158 réponses à ce sujet

[CerberusSoldier]

darkblade wrote...

CerberusSoldier wrote...

darkblade wrote...

Unfallen_Satan wrote...

I think the unlock is meant to be fun and not really an expertise-reward system. I think it'd be great if BioWare added an expertise reward system for you to get specific characters or weapons or mods, but I take the co-op MP pretty casually and the current randomness is fun. I would never have tried the Vanguard class if I didn't get the something-300 shotgun and the Drell character. It turned out to be a great change of pace from my normal sniping engineer.

See and thats bad you should want to play vangaurd because of loading screen tootips talking about the class, or because you meet a good vangaurd player in game and see thier skills and weapons...not because you get a million pieces of junk and say screw it.

    



No you should play as the class you want to play and get the unlocks . I could care less if I play with a cool vanguard. while me and the rest of us who either have bad luck or are pissed because this system is complete and utter garbage .

You kinda missed the point. I wasnt talking about playing the class you want to, i was talking about motivation to try a different class. And how if the motivation to play a different class was because you were bored of getting stupid unlocks the system is flawed whereas if you are trying something new because something in the game spurred you interest that is good.

  


I'm not playing this MP because I want to try new classes . I am plying this to play as a krogan or Turian and Asari . I want to play as the aliens but the stupid god awful ulock system is preventing that . I could care less if weapons and other things were in random packs  but they need to take the characters out of that . thats all I want . I want to play this MP and roll as a alien not some poor man's version of Commander Shepard . If I want to play as human I will play SP .

[Techlology]

WizenSlinky0 wrote...

Not that it matters but I would totally not play a multiplayer designed like that. I absolutely hate, and I can't stress this enough, hate being unable to get certain things I want because the game deems me not good enough at some random arbitrary task that is supposed to "define" its use.

This. "Assignments" completely ruin MP games for me.

[Isaidlunch]

G3rman wrote...

People just don't have any patience these days..need to be handfed all the time.

Just because we don't like playing Casino: Mass Effect edition doesn't mean we want to be handfed. I would be completely satisfied grinding 200 000 credits (or even more...) if I knew I would get the reward I want.

Modifié par Kazanth, 19 février 2012 - 06:50 .

[MythicLegands]

If Bioware doesn't fix it or make it redeemable the MP is going to die fast.

[AlphaJarmel]

Deltateam Elcor wrote...

People that are moaning didn't get anything worthwhile, though of course EVERYONE has the same probabilities of getting certain items, so its fair in sense of arithmetic.

It is however boring as hell grinding away on one item for days on end, missing out on other perhaps more useful items that i have stored away. People want their games to be so linear and unadventurous nowadays, im surprised developers don't just admit themselves to an insane asylum.

I can't believe people think like this.  Nobody cares if there is a sense of randomness to the whole process, the problem is the extent of the randomness.  The sysem was designed around somebody with a gambling addiction.  I seriously do not want to level up my random AR for the tenth time when I NEVER use one.  It's an idiotic system.

[Sidney]

Xerxes52 wrote...

Not a fan of the system either. While it may be too difficult to create a more traditional store as an alternative, one solution I think would work would be to include packs that are tailored to specific classes, weapon types, etc.

That or possibly the current boxes could be coded to more likely unlock stuff for the weapons, classes, etc that the player is currently using (i.e. If you are equipped with an AR, you'll be more likely to get ARs, AR mods, and higher-level versions of your current AR).

I just want something like Veteran AR Set, Recruit Shotgun Set....anything that lets me tailor it a bit more to my desires. I'm fine with a bit o' the random in there but the whole thing can't be a crap shoot.

[MrGPhantome]

Level system is fine. You play, you get XP, you level up. I don't think there is an issue there.

The current way of getting new characters, items and upgrades is a total joke though.

I'm hopeful that purchasing packs and getting random stuff isn't going to be the real way to progress your equipment in the game. It seems like a lazy "beta" process.

Also, I don't grinding through "skill challenges" to unlock stuff. It's totally obnoxious and doesn't actually go into creating skillful players. Skill is a reward in itself after all.

I say, make all characters unlocked, and make all weapons purchasable though in game currency. It doesn't have to be sporadic by adding in random box-o-stuff or complicated like "get 50 head shots."

Those are just dirty lame tricks to get people to play longer. Longevity of a game should be valued by gameplay not un-lockables.

[CerberusSoldier]

 

MrGPhantome wrote...

Level system is fine. You play, you get XP, you level up. I don't think there is an issue there.

The current way of getting new characters, items and upgrades is a total joke though.

I'm hopeful that purchasing packs and getting random stuff isn't going to be the real way to progress your equipment in the game. It seems like a lazy "beta" process.

Also, I don't grinding through "skill challenges" to unlock stuff. It's totally obnoxious and doesn't actually go into creating skillful players. Skill is a reward in itself after all.

I say, make all characters unlocked, and make all weapons purchasable though in game currency. It doesn't have to be sporadic by adding in random box-o-stuff or complicated like "get 50 head shots."

Those are just dirty lame tricks to get people to play longer. Longevity of a game should be valued by gameplay not un-lockables.

  



You get nothing for the XP all that does its raise your level but thats it . Oh money please so we can use it to play craps as if we were in Las Vegas or something it sucks . As far as pigeon holeing gamers . the numbers speak people love Call of Duty's unlock system . Its the standard as how unlocks are done in MP in all games . if they can't see its messed up well then it really was slapped on for no reason at all

[marshalleck]

CerberusSoldier wrote...
 As far as pigeon holeing gamers . the numbers speak people love Call of Duty's unlock system .

Do they? Or do they play it because it's "the standard" and that's all they're given?


Gotta love how "too random" turns into "this will kill the game!" Thread reminds me of this: 
 

Modifié par marshalleck, 19 février 2012 - 11:22 .

[WidowMaker9394]

I have mainly played as an Infiltrator and as a Soldier. I'm still sniping with my Mantis. Because out of the ten Veteran packs and the dozens of Recruit packs I've bought I haven't unlocked A SINGLE SNIPER RIFLE OR EVEN A DAMN MOD WTF.

My damn Carnifex is a better sniper than the Mantis!

The only good stuff I've unlocked is a Krogan Soldier and a Revenant.

[Darkov]

Jarrett Lee wrote...

I can see why it might not be everyone's cup of tea (I personally love it, and really enjoy the surprise of opening a good pack...).  That said: it's not really going to change other than the fact that your chance to unlock cool stuff will be quite a bit better in the full game. The demo is just a portion of it. Also, really the fun part is playing the actual matches themselves

We'll hold you to this one....

[Roros5e]

I liked it in Lost Planet 2, and I like it here. I have more fun chasing the unlocks I want rather than having them, and I get excited if I get a rocket launcher or medigel.

[darkblade]

I liked it in Lost Planet 2, and I like it here. I have more fun chasing the unlocks I want rather than having them, and I get excited if I get a rocket launcher or medigel.

See but with LP2 its starts to cost more as you unlock because you cant get the same thing over and over again, eventually you start getting good stuff because youve unlocked the other stuff. With ME2 you can unlock human male vanguard, then buy the next package and get human male vanguard.

Also, I don't grinding through "skill challenges" to unlock stuff. It's totally obnoxious and doesn't actually go into creating skillful players. Skill is a reward in itself after all.

Skill isnt a reward, its a means to get to a reward unless ones ambition is so low that they are merely satisfied by the belief they hold a certain lvl of skill. Never really proving it, or flexing it of attempting to push it to the next level. Once you are good enough to beat a gold there is nothing left no improvement to be made no challenge to be had. Unless they are constantly adding new content at the pace of something every month, with regular in game event calenders like what Epic does, the game will quickly fall in players as they realize that level and skill has nothing to do with the quality of gear they obtain.



Having to do something like that before you use a weapon youve unlocked gives a player time in a controlled environment to understand a weapon and get use to its mechanics so that when they employ it in an actual match they are a liability because of a weapon they dont know how to use.

Brinks Challenge system is freaking perfect for this game, perfect having alternative scenario's with varying lvl's of challenge add more actually longevity to the multiplayer and give you less high risk areas to hone and push your skills.

Not that it matters but I would totally not play a multiplayer designed like that. I absolutely hate, and I can't stress this enough, hate being unable to get certain things I want because the game deems me not good enough at some random arbitrary task that is supposed to "define" its use.

Well im sorry that you feel that way, because in fact the game doesn't deem you not good enough..you just in actuality aren't good enough. Thus dont deserve the reward, the game doesnt have to tell you this or enforce it, its apparent when you cant complete a task given to you. Which is why you strive to get better.
You might not like to earn you rewards but many people do. There are no earnings in ME3 anyone with anything good are simply lucky/play the game to much, id hate to say that but with this system that will become the newest thing to say on ME3 multiplayer.

I can see it now.

Player 1: Man That guy is racking up points.
Player 2: Only cause he has a freaking revenant with really good upgrades.
Damn really? he must be pretty good.
Player 3: LOL, you must be new to ME multi, he's probably not good just plays the game all day and dumps cash into the lotto system till he lucks out and gets good gear.

complicated like "get 50 head shots"

Thats complicated? quality of gamers has really fallen and im worried about it. Gears has harder challenges then this and you dont dont get anything for it other then a name tag, character skin, or special weapon colors. Yet it is one of the best elements of thier multiplayer because it gives one a goal to work towards that people know took either a considerable amount of time or skill to achieve.

Modifié par darkblade, 19 février 2012 - 05:15 .

[marshalleck]

As opposed to spending all day racking up 150 headshots. Please.

[darkblade]

marshalleck wrote...

As opposed to spending all day racking up 150 headshots. Please.

If thats what you want do, sure. But anyone who wants to keep thier sanity usually goes about these challenges in a passive way. You are aware that you need X amount of head shots so whenever the chance for some shows up you try and take them, even if you only get 1 head shot a game youve still made progress towards something you know you will get.

in short I'd rather grind 150 headshots then struggle through gold missions to rack up enough cred to spam on vet packs which may or may not yield jack that applies to me.

[glacier1701]

 I dont think that the system is that bad. I do think races should be purchaseable rather than random but everything else is fine. I suspect that what we see in the demo is a deliberate choice by BioWare that fits in with the context of the war going on. I would think that the galactic nature of the war means that logistics are really screwed up and that supplies are just going to be hard to find. Thus this part being random is fine as it reflects the fact that you can never be sure that the supplies you get/find are what you want after all the freighter with the stuff you want could have been intercepted and destroyed before reaching you.

However the race randomness is NOT fine and should be a purchase option. While again the nature of the war means no guarantee of the troops you can get players DO want to play certain classes/races. Making this random means that it will be a chore to get the race you want IF you are unlucky. Having played the game enough to reach the mid 50's in level I STILL have 50% of the races locked. While I am not THAT bothered by this I can see WHY players are so frustrated by this. It can happen that a player ends up without the race they want even when they have capped out MOST of their classes. That is why there SHOULD be a change made that appears DAY 1 of launch that allows players to buy races (even if it becomes increasingly expensive to buy each one) while leaving the rest as random packs.

[Ricvenart]

darkblade wrote...

I liked it in Lost Planet 2, and I like it here. I have more fun chasing the unlocks I want rather than having them, and I get excited if I get a rocket launcher or medigel.

See but with LP2 its starts to cost more as you unlock because you cant get the same thing over and over again, eventually you start getting good stuff because youve unlocked the other stuff. With ME2 you can unlock human male vanguard, then buy the next package and get human male vanguard.

Not going to reply to the whole thing but Dev's have addressed this 500 times over, it's simply not true, you do get more unlocks for it, be it an upgrade or new looks. And surely in that case it's actually better then LP2 as the cost remains the same, whether it's something you want or just filling up you're collection increasing the chance of getting what you want.
No matter how many times you people say it, it will never become true (unless the dev's patch it out of spite).

Most of the complaints on the MP solely seemed to be based on misinformation, misunderstanding and things not going thier way.

Skyrim is the worst level up system but thats nothing to do with random rewards or random shop stock. At least if they had a bit of ME3 in it, you'd be capable of upgrading leveled rewards and not get 500 iron swords.

Modifié par Ricvenart, 19 février 2012 - 06:16 .

[The Harmonizer]

I have limited time to play, therefore i'd like to know WHAT to do, and HOW to do it. By having a system of randomness, i really can't be bothered to play it at all, cause i might unlock the same thing i unlocked the last time....

If at least the system took into account what you allready unlocked, and tried to give you stuff you havnt unlocked so much of yet, i would be satisfied. The current system is just plain bad implementation...

[G3rman]

The Harmonizer wrote...

I have limited time to play, therefore i'd like to know WHAT to do, and HOW to do it. By having a system of randomness, i really can't be bothered to play it at all, cause i might unlock the same thing i unlocked the last time....

If at least the system took into account what you allready unlocked, and tried to give you stuff you havnt unlocked so much of yet, i would be satisfied. The current system is just plain bad implementation...

What have you possibly unlocked twice?

Everything has a purpose in which you unlock it, you can't do it twice.  Weapons get upgrades, consumables are always needed, characters get customization and exp or get unlocked.

[Hunter-Wolf]

SunFlowrSamurai wrote...

I love the unlock system. It's a whole lot more exciting than grinding towards the items you want. People get too fixated on getting that one certain character or weapon they want. Random unlocks force you to improve all your classes and try new combos.

Seconded .. i really loved the random unlocks system .. it is like openeing a birthday prize everytime ..also the disposable items lessen the dissapointment if you get something you didn't really want .. also .. a good incnetive to improve your skills .. play on harder diffculty to get more cash and score more medals (assists, melee, headshots, grabs, .. etc).

Keep it the same way Bioware

[Sidney]

G3rman wrote...

The Harmonizer wrote...

I have limited time to play, therefore i'd like to know WHAT to do, and HOW to do it. By having a system of randomness, i really can't be bothered to play it at all, cause i might unlock the same thing i unlocked the last time....

If at least the system took into account what you allready unlocked, and tried to give you stuff you havnt unlocked so much of yet, i would be satisfied. The current system is just plain bad implementation...

What have you possibly unlocked twice?

Everything has a purpose in which you unlock it, you can't do it twice.  Weapons get upgrades, consumables are always needed, characters get customization and exp or get unlocked.

You can unlock twice - same guns and upgrades for example and that "levels" those elements up - Aveneger V for example.

[RiouHotaru]

I rather like the system. Unlocks SEEM limited because (as the devs have said) we're only seeing half the unlocks. Once we've got the full experience I'm sure we'd see more races, more weapons, more upgrades, etc, etc. To put it in perspective:

For each class there's only 1 Human and one 1 alien unlock, making a total of 14 characters. Normally it's 2 humans and 2 humans, which is a whopping 35 characters, well over double what we can normally get.

Weapons are the same. I'm pretty sure any weapon that isn't DLC will be in the full release. Right now we've only got 3 weapons per type. We know for a fact there's 5 or more weapons per type, which is 15 vs. 25+ respectively.

[RonnyB]

I like the unlock system as well. Gives you incentive to keep playing hoping for something good. I think you'd get bored really quick if you just went for the unlocks you want.

[Hunter-Wolf]

The Harmonizer wrote...


If at least the system took into account what you allready unlocked, and tried to give you stuff you havnt unlocked so much of yet, i would be satisfied..

Ahm .. it does just that .. everything you unlocked is taken into account .. if you unlock a shotgun twice it gets upgraded, if you unlock a mod twice it gets upgraded, if you unlock a character/class twice it gets more customization options and/or tons of XP for that specific class .. you (like many others) simply weren't paying enough attention to what the unlocks actually do .. that's the real problem not the system which is jsut fine and a fresh idea XD

RonnyB wrote...

I like the unlock system as well. Gives
you incentive to keep playing hoping for something good. I think you'd
get bored really quick if you just went for the unlocks you
want.

Sometimes you get bored even quicker if you can get them too easily .. they lose a lot of their value ... also the typical grinding through tons of stuff you don't like to reach a certain item that's 10 levels away (like in BF3) has its share of flaws and gets boring very quickly .. it makes obttaining all the weapons in between pointless and you never use them .. at least ME randomness givs you something you are gonig to use (as you can use any waepon with any class) or give you consumables and tons of XP for a certain class (+unlocks and custmizations) .. i like it way better than items unlocks model in BF3.

Modifié par Hunter-Wolf, 19 février 2012 - 06:55 .

[darkblade]

Ricvenart wrote...

darkblade wrote...

I liked it in Lost Planet 2, and I like it here. I have more fun chasing the unlocks I want rather than having them, and I get excited if I get a rocket launcher or medigel.

See but with LP2 its starts to cost more as you unlock because you cant get the same thing over and over again, eventually you start getting good stuff because youve unlocked the other stuff. With ME2 you can unlock human male vanguard, then buy the next package and get human male vanguard.

Not going to reply to the whole thing but Dev's have addressed this 500 times over, it's simply not true, you do get more unlocks for it, be it an upgrade or new looks. And surely in that case it's actually better then LP2 as the cost remains the same, whether it's something you want or just filling up you're collection increasing the chance of getting what you want.
No matter how many times you people say it, it will never become true (unless the dev's patch it out of spite).

Most of the complaints on the MP solely seemed to be based on misinformation, misunderstanding and things not going thier way.

Skyrim is the worst level up system but thats nothing to do with random rewards or random shop stock. At least if they had a bit of ME3 in it, you'd be capable of upgrading leveled rewards and not get 500 iron swords.

your point is moot.

There is no misunderstanding and i have read what the devs have said. We all know there will be more unlocks this is only a demo, .depending on what weapons you use the extra content may or may not decrease your chances of getting what you seek.

And my largest concern is that its completely unituitive, and requires minimal amounts of effort from the player. I dont want to play a multiplayer RPG experience where what i use isnt anywhere near up to me.

Also you want to talk about misinformation.......wow your skyrim example is aweful. Skyrim is a sand Box RPG, you seek out an find good weapons. NPC enemies unless they are some boss arent going to be wielding super demon swords of doom. Every elder scrolls haves been like that. only difference is that in older games you could enchant.

You can like it, thats fine just dont try to rationalize and justify it. im stating whats wrong with it. Every unlocked based game has flaws in the system but the random lotto type is and always will be the least intuitive and player involved.  quick frankly if my effort to get rewards is reflected in the rewards i get i have no reason to strive to do the best i can in the game, just to play and occasionally buy a box or two. This system is like having the two super bowl playing teams play out the whole game then flip a coin for who goes home with the trophy. Im really not for that, pretty much the laziest reward system imaginable and i dont apprieciate lazy design in products i spend money on.

I'll still play it just dont expect particularly good performance from me, since my performance has no impact on the quality of my reward.

Modifié par darkblade, 19 février 2012 - 08:36 .