176 réponses à ce sujet

[incinerator950]

JeffZero wrote...

I actually vastly preferred ME2's level design. Vastly. Maybe it's my lack of shooter gaming and all that. I don't know. But the corridor issue wasn't really an issue for me 90% of the time. I liked the greater emphasis on the strategies of control, aggression, defensive posturing and so forth that I didn't really feel was ever the case with ME1's long bridges, tunnels, copy-and-pasted assignment locales and wide open spaces.

No, ME 1's layout design was more repetitive.  It's like trying to say Dragon Age had a wonderful environment, when everything looked the same for two hours. 

[Capeo]

Seeing as I haven't played the last game in the series yet I don't believe I could make that determination.

[Paul E Dangerously]

It might be more cutting if ME2 weren't a series of linear corridors with different backgrounds and chest high walls everywhere.

[Candidate 88766]

Can't we just agree that people have different opinions?

[Gemini1179]

ME2...

Pros:
- great combat mechanics- well, better than ME1 although I still have a soft spot for them.
- Looked phenominal
- Character work was fantastic
- some great lines
- smooth transition from ME1
- the N7 missions were more in depth
- Kasumi, Zaeed, Overlord and Lair of the Shadow Broker were great.
- Conrad! The refund guy!
- Normandy upgrades gave you more of a connection to the ship
- Joker and EDI were priceless
- Blood Dragon armour and Collector Armour looked great
- Heavy weapons- Arc Reactor and CAIN FTW
- Kelly, because every ship needs a community bicycle
- Mordin! Nuff said.
- Larger scope. Larger main missions.
- No having 10 000 of the same weapons with different skins that you just ended up turning into omni-gel anyway.


Pro/Con:
- No elevators. I know they drove people nuts but I found that it kept me immersed in the world.
- Loss of semi-pointless planet and galaxy scanning. It was good XP and for those of us who have to complete everything, getting all the writings, turian insignias, etc was a must.
- Planet scanning in ME2. With the upgrades it was better, but I still mostly used it to lull myself into naptime.
- I miss the Mako, so sue me. I think had they adjusted the control mechanisms of the vehicle, it could have been viable. At least it was more durable than the Hammerhead.
- HUD's in ME1 and ME2 were both better than what I'm seeing in ME3.
- Global cooldown was a shock to the system and took some getting used to.
- No omni-gel. The mini-games were ok though.

Cons:
- Story... this really is a big one. In the end, I found that you just had to not look into it deeply, which was a first in my BioWare gaming experience and very difficult. I'm not getting into the story issues here.
- Lack of customization. No customization of companions. It's stupid, but when I first played, I thought I'd be able to buy all kinds of outfits to wear on the Normandy, mods for weapons, etc.
- Level Complete screen. Hated this. No continual XP gain.
- Lore reasoning for the thermal clips. (I'd have preferred they just pretended it was always like that rather than coming up with a single codex 'hand wave' excuse. I'd always rather have a weapon that I could fire again over the potential to run out of ammo and be SOL.)
- Poor field of view. Seemed a lot less than in ME1.
- Couldn't whip out a gun and shoot random things in a public place. Why stop me from my fun? It was 'society', right?
- Linear levels, with no ability to go back to them if you missed an upgrade or something.
- No helmet toggle broke my immersion on my very first playthrough when I met Tali wearing the Blood Dragon armour and Tali seemed to recognize me.
- Not enough money and not enough pointless stuff to spend it on. Not nearly enough armour or weapons.


I'm sure I could go on in all three categories but I won't. I found that in the end, the Pro's allowed me to get over the Con's, and enjoy the game, but I'm not going to sit here and say ME2 was the best thing since sliced bread.

I think a lot of people who flat out state that ME2 was 'universally loved' ignore the fact that many of those people shared my list of Con's but, like me, felt that the Pro's made the game a good experience overall. Most of the "It was a great game" reviews came with a 'but...' attached.

I can't make any judgements on ME2's place in the series until I play ME3 to death. I'm constantly changing my opinion of the demo. I'm choosing to believe the kid is part of Shepard's PTSD because that actually makes for some intriguing story situations rather than a fairly basic attempt to get me to really 'feel' how EVIL the Reapers are when I ALREADY KNOW THAT.

[We are many]

Only bad thing about Mass Effect 2 is theirs no Mako.
maybe exagerating

Modifié par We are many, 16 février 2012 - 06:42 .

[Pee Jae]

It would be easy to have "common ground" if the majority agreed with you. Looks like that's not the case. Having never played ME1, I have no context in which to agree with you. If I thought ME2 was the worst in the series, I'd never have been interested in buying its sequel. I have over 50 PS3 games. Mass Effect 2 is the one I always come back to.

[tetrisblock4x1]

No.

[withneelandi]

JeffZero wrote...
Sometimes I try to envision what the idealized reaction from a gamer to those copypasta locales would have been.

"OK, so we're in the mine again now. Yes! The mine. Now we may know what it's like going in there, but we don't know which doors will be open this time, and so that's really cool. It's like playing that old game where you guess what's behind each door, except BioWare has made it so much less boring because the doors are pretty much decided for me already, which is really neat. OK, so we also don't know where the enemies are going to be, so it's like that old game where you smack the gofers or whatever, except I get to smack them with my gun. I love the mine. Oh no, my legs are stuck inside this badly-implemented wall! That's OK, I love the mine."

I rememer playing Me1 for the first time and thinking "some intergalactic architect has made a fortune knocking out the same research station/warehouse on just about every planet in known space".

[Kaiser Arian XVII]

Gemini1179 wrote...

ME2...


Cons:
- Story... this really is a big one. In the end, I found that you just had to not look into it deeply, which was a first in my BioWare gaming experience and very difficult. I'm not getting into the story issues here.
- Lack of customization. No customization of companions. It's stupid, but when I first played, I thought I'd be able to buy all kinds of outfits to wear on the Normandy, mods for weapons, etc.
- Level Complete screen. Hated this. No continual XP gain.
- Lore reasoning for the thermal clips. (I'd have preferred they just pretended it was always like that rather than coming up with a single codex 'hand wave' excuse. I'd always rather have a weapon that I could fire again over the potential to run out of ammo and be SOL.)
- Poor field of view. Seemed a lot less than in ME1.
- Couldn't whip out a gun and shoot random things in a public place. Why stop me from my fun? It was 'society', right?
- Linear levels, with no ability to go back to them if you missed an upgrade or something.
- No helmet toggle broke my immersion on my very first playthrough when I met Tali wearing the Blood Dragon armour and Tali seemed to recognize me.
- Not enough money and not enough pointless stuff to spend it on. Not nearly enough armour or weapons.


I'm sure I could go on in all three categories but I won't. I found that in the end, the Pro's allowed me to get over the Con's, and enjoy the game, but I'm not going to sit here and say ME2 was the best thing since sliced bread.

I think a lot of people who flat out state that ME2 was 'universally loved' ignore the fact that many of those people shared my list of Con's but, like me, felt that the Pro's made the game a good experience overall. Most of the "It was a great game" reviews came with a 'but...' attached.

I can't make any judgements on ME2's place in the series until I play ME3 to death. I'm constantly changing my opinion of the demo. I'm choosing to believe the kid is part of Shepard's PTSD because that actually makes for some intriguing story situations rather than a fairly basic attempt to get me to really 'feel' how EVIL the Reapers are when I ALREADY KNOW THAT.

Story is it, an interlude, nothing more. But T.I.M beats any Shepard's Boss in ME1.

2,3,4,7th and 8th cons are true. 5 and 6 are crap.

Modifié par Jedi Sentinel Arian, 16 février 2012 - 06:55 .

[Arkitekt]

Me2, apart from having a weaker main plot, everything else was superior or as good as me1. Music in 1 was superb and extremely sci fiish, but some tracks in me2 are just so good that I can't take you seriously. Legion ost, the attack, suicide, shadow broker, overlord... Iow the op does not know what he is talking about

[Gemini1179]

Jedi Sentinel Arian wrote...

Story is it, an interlude, nothing more. But T.I.M beats any Shepard's Boss in ME1.

2,3,4,7th and 8th cons are true. 5 and 6 are crap.

The shock of getting an interlude when you'd been hyped to believe you'd be getting Empire Strikes Back was a big one, for sure. My 5th and 6th cons could have gone in the personal pro/con section as they were pretty subjective I'll admit.

[JeffZero]

withneelandi wrote...

JeffZero wrote...
Sometimes I try to envision what the idealized reaction from a gamer to those copypasta locales would have been.

"OK, so we're in the mine again now. Yes! The mine. Now we may know what it's like going in there, but we don't know which doors will be open this time, and so that's really cool. It's like playing that old game where you guess what's behind each door, except BioWare has made it so much less boring because the doors are pretty much decided for me already, which is really neat. OK, so we also don't know where the enemies are going to be, so it's like that old game where you smack the gofers or whatever, except I get to smack them with my gun. I love the mine. Oh no, my legs are stuck inside this badly-implemented wall! That's OK, I love the mine."

I rememer playing Me1 for the first time and thinking "some intergalactic architect has made a fortune knocking out the same research station/warehouse on just about every planet in known space".

Hahaha.

[Sasie]

People go on and on about Mass effect 1's copy pasted warehouses while apparently forgetting that the main mission planets were totally unique. Noveria for example is huge, with both outdoor scenery and indoors building that only existed there alone.

Side quests was lacking sure but with the number of planets you could land on in ME1 that's no surprise. ME2 however got their boxed corridors that forced the player to remember they are playing a game all over the place. You never escape those.

[JeffZero]

Sasie wrote...

People go on and on about Mass effect 1's copy pasted warehouses while apparently forgetting that the main mission planets were totally unique. Noveria for example is huge, with both outdoor scenery and indoors building that only existed there alone.

I never implied I'd 'forgotten' about that. I was only remarking on combat areas when I initiated this particular portion of the conversation, arguing that I feel as though ME2's level design is definitely superior.

Side quests was lacking sure but with the number of planets you could land on in ME1 that's no surprise. ME2 however got their boxed corridors that forced the player to remember they are playing a game all over the place. You never escape those.

So reduce the number of planets to land on in ME1 and make them all feel a hell of a lot better to be in. Quality over quantity. As for ME2, I rarely got that feeling. I definitely got that feeling while scaling mountains poorly.

[incinerator950]

JeffZero wrote...

withneelandi wrote...

JeffZero wrote...
Sometimes I try to envision what the idealized reaction from a gamer to those copypasta locales would have been.

"OK, so we're in the mine again now. Yes! The mine. Now we may know what it's like going in there, but we don't know which doors will be open this time, and so that's really cool. It's like playing that old game where you guess what's behind each door, except BioWare has made it so much less boring because the doors are pretty much decided for me already, which is really neat. OK, so we also don't know where the enemies are going to be, so it's like that old game where you smack the gofers or whatever, except I get to smack them with my gun. I love the mine. Oh no, my legs are stuck inside this badly-implemented wall! That's OK, I love the mine."

I rememer playing Me1 for the first time and thinking "some intergalactic architect has made a fortune knocking out the same research station/warehouse on just about every planet in known space".

Hahaha.

Prefabs are amazing for that.

[Toxic Alien]

I actually enjoy playing ME2 more then ME1 so I cannot agree with you there.

Maybe because I played Me2 few times before I played Me1.

[AlanC9]

Sasie wrote...

People go on and on about Mass effect 1's copy pasted warehouses while apparently forgetting that the main mission planets were totally unique. Noveria for example is huge, with both outdoor scenery and indoors building that only existed there alone.

I don't think people forget that. But saying that the main areas were unique doesn't make the copy-pasted areas any better.

I'm with JeffZero. If you don't have the resources to do something well, don't do it at all. Easy for me to say, of course, since I didn't have much use for exploration in the first place.

Modifié par AlanC9, 16 février 2012 - 07:10 .

[AlexXIV]

AlanC9 wrote...

Sasie wrote...

People go on and on about Mass effect 1's copy pasted warehouses while apparently forgetting that the main mission planets were totally unique. Noveria for example is huge, with both outdoor scenery and indoors building that only existed there alone.

I don't think people forget that. But saying that the main areas were unique doesn't make the copy-pasted areas any better.

I'm with JeffZero. If you don't have the resources to do something well, don't do it at all. Easy for me to say, of course, since I didn't have much use for exploration in the first place.

Tbh the planets were just too empty. The different planets would have made more sense if you were not just driving to one of 3 or 4 locations. There could have been more action, especially of the kind that makes you leave the Mako at times. Mako combat was kind of ... meh. Yeah, even more than squad combat.

Modifié par AlexXIV, 16 février 2012 - 07:14 .

[withneelandi]

The thing is, that in ME1 the cut and paste locations can just about be explained by the fact that prefab buildings probably would be used in space exploration and there was a massive galaxy to explore, thats why its a minor irritation not a immersion breaking nightmare as in DA2.

I think its one of those things about computer games that makes you chuckle rather than any sort of major headache, rather than the utter confusion of why you were trudging round the same bloody cave that somehow existed under a city, on top of a nearby montain and on a nearby coastline. (but thats an other rant for another forum).

Modifié par withneelandi, 16 février 2012 - 07:18 .

[valkulon]

I like Turtles.

Proof: Turtles

Modifié par Valhart, 16 février 2012 - 07:19 .

[Gemini1179]

AlanC9 wrote...

I'm with JeffZero. If you don't have the resources to do something well, don't do it at all. Easy for me to say, of course, since I didn't have much use for exploration in the first place.

I hope you mentioned this on the DA2 forum because in this, I completely agree. Quality over Quantity every time for me please.

[Unit-Alpha]

Nope...
looking at ME3, it looks like ME2 might be the best in the series, especially considering the DLC.