351 réponses à ce sujet

[Twizz089]

Blodsven wrote...

I do not argue that the ME3 Sentinel is horribly broken. I'm certain you can beat the game with it.

However, I find it quite sad that you're better off ignoring their unique class ability. I pray that some clever chap can prove me wrong and tell me how stellar it is to manually detonate Tech Armor, alternatively how extremely valuable it is to have 40% damage reduction...

...but currently the only thing I can see is the power recharge penalty, the far lower detonation radius and the lack of shield-recharge.

I never use the detonate ability, its far too weak.  However I treat it as a passive abillity, my moves do 20% more damage and I take 30% less damage at the cost of an increase of .5 to 1 sec in my recharge times depending on the move.  It is sad that we are the only class whose class move has negatives, but it is what it is.

[scotkrow]

The vanguards secodnary class power Nova takes away your shield... that's not a negative?

[Twizz089]

scotkrow wrote...

The vanguards secodnary class power Nova takes away your shield... that's not a negative?

It can be, but if played right it is an avoidable negative, which is a big difference from one that is unavoidable (unless you just dont use tech armor)  Also nova is a secondary class power, not the main class power.

[luckyloser_62]

I'm pretty ticked that the blast radius of tech armor is so nerfed, but overall I'm still excited about the class. Lift grenades provide damage and cc off of cooldown, warp-throw is the most damaging biotic combo in the game, and cryo- throw looks like it will be pretty beastly as well. Not to mention that overload is now one of the best powers in the game. If you take stasis as a bonus and evolve it to stasis bubble you can pretty much use that to replace singularity, especially since it can be detonated as well. I plan to only really use tech armor as a passive buff, assault sentinel got smacked with the nerf stick, but caster sentinel is beastly.

[scotkrow]

luckyloser62, that's the positive thinking people should have, they should adapt to the new system and alter play styles, like the aliens in mass effect say over and over, our big advantage is our ability to adapt. Everyone who just says, "negative negative negative negative" how about stopping for a moment and actually thinking about how to turn that positive?

[Scouren]

Human female sentinel: spamming throw like a maniac.

[Twizz089]

Scouren wrote...

Human female sentinel: spamming throw like a maniac.

This.  Fully upgraded throw can take out 70-100% of an enemy's health bar.  Someone has shields on, 2-3 throws combined with a smg will not only take down the shield quckly, the enemy will be stunned the entire time unable to shoot back.

Modifié par Twizz089, 20 février 2012 - 09:05 .

[squidney2k1]

The main reason why people complain about the Sentinel: The free power that doubles your Shields, restores your shields when gone, and damages everyone and has no drawbacks and makes you nigh invincible, is gone.

Tech Armor was severely unbalanced and needed change. This was good. Every Defensive power should have a drawback, and Tech Armor is much more tactical this time around. Although the bonuses it grants could be improved, its situational use is crafty: Do you want to use Tech Armor and gain Damage Protection, DMG boost to powers, and the ability to send out an damaging pulse, but at the expense of a hefty cooldown penalty? Or leave it off, and go bare bones?

I do think it needs a mild buff, however. The pulse damage isn't that great, and an extra +10% damage reduction would be fantastic.

[Tempus Frangit]

Overall, I didn't hate the Sentinel. I was definitely most disappointed by what happened with tech armor. Having played senitnel as my main class in ME2, I was pretty confused during the demo the first time I died without my armor automatically going off to let me know to be careful haha. Then I treid detonating the armor, and was also disappointed by the impact radius/damage.

So, I adjusted my strategy. I had the most fun when wearing tech armor but not detonating it, ever. It was still useful for getting into close-quarters without taking too much damage, and being able to shotgun enemies. I also really liked using lift grenade and throw, so cool.

That said, it seems like I was justing using it as a Vanguard with a little beefed up defense...Didn't hate it.

[element eater]

^ that was exactly my problem when playing sentinel i just ended playing like a more boring vanguard never detontaing my my armour because it didnt seem worth while and then using powers leess often then i would with another class

Modifié par element eater, 20 février 2012 - 11:02 .

[I Tsunayoshi I]

squidney2k1 wrote...

The main reason why people complain about the Sentinel: The free power that doubles your Shields, restores your shields when gone, and damages everyone and has no drawbacks and makes you nigh invincible, is gone.

Tech Armor was severely unbalanced and needed change. This was good. Every Defensive power should have a drawback, and Tech Armor is much more tactical this time around. Although the bonuses it grants could be improved, its situational use is crafty: Do you want to use Tech Armor and gain Damage Protection, DMG boost to powers, and the ability to send out an damaging pulse, but at the expense of a hefty cooldown penalty? Or leave it off, and go bare bones?

I do think it needs a mild buff, however. The pulse damage isn't that great, and an extra +10% damage reduction would be fantastic.

There is a difference between balancing a power because its OP as hell, and then there is making it so that you are better off without it and playing as an inferior hybrid of two extremely effective CC classes. Bit retarded to take away everything good from Tech Armor while adding a severe nerf at the same time. Would have been better off reducing the shield boost/recharge as a whole and possibly reducing the protection given in damage resistance instead of making it into the one power that every other class laughs at because they have something better.

[hawat333]

I wonder why we have a "_insert any class here_ hate?!" topic for every single class in the game.

[SneakiestNeg]

Well Amalur solves that problem lol.

[luckyloser_62]

It seems to me like everybody just needs to think of the possibilities instead of the downsides. Sentinels can be powerful battle casters. They have a well rounded skill set to both CC and cause damage, with the added bonus of a little extra protection. If you want to have a semi-invincible assault sentinel you can still pick barrier, fortitude, or defense matrix as a bonus power and double up on defenses. Which would give you a possible 80% damage protection before possible bonuses from armor and upgrades. Load a couple of good weapons on that and you have the best tank you could hope for, but with crazy long cooldowns. You could rely on weapons, heavy melee, and lift grenades.

[rumination888]

scotkrow wrote...

Rumination888, I'm guessing you are referring to, fire, cryo and overload... Cryo isn't effective against barriers like they say it is. All classes are good against health. The Engineer is good against shields and armor, the sentinel covers all the bases, barriers, sheilds, armor. Literally all of them.

Overload >>>> Warp against barriers, especially now that there are enemies that can dodge powers with travel times. Phantoms can dodge warp, but they can't dodge overload, and both do extra damage against barriers.

--------------

And I still don't understand why people keep bringing up Tech Armor as if it was overpowered in ME2.

Overpowered compared to what?

Adrenaline Rush? lol.
Charge? Not even close.
Tactical Cloak? Nope.
Combat Drone? Debatable.
Singularity? Sure.

Charge got a huge buff with the whole weight capacity thing, AR got buffs in its upgrade path. Tac Cloak didn't change much at all. Combat Drone got a buff. Singularity, along with numerous other powers that were only good against unprotected enemies, got buffed.

Seems like BioWare devs were listening to feedback when designing powers and decided to nerf Tech Armor because there wern't enough people saying how overpowered the Soldier, Vanguard, and Infiltrator are.

Modifié par rumination888, 20 février 2012 - 11:51 .

[Kakita Tatsumaru]

squidney2k1 wrote...
The main reason why people complain about the Sentinel: The free power that doubles your Shields, restores your shields when gone, and damages everyone and has no drawbacks and makes you nigh invincible, is gone.

You talk like tech armor was most powerful power, and while it was very good, many powers were at least on par or even better than this one (AR anyone?).

Tech Armor was severely unbalanced and needed change. This was good. Every Defensive power should have a drawback, and Tech Armor is much more tactical this time around. Although the bonuses it grants could be improved, its situational use is crafty: Do you want to use Tech Armor and gain Damage Protection, DMG boost to powers, and the ability to send out an damaging pulse, but at the expense of a hefty cooldown penalty? Or leave it off, and go bare bones?

I do think it needs a mild buff, however. The pulse damage isn't that great, and an extra +10% damage reduction would be fantastic.

Balance? Who cares about that in a single player game?
Fun > Balance everytime!
And why should defensive powers have drawback? Because you cannot win just by using them?
I don't understand why one could be happy just by seeing another player getting nerfed in a SP game.
My adept give his support to poor sentinel player, seems like there's no love for caster class.

[Twizz089]

rumination888 wrote...


And I still don't understand why people keep bringing up Tech Armor as if it was overpowered in ME2.

With tech armor, on insanity a sentinel could run around the game with a shotgun out and never have to use cover, the sentinel was for the most part invincible.  If your shields got low, you just kept reactivating tech armor to bring your shields back to full strength.  As long as your shields were not geting taken down faster than the cooldown you could never be killed.  (And even if they did get taken down before the cooldown was up you get a 50% shield boast after the detonation anyway)  Also tech armor reset your squad member cooldowns, (I always assumed this was a glitch)

Modifié par Twizz089, 21 février 2012 - 12:36 .

[Praetor Knight]

Also with ME2 Tech Armor at level 3 and 4, we can reset squadmates' cooldowns, so that we can spam their powers along with Shepard's Tech Armor, very effective with Tali, Kasumi,  Legion and Liara in particular.

I can't remember how often I could recast it, but combining the Tech Cooldown Research and Guardian gave a significant bonus.


And Assault Armor gives that 50% shield boost after it breaks, so combined with the Research, Emergency Shielding, Hard Shields and Redundant Shield Generator makes the Sentinel very resilient in ME2.

I anticipate more similar research in ME3.

Modifié par Praetor Shepard, 21 février 2012 - 02:01 .

[rumination888]

People can list the reasons why Tech Armor was good in ME2 all they want, but they still aren't arguing the crux of the matter.

As I said before, it still doesn't beat time dilation + double damage multiplier(if you understood the damage mechanics of ME2, you'd realize this multiplier is insanely overpowered), complete invisibility(plus time dilation on sniper rifles, although thats an Infiltrator passive), or immunity to damage during activation + time dilation + full shield recharge + setting up a 2x damage bonus for being in melee range + half the cooldown compared to other shield recharge skills.

<cue someone responding to this and totally missing the point>

[schemata]

rumination888 wrote...

People can list the reasons why Tech Armor was good in ME2 all they want, but they still aren't arguing the crux of the matter.

As I said before, it still doesn't beat time dilation + double damage multiplier(if you understood the damage mechanics of ME2, you'd realize this multiplier is insanely overpowered), complete invisibility(plus time dilation on sniper rifles, although thats an Infiltrator passive), or immunity to damage during activation + time dilation + full shield recharge + setting up a 2x damage bonus for being in melee range + half the cooldown compared to other shield recharge skills.

<cue someone responding to this and totally missing the point>

I wanted to come up with a clever misunderstanding of what you are saying, because you cued it, and I didnt want to let you down.  But I'm not entirely sure comparing classes against each other is the way to view what happened to the Sentinel class.

[Praetor Knight]

rumination888 wrote...

People can list the reasons why Tech Armor was good in ME2 all they want, but they still aren't arguing the crux of the matter.

As I said before, it still doesn't beat time dilation + double damage multiplier(if you understood the damage mechanics of ME2, you'd realize this multiplier is insanely overpowered), complete invisibility(plus time dilation on sniper rifles, although thats an Infiltrator passive), or immunity to damage during activation + time dilation + full shield recharge + setting up a 2x damage bonus for being in melee range + half the cooldown compared to other shield recharge skills.

<cue someone responding to this and totally missing the point>

LOL at bolded.


Regarding the damage boost and time dilation, sure if we are talking about clearing a room, reaching spawn points as quickly as possible, or dealing with certain tougher enemies, but resetting squadmate cooldowns can also make Insanity a cake walk.

You can discount keeping one or two Attack Drones always on the field, or being able to use Shadow Strike and Singularity, to name a few, every ~5-6 seconds, from squadmates, as well as the other details I brought up, but there are many ways to beat ME2 on Insanity.


And no need to be rude with the listing comment.
I mean this stuff feels like it heading towards personal preferences anyway, so I don't feel that there's gonna a right and wrong answer here.

[Twizz089]

rumination888 wrote...

People can list the reasons why Tech Armor was good in ME2 all they want, but they still aren't arguing the crux of the matter.

As I said before, it still doesn't beat time dilation + double damage multiplier(if you understood the damage mechanics of ME2, you'd realize this multiplier is insanely overpowered), complete invisibility(plus time dilation on sniper rifles, although thats an Infiltrator passive), or immunity to damage during activation + time dilation + full shield recharge + setting up a 2x damage bonus for being in melee range + half the cooldown compared to other shield recharge skills.

<cue someone responding to this and totally missing the point>

Everyone has their own opinion which is fine.  As good as AR was and is, imo ME2 Tech Armor was better.  With one power you could do insane damage for 5 seconds every 8 seconds, with the other you for the most part couldnt be killed  and you could reset the cooldown times of your squadmates so that they could cast moves back to back.

The question of why tech armor was so harshly nerfed even tho AR (Which some may argue was better then tech armor) was not, is simple imo.  A biotic/tech class should not be able to fight in the front lines as good as, or better than a vanguard or a soldier.  However, did the power throwing sentinel deserve a nerf also? No. Is it as big of a deal as other people make it out to be.  No.

Tech armor needs a buff to bring it in line with the other class talents, however the sentinel is still my favorite class in ME3

[rumination888]

schemata wrote...

I
wanted to come up with a clever misunderstanding of what you are
saying, because you cued it, and I didnt want to let you down.  But I'm
not entirely sure comparing classes against each other is the way to
view what happened to the Sentinel class.

When something is viewed as "overpowered" then there is an implicit comparison being made. They argue that Tech Armor was "overpowered", therefore, it must be nerfed. I merely pointed out how false that statement is.

Praetor Shepard wrote...

LOL at bolded.


Regarding the damage boost and time dilation, sure if we are talking about clearing a room, reaching spawn points as quickly as possible, or dealing with certain tougher enemies, but resetting squadmate cooldowns can also make Insanity a cake walk.

You can discount keeping one or two Attack Drones always on the field, or being able to use Shadow Strike and Singularity, to name a few, every ~5-6 seconds, from squadmates, as well as the other details I brought up, but there are many ways to beat ME2 on Insanity.


And no need to be rude with the listing comment.
I mean this stuff feels like it heading towards personal preferences anyway, so I don't feel that there's gonna a right and wrong answer here.

Of course your first paragraph is what I'm talking about. The point of your second paragraph is a fallacy. You can beat ME2 Insanity with just a pistol and nothing else, but that doesn't mean its the bestest most overpowered weapon type in the game. Thats not even debatable. ME2 Insanity is a cake walk because its a cake walk. In this case, the only way to determine whether something is better or not is by speed and ease.

This is not an opinion. This is not personal preference.

Modifié par rumination888, 21 février 2012 - 05:28 .

[Praetor Knight]

rumination888 wrote...

Of course your first paragraph is what I'm talking about. The point of your second paragraph is a fallacy. You can beat ME2 Insanity with just a pistol and nothing else, but that doesn't mean its the bestest most overpowered weapon type in the game. Thats not even debatable. ME2 Insanity is a cake walk because its a cake walk. In this case, the only way to determine whether something is better or not is by speed and ease.

This is not an opinion. This is not personal preference.

But how is the criteria you are using, for comparison, not subjective?