good Emotional Responses:

-I like the character of Garrus, therefore I'm happy when he does something cool and sad if he dies.

-I hate TIM, because he's a well-written a hole; although the emotion is negative, it's spawned from good, intentional writing.

Bad Emotional Responses:

-I'm annoyed that Cerberus is defaulted to evil in ME3; the response is negative, but in this case, it's directed at the writers and not the character.

-I'm confused by the ending, therefore I loath it; again, my emotion is not because of a character, it's because I thought the writing was bad.

 

In this case, I think ME3's ending is horrendous because it evoked only bad emotional responses from a large portion of the fanbase. Regardless of how much sense the ending made (and I still think it made very little), the writers did a poor job presenting the point of the ending. It's not our fault that we think the ending is bad and it certainly isn't a "lack of imagination." It's the writers' fault for expecting the audience to make such a massive thematic jump unprepared.

 

ME3 would have fared better had it ended right before the Catalyst scene. The rest of the main plot would still be utter garbage and it may be an abrupt stop, but at least the game wouldn't try to go somewhere it was thematically unprepared to go.



#58
Calders

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You were in conflict with them because in ME1, ME2 and the beginning of ME3 you didn't know why they were doing this. Everyone believed the only way to stop them was to kill them all. You found the Crucible blue prints and started building it because you knew it could stop them (but you didn't know it was by solving the problem that gives them purpose). It's finally when you get up their and the Catalyst explains everything to you that you learn the only way to stop them is to solve their problem.

 

So yes you are stopping the Reapers, just not the way you thought you would.

 

So I agree with all of that... but my point is that this last minute change when the catalyst explains the Reaper purpose is the problem with the ending.  It should never have happened, the Reapers should have remained what they were for most of the trilogy, which is a force I needed to defeat.  I actually don't really care what the Reapers purpose is, that can be changed at the stroke of the writers pen, but don't change the protagonists purpose in the last 10 minutes.



#59
BioWareMod03

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Let's let old threads sleep.