1876 réponses à ce sujet

[Deadmac]

rapscallioness wrote...
This angers me to no end. It truly does. There's a definite mob mentality these days. And...some ppl are just crazy. I mean, serious crazy. Like mental illness; they're off their medication crazy.

Here is a quote from BioWare's forum statement:

... While we continue to value all of our customers and fans, participation in the BSN and engaging with staff and like-minded community members...

See the flaw in that thinking? Before the internet arrived in public domain, our differences were shielded by physical walls. As a result of those walls breaking down, due to the internet, society has finally noticed the truth to our existence. We are not like-minded individuals. Even though we would like everyone to think the same, the reality is that we will never-ever be the same. Instead of disagreeing with someone's perspective quietly, similar to how we did before the web, people are now taking their grievances out to the public. Unfortunately, the internet has also reverted the lessons of tolerance, which we have been taught by teachers, parents, and other formal institutions. We should celebrate our physical and psychological diversity by teaching people to be tolerant.

When it comes to this particular situation, something had to have triggered the backlash. Even though one side may be crying foul, I am going to take the neutral road by not commenting. If you are going to play dirty in public (employees and fans), you should expect crap like this to happen. Everyone is to blame, period.

Its time to move onward.

Modifié par Deadmac, 02 mars 2012 - 03:55 .

[Silfren]

Deadmac wrote...

rapscallioness wrote...
This angers me to no end. It truly does. There's a definite mob mentality these days. And...some ppl are just crazy. I mean, serious crazy. Like mental illness; they're off their medication crazy.

Here is a quote from BioWare's forum statement:

... While we continue to value all of our customers and fans, participation in the BSN and engaging with staff and like-minded community members...

See the flaw in that thinking? Before the internet arrived in public domain, our differences were shielded by physical walls. As a result of those walls breaking down, due to the internet, society has finally noticed the truth to our existence. We are not like-minded individuals. Even though we would like everyone to think the same, the reality is that we will never-ever be the same. Instead of disagreeing with someone's perspective quietly, similar to how we did before the web, people are now taking their grievances out to the public. Unfortunately, the internet has also reverted the lessons of tolerance, which we have been taught by teachers, parents, and other formal institutions. We should celebrate our physical and psychological diversity by teaching people to be tolerant.

When it comes to this particular situation, something had to have triggered the backlash. Even though one side may be crying foul, I am going to take the neutral road by not commenting. If you are going to play dirty in public (employees and fans), you should expect crap like this to happen. Everyone is to blame, period.

Its time to move onward.

The only thing that triggered this backlash were that some guys wanted to be jerks.  They are the ONLY ones to blame.

[seraphymon]

Deadmac wrote...

rapscallioness wrote...
This angers me to no end. It truly does. There's a definite mob mentality these days. And...some ppl are just crazy. I mean, serious crazy. Like mental illness; they're off their medication crazy.

Here is a quote from BioWare's forum statement:

... While we continue to value all of our customers and fans, participation in the BSN and engaging with staff and like-minded community members...

See the flaw in that thinking? Before the internet arrived in public domain, our differences were shielded by physical walls. As a result of those walls breaking down, due to the internet, society has finally noticed the truth to our existence. We are not like-minded individuals. Even though we would like everyone to think the same, the reality is that we will never-ever be the same. Instead of disagreeing with someone's perspective quietly, similar to how we did before the web, people are now taking their grievances out to the public. Unfortunately, the internet has also reverted the lessons of tolerance, which we have been taught by teachers, parents, and other formal institutions. We should celebrate our physical and psychological diversity by teaching people to be tolerant.

When it comes to this particular situation, something had to have triggered the backlash. Even though one side may be crying foul, I am going to take the neutral road by not commenting. If you are going to play dirty in public (employees and fans), you should expect crap like this to happen. Everyone is to blame, period.

Its time to move onward.

This is very true.

[Elhanan]

If onward means bans, coutrooms, and jail, then I agree; time for progress against those posters who are criminals.

[omnitremere]

Somehow I missed this entire situation and only read about it just now. I want to say I think the entire thing is depressing and Jennifer Helper has my full support. And this is coming from someone who has called DA2 a complete disaster more than once. Hostile personal attacks are just not something that can be tolerated. Aaryn Flynn reacted in exactly the right way. What's the point of being professional and courteous with people that think they have a right to call someone they've never met a fat ****? It doesn't make any sense and I'm sorry to hear she went through that. I sincerely hope this situation blows over and the threats toward her come to an IMMEDIATE stop. Peace.

[Sharn01]

I go and play TOR for a while and come back to check in and find all hell has broken loose.

[Koire]

SilentK wrote...

Had no idea that it was that bad. Ohh... I am so so sorry for Jennifer Hepler.

Wish there was something that we could do to show support, so glad to know that they stand up for her.

I fully agree.

[Wanya77]

I do not know what happened, but I give to Jennifer Hepler all my support.
Thank you Bioware.

[lady sheryanne]

Thank you Bioware for your support. She has mine also and I am glad that so many people care.

[Scott Sion]

When will people learn that threats and out of line remarks only ruin your argument? I have no idea what happened that got so many people mad at this Jennifer (I really don't keep up with who does what at Bioware) , but it's obvious people were try-hard trolling.

[Weltenschlange]

I despise bullying and the people who engage in it.



That is all.

[FaeQueenCory]

REALLY!?
My computer dies and I hop on here with my phone to find that scary floating terms change... Only to find out that the reason it came into being was because people are STILL harping on something Ms Helper offhandedly said!? REALLY?? It got that bad??
All she said was that she values the story more than combat. What's wrong with that???
Jeez! People are mean and dumb.
I'm apologize for everyone, Ms Helper... This got WAY out of hand apparently...

[timekilla]

Bravo, Bioware. Thank you for supporting Jennifer Hepler.

Funny thing, I read that article a long time ago. Someone sent it to me when I was resisting the ME1 wave. It worked, too. Any company that hired a writer who was so willing to break stereotype had to be worth checking out.

Your new policy makes me think I might give these forums another chance. It's also chipping away at some ground-in jadedness. Good job!

[Megaton_Hope]

esper wrote...

Actually it does. Half of those post were attacks themself and should not be tolerated, the other half were discussing gameplay and both pro- and against were removed since we went off topic there.

Silfren wrote...

Posts have been deleted either because they are too far off-topic, are being combative and insulting, or are trying to sympathize with Hepler's attackers. Those are the only posts that have been deleted, and I'm speaking as someone whose own posts were included in that.

As a poster of some of these deleted posts, I do not feel I did any of those things. My first post in the thread, which was among those that wound up being deleted, consisted of only this:

A link to (an archive.org backup of) the Killer Betties interview from which some of Hepler's comments on gender and video games had been drawn by the unknown fabricator of the "Reddit screencap."

My impression, from having read that interview, of what some of this might really be about.

None of which was, in any way whatsoever, intended to excuse Mrs. Hepler's attackers or throw doubt on her character, but rather to help explain from an outside perspective where this might have come from and where it might still be going. (Still, because obviously it has not shown a tendency to disappear over time.)

[SirGladiator]

I dont actually know what exactly went on, but apparently some people went crazy over a perfectly reasonable comment that somebody at Bioware made about story vs combat. Its not a surprise to me, there's lots of crazy people out there, and the fact is that Jennifer Helper was right, story is more important than combat. But it doesnt really matter whether you're right or wrong, crazy people will criticize you for saying stuff, thats the nature of the internet, best thing to do is ban everybody involved and make it clear that as many bans will be handed out as necessary to put a stop to such evil behavior. I certainly hope that Jennifer Helper didn't take those crazy people's comments seriously, that would be giving them the power that they so desperately crave and very much do not deserve. The fact that evil people disapprove of something you said is actually a good thing, not a bad thing, it means you're almost certainly correct. Thank you to Jennifer Helper for standing up for what's right, and to everybody who has stood up to the evildoers, may we be free of them once and for all here at the Bioware Forums, if only we could be free of them throughout the internet.

[Megaton_Hope]

SirGladiator wrote...

But it doesnt really matter whether you're right or wrong, crazy people will criticize you for saying stuff, thats the nature of the internet, best thing to do is ban everybody involved and make it clear that as many bans will be handed out as necessary to put a stop to such evil behavior. ... if only we could be free of them throughout the internet.

That would appear to be the major issue, since so far as I know, Bioware can't ban anyone from the internet as a whole. (Oh, how I wish I had that power.) They could ban whomever they want from this forum, and if they believe that somebody on this forum has been conspiring to harm or upset one of their employees, that would seem to be their prerogative.

But, y'know, there are limits to what they can do.

[bad dog]

Rock on, BioWare, Chris, and Dr. Muzyka!

[louisrielle]

Wow, some ppl take their video games to srsly. I thought DA:O and DAII were both great games. There are plenty of other games to play, so why personally attack some one, if you didn't like one game out of the thousands out there?

I am glad Bioware donated to such a great cause. At least something good come out of this yuckiness.

[jbrand2002uk]

While I dont for one second condone what those idiots inflicted upon ms hepler, i have sensed that sooner or later this would happen to an employee at BW.

Clearly anger has been building up since EA bought BW and has been fermenting ever since DA2 the shift to large amounts of chargeable DLC along with the perception given that this DLC was content cut from the core game to be sold as a money grab couple that with the shift in direction of both the ME and DA series plus the bad or misleading marketing of the games and throw in that a large percentage of the games fans get the perception that BW is ignoring them by dishing out hollow platitudes of "dont worry, we're sorry, we'll fix, it we promise we understand" and then to top it all of the highly controversial ending to ME3.

While individuals clearly took their anger way too far clearly a soloution has to be found, fans will have to learn to show restraint and respect for BW employees but on the same hand BW will have to learn how to not dig itself into these holes it has been making for itself because while bans may stop those who take their anger too far from posting on BSN the rest of the internet is still open to these extreme individuals.

Its just a shame what happened to Jennifer and also that many people who may have enjoyed Mass Effect has been put off totally making a purchase by some really bad endings.

[DarkAmaranth1966]

As far as I understand, she simply said that she found it hard to get into a game that didn't have a good story and, she though perhaps a skip combat button would be a good idea for others that also liked the story more than the combat.

I like both but, everyone likes games for different reasons, some like the combat and would rather skip all but the directly relevant to completing the quest or objective dialog, other want more back story, less fighting. Whatever, it's simply a personal preference and, last I checked who you worked for didn't have any bearing on personal preference.

Maybe you have a great writing style or a great voice for a specific game and are hired to work on that yet would never play that game. I like medieval combat and magic but hate modern firearms, laser rifles and such. Not that I can't write good stories involving that sort of thing but, I would not play a game that had those elements.

I see nothing wrong with Ms. Hepler preferring a game with a good story aside from the combat and fail to see what the big deal over her is. near as I can tell many of the attacks were based on her looks, gender and weight - low, crude, immature because they had no solid ground to attack her to begin with. None of that matter when deciding if you possess certain skills or not. Nor does what you like matter.

Say you are a vegetarian but can cook a steak as good as any top chef - you might hate steak but, that does not mean you cannot be a chef at a steak house if you have the skill to cook one properly. It also would not matter what you looked like, how much or little you weighed, or if you were male or female - only that you had the skill required to do the job you were hired to do.

[HTTP 404]

never heard of this happening ever. Is it sad that I am not surprised that it happens on BSN?

[Mithrildream]

Thanks for the update to site rules and code of conduct. Sadly, this is much needed accross a lot of forums not just bioware because of so many haters. This is why I don't type very often in forums anymore. There's always someone out there who feels the need to put others down, trying to make themselves look superior and it's self destructive behavior. It does no one any good. It's sad to know some of them are my age too and i'm in my 40's. Thanks for trying to make the internet a little safer.

[Demx]

So I take it this attack was worst then the attacks on Gaider and Laidlaw? That's why only Hepler is getting a donation in her name?

[DarkAmaranth1966]

It was/is bad. Just Google her name and see some of the garbage people are saying and spoofing in videos. All of it crud because they have no real reason to attack her - they simply don't agree with her ideas of what a good game is and are being immature about it.

They act as if she were the only person responsible for the Dragon Age Games. She did a good job with her part in the game, just because she is more fond of the story than the combat is no reason to attack her.

IMO that's as bad as saying those of us who write fan fiction stories based on the game are not really players of the game because we like the story and have fun using our imagination to expand on it. It's just a bunch of silliness that turned very ugly.

I feel for Ms. Hepler. Despite the foolish reasons behind it, such attacks hurt. I applaud Boiware for standing up and doing all they can.