374 réponses à ce sujet

[Sylixe]

ZeroMystic wrote...

Whether people like the dialog or not, has nothing to do with there being too much of it.

The only game that can be compared to this is Summoner and apparently no one here has played it. So until people in this thread saying DA:O is balanced, have played Summoner, then they need to stop making judgments and trying to use one sided false logical statements that they have no way of possibly knowing without having both sides of the argument.

As for this:

have you ever played Neverwinter Night?Baldur gates ?Mass Effect?Fallout 3?Oblivion?The Witcher? It's not a hack'n Slash or a beat em up tittle.

Bad example, I have played all of them and Fallout 3, Oblivion, & The Witcher are not hack and slash and nor are they story driven based RPG's. those are generic RPG's. Also there is no where near as much gabbing and or cinematics, and or cinematics being triggered in any of those 3.

Mass effect had way more playability in it than DA:O, and I have finished DA:O and I got more playability out of the 1st hour and a half of NWN than I did in the first half of DA:O

As I said go play Summoner and you will truely understand what a balanced story driven 3rd person single player party based RPG actually is.

You sir lost ALL credibility when you placed Summoner above The Witcher.  Go play the enhanced version that allowed them to escape the retarded rating system in this country.  That game stands head and shoulders above all pretenders in it's ability to immerse you in the game and give serious consequences to your choices.  Not to mention i wish their combat system could have been incorporated into DAO. 

/rant on
This brings up a good point about games in the US and our retarded rating system that doesn't allow any "Deviant" behavior but allows you to dismember people on command on screen without a blink.  Oh and the glorification of hardcore drug dealers and street gangs is such a great thing.  Is it any wonder why our youth is so animated toward violence but can't talk about their sexuality or anything sexual with adults?
/rant off

[addiction21]

ZeroMystic wrote...

My original statement still stands,

Whomever made the game is not relvant, the amount of dialog in this game does not balance off with playability so this game will not ever be an RPG because it does not have the proper elements in it in order for it to be an RPG.

RPG's are balanced, have an even amount of Dialog, story, and fighting all spread out evenly, and allow you freedom of choice.

DAO does not have any of those aspects in it.
It is way too log winded, the dialog is totally overloaded in the game preventing any real playability, you do not have freedom of choice because no matter how many options there are on the dialog screen, they all lead to the exact same thing in the end, and the outcome does not change regardless of what choice is made in the dialog, or how many of them you choose to go off of.

You cannot go really more than 3 min without triggering a cinematic in over 98% of this game.
You cannot skip things in this game you don't want to do because if you try the game makes you wind up doing them anyway. So there is no need at all for there to be the dialog option of saying i'm too busy if that doesn't matter and you still have to go do it anyway thuss proving my point about useless dialog being in the game.

Opinion, opinion, lie, opinion, over exaggeration, opinion, opinion, bs, bs fake numbers that are over exaggerated,  opinion etc etc etc...

[ZeroMystic]

I want to point out that people in here do not seem to get that 3/4 of the dialog in this game needs to be stripped out because it has no business being in here.

For example, if one of the dialog choices I have is that I am too busy, or that I do not want to do it, then i better be given the option of utilizing NOT doing it.

but instead you are given those options then never being allowed to use them...WHY?

Any reason anyone would like to try to come up with on why you cannot use it is not relevant.

If you cannot make use of a dialog option that is given to you, then it does not need to be in there.

Giving the option of saying i do not want to do this, then when you choose it, you are being told too bad you are doing it anyway, strips any form of freedom out of it, and that in turn kills any form of RPG elements, because RPG's are about being given options you can actually use, not being give options and then being told what to do regardless.

And the whole game is filled with these types of things, you cannot ever use/do 3/4 of the options you are given in the dialog.

Sorry but if I don't want to get my dog, I shouldn't have to be forced to go get it and then not be allowed to progress anywhere until I do.

if I am given the choice of getting my dog or not, then if I choose to not get him, then I should still be able to progress without him.

Presenting me with th option of getting my dog, then stripping the ability to chose, is retarded.

[addiction21]

Crawling_Chaos wrote...

addiction21 wrote...

ZeroMystic wrote...

My original statement still stands,

Whomeve blah blah blah blah blah at all for there to be the dialog option of saying i'm too busy if that doesn't matter and you still have to go do it anyway thuss proving my point about useless dialog being in the game.

Opinion, opinion, lie, opinion, over exaggeration, opinion, opinion, bs, bs fake numbers that are over exaggerated,  opinion etc etc etc...

[color=rgb(255,0,0)">This is NO ]LIE[/color]

www.youtube.com/watch

www.youtube.com/watch

is better

[Sylixe]

ZeroMystic wrote...

I want to point out that people in here do not seem to get that 3/4 of the dialog in this game needs to be stripped out because it has no business being in here.

For example, if one of the dialog choices I have is that I am too busy, or that I do not want to do it, then i better be given the option of utilizing NOT doing it.

but instead you are given those options then never being allowed to use them...WHY?

Any reason anyone would like to try to come up with on why you cannot use it is not relevant.

If you cannot make use of a dialog option that is given to you, then it does not need to be in there.

Giving the option of saying i do not want to do this, then when you choose it, you are being told too bad you are doing it anyway, strips any form of freedom out of it, and that in turn kills any form of RPG elements, because RPG's are about being given options you can actually use, not being give options and then being told what to do regardless.

And the whole game is filled with these types of things, you cannot ever use/do 3/4 of the options you are given in the dialog.

Sorry but if I don't want to get my dog, I shouldn't have to be forced to go get it and then not be allowed to progress anywhere until I do.

if I am given the choice of getting my dog or not, then if I choose to not get him, then I should still be able to progress without him.

Presenting me with th option of getting my dog, then stripping the ability to chose, is retarded.

True but if it is PART of the storyline than you have to circle back to it.  Think of a P&P game where your party is stuck in some place but they have no choice but to press forward.  It's not like they can just go off into the forrest and pick flowers for your RPG session.  I mean did you really gather around for the evening and decide .."Hey lets RPG picking flowers in a field" or did you get together to "Go kick the crap out of some monsters and solve some puzzles"?  If it's important for the plot of the story there is some things you are going to have to do.

If you really want that feeling of totally open world where you can do whatever you want than i suggest going and playing Oblivion.  I guarantee you will get bored quickly and be looking for some kind of plot and direction.  If you don't than this is just not the kind of game for you.

[ZeroMystic]

No one in this thread is seriously going to try to say that not being allowed to make use of dialog options that you are being given, by actually actually allowin you to execute the option you have chosen, has a point.

No one can seriously give any valid reason why you are being given dialog options that you cannot ever use because you are being forced to do one thing regardless if you try to go against it.

No one is going to and no one can say that giving the options to do mutiple things, then stripping the freedom of choice out of all of them except the one you are being told to do, is an RPG element.

[ZeroMystic]

Sylixe
DA:O has no plot direction, it's you do what BioWare has you doing, not doing what you wanted to.
From the very start of this game any and all freedom has been stripped out from under you.
You have absolutely nothing at all to say about how the games outcome is in the story because you have absolutely no freedom to do what you want so that you can actually change the story.
People here are trying to say that every choice you make affects the outcome, which is an outright blatant lie.
The dialog choices have already been set for you and those cannot be changed, nothing you do in the dialog changes anything that happens.
For example I cannot proceed without my dog. The only way to change the outcome of what happens is by allowing me to skip bringing my dog, that in turn changes everything, but the fact is that since you cannot skip getting your dog, you are therefore forced to do something even if you didn’t want to, thus changing nothing, and the same thing applies to everything in this game in the dialog.
if i do not want to do something that does not matter, I am going to forced to do the story only one way and no choice I make will or can ever change that, and that is because all your choices are already set.

Modifié par ZeroMystic, 26 novembre 2009 - 02:33 .

[Sylixe]

ZeroMystic wrote...

No one in this thread is seriously going to try to say that not being allowed to make use of dialog options that you are being given, by actually actually allowin you to execute the option you have chosen, has a point.

No one can seriously give any valid reason why you are being given dialog options that you cannot ever use because you are being forced to do one thing regardless if you try to go against it.

No one is going to and no one can say that giving the options to do mutiple things, then stripping the freedom of choice out of all of them except the one you are being told to do, is an RPG element.

You make it sound like every dialog option has dead ends in it.  That is certain not so and only happens in a handful of circumstances.  Even than some of them were made dead ends because of choices you made earlier.  I would agree though that if you made a choice earlier than that dialog later should not showup.

[EricHVela]

They built this game with the intention of replayability. Those dialogs are there to help players get the idea that they're missing out on something and need to play again in a different way to see it. It is a kind of teaser.

If one has never played these kinds of BW games, they may be in for a shock, but BW has a line of games with this exact style of story. It would be difficult to keep this story-based, choice-based game moving forward without these dialogs.

If the player is wanting a series of pre-defined, static missions and nothing more, then this game may not appeal to them well. If a player wants a story where they can affect the encounters through dialog, then this is likely what they're looking to find.

[Sylixe]

ZeroMystic wrote...

Sylixe
DA:O has no plot direction, it's you do what BioWare has you doing, not doing what you wanted to.
From the very start of this game any and all freedom has been stripped out from under you.
You have absolutely nothing at all to say about how the games outcome is in the story because you have absolutely no freedom to do what you want so that you can actually change the story.
People here are trying to say that every choice you make affects the outcome, which is an outright blatant lie.
The dialog choices have already been set for you and those cannot be changed, nothing you do in the dialog changes anything that happens.
For example I cannot proceed without my dog. The only way to change the outcome of what happens is by allowing me to skip bringing my dog, that in turn changes everything, but the fact is that since you cannot skip getting your dog, you are therefore forced to do something even if you didn’t want to, thus changing nothing, and the same thing applies to everything in this game in the dialog.
if i do not want to do something that does not matter, I am going to forced to do the story only one way and no choice I make will or can ever change that, and that is because all your choices are already set.

I think you are looking for something that is not there.  This game is NOT and opened ended RPG and they never said it was.  It is a STORY DRIVEN rpg.  There is a huge difference in the two and the way the game is played out for you. 

Bioware gives you all the tools you could need or want up front and allows you to interact and utilize them to your own end.  Bethesda gives you a game world with a blank slate and tells you basically do whatever you want and if you happen to find something along the way good for you.  Both have story and background but one is presenting it up front and the other is allowing you to unfold it at your own pace or no pace at all.

[Shinji Ex]

That's what I like BioWare games the dialog system an how people react to your response or how they answer your questions which you choose to ask

[addiction21]

Its not a fantasy life simulator.

Not even in Summoner can you decide to not destroy your home village or choose not to regain your summoneing powers and then continue your journey. Which if I remember correctly you have no choice about stopping *gasp* a evil emperor trying to conquer the world...



So by your own standards Summoner is not the great rpg you said it was.

[Spankinstein]

Duh...me like no talk in game...me get RPG.....did me say Duh yet?

[addiction21]

Spankinstein wrote...

Duh...me like no talk in game...me get RPG.....did me say Duh yet?

Said it twice...

[ZeroMystic]

this game is not an RPG, so people need to stop calling it something it's not,

RPG has fredom of choice in it's story line,

DA:O has stripped out all freedom to choose anything in the dialog. Even though the options are there, you are still not being allowed to use the ones you choose, unless it's a choice already programed in.

Modifié par ZeroMystic, 26 novembre 2009 - 02:55 .

[X ROMAN VI X]

It was fine on my first playthrough, listened to almost every piece of dialog. On my second play through I turned on subtitles, read them to see what was going on, then skipped the dialog.



Now that I'm my 3rd playthrough, I pretty much know what everyone is going to say so I skip all the dialog.

[ZeroMystic]

It was fine on my first playthrough, listened to almost every piece of dialog.

That brings me to this question:
Why even read it all, the only thing you need to know is what is said at the end, because that is all you are allowed to do anyway, nothing else in the dialog has any form of useful purpose due to the fact you cannot use anything in it unless it coincides with what is already pre-planed for you.
Seriously you do not need to sit through 5 min of dialog that doesn’t' allow you to use any option in it except for the one that is already pre-picked that is a complete waste of time and programming space, and all that could have been put to more freedom within the game.
Anyone who thinks this game has freedom in it needs to have their head examined

Modifié par ZeroMystic, 26 novembre 2009 - 03:03 .

[ZeroMystic]

Crawling_Chaos,



If there was any freedom then you would be able to execute any dialog choice that is in anyone's dialog, not be being shown the option then only being allowed to use the one that is pre-programed.

[Shinji Ex]

Crawling_Chaos wrote...

ZeroMystic wrote...

this game is not an RPG, so people need to stop calling it something it's not,

RPG has fredom of choice in it's story line,

DA:O has stripped out all freedom to choose anything in the dialog. Even though the options are there, you are still not being allowed to use the ones you choose, unless it's a choice already programed in.

:lol: