Uh....that's kind of part of the reason DA2 got so much criticism.LZA_FUNK wrote...
it will get the hand me downs ideas from Mass Effect 3
DA2 - Reevaluation of Criticism
Débuté par
Hubrah
, févr. 20 2012 02:41
#51
Posté 24 février 2012 - 04:52
HiroVoid
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Retour en haut
#52
Posté 24 février 2012 - 05:27
Wissenschaft
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"You should be able to kill Merril"
Err, I believe you can kill merril if you side with the templars and don't have max approval with Merril.At least I have seen in on youtube.
For me, the game is fine. Its just not polished. Act 3 would be fine if they simply developed the rational for Orsino and Meredith better. They should have made it so that Meredith finds Orsino before Hawke and Orsino transforms after being fatally wounded by Meredith in order to buy time for his fellow mages to escape. Then Merediths mind snaps while fighting the abomination Orsino becomes then the ending would have been fine. Also, it would have made the ending much more tragic since if done well would avoid making either Orsino or Meredith being unsympathic villians.
For example, if you side with the templars you storm the circle but if you side with the mage, prehaps the mages could have done a preemptive strike. Then Hawkes effect on the story becomes clear. While Meredith vs Orsino would be come predetermined, Hawke can decide how the battle started. Either the templars or mage being the aggressors.
There should have been a third option as well, where Hawke decides to stay neutral. Here Hawke can focus on protecting civilians from the chaotic battle but is reluctantly pulled into the battle to stop the battle between Orsino/Meredith for destorying the city.
Storywise I think a 7/10 is about right. The story is promising but the 3 acts come off as 3 seperate short stories. Its the character banters that really make me enjoy the game. Me likes skanky Isabela and Emo Rage Fenris. The reuse of areas would be fine if it wasn't so exessive. Whenever cave is the same the game feels unnessarily repeative.
Combats about 9/10: I really love the combat in this game which is why I play it. Kingsdoms of Amular Reckoning reminds me of Dragon Age 2's combat. Very flashy and over the top. And yet that game doesn't have waves of enemies that drop out of the sky. Just so you know, I'd rate Origins combat as a 7/10 for being too slow. Which is odd because I've played balurs gate plenty of time so I have no problem with slower combats. I suppose I've just become infatuated with fast passed adrenaline rushing combat.
Overall, the game gets a 8/10 from me. I was going to give it a 7 but I play this game too much so its doing something right to keep my interest. My main problem is that is feels more focused on combat than the story. If they give us much more varied areas to explore, a more focused story, and tone down the use of mass enemy waves in combat for DA 3 than I'll be very happy.
Err, I believe you can kill merril if you side with the templars and don't have max approval with Merril.At least I have seen in on youtube.
For me, the game is fine. Its just not polished. Act 3 would be fine if they simply developed the rational for Orsino and Meredith better. They should have made it so that Meredith finds Orsino before Hawke and Orsino transforms after being fatally wounded by Meredith in order to buy time for his fellow mages to escape. Then Merediths mind snaps while fighting the abomination Orsino becomes then the ending would have been fine. Also, it would have made the ending much more tragic since if done well would avoid making either Orsino or Meredith being unsympathic villians.
For example, if you side with the templars you storm the circle but if you side with the mage, prehaps the mages could have done a preemptive strike. Then Hawkes effect on the story becomes clear. While Meredith vs Orsino would be come predetermined, Hawke can decide how the battle started. Either the templars or mage being the aggressors.
There should have been a third option as well, where Hawke decides to stay neutral. Here Hawke can focus on protecting civilians from the chaotic battle but is reluctantly pulled into the battle to stop the battle between Orsino/Meredith for destorying the city.
Storywise I think a 7/10 is about right. The story is promising but the 3 acts come off as 3 seperate short stories. Its the character banters that really make me enjoy the game. Me likes skanky Isabela and Emo Rage Fenris. The reuse of areas would be fine if it wasn't so exessive. Whenever cave is the same the game feels unnessarily repeative.
Combats about 9/10: I really love the combat in this game which is why I play it. Kingsdoms of Amular Reckoning reminds me of Dragon Age 2's combat. Very flashy and over the top. And yet that game doesn't have waves of enemies that drop out of the sky. Just so you know, I'd rate Origins combat as a 7/10 for being too slow. Which is odd because I've played balurs gate plenty of time so I have no problem with slower combats. I suppose I've just become infatuated with fast passed adrenaline rushing combat.
Overall, the game gets a 8/10 from me. I was going to give it a 7 but I play this game too much so its doing something right to keep my interest. My main problem is that is feels more focused on combat than the story. If they give us much more varied areas to explore, a more focused story, and tone down the use of mass enemy waves in combat for DA 3 than I'll be very happy.
Modifié par Wissenschaft, 24 février 2012 - 05:57 .
#53
Posté 24 février 2012 - 05:56
MacNille
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I have not played this game since i got it in march last year. But i still loath it. Act 3 was so damn awful, and destoyerd the game. I find it werid that we didn't got to play as Hawk when he/she was forced to work to pay off a bet. It just skip to "one year later". It feelt rushed.
#54
Posté 24 février 2012 - 06:45
nos_astra
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One of the best things of DA2 are these carefully designed NPCs in the streets of Kirkwall.
I wonder why they are rarely mentioned.
I wonder why they are rarely mentioned.
Modifié par klarabella, 24 février 2012 - 06:45 .
#55
Posté 24 février 2012 - 08:31
Jerrybnsn
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I didn't buy DA2 until this past September and, after one play through, I still haven't felt the need to revisit it. Maybe next September I might put it in and feel that the game didn't deserve my initial criticism. But with the Dragon Age series, from one game to the next, it just seems in regard to your decisions and progression....what's the point?
#56
Posté 24 février 2012 - 10:02
Darth Death
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The game honestly had many great ideas, but were poorly executed. Hopefully BioWare will learn from their mistakes to make DA3 outstanding.
#57
Posté 25 février 2012 - 09:53
Aemony
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Title it as Dragon Age: Kirkwall (the number 2 will brings thoughts to sequels, no matter how much you try to argue it away), don't mention Origins in the same sentence, don't make a "import save from DA:O" function and the premises amongst players would've been A LOT better, which possibly would've resulted in more sales.
The design of quite a lot of elements in the game, and the execution of said elements, is still bad, mind you, but this just might've allowed the game to pass while still serving as an acceptable experiment of BioWare producing good data.
The design of quite a lot of elements in the game, and the execution of said elements, is still bad, mind you, but this just might've allowed the game to pass while still serving as an acceptable experiment of BioWare producing good data.
#58
Posté 26 février 2012 - 10:20
ScotGaymer
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Aemony wrote...
Title it as Dragon Age: Kirkwall (the number 2 will brings thoughts to sequels, no matter how much you try to argue it away), don't mention Origins in the same sentence, don't make a "import save from DA:O" function and the premises amongst players would've been A LOT better, which possibly would've resulted in more sales.
The design of quite a lot of elements in the game, and the execution of said elements, is still bad, mind you, but this just might've allowed the game to pass while still serving as an acceptable experiment of BioWare producing good data.
I am in the "liked DA2" camp and even I agree with this.
I place much of the blame for the failure of DA2 with the Marketing Department of BW because the PR and Marketing to do with DA2 was appalling in the run up to the release of the game (and immediately after). It took them being completely routed on the media front to shut the heck up with the inaccurate, stupid, and wrong crap they were spouting about Dragon Age, and its fans.
If the game had been titled Dragon Age: Hawke Rising or something like that I really think that there woulda been less "haters" and less vitriol. Simply because they couldnt use the "but its supposed to be a sequel to Origins!" arguement.
It wasn't and isn't an Origins sequel; not in the sense that a sequel is supposed to be a sequel.
The higher ups saw how well DAO sold, how much money they made from the game, and saw dollar signs. After all it is widely known that DAO was and is BW's best selling game.
Marketing made erroneous assumptions about DA, about its fan base, and about the Genre of game that BW does and tried to do the typical EA thing and create out of DA a **** yearly release franchise. That kind of marketing, & style of game creation barely works with Simulation type games never mind with RPGs.
The one good thing to come out of the debacle with DA2 is that style of thinking at Bioware appears to well and truely have been routed (given ME3 was pushed back, and much of the rhetoric coming out of BW about both games was unceremoniously dropped); and Bioware appear to have turned over a new leaf (if the DLC is anything to go by) or rather returned to an old leaf lol. The one that worked.
On the one hand this makes me very very glad because I hate the EA/Activision/Atari style of doing things in the gaming industry. I think it is anti-consumer, pro-business and pro-monopoly; and I generally avoid games that are published by those three publishing houses.
The only exception is Bioware games for me; and even as amazing is BW is, if they had continued down that road I would have dropped them too.
I even prefer Microsoft to Activision and EA; and its a sad day when consumers start having more respect for Microsoft as a company than your own.
On the other hand, it makes me sad because I liked the concept of experimentation that Dragon Age 2 represented and I worry that it means that BW will be unlikely to want (or be allowed) to experiment in the future.
#59
Posté 26 février 2012 - 11:00
philippe willaume
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well first my choice of words were probably too sarcastic, so sorry foir thatEyeofanger wrote...
I can tell you with a straight face I liked act 3 too in fact it's my favorite part. I am not very picky about games. I try to enjoy a game and I form my own opinions and I do not really care what others think about a game as long as I can enjoy the game
and yes you are not very picky.
phil
Modifié par philippe willaume, 26 février 2012 - 11:01 .
#60
Posté 26 février 2012 - 04:55
Aemony
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FitScotGaymer wrote...
On the other hand, it makes me sad because I liked the concept of experimentation that Dragon Age 2 represented and I worry that it means that BW will be unlikely to want (or be allowed) to experiment in the future.
I doubt it, actually, given certain statements from certain people at BioWare (don't remember whom, but it's in the kind of "We've been at Origins, we're not going back there"). I've also heard that BioWare are looking towards Skyrim for inspiration to Dragon Age 3, which actually... makes me feel even less secure of whether or not I'll buy the next game on release date... DA:O catered to one of my RPG needs, Oblivion/Skyrim another and finally ME2 to a final one. I don't want another franchise that caters to one I already have a game for.
But the matter of innovation within the gaming industry is a hard one. Most of the time you just don't do it with an established franchise unless you want to set yourself up for the worst possible outcome ever. It's only seldom experimenting on a bigger scale with an established franchise works with a positive outcome (I can only think of Metal Gear Solid 1 -> 2).
At the same time, innovating with a whole new IP costs and carries a high risk of not even turning up a profit.
Examples of sequels with innovation on a bigger scale:
CnC 4: Disaster
DA2: Disaster
MGS2: Success
If you haven't already, I recommend reading this analysis on Gamasutra: http://www.gamasutra..._Bad_Sequel.php
Also worth reading:
http://www.gamasutra...ll_in_game_.php
Modifié par Aemony, 26 février 2012 - 04:56 .
#61
Posté 26 février 2012 - 09:13
JamieCOTC
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I like that DA2 tried to do something different. I liked my Hawke. Unfortunately, experimenting in a mad rush does not usually end well. Had the team had more time w/ the game, I believe we would have gotten a far superior product.
Contrary to what certain devs say, I do not want a DA:Origin clone. I do want something different, something that takes risks, but I want it done right. I want them to take their time. I don't need or want another DA game, DLC or whatever right now. I wouldn't mind being kept up to date on it, though.
Contrary to what certain devs say, I do not want a DA:Origin clone. I do want something different, something that takes risks, but I want it done right. I want them to take their time. I don't need or want another DA game, DLC or whatever right now. I wouldn't mind being kept up to date on it, though.
#62
Posté 24 avril 2012 - 10:38
VinnyI82
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This game should have been called something like "Dynasty Warriors: Dragon Age Edition"
#63
Guest_Begemotka_*
Posté 24 avril 2012 - 10:59
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Lethys1 wrote...
The story of the game makes beyond no sense. You can spend the entire game trying to help mages and the effect of the "Champion" and his actions would be the same as if you spent the entire time trying to wipe them out. The game shifts gears completely and gives us two unsatisfying storylines; one that ends far too quickly (Arishok, only good character in the game) and one that makes no sense (blood mages vs templars).
There are too many blood mages to feel any semblance of sympathy for them, and they attacked my Hawke for no reason on the outskirts of the city despite that me and that sort of renegade templar were helping them. I am a pro-mage guy the entire game and they turn on me, so I had not even a single remorse in slaughtering everyone. The templars also are too brutal to feel badly for them.
There are no consequences for your specific actions. If I was pro-templar all game it would make sense for mages to attack me, but I was pro-mage. And they still attacked me. Your mother has to die, your sibling has to be removed after chapter one, and in the end you kill both Orsino and the head templar.
There is nothing morally ambiguous, making for a tough decision. Everyone turns out to be evil in the end, except for Hawke who has to kill everyone. You should be able to kill Merrill, which I wanted to do, and side with the Arishok, which I wanted to do. You should not dislike vehemently the people you're forced to group with except for Varric.
The game uses the deaths of major characters who are, in reality, on the periphery to try and pull on our heartstrings in a way that felt incredibly cheap. The initial death of the sibling desensitizes people to any subsequent deaths. The mother's death scene is incredibly cheesy, with her dying in your arms. The second sibling death or take-away ruined my entire party make-up, with Bethany playing the role of least annoying character because she basically had no character.
The straight male romance options were horrific. Isabela, a stereotypical "woman amongst men" type of promiscuous STD-ridden pirate, or a character that acted like a 12 year old who also happened to be a blood mage. I chose the pirate and, as it turns out, she stole some stuff. Either bail her out or have no romance content.
And the gameplay was atrocious as well. Ever-spawning enemies don't allow for strategic gameplay or planning, class imbalances, healing was reduced to potion-fest 2011, enemies who both could disappear entirely and had just as much health as the hardest enemies, a distinct lack of need for good spacing. Tanking became essentially useless as now the tanks couldn't attract enemy units efficiently enough. Magic was overpowered beyond an acceptable level.
How, if you are a blood mage, does that NOT impact the story???????? Or a mage at all for that matter. The one city setting was incredibly boring the entire game and the timeline moves just as people get settled in their surroundings.
The biggest problem is simple; I felt like the game was pulling me, instead of me influencing the game. It was too fast, had no significant choices, and I am incredibly disappointed in it still.
THIS.
Sorry Lethys for wrapping myself in quotations from you,but that sums up my gripes with DA : The Rise of the Champion (not DA2) perfectly.
#64
Posté 24 avril 2012 - 11:03
Sejborg
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I tried to play DA2 again just recently. I barely made it to Kirkwall before I had to stop and put the game back on the shelf.
