I'm going to make a human R/B DW warrior, can someone give me some tips on attributes I should distribute and pump? Some help with skills/talents would be nice too. And whats the weapons/armor I should look for and if you know where that be nice too. Thanks for the help.
DW Reaver/berserker warrior build.
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Endgame13
, nov. 24 2009 07:16
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#2
Posté 24 novembre 2009 - 07:22
Endgame13
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Also has anyone tryed this build before? Did you like it? Did it kick ass? Thanks.
#3
Posté 24 novembre 2009 - 07:26
Zenthar Aseth
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Yes, it is good. Berserker is a bit annoying, though, because Berserk has such a long animation and you have to turn it on at the beginning of every fight..
You should have about 1:1 STR/DEX until you reach 36 dex.. then you mainly pump STR. Const @ about 20.
Momentum is the most important talent, go for it as quick as you can.
You should have about 1:1 STR/DEX until you reach 36 dex.. then you mainly pump STR. Const @ about 20.
Momentum is the most important talent, go for it as quick as you can.
#4
Posté 24 novembre 2009 - 07:30
GlassRain
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I tried it and hated it. My first toon was this build and it was unimpressive. Reaver really isn't that fantastic. My plan was to build a toon with 100% spirit resist but it seems friendly fire damage resist is bugged so you still take the damage from the aura.
I enjoy Templar/Berserker far more.
I enjoy Templar/Berserker far more.
#5
Posté 24 novembre 2009 - 08:13
DragoonKain3
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A min/maxed DW berserker/reaver for dps either goes...
1) pure DEX, and dual wields daggers. Offers much higher defense and slightly more DPS (higher attack speed benefits more your +x damage static bonuses), but you'll be running in total -0.5 health per tick and -2 stamina per tick with all sustains on.
2) Dex until 24 (the rest of the dual wield line doesn't offer much), then the rest in STR. Using Veshiale/Rose of Thorns and Wade's Superior dragonscale armor set + Andruil's Blessing + Lifegiver, only runs -0.5 health per tick. Meaning while this build runs slightly lesser DPS, this can run their sustains indefinitely.
If you want, you can up your DEX to 28 for another CC ability, or to 30 for another AoE ability, for a slight trade in DPS (around 2.25 per hit, which when you hit every 1.2 secs, is bigger than you'd think). But dualing two big weapons isn't worth the trade off, when most of your damage comes from momentum and your static bonuses.
In both cases, you just turn on Berserk/Frenzy/Dual Striking/Momentum, and go to town with them. They're better on your DPS than your activated abilites, which you should only use when surrounded or in need of CC.
As such, you should beeline for Momentum first. If you have CE of the game, then you can get it as early as lvl 2. If not, plan for it for lvl 3, so your initial talents should be dual weapon sweep (commoner origin), dual weapon training, dual weapon finesse, and just pump your DEX nonstop til you qualify for momentum.
1) pure DEX, and dual wields daggers. Offers much higher defense and slightly more DPS (higher attack speed benefits more your +x damage static bonuses), but you'll be running in total -0.5 health per tick and -2 stamina per tick with all sustains on.
2) Dex until 24 (the rest of the dual wield line doesn't offer much), then the rest in STR. Using Veshiale/Rose of Thorns and Wade's Superior dragonscale armor set + Andruil's Blessing + Lifegiver, only runs -0.5 health per tick. Meaning while this build runs slightly lesser DPS, this can run their sustains indefinitely.
If you want, you can up your DEX to 28 for another CC ability, or to 30 for another AoE ability, for a slight trade in DPS (around 2.25 per hit, which when you hit every 1.2 secs, is bigger than you'd think). But dualing two big weapons isn't worth the trade off, when most of your damage comes from momentum and your static bonuses.
In both cases, you just turn on Berserk/Frenzy/Dual Striking/Momentum, and go to town with them. They're better on your DPS than your activated abilites, which you should only use when surrounded or in need of CC.
As such, you should beeline for Momentum first. If you have CE of the game, then you can get it as early as lvl 2. If not, plan for it for lvl 3, so your initial talents should be dual weapon sweep (commoner origin), dual weapon training, dual weapon finesse, and just pump your DEX nonstop til you qualify for momentum.
#6
Posté 24 novembre 2009 - 10:27
JJM152
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Don't dual wield daggers, you will massively gimp your whirlwind/dual weapon sweep damage, especially if you don't have the dexterity mod fix, plus the low base damage isn't offset by the armor penetration stat on the dagger without a decent amount of cunning, which as a warrior, you should never put a single point into 
If you do the mage tower quest first and get the stat bonuses in there, then by level 10 or 11 you should be easily able to obtain 36 STR/DEX. Purchase dual wield mastery and then get a pair of dragonbone waraxes as soon as possible (or other hard hitting weapons).
Do not build your warrior like a rogue. It will seriously gimp you. Warriors do not do "DPS" they either tank or do burst damage.
Also, I would not take Reaver - I would take Champion instead. The buffs/knock down are far better than the tiny damage increase from Reaver.
Finally, "DPS" is a joke. There are a hand full of encounters where you will have the luxury of an enemy that just sits there and lets you wail on them for a minute or two. The rest of the time it's all about moving around as fast as possible and getting as much damage out as quickly as possible.
When at level 10 you can hit a stack of enemies for over 200 pts of damage each with a dual weapon sweep/whirlwind in about 3 seconds, "DPS" becomes a moot point because anything still standing will have a sliver of life left
If you do the mage tower quest first and get the stat bonuses in there, then by level 10 or 11 you should be easily able to obtain 36 STR/DEX. Purchase dual wield mastery and then get a pair of dragonbone waraxes as soon as possible (or other hard hitting weapons).
Do not build your warrior like a rogue. It will seriously gimp you. Warriors do not do "DPS" they either tank or do burst damage.
Also, I would not take Reaver - I would take Champion instead. The buffs/knock down are far better than the tiny damage increase from Reaver.
Finally, "DPS" is a joke. There are a hand full of encounters where you will have the luxury of an enemy that just sits there and lets you wail on them for a minute or two. The rest of the time it's all about moving around as fast as possible and getting as much damage out as quickly as possible.
When at level 10 you can hit a stack of enemies for over 200 pts of damage each with a dual weapon sweep/whirlwind in about 3 seconds, "DPS" becomes a moot point because anything still standing will have a sliver of life left
#7
Posté 25 novembre 2009 - 01:53
RamsenC
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"Warriors do not do "DPS" they either tank or do burst damage."
I have to disagree with that, warriors do the most single target dps in the game without having to be behind your opponent. On top of that a dex based DW warrior can tank very well. I am referring to nightmare btw.
I have to disagree with that, warriors do the most single target dps in the game without having to be behind your opponent. On top of that a dex based DW warrior can tank very well. I am referring to nightmare btw.
#8
Posté 25 novembre 2009 - 02:14
JJM152
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RamsenC wrote...
"Warriors do not do "DPS" they either tank or do burst damage."
I have to disagree with that, warriors do the most single target dps in the game without having to be behind your opponent. On top of that a dex based DW warrior can tank very well. I am referring to nightmare btw.
My point is I suppose that while you can do sustained DPS with a warrior, it's pointless to specialize in it because doing so undermines your primary strengths. If you are a two handed warrior you want to focus on huge two weapon sweeps and one shotting stuff with critical strike. If you are a dual wield warrior you want to focus on frontloading heaps of damage with aoe attacks.
The fixation with "DPS" in this forum is frankly, quite bizzare. Long term damage output only matters when an enemy has more health than you can burst out with your specials before stamina is depleted or they are all on cool down.
This should be blindingly obvious to people. If it takes you 3 or 4 seconds with "massive dps" to take down one target, then the time it takes you to finish an encounter is multiplied by the number of targets you have to take down. If you use area attacks or instant burst attacks this becomes a moot point because unlike single target builds where your effacy goes down as there are more enemies, your effectiveness actually goes up if there are more enemies.
I understand the nerdy allure of theorycraft (I crunched it for years myself before I gave up WoW), but it's practically pointless in this game due to the style of encounters. Very few enemies present you with the opportunity for any high DPS build to shine. You're far better off focusing on Crowd Control abilities and AOE burst damage - why does everyone think mages kick so much booty, they are the best at both!
#9
Posté 25 novembre 2009 - 02:32
RamsenC
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DW has garbage crowd control, thats what mages are for. DW warriors should be built to tank and kill whatever they are facing. Weapon sweep and whirlwind are not that good, have long cooldowns and very short range. Building a warrior around those abilities is a bad idea. I would not say this is a warriors primary strength at all.
On top of that the time it takes to round enemies up for you to use the small AoE DW abilities is wasted time.
On top of that the time it takes to round enemies up for you to use the small AoE DW abilities is wasted time.
#10
Posté 25 novembre 2009 - 02:44
JJM152
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RamsenC wrote...
DW has garbage crowd control, thats what mages are for. DW warriors should be built to tank and kill whatever they are facing. Weapon sweep and whirlwind are not that good, have long cooldowns and very short range. Building a warrior around those abilities is a bad idea. I would not say this is a warriors primary strength at all.
On top of that the time it takes to round enemies up for you to use the small AoE DW abilities is wasted time.
All warriors have CC through their class line. Taunt and Disengage for starters. All warrior lines also have single target stuns and knock downs, some better than other. 2 of the lines have AoE attacks, the remaining line focusing more on CC.
The Champion specialization has a great CC ability. Two handed has a combination AoE + Knock Down.
These are the warriors class abilities, now it seems to me that this very clearly states what the developers intended for the warrior role. Maybe you feel their implementation is lacking, fair enough that's your opinion, but I do not. Heck, to me, the fact that you instantly dismiss dual weapon sweep and whirlwind shows a real lack of understanding of how to play the game effectively. A whirlwind from oghren and a two handed sweep from Sten can clear 5 to 6 guys out immediately. I don't understand how you can possibly think that is bad. In the dual weapon tree, dual weapon sweep is actually on a relatively fast cool down and while it's a shallow cone effect, it's still more than sufficient to stack guys 2 deep and within a 180 degree angle of your orientation.
Really, I don't know what more to say... I think the "DPS" culture fixation in this forum has warped people's perspective on the gameplay mechanics of DA:O. Enemies for the most part do not have more health than can be eliminated with a couple of AoE attacks. Certainly you may have to use 2 characters (two warriors, warrior + mage), but how is it not obvious to people that dropping a half dozen guys in a couple of seconds is vastly superior to dropping half a dozen guys in 20 seconds?
Single target DPS is terribly terribly unimportant in this game.
#11
Posté 25 novembre 2009 - 03:46
Jormungand3r
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single target dps is an mmo staple and like it or not wow has dominated pc gaming for the past 3 years. in this game i personally want as much multi target dps as possible since the difficulty in the fights usually comes from the sheer numbers. The boss fighs is where single target dps shines but even then the bosses have enough knockbacks, stuns and grabs and adds that i cannot just camp my dual wield rogue behind a boss and just backstab for the entire fight.
#12
Posté 25 novembre 2009 - 03:58
RamsenC
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I would agree with you if whirlwind didn't have a 40 second cooldown. On top of that dual weapon sweep isn't exactly one shotting enemies in nightmare. I DO use dual weapon sweep when I can, but I'm never impressed.
Just wanted to add, I'm not reffering to 2h warriors, I acually think they are the burst damage warrior class and should be used as such, but not dw.
edit: I don't play MMOs, I find them boring
Just wanted to add, I'm not reffering to 2h warriors, I acually think they are the burst damage warrior class and should be used as such, but not dw.
edit: I don't play MMOs, I find them boring
Modifié par RamsenC, 25 novembre 2009 - 04:07 .
#13
Posté 25 novembre 2009 - 04:05
JJM152
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Jormungand3r wrote...
single target dps is an mmo staple and like it or not wow has dominated pc gaming for the past 3 years. in this game i personally want as much multi target dps as possible since the difficulty in the fights usually comes from the sheer numbers. The boss fighs is where single target dps shines but even then the bosses have enough knockbacks, stuns and grabs and adds that i cannot just camp my dual wield rogue behind a boss and just backstab for the entire fight.
This is my point entirely
95% of the game content revolves around AOE damage and CC, with the remaining 5% of the battles seriously favoring ranged DPS due to their ability to stay out of the area of the bosses own CC.
Even the guys here whos only exposure to RPG type games comes from things like World of Warcraft should be able to realize that DA:O plays more like PVP than it does a Raid. Think of the difference between a Pre Burning Crusade Arms spec warrior and a Fury spec warrior.
#14
Posté 25 novembre 2009 - 04:11
JJM152
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RamsenC wrote...
I would agree with you if whirlwind didn't have a 40 second cooldown. On top of that dual weapon sweep isn't exactly one shotting enemies in nightmare. I DO use dual weapon sweep when I can, but I'm never impressed.
Just wanted to add, I'm not reffering to 2h warriors, I acually think they are the burst damage warrior class and should be used as such, but not dw.
edit: I don't play MMOs, I find them boring
None of these attacks will one shot an enemy on nightmare, that's not the point. The idea here is just to stack AOE attacks from your team as much as possible and the major benefit here for melee classes is that their aoe sweeps and such ignore friendly fire.
#16
Posté 25 novembre 2009 - 04:21
RamsenC
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The issue I have with that is you are going against the DW warriors greatest strength. With your tactic 2h warrior is better.
#17
Posté 25 novembre 2009 - 04:24
JJM152
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RamsenC wrote...
The issue I have with that is you are going against the DW warriors greatest strength. With your tactic 2h warrior is better.
Dual wield warriors actually have more AoE attacks on a faster cool down...
Look, you don't have to play the game the way I play it, that's fine. It's just single target DPS is not a strength in this game at all, except as has been pointed out, in a very small minority of the game content.
#18
Posté 25 novembre 2009 - 04:52
RamsenC
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Alt-tabbing dragon age once in awhile to check this thread is a downer 
I'll just say this, with a three mage party AoE is completely taken care of (which is what i am running). Having a single target monster that can tank is actually very nice in this case.
Now if you were running a mageless group or even one mage, I'll concede that you are probably right.
I'll just say this, with a three mage party AoE is completely taken care of (which is what i am running). Having a single target monster that can tank is actually very nice in this case.
Now if you were running a mageless group or even one mage, I'll concede that you are probably right.
#19
Posté 25 novembre 2009 - 08:50
GlassRain
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Maybe I'm the only one that never uses AoE spells on my mages? I hate friendly fire and am strictly single target, healing or control spells.
Dual wield has decent AoE but it's not going to slay anything in a single shot. Two-handed also has the same ability but its version knocks everything back on its arse which I find to be incredibly useful. DW has a second frontal cone attack but its not going to win any awards since 2-handed has indomitable which means zero interruptions in damage output. 2handed also has stunning attacks and sundering strikes that make up where it falls short.
My current play through is a templar/berserker dwarf with 90% spell resist 2handed. He is frankly.. unstoppable. Sure my dual wielder killed alot faster but when I encountered any sort of stun or knockdown I was pretty much boned. The ability to knock back several targets with 2handed sweep or smite is absolutely god sent as well when you need a break for heals to land. Also allows your mages time to drop blood wound or mass paralyze.
In closing, all the weapon styles have benefits to them.. the trick is finding the style that suits you.
Dual wield has decent AoE but it's not going to slay anything in a single shot. Two-handed also has the same ability but its version knocks everything back on its arse which I find to be incredibly useful. DW has a second frontal cone attack but its not going to win any awards since 2-handed has indomitable which means zero interruptions in damage output. 2handed also has stunning attacks and sundering strikes that make up where it falls short.
My current play through is a templar/berserker dwarf with 90% spell resist 2handed. He is frankly.. unstoppable. Sure my dual wielder killed alot faster but when I encountered any sort of stun or knockdown I was pretty much boned. The ability to knock back several targets with 2handed sweep or smite is absolutely god sent as well when you need a break for heals to land. Also allows your mages time to drop blood wound or mass paralyze.
In closing, all the weapon styles have benefits to them.. the trick is finding the style that suits you.
#20
Posté 25 novembre 2009 - 12:35
Vabjekf
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The PC in my current playthrough is this build.
It works fine. I went 26 dex (30 after the mage tower, whirlwind does come in handy in a few situations, particularly when you are being swarmed with minions) and the rest str.
Its a solid build but there are a few things to note
Berserk, being non sustainable, is kind of a skill you dont bother turning on for most fights, if reaver skills were lower levels it would be the class to take first, but the second one is like level 12 so its best to grab berserker first. I honestly hit hard enough with out it.
My view of this build is like all warriors. its better to just load them up on tactics. You will be spending most of the game controlling a rogue or mage companion as manual control of them is a huge bonus, my warrior i only bother manually grabing if i want to aoe minions, or turn on berserk (you could just set it to auto-activate and it will be up every other fight or so if you are moving at a good clip, this may be smarter considering most boss fights have dialogue or time before them anyway)
Though dual wield warrior can do lots of damage, i dont think ill be taking them ever again. When i really wished i had their higher dps they are just getting knocked around (dragons and such) and are useless most of the fight.
This is why id say a 2h warrior is much better, even if it does lower damage.
And yeah i never use aoe spells that cause friendly fire on my mages either, but then i have two warriors in my party, ive played through with just one and things did not go as well and i depended on mages killing stuff fast much more often, but now i just let the warriors run lose, move the rogue behind the enemy (i dont think ill bother using rogues in the future either as ive never gotten anything good from stealing/locked chests), then micromanage my mage, switch to rogue if it needs to go somewhere else.
Just get a bunch of big beefy 2h warriors and they can go around being awesome and smashing things.
you can give one an axe and one a sword and one a maul.
It works fine. I went 26 dex (30 after the mage tower, whirlwind does come in handy in a few situations, particularly when you are being swarmed with minions) and the rest str.
Its a solid build but there are a few things to note
Berserk, being non sustainable, is kind of a skill you dont bother turning on for most fights, if reaver skills were lower levels it would be the class to take first, but the second one is like level 12 so its best to grab berserker first. I honestly hit hard enough with out it.
My view of this build is like all warriors. its better to just load them up on tactics. You will be spending most of the game controlling a rogue or mage companion as manual control of them is a huge bonus, my warrior i only bother manually grabing if i want to aoe minions, or turn on berserk (you could just set it to auto-activate and it will be up every other fight or so if you are moving at a good clip, this may be smarter considering most boss fights have dialogue or time before them anyway)
Though dual wield warrior can do lots of damage, i dont think ill be taking them ever again. When i really wished i had their higher dps they are just getting knocked around (dragons and such) and are useless most of the fight.
This is why id say a 2h warrior is much better, even if it does lower damage.
And yeah i never use aoe spells that cause friendly fire on my mages either, but then i have two warriors in my party, ive played through with just one and things did not go as well and i depended on mages killing stuff fast much more often, but now i just let the warriors run lose, move the rogue behind the enemy (i dont think ill bother using rogues in the future either as ive never gotten anything good from stealing/locked chests), then micromanage my mage, switch to rogue if it needs to go somewhere else.
Just get a bunch of big beefy 2h warriors and they can go around being awesome and smashing things.
you can give one an axe and one a sword and one a maul.
#21
Posté 25 novembre 2009 - 03:42
GlassRain
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I agree with most of what you say, Vabjekf. 2hand warriors are far more reliable in tough fights than dual wield though I would never bring two of them. A sword and board warrior is just as reliable with shield wall up and a few hale runes.
The biggest drawback to two-handed warriors is their attack is quite a bit lower than their dual wield counter parts in my experience. This has always lead me to work with rally and song of courage. Honestly a Templar/Champion would be a nice build for a two hand warrior due to having three aoe control moves: Smite, 2handed sweep, war cry.
Might wonder why I'm so in love with Templar and the reason is simple: spell resist. Being able to charge any mage without fear of any sort of spell effecting you is almost broken. I remember charging a wave of darkspawn with my two-handed tank and taking a fireball to the face. Fully resisted it while it nearly killed the 10 or so enemies that had almost surrounded me. Also paved a path straight to the mage who my warrior decapitated in two swings.
I've also had a hard time getting into the rogue class. I've enjoyed both warrior and mage but rogue just feels lacking. Alot of micro managing for minimal gain. Then, I've never been the one to pick a lock, set a trap and draw enemies into an ambush... its always been my method to kick down the door with my weapons drawn. Makes it really hard to get that level 20 rogue achievement, heh.
The biggest drawback to two-handed warriors is their attack is quite a bit lower than their dual wield counter parts in my experience. This has always lead me to work with rally and song of courage. Honestly a Templar/Champion would be a nice build for a two hand warrior due to having three aoe control moves: Smite, 2handed sweep, war cry.
Might wonder why I'm so in love with Templar and the reason is simple: spell resist. Being able to charge any mage without fear of any sort of spell effecting you is almost broken. I remember charging a wave of darkspawn with my two-handed tank and taking a fireball to the face. Fully resisted it while it nearly killed the 10 or so enemies that had almost surrounded me. Also paved a path straight to the mage who my warrior decapitated in two swings.
I've also had a hard time getting into the rogue class. I've enjoyed both warrior and mage but rogue just feels lacking. Alot of micro managing for minimal gain. Then, I've never been the one to pick a lock, set a trap and draw enemies into an ambush... its always been my method to kick down the door with my weapons drawn. Makes it really hard to get that level 20 rogue achievement, heh.
