13369 réponses à ce sujet

[tetrisblock4x1]

So there are two kinds of people: those of us who believe that the squaddie DLC is cut from the game and has been on the disc for a large portion of the development cycle, and those who buy into their claim that this is just a last minute addition so there is no way that the character could have made it beofre going gold.

Well if the former is true then that means he is a fully realized character who could easily have a lot of plot importance and having to pay for that would clearly prove that Bioware are milking the audience, and nobody wants that. But on the other hand, if you believe the latter, this implies that Bioware have taken the games most interesting and important
character right next to the Reapers, and treated the character merely as side content who is a mere curiosity and not all that important to the plot. So we're either been milked or the character is not getting the full respect it deserves by been fully integrated into the games plot and frankly considering how huge the character is it shouldn't have been added into the game like just another squad mate. So either way we all lose.

Modifié par tetrisblock4x1, 24 février 2012 - 12:43 .

[Yuoaman]

Goth Skunk wrote...

Yuoaman wrote...

Goth Skunk wrote...

Massefeckt wrote...

Wow you take this thing wayyyyy to seriously. Bioware aren't members of your family, they aren't your friends, they are a business out to make as much money as possible and will screw people over to get it.

And this, ladies and gentlemen, is why I am here. Scathing, audacious accusations like this.

Because people are somewhat cynical about capitalism? Odd reason, but who am I to judge?

Spare me the condescenscion, if you want me to treat you civilly. You know damn well that bolded remark is a direct knock on BioWare and not on capitalism in general.

I think I've earned a little snark - but I'll cut it out. I know the remark was aimed at Bioware, but the practice that people take issue with is one which capitalism fosters, you have to admit.

And no I'm not trying to start some sort of tirade against capitalism here, just clarifying my statement.

[Heimdall]

nightcobra8928 wrote...

ElementL09 wrote...

piemanz wrote...

Heres the problem as i see it.

CE owner: Hmm an extra squad member, I think i will purchase that
SE owner:Meh, I'll stick with the standard edition i'm sure they'll release it at some point
Bioware: It's a Prothean
CE owner:WOOOOHOOOOO!
SE owner: OMFG, DO WANT!!!!
Bioware:It's ok you can purchase it on release! woot!
SE owner:OMFG WTFBBQ! DAY 1 DLC!?!

CE owner:  Well thats not right, the CE is well worth the 80$ without From Ashes, why can't everyone who purchases the game new get it for free at launch?  Why not make it like Zaeed and Firewalker (which both I thoroughly enjoyed)?

that's my reasoning, but i don't know maybe some CE people think they're actually paying for the DLC which they actually aren't really, even bioware said the DLC was free for them making those 20$ extra dollars for the collectibles even if their intention to buy the CE edition was for the DLC in the first place. 

"Myster Squadmate" was part of the CE from the start.  We ARE paying for it.

[Tiax Rules All]

I just want to remind some people that gameplay and story elements should have never been included in the Collectors Edition in the first place.

Why? Because then the differences between the editions makes it seem like te Standard Edition is not complete and even though the SE has a beggining, middle and end, it has a missing element of the game that others got at launch. Its an obvoius marketing ploy. They can deny that it effects the game much or that it was part of the original game and cut later but the message that gets out there and sticks is that "you dont have everything there is to have at launch unless you pay unpressidented amounts of money on day 1 for a normal game.

How does a SE owner NOT feel like he is getting an incomplete copy of the game.

I have no problem with CE's coming with any kind of exclusive content they want as long as it is collectables and artwork and other cosmetic stuff.

The arguement about how much or "what, you can't afford $10" is irrelevant. It should be free because nobody should ever feel like the game they buy at launch day is incomplete.

If Bioware and EA had any real balls they would have just made the SE $79.99 in stores with all the content, take it r leave it. Because thats what it really comes down to. They want 80, not 70 from you at launch day. It just too much. Not because of the sheer value of $10 but for one thing that people don't seem to get here, Principle.

[Bibdy]

Just swinging by with my first post in a long time to say I'm so insulted by this action that I cancelled my pre-order yesterday, throwing away a $12 discount at newegg.com. So, yes, I still would have saved $2, but it's not about the money. It's about the crude, unsubtle monetization tactics by dangling cash-carrots in front of me in order to extract more dollars from my wallet on release day. I find this kind treatment insulting and antithetical to how I believe gaming should be. I don't think it's a wild stretch of the imagination to imagine EA becoming the first publisher to attempt to bring Pay-2-Win mechanisms (currently restricted to Free-to-Play games) into mainstream upfront-purchase multiplayer gaming, and so I'm drawing my line in the sand here. I used to love the release-day rush, but I think you've finally killed it for me.

And a great shame, too. After the DA2 'lazy/rushed gamecraft' debacle, you rebuilt a lot of goodwill with me through TOR and the DA2 DLC. But, in one moment you reminded me that it's just not about us.

[Solgineer]

Chozo_Hybrid wrote...

How about they reduce the CE by ten bucks and include it in the SE of the game? Refend those by ten bucks who bought the CE and have already paid etc.

In an ideal world perhaps.

I had the idea that maybe SE purchasers could get From Ashers for free, like what was done for the Cerberus Network. In substitution for CE buyers, they could get the Prothean race to play as online and only they could play as it, so they can feel all special and tingly about it. Mostly it'll have Human abilities and be a skin I hope, but whatever.

[Leaser Resael]

PetrySilva wrote...

mogonk wrote...

If games were "worth" $70, companies would charge $70 for them and customers would pay it.  The fact that they don't means they aren't.  That's market capitalism.

Day 1 DLC is effectively a raise in the price of the game that is designed to trick the consumer into believing it's cheaper than it is.  It's a way of pricing the game at $70 without putting a $70 price tag on it. 

In the same way that the real cost of most f2p games is higher than their p2p counterparts, DLC is a way of misleading players into misperceiving the real costs of their purchase.  In both cases this is achieved by making the player pay for content.  When that content is not produced outside of the development cycle, but as part of the development process, this becomes particularly egregious.  That's what we have here. 

I can understand why some consumers would grumble about this, but buy the game anyway.  What I cannot understand is why some consumers defend with great intensity a company that is adopting business practices that hurt them.

It's sorta surreal.  The kind of thing one might expect to read in a dystopian science fiction novel.

Ever heard of people who got raped and said: "thank you for raping me"?

That's exactly what's happening to Bioware's defence force.

+1

The funny thing is that Bioware said that they couldn't implement proper joystick support in the game, HD textures or weapon holster on the PC version (to mention something) because they didn't have the people and time to do it before release, but all of the sudden they had an entire different team making this dlc? So instead of making every version the best possible one with proper support, they put people to work on DLC, and that DLC is a prothean, the last of it's race alive?
This is so wrong in so many ways that it's just sad to see Bioware doing it but is even more sad to see people defending them.

[Kithrus]

Chozo_Hybrid wrote...

How about they reduce the CE by ten bucks and include it in the SE of the game? Refend those by ten bucks who bought the CE and have already paid etc.

In an ideal world perhaps.

When you buy a game your paying from the moment the devolpment team clocks in day 1 to the day they clock out the night before launch. Them taking that time to make other content then charging for it is wrong.

There are exceptions to this rule like weapons skins and other causmetic things but thats not what this DLC.

Do I care that its a Prothean... A bit yes but I care more that its a content DLC I'm paying for technically twice.

I won't lie, I expected this extra charater to be like Zaeed in the second game. He makes some witty comments in his room but doesn't have a diologue tree and a small mission.

That would have been something I could grudgingly let slide.

However.... We have a charater who clearly unless Bioware is stupid has a full fleshed out plot interweaved into the exsisting story with missions, new powers, diolog and who knows what else.

thats more then a tiny DLC.

So selling that on day one is bad marketing. Not from a money stand point but ethically from a customer relations stand point.

The Question is what will they be willing to do next time? Whill they be honest and let us have the future Shale free because it was meant for the game or charge us because they can?

I know this DLC wasn't meant to be anything but a DLC but that fact bugs me too.

Modifié par Kithrus, 24 février 2012 - 12:44 .

[Heimdall]

tetrisblock4x1 wrote...

So there are two kinds of people: those of us who believe that the
squaddie DLC is cut from the game and has been on the disc for a large
portion of the development cycle, and those who buy into their claim
that this is just a last minute addition so there is no way that the
character could have made it beofre going gold.

Well if the
former is true then that means he is a fully realized character who
could easily have a lot of plot importance and having to pay for that
would clearly prove that Bioware are milking the audience, and nobody
wants that. But on the other hand, if you believe the latter, this
implies that Bioware have taken the games most interesting and important
character right next to the Reapers, and treated the character merely as
side content who is a mere curiosity and not all that important to the plot. So we're either been milked or the character is
not getting the full respect it deserves by been fully integrated into
the games plot and frankly considering how huge the character is it
shouldn't have been added into the game like just another squad mate.

The character was in the original script but was cut because he took the spotlight away from Shepard.  They later decided to include him as DLC.  Just because you find the Protheans so fascinating in no way makes it innapproriate to have one as side content.

[nightcobra]

Chozo_Hybrid wrote...

How about they reduce the CE by ten bucks and include it in the SE of the game? Refend those by ten bucks who bought the CE and have already paid etc.

In an ideal world perhaps.

except you didn'y pay for the DLC in the CE, version.
the DLC was free as said by bioware but they put it there for a reason, to entice you to shell out those 20$ that were the collectibles.

[rainasa]

ArkkAngel007 wrote...

GnusmasTHX wrote...

 

ArkkAngel007 wrote...



Ok.  Original script, back in the pre-development stages, he was a central character.  The issue was though that pretty much Shepard became irrelevent to the point where he was no more than a very vocal bodyguard with lots of friends and personal issues, while the Prothean carried the whole plot on his shoulders.  There was also a few points in the script where things involving him were...not good, at all.  Thus, amongst other issues, the original draft was rewritten with a plot more focused on Shepard to give the player a better sense of involvement in what is going on, that they are directing the outcome of this thing and not some 50,000 year old arrogant ******bag.

Now, he's just a bonus squadmate with altenative viewpoints on what you can already learn in the retail game, and has nothing to do with the overall plot of the game.

 

I've read A script, apparently now there are two, though, and in the one I read, which was months back he did virtually nothing of note.

I'm sure you read the current one, while incomplete at the time, that was used for the retail version.  The old one was really focused on him...kidnapping cliches included.  He wasn't a permanent squad member either.

They basically used the same planet and banter dialogue, but that was it.  Everything else is vastly different.

yea, from what i remember of the script his story was....subpar to say the least and im glad the focus on him was removed. my main issue was that they choose someone from his calibur (a friggen prothean) and the first dlc to do, i would have much rathered prefred someone less....volitle and had them simply wait a few months before they released the prothean as a priced DLC squadmate.

Modifié par rainasa, 24 février 2012 - 12:46 .

[Gobbi82]

Tiax Rules All wrote...

I just want to remind some people that gameplay and story elements should have never been included in the Collectors Edition in the first place.

Why? Because then the differences between the editions makes it seem like te Standard Edition is not complete and even though the SE has a beggining, middle and end, it has a missing element of the game that others got at launch. Its an obvoius marketing ploy. They can deny that it effects the game much or that it was part of the original game and cut later but the message that gets out there and sticks is that "you dont have everything there is to have at launch unless you pay unpressidented amounts of money on day 1 for a normal game.

How does a SE owner NOT feel like he is getting an incomplete copy of the game.

I have no problem with CE's coming with any kind of exclusive content they want as long as it is collectables and artwork and other cosmetic stuff.

The arguement about how much or "what, you can't afford $10" is irrelevant. It should be free because nobody should ever feel like the game they buy at launch day is incomplete.

If Bioware and EA had any real balls they would have just made the SE $79.99 in stores with all the content, take it r leave it. Because thats what it really comes down to. They want 80, not 70 from you at launch day. It just too much. Not because of the sheer value of $10 but for one thing that people don't seem to get here, Principle.

I think you have just summed up everything most people had to say

[LivingHitokiri]

Rip504 wrote...

GnusmasTHX wrote...

gabe2gg wrote...


you are a biodrone,  the problem isnt the price, but there has to be limits somewhere with this DLC nonsense.  But no, all of us are poor peasants wanting something for free, am I right?

That's the stupidest thing I've ever heard, if the problem isn't the price, then there is no problem.

QFT. If you don't have a problem spending 10 dollars,why exactly are you complaining.

Because it should be a free part of the game,it is not,it cost 10 dollars, Hence the problem.
dlc.

Bought.!

Amazing,you didnt even bother to read people that explained  tons of times ( myself included) about why people complaign about it and the price is not the point of it but the whole ideology of milking the fans by putting an important part of the game that could even ruin the whole story that was build around it just for the 10 bucks.
There is even a video on someone voicing and answers exactly your question in more than many ways, yet you go arround totally ignoring everything said by the one complaigning and bable for nothing.
Mind boggling .

[Xerxes52]

nightcobra8928 wrote...

ElementL09 wrote...

piemanz wrote...

Heres the problem as i see it.

CE owner: Hmm an extra squad member, I think i will purchase that
SE owner:Meh, I'll stick with the standard edition i'm sure they'll release it at some point
Bioware: It's a Prothean
CE owner:WOOOOHOOOOO!
SE owner: OMFG, DO WANT!!!!
Bioware:It's ok you can purchase it on release! woot!
SE owner:OMFG WTFBBQ! DAY 1 DLC!?!

CE owner:  Well thats not right, the CE is well worth the 80$ without From Ashes, why can't everyone who purchases the game new get it for free at launch?  Why not make it like Zaeed and Firewalker (which both I thoroughly enjoyed)?

that's my reasoning, but i don't know maybe some CE people think they're actually paying for the DLC which they actually aren't really, even bioware said the DLC was free for them making those 20$ extra dollars for the collectibles even if their intention to buy the CE edition was for the DLC in the first place. 

Same here. I preordered and paid off my copy of the CE, and the extra content is well worth $20, not even taking From Ashes into account imo.

I would be perfectly fine with Bioware if everyone had From Ashes included with a new purchase, the CE already has tons of bonuses as it stands now.

Modifié par Xerxes52, 24 février 2012 - 12:49 .

[Heimdall]

Kithrus wrote...

Chozo_Hybrid wrote...

How about they reduce the CE by ten bucks and include it in the SE of the game? Refend those by ten bucks who bought the CE and have already paid etc.

In an ideal world perhaps.

When you buy a game your paying from the moment the devolpment team clocks in day 1 to the day they clock out the night before launch. Them taking that time to make other content then charging for it is wrong.

There are exceptions to this rule like weapons skins and other causmetic things but thats not what this DLC.

Do I care that its a Prothean... A bit yes but I care more that its a content DLC I'm paying for technically twice.

I won't lie, I expected this extra charater to be like Zaeed in the second game. He makes some witty comments in his room but doesn't have a diologue tree and a small mission.

That would have been something I could grudgingly let slide.

However.... We have a charater who clearly unless Bioware is stupid has a full fleshed out plot interweaved into the exsisting story with missions, new powers, diolog and who knows what else.

thats more then a tiny DLC.

So selling that on day one is bad marketing. Not from a money stand point but ethically from a customer relations stand point.

The Question is what will they be willing to do next time? Whill they be honest and let us have the future Shale free because it was meant for the game or charge us because they can?

I know this DLC wasn't meant to be anything but a DLC but that fact bugs me too.

Read the thread, this has been debunked.  Get a better understanding of game development, there is a span of time that can be months before the retailers start selling and the disc content finalization.

[breadedpudding]

Tiax Rules All wrote...

I just want to remind some people that gameplay and story elements should have never been included in the Collectors Edition in the first place.

Why? Because then the differences between the editions makes it seem like te Standard Edition is not complete and even though the SE has a beggining, middle and end, it has a missing element of the game that others got at launch. Its an obvoius marketing ploy. They can deny that it effects the game much or that it was part of the original game and cut later but the message that gets out there and sticks is that "you dont have everything there is to have at launch unless you pay unpressidented amounts of money on day 1 for a normal game.

How does a SE owner NOT feel like he is getting an incomplete copy of the game.

I have no problem with CE's coming with any kind of exclusive content they want as long as it is collectables and artwork and other cosmetic stuff.

The arguement about how much or "what, you can't afford $10" is irrelevant. It should be free because nobody should ever feel like the game they buy at launch day is incomplete.

If Bioware and EA had any real balls they would have just made the SE $79.99 in stores with all the content, take it r leave it. Because thats what it really comes down to. They want 80, not 70 from you at launch day. It just too much. Not because of the sheer value of $10 but for one thing that people don't seem to get here, Principle.

I don't disagree with you - and if it does seems that way it was not my intention - but I do have an honest question for you concerning what you're saying about Collector's Editions. I did purchase it. At the time, I had a bit of extra money, and I loved the little cosmetic/collectable bits that come with it (artbooks and soundtracks are always bonuses for me). The fact that there was extra content did factor in as well, but it wasn't the only reason why I shelled out the money. While I can understand what is going on from both sides, what about someone like me who purchased a CE for both cosmetic and content purposes?

[Maeshone]

Leaser Resael wrote...

PetrySilva wrote...

mogonk wrote...

If games were "worth" $70, companies would charge $70 for them and customers would pay it.  The fact that they don't means they aren't.  That's market capitalism.

Day 1 DLC is effectively a raise in the price of the game that is designed to trick the consumer into believing it's cheaper than it is.  It's a way of pricing the game at $70 without putting a $70 price tag on it. 

In the same way that the real cost of most f2p games is higher than their p2p counterparts, DLC is a way of misleading players into misperceiving the real costs of their purchase.  In both cases this is achieved by making the player pay for content.  When that content is not produced outside of the development cycle, but as part of the development process, this becomes particularly egregious.  That's what we have here. 

I can understand why some consumers would grumble about this, but buy the game anyway.  What I cannot understand is why some consumers defend with great intensity a company that is adopting business practices that hurt them.

It's sorta surreal.  The kind of thing one might expect to read in a dystopian science fiction novel.

Ever heard of people who got raped and said: "thank you for raping me"?

That's exactly what's happening to Bioware's defence force.

+1

The funny thing is that Bioware said that they couldn't implement proper joystick support in the game, HD textures or weapon holster on the PC version (to mention something) because they didn't have the people and time to do it before release, but all of the sudden they had an entire different team making this dlc? So instead of making every version the best possible one with proper support, they put people to work on DLC, and that DLC is a prothean, the last of it's race alive?
This is so wrong in so many ways that it's just sad to see Bioware doing it but is even more sad to see people defending them.

Uh, no. That's just blatant lying. It was the same team that worked on the Prothean DLC, they just did it after the game had shipped for verification or whatever the process of getting it approved for consoles is called. During this time, the team CAN NOT add more content to the base game, and when it comes back, that is the gold game. So why not spend this time working on DLC?

[tetrisblock4x1]

Lord Aesir wrote...

tetrisblock4x1 wrote...

So there are two kinds of people: those of us who believe that the
squaddie DLC is cut from the game and has been on the disc for a large
portion of the development cycle, and those who buy into their claim
that this is just a last minute addition so there is no way that the
character could have made it beofre going gold.

Well if the
former is true then that means he is a fully realized character who
could easily have a lot of plot importance and having to pay for that
would clearly prove that Bioware are milking the audience, and nobody
wants that. But on the other hand, if you believe the latter, this
implies that Bioware have taken the games most interesting and important
character right next to the Reapers, and treated the character merely as
side content who is a mere curiosity and not all that important to the plot. So we're either been milked or the character is
not getting the full respect it deserves by been fully integrated into
the games plot and frankly considering how huge the character is it
shouldn't have been added into the game like just another squad mate.

The character was in the original script but was cut because he took the spotlight away from Shepard.  They later decided to include him as DLC.  Just because you find the Protheans so fascinating in no way makes it innapproriate to have one as side content.

They are the main characters of Mass Effect and far more worthy than anyone including Shepard. Damn near everyone who cares about Mass Effect find the Protheans very fascinating, and BiowEAr know it.

Modifié par tetrisblock4x1, 24 février 2012 - 12:49 .

[CG50]

Bibdy wrote...

Just swinging by with my first post in a long time to say I'm so insulted by this action that I cancelled my pre-order yesterday, throwing away a $12 discount at newegg.com. So, yes, I still would have saved $2, but it's not about the money. It's about the crude, unsubtle monetization tactics by dangling cash-carrots in front of me in order to extract more dollars from my wallet on release day. I find this kind treatment insulting and antithetical to how I believe gaming should be. I don't think it's a wild stretch of the imagination to imagine EA becoming the first publisher to attempt to bring Pay-2-Win mechanisms (currently restricted to Free-to-Play games) into mainstream upfront-purchase multiplayer gaming, and so I'm drawing my line in the sand here. I used to love the release-day rush, but I think you've finally killed it for me.

And a great shame, too. After the DA2 'lazy/rushed gamecraft' debacle, you rebuilt a lot of goodwill with me through TOR and the DA2 DLC. But, in one moment you reminded me that it's just not about us.

The whole DLC thing was for those who would have missed out on it by not being able to buy a collectors edition. I'm sorry that you cancelled because you are going to miss out on a great game. If you don't believe that is why they did it, well thats up to you, i am just stating what BioWare staff have stated in case you missed it. I can't tell you what to do. However it is an optional DLC "cash carrot" which is not, as already stated, integral to the main game. 

[Gobbi82]

I think what most people fail to realize is that the DLC included in our copies of the CE was not and never will be free.... $20 just for the collectibles ? Don't kid yourselves.

[TK Dude]

Leaser Resael wrote...

PetrySilva wrote...

mogonk wrote...

If games were "worth" $70, companies would charge $70 for them and customers would pay it.  The fact that they don't means they aren't.  That's market capitalism.

Day 1 DLC is effectively a raise in the price of the game that is designed to trick the consumer into believing it's cheaper than it is.  It's a way of pricing the game at $70 without putting a $70 price tag on it. 

In the same way that the real cost of most f2p games is higher than their p2p counterparts, DLC is a way of misleading players into misperceiving the real costs of their purchase.  In both cases this is achieved by making the player pay for content.  When that content is not produced outside of the development cycle, but as part of the development process, this becomes particularly egregious.  That's what we have here. 

I can understand why some consumers would grumble about this, but buy the game anyway.  What I cannot understand is why some consumers defend with great intensity a company that is adopting business practices that hurt them.

It's sorta surreal.  The kind of thing one might expect to read in a dystopian science fiction novel.

Ever heard of people who got raped and said: "thank you for raping me"?

That's exactly what's happening to Bioware's defence force.

+1

The funny thing is that Bioware said that they couldn't implement proper joystick support in the game, HD textures or weapon holster on the PC version (to mention something) because they didn't have the people and time to do it before release, but all of the sudden they had an entire different team making this dlc? So instead of making every version the best possible one with proper support, they put people to work on DLC, and that DLC is a prothean, the last of it's race alive?
This is so wrong in so many ways that it's just sad to see Bioware doing it but is even more sad to see people defending them.

I might agree with this point. But I can't tolerate the fact PetrySilva is comparing this whole issue to a crime that hurts an individual in more ways that one. It's sick somebody says something like that. 

[Darkeus]

I must say, as someone who has the CE pre-ordered and ready to buy, I am a bit put-off by the behavior of some of the people who have CEs preordered like me and taking a horrible attitude with people who are just getting the standard edition.

I feel like EA/BioWare has gone a little too far with this. The "From Ashes" DLC should be available to anybody who buys the game new. It just seems wrong to withhold something that a lot of fans care deeply about. As you can see, they have already created an atmosphere of elitism as CE buyers are now ridiculing SE buyers. How sad....

I understand incentives to buy CE and to buy games new. But this is lore that is important to the fans of teh universe. It is a Prothean for the gods' sake! An integral reason for why Shepard and rest of the universe aren't bantha poodo anyway. It is just sort of greedy.

In fact, most of the marketing for ME3 has been flat out bad. Too many cross product tie-ins. Too many ways to skip out on the Single player experience. /Sigh

I will be getting ME3 because I have invested too much time (Five playthroughs of ME1 and ME2) to miss out on the finale. But man, I have never seen a company try so hard to alienate fans. I mean, i know I am becoming wary of any new games coming from BioWare right now....

[Chozo_Hybrid]

nightcobra8928 wrote...

Chozo_Hybrid wrote...

How about they reduce the CE by ten bucks and include it in the SE of the game? Refend those by ten bucks who bought the CE and have already paid etc.

In an ideal world perhaps.

except you didn'y pay for the DLC in the CE, version.
the DLC was free as said by bioware but they put it there for a reason, to entice you to shell out those 20$ that were the collectibles.

It's the best constructive idea I could come up with.

Also, on a personal note, I tend to play more because of where I live, in New Zealand we pay almost double for anything, and not for a real reason. So, I kinda feel I am paying for it considering I'm paying $150 for the CE. 150 NZD = 125 US dollars, and this is what it's like for any game. Not just this one. Game comes out at $60 in the US, we pay almost $120 every time.

Modifié par Chozo_Hybrid, 24 février 2012 - 12:53 .

[N7Raider]

Sofia Lamb wrote...

tetrisblock4x1 wrote...


They are the main characters of Mass Effect and far more worthy than anyone including Shepard.

You need to be more subtle.

please, just ignore him.