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A lengthy look at general multiplayer tactics... (Beware: Wall of Text)


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#1
Solid Sherlock

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*I originally began this article as an explanation for my circle of friends and as such it can wonder around topics a bit. It wasn't my intention to really create anything formal or intricate. In the process of writing it however I felt that I should post it here with the objective being that if it even benefits a single player then it was perhaps a worthwhile endeavor. Note that in this guide I use the terms situational awareness, firing lane, area denial and killbox in their very casual definitions. I am certainly no expert on these topics and this article is merely a collection of my rudimentary observations. If you believe I have left out a critical point, that something is misleading, or I am just plain wrong then I implore you to speak up. I wish to have as open a discussion as possible so that we may possibly be made better players for it.


If I were asked what the one thing is that separates the good and bad players, it would be situational awareness. If were to only take away one thing from this guide, this I believe to be the most critical. While many have began to instinctively perform these actions without such examination, it is by putting it into simple language that those of us who haven't may begin to do so and those of us who have to improve through careful examination.


Situational Awareness
Particularly in our case called Battlefield Awareness, is remaining knowledgeable about your environment, the implications of every aspect of it, and it's projected status when variables have changed. To break that down in our situation this means to...

A.) Remain aware of the environment.
Know the map. Every nook and cranny. Know where every ammo boxes are and always know how much ammo you have left. Know which of you powers is best used in what situation and remain aware of the cooldown. Most
importantly this means knowing where the enemy is at all times. There is a phenomenon called tunnel vision in which we become so focused on an objective, such as bursting down an important target, that we lose awareness. It is critical to realize when your doing this. If you are shooting at an enemy and suddenly you are shot from the side or back, you weren't remaining as aware as you could have been. To prevent this you...

B.) Know the implications of everyaspect of the environment.
Know every piece of cover. Notice every direction in which every piece of cover gives you an advantage and more importantly note the weaknesses, which directions you can be shot from. Enemies will aggressively flank you which means trying to expose your weaker areas. Retaining awareness will allow you to react as quickly as possible when an enemy tries to do this. Knowing the cover intimately will allow you to move to a more favorable position where you gain the advantage, but it is absolutely key to retain awareness while doing this so that you do not expose yourself to the fire of another enemy. At any given time there is a most advantageous position to be in and you should be there. Variables change quickly however, so the most advantageous position one moment could be the worst the next. In order to determine what to do in these situations we must...

C.) Know all the possible outcomes of any given situation.
It is only through remaining aware of your environment and knowing the implications of it can we predict what will happen when variables change. This means knowing with confidence what to do no matter what happens. What if that enemy starts to flank you? Where will you move? What if there is an enemy turret around that corner? What if a phantom suddenly appears behind you? What if you head into that room and there are two atlas, three phantoms, a turret in opposite corners denying you cover, and smoke grenades are being tossed everywhere? We must ideally have a plan for each of the situations before you even turn that corner, head through that door, get shot in the back, etc. If that plan fails then you must in split seconds determine what the best course of action is. Expect your plan to fail miserably and have a second one immediately prepared. By layering these contingency plans we can retain the greatest advantage possible in any situation no matter what we are faced with.


Note that reading about this topic is certainly not enough, you must experience it.
Most importantly to capitalize on that experience, you must examine it. Soldiers in real life do not have the luxury of mistakes, but we do. A mistake is never a bad thing provided that you have learned from it. Any time you have done something wrong or even at any time in which you did not do the absolute best you could have, examine the implications of your actions. Study what you could have done to improve in that situation and experiment. Every mistake you make is an opportunity in which to learn a valuable lesson. The consequence of your actions essentially end with that session, but the lesson you potentially learn will be carried over into every game afterward. Playing it safe is usually good, until your faced with a worst case scenario. It is only by facing those situations and examining the implications of your actions can you know with certainty what to do when they happen. When you have become adept at adapting to the worst case scenario, you will find yourself maximizing advantages when your plans do succeed.


Splitting The Group
The second topic I'd like to discuss are the act of splitting into coordinated groups.

I cannot stress enough the advantages of dividing into two man teams.
Two individuals move together to support each other, never moving so far that they cannot support the other group. The ideal would be having one individual who can strip defenses (this can be through sustained fire or abilities like overload/energy drain) and the other who can provide some damage mitigation (this can be through krogan with fortification or even crowd control abilities like combat drone or stasis). Some abilities can do both, like overload, and some classes can do both, like engineer. Redundancy is a good thing provided you have divided the groups in the most advantageous way possible without leaving the other lacking. This changes depending on not only the skill of the player, their class, but even the choices in power evolutions. I wont go into listing the most advantageous groupings here because that could be an it's own very wordy topic. Moreover each group it would be good to have someone to have long range capability and one short range for maximum versatility.

Changing group dynamics on the fly is most advantageous.
If you'd have an appropriate amount of redundancy in capabilities, you could even further divide the group into several possible groupings given the situation. Group A, Player 1 (with long range) with player 2 (short range) would be default for adaptability and similarly with group B. Should you be faced with a situation such as enemies spawning down a long firing lane such as the Cerberus base, you could change the group dynamic to a second configuration. The groups then change to Group C, with both long range players setting up on the high ground, while Group D now formed of both short range players flaking the same enemy group and attack from the side through the corridors. You must understand in changing configurations like this, you are changing the strengths and weaknesses of each group. The concept relies upon knowing which group can capitalize on a given situation in order to play to it's strengths and minimize it's weaknesses. This is a very basic structure of the possibilities, attempting to maximize effectiveness for a given situation. It is key in using such a plan of course to have good communication and the players know exactly what to do when changing the group dynamics. Also a certain amount of redundancy is needed in roles such as defense stripping and damage mitigation, you do not want to leave any possible group configuration lacking in a key area if your goal is to maximize advantages while retaining adaptability for when variables change.

Mobility is absolutely key.
I touched on the aspect of flanking using these two groups and to do this it is not requir;. to get so complex as I have done in the paragraph above. The advantages of the two group structure are invaluable even with suboptimal groupings. This inherently provides damage mitigation by dividing enemy fire and splitting their attention, while giving you the advantage of focusing on more singular grouping. An enemy will often focus on one group, who is not even being actively damaged because of cover, while the second group sweeps those who are not focused on them. Each group covers the other to create a situation where you are mitigating damage to you and maximizing damage to them. Maximizing of course with area denial in such that an enemies cover may provide nearly complete defense to one groups firing lane, it provides none to a second group who is flanked to the side effectively denying them the area.

To use the term in a rudimentary fashion, this establishes a killbox.
This means that if the enemy takes cover from group a, group b has a clear firing lane to pick them off and vise versa. So no matter where they move, they will not have cover. For example anyone who has played enough at the Cerberus base may know about the L shaped area with a ladder down to it to the side of the center high ground with the ammo box. Enemies will often spawn near the landing pad down one alleyway as well as to the opposite side of the level parallel to the corridor. This makes being in that corner near the ladder into a killbox where if you take cover from one enemy group, the other can clearly hit you. I've seen it wipe entire groups due to a lack of understanding that this area is inherently disadvantageous. Our goal splitting into groups is to use this same tactic on the enemy. This goes back to battlefield awareness, knowing where the best position for each player to be at any given moment in direct relation to each other player and each other enemy.



In conclusion, I have been playing far to much trying to get my girlfriend the asari adept.

Modifié par Solid Sherlock, 23 février 2012 - 11:33 .


#2
AreleX

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this is all very good information and i suggest anyone looking to improve takes the time to read it

#3
Cicero.me

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http://t2.gstatic.co...R_XtBDHjvKmqqgn

Really though nice post, wish more were like these honestly.

#4
Cicero.me

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Double post

Modifié par Cicero.me, 22 février 2012 - 02:02 .


#5
NekOoNinja

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Well said. You put a lot of effort into this, much appreciated. Some bits of this sound like drawn from the shooter bible (Know the map, stay in motion) for noobies, because it is the essence of such action games. Stay alert, and evalue situations in fragments of a second. Becomes second nature after enough practice, so one should not feel discouraged if it won't work right away. Memorizing maps also takes time.

But in the end it makes for a better player, and a more satisfying game experience.

Wheres that upvote button....

Modifié par NekOoNinja, 22 février 2012 - 02:05 .


#6
jtg556

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Great guide, but would you please stick some headers on your paragraphs for easy reference and navigation, splitting up a wall of text into smaller walls doesn't really help. Anyway, I really love the idea of two man teams working together to flank, I think I'll have to organize that next time I play with friends. We have 2 vanguards and 2 techs so balanced teams be damned, I want a vanguard fireteam which charges in unison. The ultimate flanking tool.

#7
Solid Sherlock

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I thank you all for your compliments.

NekOoNinja : While I am not much of a shooter player anymore, I have played them quite a bit in the past. Your absolutely correct that much of this would apply to any first-person or third-person shooter. Also it's just as you have said, not much of this is going to cause drastic changes overnight. Practicing battlefield awareness takes time and honestly it's hard to say that it cannot always be improved upon.

jtg556 : Your quite right, it was very assaulting to the eyes. I added some headers like you've suggested, how's it look now?
Your idea of two vanguards would absolutely work, you've just got to know when to adapt and change the group dynamic. There are going be situations where the vanguard team is superior and there are going to be times where a vanguard/tech mix is superior. Learning which of those situations calls for each is the real trick here. Fortunately vanguards and infiltrators as well have amazing mobility which translates to flexibility in rapidly changing that dynamic.

Modifié par Solid Sherlock, 22 février 2012 - 02:50 .


#8
javierabegazo

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Nice post :) It would be nice to play alongside you sometime

#9
jtg556

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Solid Sherlock wrote...

I thank you all for your compliments.

NekOoNinja : While I am not much of a shooter player anymore, I have played them quite a bit in the past. Your absolutely correct that much of this would apply to any first-person or third-person shooter. Also it's just as you have said, not much of this is going to cause drastic changes overnight. Practicing battlefield awareness takes time and honestly it's hard to say that it cannot always be improved upon.

jtg556 : Your quite right, it was very assaulting to the eyes. I added some headers like you've suggested, how's it look now?
Your idea of two vanguards would absolutely work, you've just got to know when to adapt and change the group dynamic. There are going be situations where the vanguard team is superior and there are going to be times where a vanguard/tech mix is superior. Learning which of those situations calls for each is the real trick here. Fortunately vanguards and infiltrators as well have amazing mobility which translates to flexibility in rapidly changing that dynamic.


Yeah sorry to nitpick a great post but that small change really makes it so much better. Anyway, when the eventual strategy guide compilation thread for ME3 comes out make sure to get this included, more people really need to read this, the tactical suggestions are great and I wish I had thought of a few myself. Purely out of curiosity, what is your preferred class?

#10
Solid Sherlock

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jtg556 wrote...

Yeah sorry to nitpick a great post but that small change really makes it so much better. Anyway, when the eventual strategy guide compilation thread for ME3 comes out make sure to get this included, more people really need to read this, the tactical suggestions are great and I wish I had thought of a few myself. Purely out of curiosity, what is your preferred class?


No need to apologize, not a nitpick at all. It was definitely hard to read.
Had no clue there is going to be a strategy guide compilation thread, I'll try to get this added when it happens.

Honestly it's hard to say there is one class which class I prefer, I've just been steadily alternating between them all because it allows me to know their strengths which is essential to maximizing my teammates advantages. Also each forces me to use a different skillset, which I think overall makes me a better player with the lesson I learn from each of them. It's why the unlock system doesn't bother me in the slightest. Note that I do not have Quarian Engineer and Asari Adept as I'm lacking those two. The only one I've not enjoyed was human soldier, but the Krogan is pretty fantastic. Turian Sentinel brings some good utility to the table with how rediculous Overload stripping/stunning is plus warp detonating teammates biotics on top of tech armor survivability. While I play him alot, the lack of roll really bothers me. Salarian Infiltrator particularily as a shotgun/melee build is pretty devistating with the addition of energy drain. That mobility from tactical cloak combined with ability to strip shields makes them practically unkillable while also allowing them to take out any target.

I suppose I'd say I gravitate towards Human Engineer. Incinerate burns away armor and health as well as causing the enemy to panic. Overload's instantaneous hit, striping shields, jumping across targets, and stunning is probably downright broken. Even those two alone with a pathetic third power and it'd still probably be a fantastic class, but then on top of that you've got the amazing combat drone stunning and causing targets not to shoot you or teammates. Maxed out cooldowns with a scoped+barrel phalanx means constant power spam as well as the ability to snipe at long range and still deal well at close. Never have to worry about running out of ammo either. The human engineer just brings so much utility to the table being able to solo silver as well as providing so much advantage for teammates.

Modifié par Solid Sherlock, 22 février 2012 - 04:50 .


#11
jtg556

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About the compilation thread this was the ME2 one http://social.biowar...1/index/2749272 It was incredibly useful for a beginning reference point when starting new classes etc. I would recommend you read this http://social.biowar...8411/blog/2696/ as it is similar to yours but also valuable even if it applies more to ME2. When the full game gets released you can touch your guide up, incorporate new info from the full game and get it put in. Anyway, I actually feel the exact same way about the classes having tried them all. They were all great in their own way except soldier, who, due to the overall nerf in weapon damage and the weight capacity system is really crippled. Concussive shot, while nice, is just throw with a longer cooldown. I actually decided on the exact same build in the end - Human engineer + Phalanx. Only taking one gun to lower cooldowns though, I decided to sacrifice accuracy and take the scope off for CQC aiming.
And I'm sure you already know this, but in case you don't, and as if engineer powers aren't effective enough alone, overload + incinerate combos into tech burst. That really sold the engineer for me over the adept, which is fun but completely eclipsed by the engineer.
 I do have to credit the shotgun Infiltrator though for CQC power, trivializing objectives and survivability due to cloak as 2nd place.

Modifié par jtg556, 22 février 2012 - 05:03 .


#12
Guest_A Space Ostrich_*

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I can't decide between the engineer, infiltrator, or sentinel. I also got lucky with an asari adept in my free beginners pack so I'm almost obliged to use it. Any suggestions?

#13
Zzinged

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Solid Sherlock wrote...



In conclusion, I have been playing far to much trying to get my girlfriend the asari adept.


The ultimate goal is revealed! :lol:

#14
jtg556

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A Space Ostrich wrote...

I can't decide between the engineer, infiltrator, or sentinel. I also got lucky with an asari adept in my free beginners pack so I'm almost obliged to use it. Any suggestions?


             I realize this is not my topic but like the OP I have played every class (for me save Krogan soldier and Turian sentinel, I haven't been lucky enough to get these two). As useful as the asari adept is on phantoms, it's not really a beginner's class due to general squishiness, and you should definitely not use it if you're not even considering using the class to begin with. It's my personal feeling that you should start with the human classes as they are usually the best balanced and include all the basic game mechanics you need to learn, and think of alien classes as more specialized, advanced builds for when you understand the game a little better and what you want your niche to be in a team.
            That said, of the three classes i would not do sentinel. It's not bad, but it really is not for new demo players either. Firstly, tech armor provides up to 40% damage reduction but will increase cooldowns 80%, so it is not always easy knowing when to or even remembering to activate it. Second, warp and throw are not the most effective power set to begin with, and although they combo (warp + throw) they won't help you against shielded enemies. Basically, if you want to do it, it is best played as a turian for the shield buff (it is a tank class), which is a race you don't have yet and for the overload power against shields.
           Now between infiltrator and engineer - Infiltrator cloak is very forgiving to your tactical mistakes, press Y and run and you've escaped a nasty situation. Cloak is best used for hit and run tactics in close, esp w/ a shotgun. Cloak behind an enemy, shoot, take cover and disappear again. It can also be used as a damage buff for snipers, but I see that as a waste of its potential. If you want to use it for snipers, use it for the damage bonus but don't forget to use it to reposition for a better shot if you want to make full use. Cryo is a useful skill in CQC, but only on unprotected enemies. Guardians will be hard for you because they seem to turn to face you even when you are cloaked if you get too close. Also, you have no natural powers vs Phantoms, the arguably deadliest enemy in game. That means your best defense is usually to cloak and run against these enemies. Your best advantage is your ability to cloak and take objectives and make revives w/o drawing fire.
        As an engineer you have natural power to deal with every defense in the game and a combat drone on top of that. If you go this route, take minimal weapons to reduce cooldowns. Remember that overload, while a shield power, also stuns and electrocutes unprotected enemies, and when upgraded to chain is devastating in CQC. Also Overload + Incinerate on a single target creates a large electrical fire explosion. Plus you have combat drone, always a joy to use. Drone can be cast behind guardians to turn them around and expose their back, and at an Atlas or Phantom to distract them while you attack. It can also taser a group of enemies repeatedly, stunlocking them. You are probably the best rounded class, and no enemy will be a problem for you. It might sound a bit boring, but drone really makes this a a fun and dynamic class to use.  
Well, good luck with whatever you choose, all the classes are really great. Except soldier.

Modifié par jtg556, 22 février 2012 - 05:34 .


#15
Solid Sherlock

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jtg556: That is a well composed guide, makes me wish I'd composed mine in a similar manner.
I think you misunderstood me, I'm only taking the phalanx. No way would I increase my cooldowns on the engineer, I don't much like doing it on any class for that matter. In my experience the pistols just perform to well to make many weighted weapons worthwhile with few exceptions. I was really on the fence about the scope as well, but trust me on this. Practice firing it without using the zoom and eventually any downside to the scope dissapears and can provide a huge advantage. I did just discover the tech burst two days ago and man am I glad they added it, it can be really devistating. It's funny because I'm primarily an adept player in single player, with engineer never really appealing to me. They really did a good job of making each class interesting to me this time.
Good to know there are other shotgun salarians out there, every time I see one sniping I cry at little inside after realizing how powerful they are at close range.

A Space Ostrich:
Why choose? Play them all, you'll learn a different skillset with each, know the strengths/weaknesses of your teammates when they are playing them, and be a better player for it. It's not like were playing an mmo where it takes so long to level. Only real reason to devote to one class would be to get to gold asap and earn packs as quickly as possible for weapon unlocks. What jtg556 said about the classes is right on the money. Personally I think the human sentinel and infiltrator somewhat pale in comparison to their alien counterparts. That said, they certainly aren't bad either. I think the real solution here is for you to play each and find which suits you the best.

#16
cronshaw8

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Solid Sherlock wrote...

 Any time you have done something wrong or even at any time in which you did not do the absolute best you could have, examine the implications of your actions. Study what you could have done to improve in that situation and experiment. Every mistake you make is an opportunity in which to learn a valuable lesson. 


Good post. This happened to me today. I was playing a quick match with a team of three, on the Ghost map. I was covering the wide open area with my Turian Sentinel. I was sniping away and forgot about my left flank. I had been periodically checking my right but not my left and boom kabobed by a phantom. I realized that if i were going to be by myself i should have set up back further so i could more easially check my left and right flanks. As you say ideally there would have been another player there to cover me, but that is how is goes in quick matches sometimes. And as you say every failure is a learning oppurtunity.

Modifié par cronshaw8, 23 février 2012 - 01:29 .


#17
jtg556

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Oh I didn't actually write the one I linked you, that was Thisisme8's guide from his blog on here. I was always going to write my own ME2 combat guide but I never got around to it so I guess I'll do one after ME3 releases. Thisisme was one of the best ME2 Insanity players but I don't think he's active on the forums anymore.

#18
vonSlash

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jtg556 wrote...

A Space Ostrich wrote...

I can't decide between the engineer, infiltrator, or sentinel. I also got lucky with an asari adept in my free beginners pack so I'm almost obliged to use it. Any suggestions?


             I realize this is not my topic but like the OP I have played every class (for me save Krogan soldier and Turian sentinel, I haven't been lucky enough to get these two). As useful as the asari adept is on phantoms, it's not really a beginner's class due to general squishiness, and you should definitely not use it if you're not even considering using the class to begin with. It's my personal feeling that you should start with the human classes as they are usually the best balanced and include all the basic game mechanics you need to learn, and think of alien classes as more specialized, advanced builds for when you understand the game a little better and what you want your niche to be in a team.
            That said, of the three classes i would not do sentinel. It's not bad, but it really is not for new demo players either. Firstly, tech armor provides up to 40% damage reduction but will increase cooldowns 80%, so it is not always easy knowing when to or even remembering to activate it. Second, warp and throw are not the most effective power set to begin with, and although they combo (warp + throw) they won't help you against shielded enemies. Basically, if you want to do it, it is best played as a turian for the shield buff (it is a tank class), which is a race you don't have yet and for the overload power against shields.
           Now between infiltrator and engineer - Infiltrator cloak is very forgiving to your tactical mistakes, press Y and run and you've escaped a nasty situation. Cloak is best used for hit and run tactics in close, esp w/ a shotgun. Cloak behind an enemy, shoot, take cover and disappear again. It can also be used as a damage buff for snipers, but I see that as a waste of its potential. If you want to use it for snipers, use it for the damage bonus but don't forget to use it to reposition for a better shot if you want to make full use. Cryo is a useful skill in CQC, but only on unprotected enemies. Guardians will be hard for you because they seem to turn to face you even when you are cloaked if you get too close. Also, you have no natural powers vs Phantoms, the arguably deadliest enemy in game. That means your best defense is usually to cloak and run against these enemies. Your best advantage is your ability to cloak and take objectives and make revives w/o drawing fire.
        As an engineer you have natural power to deal with every defense in the game and a combat drone on top of that. If you go this route, take minimal weapons to reduce cooldowns. Remember that overload, while a shield power, also stuns and electrocutes unprotected enemies, and when upgraded to chain is devastating in CQC. Also Overload + Incinerate on a single target creates a large electrical fire explosion. Plus you have combat drone, always a joy to use. Drone can be cast behind guardians to turn them around and expose their back, and at an Atlas or Phantom to distract them while you attack. It can also taser a group of enemies repeatedly, stunlocking them. You are probably the best rounded class, and no enemy will be a problem for you. It might sound a bit boring, but drone really makes this a a fun and dynamic class to use.  
Well, good luck with whatever you choose, all the classes are really great. Except soldier.


This was an excellent and helpful post until the bit I underlined. Apparently, however, you've been too busy figuring out all the useful applications of powers to discover any of the useful applications of gunfire.

#19
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I've got the hang of my adept and infiltrator, so I'm focusing on the engi to round out my skills. I ditched sentinel after realising how useless the moves were for my playstyle.

#20
Blissey1

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I try to be a good player that maintains situational awareness and coordinate with my teammate. I'm rather good at it with my engineer!

But when I'm on my krogan soldier, the rage overtakes me...I can't help it!

#21
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vonSlash wrote...
This was an excellent and helpful post until the bit I underlined. Apparently, however, you've been too busy figuring out all the useful applications of powers to discover any of the useful applications of gunfire.

That's exactly the problem though. Because powers have been buffed and gunfire nerfed, the soldier has lost its place. In ME2, the soldier had the largest amount of health/shields and was the only class able to use assault rifles. If you notice now though, every class starts with 500/500 health/shields. Additionally, if you played soldier, I'm sure you remember the brutal effectiveness of adrenaline rush. Adrenaline rush is frankly underwhelming in ME3. Instead of compensating for removing time slowdown (in MP only ofc) they nerfed it further. About their other powers, Concussive shot is basically a weaker, longer cooldown version of throw and frag grenade, while decent, is limited by carrying capacity. It is also of note you lose access to the ammo powers which used to make you more damaging by ~60%. And this could conceivably be a bug, but I've noticed you can only refill grenades from each ammo box once a round, necessitating hoarding your best power. And again, if you played ME2 you would notice the huge nerfing of the effectiveness of assault rifles, SMGs and (to a lesser degree) snipers. The most effective weapons right now are heavy pistols which are more powerful and more accurate than an assault rifle. This allows a caster class to use a Carnifex and retain the power of a shotgun up close and the accuracy of a sniper at range. The fact is gunfire is simply less effective at taking down enemies than it was and the heavier weapons do no better than a pistol. The one advantage soldiers have left is the ability to carry more weapons, but the advantage is not as big as it seems and carrying more weapons does not make you drastically more effective as I detailed above. If you must be a weapon using tank, Sentinel is a far better option due to a 40% damage reduction with tech armor and a useful power set. If you consider CS=Throw, warp is clearly better than frags as it is unlimited and can set off detonations in concert with throw. But all that is theoretical. In practice you will find yourself shooting through shields you could have overloaded as an tech class, shooting through health you could have detonated in a brilliant explosion as an biotic, in CQC you lack the survivability of a sentinel or the agility of a vanguard, as a sniper and objective capper you are inferior to the infiltrator, you have 0 crowd control, and you aren't the jack of all trades the sentinel is. So where does that leave you as a soldier? (*Krogan soldier is a special case ofc, but fortification makes it more of a sentinel in class composition imo)

#22
Solid Sherlock

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vonSlash: Unfortunately jtg556 is correct. Listen to this man, he hit on every point that I was going to say. Please don't take us saying this as being some sort of opposition against you, the situation is quite the opposite. I want to see the soldier be the class it should be. It's only by meticulously examining these faults and bringing them to bioware's attention can the soldier be put in it's rightful place.

A Space Ostrich: Good to hear Ostrich, keep at it.

Blissy1: Your certainly not the only one, with that glorious krogan laugh upon melee it's hard not to.

Modifié par Solid Sherlock, 23 février 2012 - 10:07 .


#23
stysiaq

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jtg556 wrote...

vonSlash wrote...
This was an excellent and helpful post until the bit I underlined. Apparently, however, you've been too busy figuring out all the useful applications of powers to discover any of the useful applications of gunfire.

That's exactly the problem though. Because powers have been buffed and gunfire nerfed, the soldier has lost its place. In ME2, the soldier had the largest amount of health/shields and was the only class able to use assault rifles. If you notice now though, every class starts with 500/500 health/shields. Additionally, if you played soldier, I'm sure you remember the brutal effectiveness of adrenaline rush. Adrenaline rush is frankly underwhelming in ME3. Instead of compensating for removing time slowdown (in MP only ofc) they nerfed it further. About their other powers, Concussive shot is basically a weaker, longer cooldown version of throw and frag grenade, while decent, is limited by carrying capacity. It is also of note you lose access to the ammo powers which used to make you more damaging by ~60%. And this could conceivably be a bug, but I've noticed you can only refill grenades from each ammo box once a round, necessitating hoarding your best power. And again, if you played ME2 you would notice the huge nerfing of the effectiveness of assault rifles, SMGs and (to a lesser degree) snipers. The most effective weapons right now are heavy pistols which are more powerful and more accurate than an assault rifle. This allows a caster class to use a Carnifex and retain the power of a shotgun up close and the accuracy of a sniper at range. The fact is gunfire is simply less effective at taking down enemies than it was and the heavier weapons do no better than a pistol. The one advantage soldiers have left is the ability to carry more weapons, but the advantage is not as big as it seems and carrying more weapons does not make you drastically more effective as I detailed above. If you must be a weapon using tank, Sentinel is a far better option due to a 40% damage reduction with tech armor and a useful power set. If you consider CS=Throw, warp is clearly better than frags as it is unlimited and can set off detonations in concert with throw. But all that is theoretical. In practice you will find yourself shooting through shields you could have overloaded as an tech class, shooting through health you could have detonated in a brilliant explosion as an biotic, in CQC you lack the survivability of a sentinel or the agility of a vanguard, as a sniper and objective capper you are inferior to the infiltrator, you have 0 crowd control, and you aren't the jack of all trades the sentinel is. So where does that leave you as a soldier? (*Krogan soldier is a special case ofc, but fortification makes it more of a sentinel in class composition imo)


That man is right. human soldier is very underwhelming. Soldiers should have a gunfire damage bonus on every level of their passive, to even come close to the other classes effectiveness.
I play my Krogan almost the same way as I play my Turian sentinel - lots of melee, Claymore-only. Unfortunately I wasted some points in inferno Grenade, so I won't max the passive. With the Turian I max everything but Warp, which I ommit, resulting in a tanky melee oriented build still able to strip down shields with overload. The Krogan plays almost the same, but he has even stronger melee and Carnage instead of Overload.

I don't have any idea how to build my Human Soldier. Ammo packs are plentiful, so the grenade looks like an option, but the Adrenaline Rush doesn,t have the kick at all. Krogans get it pretty much for free. Concussive Shot is redundant, because your squadmates have better powers anytime. Ammo is so plentiful you don't need the extra guns, and the capabilities of Heavy Pistols are just sick.
Soldiers should have an access to exclusive and (pretty much) overpowered weapons. Like making the Carnifex human-soldier only. Or giving them an AR superior to all the others due to the special treatment by the HQ.

#24
xcrunr1647

xcrunr1647
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I agree completely that Adrenaline Rush blows chunks in multiplayer. I have two points in it because I put a second one in it before I realized that it was terrible. Luckily I can still max everything else =)

Oddly enough, I get the highest scores (by far, its not a close call) with my human soldier. I'm typically #1 or #2 on most of my classes...on my human soldier I'm typically #1 and out in front by a solid 15-20k on bronze. I don't understand it.

@stysiaq: Concussive shot is definitely not redundant. It's the most useful ability that is truly spammable. One of my teammates yesterday that is relatively new to the demo (N7 rating of <20) kept saying "There's an Atlas!" and we were like "Where?" He said, "I don't know, but I can feel it and hear it!" "Nah bro, that's my concussive shot haha."

The cooldown on my human soldier's Concussive Shot is just over a second. Between that and frag grenades, I could make it through the entire match and not even need to fire a single round.

#25
Solid Sherlock

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xcrunr1647: If your making those kinds of scores your skill is to high to be on bronze. Play the higher difficulty levels and you'll soon find you never want to go back.