25 réponses à ce sujet

[Badwater]

I would like some variety in how I set up the look of merchant
interiors. It seems that there is not much variety in what is available
for placeables in terms of display cabinets. I can change the look of an
armor or weapon merchant easily enough, but what I'm after is being
able to build a jewelery merchant and have more than just an empty
display case and some plants because nothing else seems to fit.

I'm
quite familiar with the various app changes that are available (in fact
I keep resource usage down by not making a new placeable when just
changing an app will do). I see nothing in the way of placeable jewelry
or clothing.

It would be nice to have a tailor with a static
stack of shirts or trousers displayed. It would be nice to have a rings
and amulets displayed in a case or on a mannequin or bust, or in a glass
cabinet.

Are there any placeable downloads that include some of
these decorative aspects in building a nice looking merchant
establishment?

[Rolo Kipp]

 <shopping for jewelry...>


The Submarine Helm of Air we did in the Nov 2011 - Underwater CCC included a drop-model of Estelinis' gold Torc (fromNov 2010 - Ancient Civs CCC). But, honestly, I think that's the only dropable jewelry I know of.
.
That said, I know ShadowM made gem items

and Tiberius Morguhn made gem placeables.

For clothing, there are the "hangers" in the Aug 2010 - High Priestess Chamber CCC:

There's undoubtedly more gold in them thar hills... just gotta dig :-)

Or pounce on someone else who has already dug ;-)

Edit: Grrrr, the board ate half my post :-(

<...with his ten-finger discount>

Modifié par Rolo Kipp, 15 février 2012 - 11:19 .

[Badwater]

Thanks for your reply, Rolo. I have to make some sort of decision....I like the placeables download, don't know that I need that much but it's relatively easy to selectively incorporate any placeables I like to an existing hak.

I'm mostly a PW builder, but perhaps I should look and a shot at building some customized placeables and sharing with the community. As we all know, anything we do in our own personal niches takes a lot of time and I just wonder about a time commitment as it relates to our little PW.

[Rolo Kipp]

<flips over...>

classic game-theory :-) The cooperative approach yields the highest gains.

Obviously I'm biased <heh> but not only does trying to make *something* (no matter how trivial) for the CCC every month keep me creating, it get's *all* the juices flowing and the end result is such a rich contribution not only to the community, but to *ME* =)

I make something... I get a dozen cool things back. Whoa! Now *that's* return on investment!

OTOH, the time commitment. *sigh* I'm nuts <we all agree there, boss>
But *everyone* doesn't have to send anywhere near the time I do. Look at the themes coming up and pick one likely to win soon. like Elven Things. It may not win next month, but it looks to me like it'll probably win pretty soon. Got some elven jewelry in mind? Start making it now. You can't *lose* because you'll use it anyway for your own world. If you feel like making stuff, you should. It really applies a strong "JuicesFlowing" effect ;-) And who knows how you'll influence the other content in the CCC? <ranting, wizard>

Right. 'Nuff said by me.

<...the hour-glass>

[Badwater]

I appreciate the comments and the help RK

I may look at what I can do with placeables because outside of the tileset they can impact the feel and atmosphere of an area like nothing else.

Modifié par Badwater, 19 février 2012 - 01:59 .

[Rolo Kipp]

<bumping...>

I *almost* agree :-)
Make drop models for jewelry items (and other things). They can be scattered about like placeables but also picked up and *used* by PCs. Double the pleasure! ;-)

Personal opinion there, but other than tiles, I think *items* offer the biggest bang for the buck. They can be used like placeables (and even made unusable) for atmosphere, but they can also be acquired and used by players and, of course, there's all *kinds* of scripting for them.

Downside? More resources and limited animations. Placeables *do* have a purpose, but items are better :-)

<...badwater>

[henesua]

Items have one downside. They are difficult to position properly in an area because they simply drop (Z axis adjusts) to the nearest mesh surface. A placeable can be given any z position you want and will keep that position.

[Badwater]

I do have a question - I am trying to incorporate this into our PW:

http://nwvault.ign.c...d=34511&id=8102

The notes say that if you're not using any other haks then just add the hak and import the erf. But what if other haks are being used? Does the hak need to be merged with another?

My problem is that I'm not getting appearances with the custom placeables. In Properties the Appearance Type is blank because the appearance is not there. What do I need to do to address this?

[Fester Pot]

Yup.

You need to take the placeables.2da from your HAK and put it someplace - desktop, etc.

Then you need to take the placeables.2da from the above HAK and put it in a different place, along with everything else in the HAK - a directory would be best for this.

Now open up the placeables.2da from the first HAK in your favorite text editor.

Open up the placeables.2da from the new HAK into the same text editor.

You want to take all the lines from the placeables.2da HAK you want to add and COPY, then PASTE them to the placeables.2da from the HAK you're already using.

RENUMBER the lines once you've copied them, otherwise you'll have issues.

If your current placeables.2da numbers end at 3853, and you COPY and PASTE the lines from the new HAK you want to use and they start at 830, you'll need to renumber them starting at 3854.

Then you SAVE your modified placeables.2da and place it back into your HAK file.

Then you add all the files from the new HAK to your current HAK. Save.

Have everyone redownload the now modified HAK it to apply the new changes.

It's just that easy!

FP!

Modifié par Fester Pot, 20 février 2012 - 11:58 .

[ShadowM]

henesua wrote...

Items have one downside. They are difficult to position properly in an area because they simply drop (Z axis adjusts) to the nearest mesh surface. A placeable can be given any z position you want and will keep that position.

when he say mesh he mean any mesh so if you have a placable it will drop on top of that, like a placable table or display cabinet. Use adjust location option to position them and if you select them from item list instead of clicking on them in the scene window you should be ok (if you click on them in the scene window they will drop to the tileset walkmesh). I personally would get both version for flexibility.

[Tiberius_Morguhn]

One thing to note from FP notes is that the ERF I made for the placeables is not longer applicable if you move the 2da lines around. Bioware went with flat indexing versus other methods to enumerate stuff (placeables for instance) and by moving the index in placeables.2da, the internal numbering in the ERF will point to the wrong item should you do an import. You'll have to make new blueprints or go ahead with the import, and spend some time re-picking the correct appearance.  If the ERF is present, its usually easier to do the second and just readjust the model appearance as all other information is correct (HP, hardness, DC, etc.) and you don't have to start a blueprint from scratch.  

Modifié par Tiberius_Morguhn, 21 février 2012 - 01:53 .

[Badwater]

Thanks all, I am working on this right now. FP's explanation is straight forward enough but I'll pop back in if I have a question.

I believe I understand what you're driving at TM...it looks like I will have to make some app changes to make it work. I'll deal with a basic blank module and see what happens.

Modifié par Badwater, 21 février 2012 - 09:02 .

[Badwater]

Fester Pot wrote...

...
RENUMBER the lines once you've copied them, otherwise you'll have issues.

If your current placeables.2da numbers end at 3853, and you COPY and PASTE the lines from the new HAK you want to use and they start at 830, you'll need to renumber them starting at 3854.

...
FP!

I use CEP 2.4 so between the CEP placeables and reserved lines, it ends at 20000.

Can I safely use USER lines? (1000-1499, 4000-4168, etc)

[Badwater]

*bump* Anyone?

[The Amethyst Dragon]

Go ahead and use "user" lines. It's what they are there for.

[Badwater]

Thanks AD. This is unknown territory so I'm just double checking.

[Badwater]

Hmm, somehow this isn't working. I'll retrace my steps and see if anyone has an idea of where I've gone wrong.

What I did was to copy 100 of the placeables to the placeables.2da file and then merge that hak to the CEP top hak that I'm working with. When I look at my modified version of the CEP hak in my text editor then I see the changes I made in the placeables.

I downloaded Tiberius' erf and then was going to assign the appearance to the placeable on the palette and save. The appearance shows up now on Appearance Type in Properties, but when I select the appearance I get an error  "The selected model does not exist. Please choose another one."

I copied in only 100 or so appearances to see if it would work. I've tried this on a few of the new placeables where I modified the placeables.2da file but get nothing.

In addition to renumbering, I added quotes to the first field because all the other placeables in the CEP hak use that syntax. I also added spaces to line up the columns because the pasted lines did not line up. Is the placeables.2da file sensitive to added spaces? If so, then perhaps I need to copy again and not worry about how it looks?

Or is there something else in my procedure that I may have done incorrectly?

Modifié par Badwater, 23 février 2012 - 07:44 .

[Rolo Kipp]

<thinking...>

Two suggestions based on experience:
1) Make sure the placeables.2da points to the right portrait and the portrait exists (case sensitive to be sure) in the new hak.
2) Make sure the placeable models are in the hak with the new placeables.2da

<...hard, 'cuz thinking *is* hard>

[Badwater]

I can see that the models are missing...how involved is it to incorporate the models into the 2da file? Or should they be in with a CEP core hak? Or should the models be their own hak (maybe minus the 2da lines which are being added to the 2da file)?

Modifié par Badwater, 23 février 2012 - 09:28 .

[Rolo Kipp]

<blushing...>

Er, yes. As TSL points out, the portrait thing applies to creatures, not placeables. It was with creatures I ran into this problem :-P

<...slightly>

[Badwater]

Nevermind...I added the models and whatnot as their own hak and that's going to work just fine.

Thanks everyone for your help!

[Badwater]

Well.....<_<

The placeables added are working just fine but the inclusion into the CEP 2da file affects the appearance of other CEP placeables - a LOT of other placeables. I thought that perhaps the fact that some lines were not lined up with the other columns might have been responsible. I changed that in the text editor and the affected CEP appearances are different from before but still wrong.

I have no clue what to be doing to fix this. Any ideas?

[Tiberius_Morguhn]

Please post your top level placeables.2da and I'll look at it.

[Badwater]

I don't think posting here will work. Here is a link to download the placeables 2da:

www.4shared.com/file/UaeI5jgn/bwplc2daold.html

[Tiberius_Morguhn]

Okay, extracting your placeables.2da file shows a lot. You have significant number of unprintable characters buried in there (they appear to be tabs) - especially in the mtp placeables line you wanted to add. What editor did you use for your work? Don't use a word processor like Word, always use a plain text editor. Also, if you must use tabs for alignment or prettification, then have the editor convert tabs to fixed spaces upon saving. Many text editors do this.

Second, and most importantly, you have several missing line numbers. You were missing these lines which throws everything off internally: 1006, 1066, 1099, 1174, 1359, 6147.

Third, and also important, you had duplicate line 1323.

I took the duplicate line 1323 and moved/renumbered it to be line 1359. All the other missing lines I simply inserted a BIO_RESERVED placeholder line so the whole thing didn't have to be renumbered/redone. I have uploaded the 2da file here : placeables.zip

See if that doesn't fix your issues.

Modifié par Tiberius_Morguhn, 25 février 2012 - 03:59 .