161 réponses à ce sujet

[Hybrid Boomer]

Surely the most obvious solution (without detracting from the 'random loot' - which, FYI, i'm not a massive fan of) is this: When you start, you start with ONE playable character from each class but YOU get to pick which 1 starting race/character to use.

I plan on whoring myself around and trying out all the different classes/races, but it would be at least nice to have the starting point be of my own free choosing if everything else is going to be utterly random. I don't mind having to sacrifice the chance of getting Assault Rifles, or Cryo Rounds so long as i know at least ONE part of the unlocking is within my control.

[Hybrid Boomer]

Just thought - speaking of those unlock boxes, why not set up boxes for each class. That way, if a Vanguard is your preference, you can buy the 'Vanguard Pack' which has random unlocks, but one's that will always be class-related?

Just wait until i get my hands on the Engineer packs. Damn fools won't know what hit 'em!

[staindgrey]

Have to wholeheartedly agree with the sentiment of this thread. Lost Planet 2 had a similar item-earning process, and all it served as was an artificial way of making you play the game longer. You want to play as an asari? Well good luck. You'll have to play as everything else first, multiple times, then maybe, if you're lucky, you can.

I've enjoyed the demo so far because I got an asari in only my second veteran pack. But I haven't gotten to try any other race since, and can't customize my asari at all because I never, ever get another upgrade for her. All I want is a purple skin tone, dammit, and that's going to take for.ev.er. in this setup.

I understand that there needs to be an appeal to continue playing, but the whole lottery aspect is the wrong way to do it. Give us either some semblance of choice (as mentioned, a "Vanguard Pack" or "Character Pack", etc.) or remove the lottery aspect altogether and give us objectives toward which to work (Unlock Salarian: Get 250 kills as an Engineer class, etc.).

The current setup is only going to agitate me to the point that I no longer want to work for all the races and classes. I'll just stick with what I've earned already, then get bored quicker. Counterproductive.

[We Tigers]

You know what the worst part of old SNES RPGs was?  Grinding to get a rare item drop.  I remember fighting Brachosaurs for 4 hours in Final Fantasy 3 to get an economizer.  It sucked. 

I like the multiplayer gameplay a lot, but this is indeed completely ridiculous.  Randomness or a defined path a la COD for the weapons is okay.  Randomness for classes/races?  Come on.  There is absolutely no reason not to have all races and classes available from the outset.  I just want to play a freaking Asari adept and I can't.  That's an iconic ME universe character!  It would even be acceptable to have races/classes actively unlockable instead of passively so.  How about instead of buying "packs" we just get to buy what we want?

Why am I paying $80 for a game on which I have to waste 6 hours just to even try playing as a Krogan?  And that's if I'm lucky.

[SunFlowrSamurai]

I love the random crates. It makes earning things a whole lot more exciting. I have the most fun when I'm trying out new things. Don't get so focused on certain items/classes. If you keep upgrading something you're not using, then start using it. It will probably be something pretty awesome once you work out a strategy the uses it properly Random crates make it more about building a good character for each class, rather than putting all your energy into heading towards what you think will be the best character/weapon combo.

[odi0n]

I love this system. Reminds me of booster packs for card collectible games:
Magic the gathering, or on iPad: Assassins Creed Recollections.

[AndanteInBlue]

Random crates really shouldn't give you something you can't use (i.e. a class you already unlocked). That's just mean and lazy of them. Some way of beelining to the unlocks you want would be great though, even if they cost more credits and/or takes multiple steps (maybe leveling one char to 20 = unlock one class of your choice?). I have a feeling they'll add the ability to unlock specific things for real cash; hopefully I'm just being cynical

[TruSkill]

In my opinion, people wouldn't have as much of a problem if the "upgrade" system was tweaked. I hear tons of complaints about people buying 5 veteran packs to only get upgrades for guns they don't use. The system would work better if once a rare weapon or class was unlocked, its upgraded forms show up in the standard pack instead of being considered rare themselves. That way, every time you bought a veteran crate, you would get something new, but could still get upgrades for the fancy guns and classes you unlock.

[TruSkill]

odi0n wrote...

I love this system. Reminds me of booster packs for card collectible games:
Magic the gathering, or on iPad: Assassins Creed Recollections.

AndanteInBlue wrote...

Random crates really shouldn't give
you something you can't use (i.e. a class you already unlocked).
That's just mean and lazy of them. Some way of beelining to the unlocks
you want would be great though, even if they cost more credits and/or
takes multiple steps (maybe leveling one char to 20 = unlock one class
of your choice?). I have a feeling they'll add the ability to unlock
specific things for real cash; hopefully I'm just being cynical

Reminds me of what they did to Need for Speed World.

[Xerxes52]

Other than just adding in a traditional store (which would be my first idea), the other solution I think would work would be to have the boxes weighted to unlock items that you currently are using (i.e. If you're a Soldier equipped with an AR and a Shotgun, you'd be more likely to unlock related weapons, class items, mods, etc).

[Bismth]

agreeing with the criticism of the ridiculous play for 88989 hours and hope the random selection gives you what race/class you'd love to play as, artificial incentive to play crap. it got old really quickly and is tedious and quickly became frustrating, at least let us choose our first character for ourselves, geez.

[Joe_8998]

starmine76 wrote...

I think everyone loves progression, but what Bioware needs to understand is that players have more fun when they are IN CONTROL of they're progression.

Take a look at Halo: Reach's armory system, for example. Players have more incentive to keep playing if they can actually see that piece of equipment they want to work toward, rather than some faceless "upgrade package".

In fact, this is a main tenet of consumerism in general. How many people would save up to buy a new TV from Best Buy if, upon arriving there, an employee just put their money on to a spinning chance wheel and gave them whatever it happened to land on?

This isn't how you get people addicted to your game, Bioware.

The comparison to the system in Halo: Reach is pretty apt. Many of the items in Reach required significant play time to achieve, but it certainly kept you motivated and it was definitely a lot of fun saving up for the one piece you could not wait to buy. You weren't ever handed anything, but there was always something to strive for (Inclement Weather, anyone?).  I cannot imagine the backlash if the armor pieces came in random boxes.

I am glad to see we have an open dialogue going about this. There are some pretty neat theoretical solutions and changes people are coming up with.

[incinerator950]

I didn't play Reach, not going to start why.

Space Marine had something similar, but not as descriptive. Took me less then a weak to unlock everything and max level. Most of the new shooters just extend the time it takes to do these, but that ends up being redundant if you flip the perspective around. The problem with unlocking via grinding pro-rate is that:

A) Easier to boost out a grind of a particular item, detracting the actual progression you recieve.

It's incredibly stale, predictable, and abusive.

The problem with the unlocks is that they can incredibly more powerful then the gear you start off.

Also, the sticky at the top practically states that these are not the only unlock packs we will be able to use. I'm not against the unlocks, and quite enjoy them. However, a lot of you seem to have your panties bunched up in not being catered too, so I'd say a good compromise to upgrade the system would be class and Weapon specific packs. Like it's assumed, Multiplayer is big, but this demo only has a fraction of it. I'd wait until the full game comes out, not complain that you're inconvenienced that you haven't unlocked your Super Guardian/Atlas killer Sniper or your stasis spamming Asari.

[Slayer299]

I agree with the OP about the randomness of the vet packs, so far out of all the ones I've bought the only char I've gotten as an unlock is the Female Vanguard which I was playing as when I got it. I was expecting to earn unlocks in the vet packs as it went along, not jus medigel, occasional ammo and a sniper scope.

[Estori]

Bismth wrote...

agreeing with the criticism of the ridiculous play for 88989 hours and hope the random selection gives you what race/class you'd love to play as, artificial incentive to play crap. it got old really quickly and is tedious and quickly became frustrating, at least let us choose our first character for ourselves, geez.

I couldn't agree more.

The biggest draw for the multi-player for me was being able to play as my favourite race in the Mass Effect Universe, which is Salarian. After sinking in about ~20 hours of playtime, I'm still mucking about with no Salarian and have the feeling I'm not going to be getting it anytime soon. Any "incentive" or motivation is beginning to wear thin. Weapons, Modifcations and Additional Customization Options etc, I have no problem with 'spinning the wheel' for. Being restricted to playing races whom I have no real aesthetic appeal towards or desire to play is what torches my tush.

Like Bismith said, having a free character / profession card of you choice would have been dandy.

[Plakmasta]

I don't mind the random, all i would like is a pack that has a good chance of getting a character. I spend so much trying to get them anyway so, saving up wouldnt be a problem. I want me a krogan soldier or asari adept.

[Knight_Quack]

Although I said in a previous post that I don't like the current system, I've since changed my opinion. This system encourages you to play as classes you've never played before. My favorite class is Infiltrator (Sniper rifles FTW), but seeing how initially I only had a FEMALE infiltrator, I started playing as a Human Adept and got the Krogan Soldier in my starter package. I love now the human adept and the krogan soldier, and I've would never had considered it if not for this system. In fact I would be pissed if I got a Drell in the full version instead of a Krogan/Turian, but well maybe I'll be surprised.

[Bearcavalryman]

definitely the worst part of the game, at first it was annoying, but after playing for several days and buying many random packs without getting what i wanted its extremely irritating, yeah the system may give me things i would not have considered, but im not able to get the things ive been really looking forward too, and that's just upsetting

[Yakko77]

Plakmasta wrote...

I don't mind the random, all i would like is a pack that has a good chance of getting a character. I spend so much trying to get them anyway so, saving up wouldnt be a problem. I want me a krogan soldier or asari adept.

Heh, I got the Krogan soldier on my second or third veteran pack oddly enough but I'm a big engineer player and have been looking to get the female human, Quarian or Salarian engineer for some time now.  Will keep trying!

[Medrex]

The random unlocks only get more frustrating and disapointing as you play more. I have played a LOT with my friends and about we've all gotten to the the point where we just don't have much hope for unlcoking the things we want because whenever we spend two bronze matches worth of credits on packs we almost never get anything good. It is beyond frustrating when I spend my hard earned credits and get yet another worthless mod for the SMG I never use, to say nothing of once more unlocking a class I've already unlocked all customization options to.

It's clearly a reward system designed to encourage and lengthen out online play like Call of Duty does with its weapon/mod unlocks but the fact is it's fundamentally flawed since it's a reward system that more often then not leaves you feeling unrewarded, annoyed or even cheated the longer you have to put up with it.

On the subject of unlocking class customisation it really just feels like lasy padding that you'd have to actually get the ability to fully customise a character from random drops but if that's going to be the case then at least make drawng a rare class from the pack more common once you've unlocked that class.

The one really good thing I can say about the random drops is that I ended up trying a class I likely would've given a pass on (Asari adept) but found i really liked once i started playing it. Whatever happiness I felt from that stroke of fortune however has been smothered up by the countless disapointments since then.

[Shinji Ex]

I have no idea how it works... which is a bad thing since I've been playing games for years

And never have I seen such an odd approach to getting weapons & items etc.

Unless... it's BioWare's attempt of an MMO random loot drop system?

[Drake-Shepard]

i like it.
otherwise 90% of player's who don't insist on vanguard would be asari adept's and krogan soldiers...and running around with widows.

But maybe i don;t mind 'cos i got a asari adept and widow lol

edit,

That said, there should be a 40k credit pack that guarantee's unlocking a rare character or weapon

Modifié par Drake-Shepard, 18 février 2012 - 05:11 .

[TK EL_]

The comparison to Halo Reach unlock system is completely brain dead. All the unlocks in Halo Reach are completely cosmetic and their novelty is quite short lived, especially since its an FPS and you don't get to see most of it without watching a theater video or doing an assassination. Please be helpful in your suggestions.

So far the most helpful suggestion I've seen here is to be able to sell back certain items to the store, albeit at a lower price. The trading system could also hold some merit, though some parameters would need to be put in place to prevent people using dummy accounts and such. Anyway, I'm sure all the data from the demo is being noted and considered and will be acted upon which is one of the reasons why I like Bioware

[starmine76]

Drake-Shepard wrote...

i like it.
otherwise 90% of player's who don't insist on vanguard would be asari adept's and krogan soldiers...and running around with widows.

But maybe i don;t mind 'cos i got a asari adept and widow lol

edit,

That said, there should be a 40k credit pack that guarantee's unlocking a rare character or weapon

But that's the whole point of RPG progression-you're supposed to specialize your character for a certain type of combat. The random upgrade system practically forces you to be a jack of all trades, which would be okay if it didn't work counterintuitive to the power progression system. 

If I want to be a Vangaurd tank/close range specialist with maxed out health and biotic charge, then yes, I deserve to be pissed off when I buy an upgrade package and receive an assault rifle scope rather than a better shotgun.

[Jarrett Lee]

Knight_Quack wrote...

Although I said in a previous post that I don't like the current system, I've since changed my opinion. This system encourages you to play as classes you've never played before. My favorite class is Infiltrator (Sniper rifles FTW), but seeing how initially I only had a FEMALE infiltrator, I started playing as a Human Adept and got the Krogan Soldier in my starter package. I love now the human adept and the krogan soldier, and I've would never had considered it if not for this system. In fact I would be pissed if I got a Drell in the full version instead of a Krogan/Turian, but well maybe I'll be surprised.

This is what I found too. I was convinced I'd only play vanguard, but then I unlocked the Salarian infiltrator - now I play that all the time.

What I can tell you is in the full game, things will be easier to get and more rewarding - I just can't get really specific about why