1876 réponses à ce sujet

[notwuat]

[Inanity removed]

Modifié par JohnEpler, 21 février 2012 - 11:18 .

[smirtington]

FoxyB wrote...

smirtington wrote...

Regardless of the response she received, is she going to be at least be talked to about why her initial comments, which sparked the whole thing, weren't professional on any level? Or how about the comments of Aaryn Flynn, telling potential customers to "**** off?"

Her "jealousy" comment didn't spark it. The reddit post did and then they got wind of her twitter account. And I'm sure she is aware by now that her and Aaryn's behavior was less than professional.

The jealousy comment was definitely the spark that burned the barn down. I don't think it would of blown up as it did without that tweet.

[Matt125]

Bullying is unacceptable, but people need to remember it was Jennifer Hepler who brought her gender into the equation by tweeting about her vagina. That gave 4chan/Reddit users the excuse to lay on the misogyny. Before then, there was a lot of legitimate criticism about her writing and her attitude to video games.

Modifié par Matthias Silverblade, 21 février 2012 - 11:17 .

[Savber100]

The recent attacks allowed me to conclude this:

Gaming fans < EA, Activision

Sorry they might be greedy stinking pigs but that's nothing like the real cancer that is killing gaming.

Morons like this only serves to further prove that gamers are nothing more than fat, ugly, hateful people who have nothing better to do than rip people apart for a daily living.

Modifié par Savber100, 21 février 2012 - 11:18 .

[Jelefant]

I would like to interject for a moment. What some people in this thread refer to as "going too far" are obviously just innocent pranks. Death threat phone calls? Seriously? That's not even a federal offense. I can understand murdering her child or blowing up her car as "sort of going too far", but please don't put labels on things you don't understand. Christ, some people just can't understand jokes when they're shoved in their faces.
I'm not saying she deserved it, but I'm DEFINITELY not saying she DIDN'T deserved it either

[Marionetten]

Arnagath wrote...

I actually agree with her, the battles in dragon age 2 are so terrible (because of spawns and the unability to talk your way through) so I think it would be welcome to skip them. They are by far the worst part of the game. Dragon Age fights where not allot better (the tactical element from Baldurs Gate is gone).

Either make battles interesting or make them shorter/let us skip them.

That's because gameplay was wholly divorced from the plot. Dragon Age II was built more like an MMORPG than an RPG. You did your fetch quest, turned it in and got treated to a little scene.

[Hakurou]

Thanks for coming out in support of Ms. Hepler.

[Deviija]

Passionaticus wrote...
Hepler was just unlucky and naive enough to underestimate the rage of old-school Bioware fanbase,

Nah.  I'm an old-school BioWare fan, and have been an active part of the fanbase for over a decade.  There is no rage from me, so that comment is pure generalization.  Anyway, if 'old-school BioWare fans' reacted with death threats/comments and harrassment phone calls, I wouldn't be a part of that fanbase. 

[Vosch]

JohnEpler wrote...

Andhaira wrote...

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

It seems you know little of John Epler. He is one who always gives room to both sides of the story. In this case there is no logic in it at all.

So we can discuss both sides of the story... except we are not allowed to discuss the, as you called, "illogical" side of it because... it's not allowed to be discussed.

Cool.

Nope, you can discuss the 'illogical' side of it, as long as you're civil and you keep the personal attacks out of it. And, yes, this involves telling the world why you think those attacks were justified.

You're more than welcome to disagree with Jennifer's ideas, but keep it polite and civil.

Keep it civil? You mean like when Aaryn Flynn told potential customers with valid criticisms to f*** off and called them idiots? That kind of civil?

[Merci357]

smirtington wrote...

Regardless of the response she received, is she going to be at least be talked to about why her initial comments, which sparked the whole thing, weren't professional on any level? Or how about the comments of Aaryn Flynn, telling potential customers to "**** off?"

You know, if someone acts like a jerk, you'll show them where the door is, simple as that. Potential customer or not, some people you don't want as a customer at all - and I work in a service trade.

[Esquin]

Blacklash93 wrote...

I let myself get a little emotional last time I argued about this and that didn't work out for me. I just can't stand not only those who have made these childish insults, but even those who make anything that even slightly resembles an excuse for it. Promoters and encouragers are just as bad.

Part of me thinks people wouldn't be so critical of her work if she didn't say that thing about combat in the interview. It would have never put the spotlight on her and she'd be just another writer at Bioware.

I honestly think she's a good writer in what she's currently doing. The Dwarf Commoner and Mage Origins were some of my favorites and I believe she did a really good job with Anders in DA2. She also wrote a significant part of Orzammar and the Anvil of the Void and everything in that was well written, IMO.

Not a fan of Sebastian currently, but he has his far share.

You're probably right. In fact you're absolutely right. It's her views on the interactive elements of gameplay that have exposed her to so much criticism. She doesn't like the interactivity of games. In my opinion this makes her entierly unsuiited to the medium. She should not be working in the video game industry.

[Abortherchildakawuat]

[Inanity removed]

Modifié par JohnEpler, 21 février 2012 - 11:21 .

[Merilsell]

While I'm in no way a fan of her writing, the attacks against her person were and are just low. Period.

[Xanatos Chimera]

[quote]Esquin wrote...

[quote]JohnEpler wrote...

...

/quote]

The behaviour expressed by those bully Jennifer was indeed terrible and should never be repeated. I agree 100% with you on that.

However I still feel that some of Jennifers writing is not up to scratch. I also think that her ideas regarding "skippable combat" are something that would have a negative impact on video games as a form of entertainment. I don't say these things to attack her, or to say she is a bad person. But I do strongly disagree with her ideas, and it is my right to voice that disagreement. I am not bullying or judging her as a person. I'm simply saying that I disagree with her and her opinions on gaming. I believe that her opinions on the future of gaming make her ill suited to working in the industry. 

...

[/quote]

Master of Orion had an option to let the computer just quickly handle combat, or one could turn on tactical combat if one liked that.  I don't see how having the *option* to skip combat will ruin games.  It's not like it's being forced on one.  That was not what Jennifer Hepler was saying.  The combat afficionados get the option to skip the "boring dialogue" and cutscenes, why not allow the option to streamline combat in an RPG and focus on other aspects of the game, like the relationships, the conversation trees and so forth?  Or should we also remove the option to choose difficulty levels?  That's been around since Doom and Wolfenstein and, yes, there are some who think it should be removed, but would it really ruin games?  This smacks a little too much of One True Wayism and BadWrongFun.

If her writing is not up to scratch, one can critique that and provide reasons why it isn't.  This is not what was done.  One can disagree with her opinions and ideas for options that should be included in RPGs and provide coherent reasons why.  This is not what was done.  What was done was to initiate a bunch of vitiriolic ad-hominem attacks and harrassment on the basis of misconstrued quotes and outright lies.

[Marionetten]

Savber100 wrote...

Morons like this only serves to further prove that gamers are nothing more than fat, ugly, hateful people who have nothing better to do than rip people apart for a daily living.

Incredibly classy. You accuse others of being hateful while using fat and ugly as if that would somehow lessen a person's worth. I suspect you have quite a bit in common with these individuals.

[Siona]

Jelefant wrote...

I would like to interject for a moment. What some people in this thread refer to as "going too far" are obviously just innocent pranks. Death threat phone calls? Seriously? That's not even a federal offense. I can understand murdering her child or blowing up her car as "sort of going too far", but please don't put labels on things you don't understand. Christ, some people just can't understand jokes when they're shoved in their faces.
I'm not saying she deserved it, but I'm DEFINITELY not saying she DIDN'T deserved it either

I don't know what world you're living in where calling a stranger's house to tell them to die isn't construed as hurtful and wrong.

wtf is this post I cannot even

[T0ILET]

[Inappropriate post removed]

Modifié par JohnEpler, 21 février 2012 - 11:21 .

[Danijou]

Abortherchildakawuat wrote...

I have no life.

Can you guys pin an IP ban on this nutter already?

[Esquin]

Marionetten wrote...

Arnagath wrote...

I actually agree with her, the battles in dragon age 2 are so terrible (because of spawns and the unability to talk your way through) so I think it would be welcome to skip them. They are by far the worst part of the game. Dragon Age fights where not allot better (the tactical element from Baldurs Gate is gone).

Either make battles interesting or make them shorter/let us skip them.

That's because gameplay was wholly divorced from the plot. Dragon Age II was built more like an MMORPG than an RPG. You did your fetch quest, turned it in and got treated to a little scene.

The thing is that it was her opinions of game play that caused the DA2 battles to be so terrible. She wanted to make combat as meaningless as possible for those who don't enjoy it. It was her choices and feelings that made the game's gameplay so separate from the story.

[CG50]

Arnagath wrote...

I actually agree with her, the battles in dragon age 2 are so terrible (because of spawns and the unability to talk your way through) so I think it would be welcome to skip them. They are by far the worst part of the game. Dragon Age fights where not allot better (the tactical element from Baldurs Gate is gone).

Either make battles interesting or make them shorter/let us skip them. 

 If they take the gameplay out of the game, it's not really a game then. It's more like an interactive movie (which might actually happen in the future who knows?). I think ME3 tried to address it by have the story mode though (which i'm against but people have their play styles). 

[conorrory]

Siona wrote...

conorrory wrote...

While I agree that these kind of unprecendented attacks on any individual are unwaranted and unfair, and Its good to see a company support their employee's I would ask Bioware to remind their employee's from a buisness and company representation point of view to conduct themselves in a polite and orderly manner without lowering themselves to the levels of harsh critics or indeed abusive commentors.

This is true in any line of work where you are a public face for any company.

While I respect the fact the your employee's rightfully defended themselves from these unwaranted attacks by organised groups such as reddit, the language used in defence was less than elequent and not befitting of a public persona.

"Rather than defend the person who was called at her own house about how she was cancer and should miscarry and just die, I'm going to instead attack how she wasn't NICE to defend herself!"

Are you being serious with this right now?

I'll just say it: if this had been a guy doing this, I'd bet everyone would be kissing his ass to high heaven and praising him for being such a badass. But, nope, a woman does it and suddenly she's ~unprofessional~ for not bowing down to assmunches.

I never attacked her I support the fact that she should not be victimised, however working in pr myself I found comments from some bioware staff to be unprofessional, I was more so citing quotes made by one Aaryn Flynn.

why do you have to bring sex into this argument when I never even touched upon it in any shape or form in my original post?

[thats1evildude]

Jelefant wrote...

What some people in this thread refer to as "going too far" are obviously just innocent pranks. Death threat phone calls? Seriously? That's not even a federal offense.

Uh, yeah, they are within most parts of the world, including Canada and the U.S. What country do you live in that they're not?

[Aeowyn]

Jelefant wrote...

I would like to interject for a moment. What some people in this thread refer to as "going too far" are obviously just innocent pranks. Death threat phone calls? Seriously? That's not even a federal offense. I can understand murdering her child or blowing up her car as "sort of going too far", but please don't put labels on things you don't understand. Christ, some people just can't understand jokes when they're shoved in their faces.
I'm not saying she deserved it, but I'm DEFINITELY not saying she DIDN'T deserved it either

You're joking, right? Since when it death thread phone calls ever "innocent pranks"? There's nothing "innocent" about it. 

[Matt125]

Marionetten wrote...

Savber100 wrote...

Morons like this only serves to further prove that gamers are nothing more than fat, ugly, hateful people who have nothing better to do than rip people apart for a daily living.

Incredibly classy. You accuse others of being hateful while using fat and ugly as if that would somehow lessen a person's worth. I suspect you have quite a bit in common with these individuals.

*applause*

[John Epler]

If folks would like to start a thread in the DA2 general forum discussing the division of gameplay and story, and how to bring the two into closer harmony, that's cool. That's a discussion worth having.

I'd do it, but I have my hands full.