1790 réponses à ce sujet

[TwwlX]

The apologists on this forum are so far up BioWare's ass that it has started suffocating their already pea sized brains from getting any oxygen. Their comments are rather amusing.

Modifié par TwwlX, 22 février 2012 - 09:55 .

[Draconis6666]

DeathKong wrote...

Draconis6666 wrote...

schnydz wrote...

Draconis6666 wrote...

schnydz wrote...

Mr. Gogeta34 wrote...

Bioware confirmed a long time ago that the CE char/mission would be available on Day 1 (at a price) for those who didn't purchase the CE.

This isn't Zareed

you also have no proof that hes any more relevant to the plot of the game than Zaeed was so yes he could very well be Zaeed.

My proof is that it is Prothean. Which has been discussed ad nauseum. 

Your proof is not proof though, your argument is a failure before it even begins if thats your proof.

It's a LIVE PROTHEAN! This is not some stupid merc, I'm starting to wonder if you never played ME because you don't realise the significance of a living breathing prothean has to the ME universe.

It has no more significance than Vigil did, and in fact is likely to posses less actualy useful information towards the plot of the game than Vigil did. The protheans are not the center of the series, the reapers are, prothean technology is just reaper technology. Nothing about him being a Prothean ensures he will contribute massive plot important information to the story that detracts from the overal plot of the game or even the entire series. Or even that anything he migh tmention isnt already revealed elsewhere in the game through other means.

[RiouHotaru]

El Ejcovero wrote...

RiouHotaru wrote...

Aspiriini wrote...

tsaio wrote...

The PLC wrote...

Unbelievable that some people are actually defending this.. wow.

some people are mentally challenged. please be kind to those less fortunate.

Yeah, its like drug users defending their drugdealer.

Wow, and you argue that the people who don't mind the DLC are idiots?

I believe you need to speak for yourselves before you claim to understand us.

No, but even if you are willing to let it slide, you have to admit it is a scumbag move. But then, people are willing to pay $120 for CoD every year, because of the franchise name, maybe the same is true here. That is how people like George Lucas kept on releasing movies...

I'm letting it slide because there's NOTHING WRONG WITH THE PRACTICE.

There was an entire thread regardling DLC and the development of it which explained everything.  I know for a facty based on that thread that there's nothing scummy about this DLC.

I also know for a fact that people whined and complained about the Multiplayer.

And look at how well it was recieved when the demo came out.

People are jumping the gun so hard right now it's gone from "knee-jerk" reaction to "grand-mal seizure"

[mulder1199]

[quote]El Ejcovero wrote...

[quote]Yeah, its like drug users defending their drugdealer.

[/quote]


Wow, and you argue that the people who don't mind the DLC are idiots?

I believe you need to speak for yourselves before you claim to understand us.

[/quote]

No, but even if you are willing to let it slide, you have to admit it is a scumbag move. But then, people are willing to pay $120 for CoD every year, because of the franchise name, maybe the same is true here. That is how people like George Lucas kept on releasing movies...

[/quote]

there you go, that's it bad business (this is not) bad business ethics (definitely, or at least a bit shady)

Modifié par mulder1199, 22 février 2012 - 09:57 .

[El Ejcovero]

tsaio wrote...

bioware, when your precious biodrones are becoming the minority on your forums, you know you've got a problem.

I really wonder how these companies come to the conclusion that having their loyal fans hate them is a good thing.

[DJBare]

Draconis6666 wrote...

Legion being a DLC character would have in no way detracted from the plot or story of ME 2 the only thing it would detract from is the legion specific portion of the plot.

You are not serious with this statement?, you are!, Legion is the tie in to the whole Quarian/Geth story, he is the ambassador for the Geth.

[Draconis6666]

El Ejcovero wrote...

OmegaZyklon wrote...

Draconis6666 wrote...

Alek the Great wrote...

This is bullcrap, I tolerated the multitude of exclusive pre-order dlc but this has gone too far. Its like If legion was made a dlc character in ME2. This is a horrible business practice and needs to stop. Bioware deserves any flak they get from this.

Legion being a DLC character would have in no way detracted from the plot or story of ME 2 the only thing it would detract from is the legion specific portion of the plot.

This is bull@%#^ and everyone knows it.  Legion is a perfect example of what would be unacceptable DLC content.  An entire section of the storyline involves relations with the Geth.  His presence is required to facilitate choices made when interacting with the Geth.   Your opinion is officially worthless.

Exactly, although I bet this would be less of an offence, since Geth aren't the main plot, unlike the Protheans.

The prothans are not and never have been the main plot, the REAPERS are the main plot the protheans are simply an element of the REAPER plot that could easily be removed with a few alterations or replaced with any other race at a whim.

[N7Infernox]

tsaio wrote...

bioware, when your precious biodrones are quickly becoming the minority on your forums, you know you've got a problem.

This. Bioware needs to make some kind of statement.

[Draconis6666]

DJBare wrote...

Draconis6666 wrote...

Legion being a DLC character would have in no way detracted from the plot or story of ME 2 the only thing it would detract from is the legion specific portion of the plot.

You are not serious with this statement?, you are!, Legion is the tie in to the whole Quarian/Geth story, he is the ambassador for the Geth.

Which has nothing to do with the actual plot of ME 2

[Aspiriini]

Draconis6666. Seriously now. Listen to yourself.

[Theory75]

CDRSkyShepard wrote...

Theory75 wrote...

Oh and by the way to the people who compare this to Kasumis Memory, or LotSB, etc...The difference here is that they were developed AFTER the game itself was finished and released....So no, you can´t use those as comparison points.

Yeah, I can. You know why? Prothy was intended to be in the CE, that's why he was developed at the same time as the main game. Those that ordered the CE knew they were getting a special DLC squadmate, those that didn't knew that they weren't. 

Also, LotSB and Arrival are plot-critical, regardless of when they were developed. We still had to pay extra for them rather than downloading a patch or something free of charge, and if you didn't play them, some things in ME3 won't make sense. So, if you're wanting a worst offender in the DLC category, look at those two, not this.

Just to clarify, yea, I´ve played through all of the ME2 dlc.
Now, back on the subject - The main thing here and atleast the thing I am aggainst of is that when developing the main game you cut something off it and sell it as dlc. Selling an incomplete product is just plain wrong. Now I don't have a problem in dlc in general and dlc like KM and LotSB I'm completely fine with. The thing is that they weren't included (at least to my knowledge? or were they in the ps3 version maybe?) in any of the versions that were available on the release of the game. 

Now something as vital and relevant to the whole ME series as the protheans and limiting that contents availability to only the CE version, or otherwise you have to buy it separately at the release of the game, is still in my oppinion, just wrong.

Your thoughts ?

[Qunu]

I'm just trying to figure out why EA and Bioware has felt the need to go down this route. Why are they cutting out content from the game and re-selling it to people? Are they that self-destructive? Once again the idea that the average customer is being screwed while the pirates benefit from this scenario holds true.

And for everyone that is saying that ethics has no place in business, brush up on your history. Particularly European history 1900's to 1930's. Then tell me that ethic's has no place in business.

[CDRSkyShepard]

Daywalker315 wrote...

The PLC wrote...

Unbelievable that some people are actually defending this.. wow.

We're defending it because it's their prerogative to do whatever they want. It's their game. I ordered the CE with full knowledge I got a bonus character and mission. I fully expected it to be available to everyone else but if my bonus character and mission was given away freely to non-CE buyers I'd feel a little slighted. Either way, I'd move past it because I'm a grown-up and I realize that BioWare is a for-profit business that spent tens of millions of dollars making this game. They can sell it however they want to.

You, sir, deserve a cookie.

I may not be a fan of the Day 1 DLC game, but this was DLC that I was getting in my CE, and I knew I was getting it. I cannot condone special CE DLC that was advertised as being special CE DLC (even listed on the wiki page) being made available in the SE for free because then they go back on the CE folks who were told they'd get a special DLC character and mission included. 

[Daywalker315]

Armass81 wrote...

I think this is pretty unacceptable. You make content for a game, a freaking prothean no less, then you cut it from launch and charge 10 bucks from people who dont want to spent their money on CE. Why is this not free dlc like Zaeed? This is a clear bait and switch so you can get more money!

How greedy can you be? Goddammit Bioware!

I would bet good money that they couldn't even fit the 600MB+ download of this DLC onto the discs for Xbox. They have to be CRAMMED to fit ME3 and multiplayer onto two discs. So cut from launch might not be the best term. Sure, that doesn't preclude them from giving it away freely to everyone but honestly, I don't blame them for doing it this way. They spent tens of millions of dollars making the game, so they can sell it however they want to. What is a safe bet is that if it is optional DLC, then it's clear that having Prothy in your squad WILL NOT be crucial to the ME3 story. They wouldn't cut something that completely overhauls the narrative of the story. That wouldn't make sense because they would burn up their extra profits selling the DLC just making a whole new branch of story, dialogue, and so on. Extra lore, new abilities, cool to have ... check. Imperative to complete the story ... no.

People spend $60 on map packs for CoD, $10 for a weapon skin for Gears of War 3, and so on. BioWare isn't even close to that bad. They add optional characters and story for the price of a weapon skin. I can accept that.

[dangermouseuk78]

Draconis6666 wrote...

tsaio wrote...

The PLC wrote...

Unbelievable that some people are actually defending this.. wow.

some people are mentally challenged. please be kind to those less fortunate.

from what i can see the mentally challenged are the ones who keep yelling that its got to be vital to the story simply because its a prothean not the ones defending what is a widely accepted business practice in multiple other industries that no one rants and complains about.

Im not yelling Nor metally challenge thankyou very much, However having read the books, comics and gotten into the world of Mass Effect i cant believe that Living Prothean wouldnt be important to the story. if they are not important i cant  even see why they made the DLC apart from cashing.

Im not against day one DLC im just saying from a story point and how i would expect a Character such as Prothean to be part of it.

Thats Just my Opinion and your very much welcome to yours as well.

[mulder1199]

El Ejcovero wrote...

tsaio wrote...

bioware, when your precious biodrones are becoming the minority on your forums, you know you've got a problem.

I really wonder how these companies come to the conclusion that having their loyal fans hate them is a good thing.

loyal fans aren't where the money is to be made....casual fans are where it's at....

[Draconis6666]

Aspiriini wrote...

Draconis6666. Seriously now. Listen to yourself.

my arguments are far more logical and based in reality than

"OMG ITS A PROTHEAN IT HAZ TO BE IMPORTANT GAME WONT MAKE SENSE WITHOUT IT OMGZ!!!! PRE ORDER CANCLED!!!"

[Eain]

For anyone not getting this:

If you allow developers to get away with deciding which pre-release content they sell as a launch title and which gets sold as additional DLC, then you are effectively allowing them to RAISE THE PRICE OF THE FULL GAME.

Don't you people get it? EA would love nothing more than to charge you 80 bucks for a game at launch day, and if they get away with a single piece of 10 bucks launch DLC now, then next year they'll be getting away with two pieces because they'll just try keep pushing the boundaries of your tolerance.

This is business strategy 101. They want to see at which point your brains activate and you realise that you're actually just shelling out way more cash for a full game than you would've done five years ago.

Have mercy on your own bloody wallet and defend your consumer's rights. Draw the line HERE.

All pre-release content on one disk, or no sale. That is the stand you can make, and if you make it now you'll be thanking yourself for all the hundreds of dollars you've saved yourself on what would have been morally bankrupt DLC over the years.

Modifié par Eain, 22 février 2012 - 10:01 .

[eoinnx02]

They did do it with Kasumi. It's there as an option, like all DLC. Don't like it, don't buy it then. Yeah its annoying, but gaming companies are exactly that. Companies. Money is needed to make more games... allot of money in fact.

Basically it sucks that money exists.

[El Ejcovero]

mulder1199 wrote...

El Ejcovero wrote...

No, but even if you are willing to let it slide, you have to admit it is a scumbag move. But then, people are willing to pay $120 for CoD every year, because of the franchise name, maybe the same is true here. That is how people like George Lucas kept on releasing movies...

there you go, that's it bad business (this is not) bad business ethics (definitely)

Which is why I told Mclouvins, this is all about unethical business not bad business, because if the goal is to maximize profits, then we go ahead and sell in-game monocles at $70.

[RiouHotaru]

Theory75 wrote...

CDRSkyShepard wrote...

Theory75 wrote...

Oh and by the way to the people who compare this to Kasumis Memory, or LotSB, etc...The difference here is that they were developed AFTER the game itself was finished and released....So no, you can´t use those as comparison points.

Yeah, I can. You know why? Prothy was intended to be in the CE, that's why he was developed at the same time as the main game. Those that ordered the CE knew they were getting a special DLC squadmate, those that didn't knew that they weren't. 

Also, LotSB and Arrival are plot-critical, regardless of when they were developed. We still had to pay extra for them rather than downloading a patch or something free of charge, and if you didn't play them, some things in ME3 won't make sense. So, if you're wanting a worst offender in the DLC category, look at those two, not this.

Just to clarify, yea, I´ve played through all of the ME2 dlc.
Now, back on the subject - The main thing here and atleast the thing I am aggainst of is that when developing the main game you cut something off it and sell it as dlc. Selling an incomplete product is just plain wrong. Now I don't have a problem in dlc in general and dlc like KM and LotSB I'm completely fine with. The thing is that they weren't included (at least to my knowledge? or were they in the ps3 version maybe?) in any of the versions that were available on the release of the game. 

Now something as vital and relevant to the whole ME series as the protheans and limiting that contents availability to only the CE version, or otherwise you have to buy it separately at the release of the game, is still in my oppinion, just wrong.

Your thoughts ?

But Lair and Arrival aren't plot critical.  Anderson in the demo specifically DOES NOT mention Arrival since it's a default Shepard.  And Liara becoming the Shadow Broker in ME3 could be easily explained even if you didn't play Lair (she did it herself rather than have you help her)

[Giantdeathrobot]

To people whosay it wasn't cut from the game: uh, seriously? We heard about a ''secret DLC character'' ever sinc this summer. Protty was in the leaks since the beginning. His voice files are right in the demo We have heard about this DLC since before the game went Gold.

Or do you honestly think that, after the game went Gold, they went back to work in order to complete a mission and a whole new character (which needs to be inserted into the story, moreso because it's a damn Prothean) in time for lauch day? How can somebody be that blind? I mean, I like Bioware, but that's not even the point. You are doing a disservice to everyone by burying your head in the sand like this.

[N7Infernox]

CDRSkyShepard wrote...

Daywalker315 wrote...

The PLC wrote...

Unbelievable that some people are actually defending this.. wow.

We're defending it because it's their prerogative to do whatever they want. It's their game. I ordered the CE with full knowledge I got a bonus character and mission. I fully expected it to be available to everyone else but if my bonus character and mission was given away freely to non-CE buyers I'd feel a little slighted. Either way, I'd move past it because I'm a grown-up and I realize that BioWare is a for-profit business that spent tens of millions of dollars making this game. They can sell it however they want to.

You, sir, deserve a cookie.

I may not be a fan of the Day 1 DLC game, but this was DLC that I was getting in my CE, and I knew I was getting it. I cannot condone special CE DLC that was advertised as being special CE DLC (even listed on the wiki page) being made available in the SE for free because then they go back on the CE folks who were told they'd get a special DLC character and mission included. 

But what about the people who would pay for a CE, but couldn't get one in time? Or had their pre-order cheated from them? 

[RiouHotaru]

Eain wrote...

For anyone not getting this:

If you allow developers to get away with deciding which pre-release content they sell as a launch title and which gets sold as additional DLC, then you are effectively allowing them to RAISE THE PRICE OF THE FULL GAME.

Don't you people get it? EA would love nothing more than to charge you 80 bucks for a game at launch day, and if they get away with a single piece of 10 bucks launch DLC then next year they'll be getting away with two pieces because they'll just try keep pushing the boundary.

This is business strategy 101. They want to see at which point your brains activate and you realise that you're actually just shelling out way more cash for a full game than you would've done five years ago.

No it's not.  There's absolutely no evidence of this.  Just because a potential for abuse exists doesn't mean it's inevitable.

[Draconis6666]

dangermouseuk78 wrote...

Draconis6666 wrote...

tsaio wrote...

The PLC wrote...

Unbelievable that some people are actually defending this.. wow.

some people are mentally challenged. please be kind to those less fortunate.

from what i can see the mentally challenged are the ones who keep yelling that its got to be vital to the story simply because its a prothean not the ones defending what is a widely accepted business practice in multiple other industries that no one rants and complains about.

Im not yelling Nor metally challenge thankyou very much, However having read the books, comics and gotten into the world of Mass Effect i cant believe that Living Prothean wouldnt be important to the story. if they are not important i cant  even see why they made the DLC apart from cashing.

Im not against day one DLC im just saying from a story point and how i would expect a Character such as Prothean to be part of it.

Thats Just my Opinion and your very much welcome to yours as well.

Because for one you have no idea if any information he provides isnt already provided elsewhere, just because he is a living prothean doesnt mean he will provide any important information to the main plot of the Reapers. Suppose he was placed in Stasis before the reapers even arrived, what useful information would he have then? Does it really help to know the daily habits of Protheans? or other trivial information? There are plenty of reasons he might be of little to no help. Its all conjecture without being able to actualy play them and a rediculous reason to scream for a boycott. 

If you want to use Day 1 DLC as a reason then ok sure thats got plenty of valid points, but screaming that because it a prothean its super important and has to be cut content is rediculous.