13369 réponses à ce sujet

[Heimdall]

macdadams2 wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...

moonbal wrote...

Outrageous and unacceptable.
Sure you can say that this DLC was done after the game was completed. So what? Game's not released yet. Add it. Or allow free download for customers who purchase any version of the game.

Developers releasing games short of 100% and making DLCs for profit is getting way out of hand. This is especially rampant in console games (Japanese games are notorious offenders).
This was done purely for profit. And I'd like to believe EA had a hand in this.

Was looking forward to ME3 for a long time. Been playing ME2 all over again in anticipation but I'll not be getting the game until price plummets so low that the profit to EA would be a non-factor. Shame shame..

For christ's sake...

The ONLY reason bioware has ever released free day one DLC before was as an incentive to combat the used game market and piracy.  And you know what?  Their doing it again!  The multiplayer and Alliance network fill that role.  They are releasing this piece of DLC as it's own content and as a part of the package of CE buyers.

THIS IS NOT CUT CONTENT.  I'm not sure how often this needs to be said, but this is content that was planned while the core game was in developement and

You can stop right there.

No, don't be a child.  <_<

Lord Aesir wrote...

was primarily developed only after the game went in for certification. 
Someone who gets the SE is getting the 100% Mass Effect 3 experience. 
Someone that gets DLC in addition or the CE is getting the 100% Mass
Effect 3 experience plus extra.  In no way is Bioware shipping an
incomplete game.

Of course their doing this for profit, bioware
has always done things for profit.  They were a company long before EA
came into the picture.

Of course, Bioware planned the DLC in advance, most DLC is planned in advance even if it was released later.  They didn't work on it until later because that's when the resources became available.

Modifié par Lord Aesir, 24 février 2012 - 06:08 .

[nepaliguru]

TheGoddess0fWar wrote...

We can start a "CE Owners who DGAF group"

Oh oh oh! I want to join. I tried to GAF at the start of this whole thing, but for the sake of my sanity / health I wont anymore and will enjoy my CE when it comes

[RaenImrahl]

heart again wrote...

yesssss

now we need a sig/banner

Indeed.  And the group's discussion should probably move to the group page.  I smell popcorn...

RI

[TheGoddess0fWar]

heart again wrote...

TheGoddess0fWar wrote...

CommanderCoffee wrote...

TheGoddess0fWar wrote...

Alright someone go make the group. Let's do this. Settle in with your glasses and popcorn and watch everyone else scream bloody murder around you.

http://social.bioware.com/group/6978/ 

I love you for this <3

yesssss


now we need a sig/banner

Making one.

[CitizenSnips]

royard wrote...

Kevin Lozandier wrote...

royard wrote...

Kevin Lozandier wrote...

royard wrote...

CommanderCoffee wrote...

TheGoddess0fWar wrote...

So...when will this thread die again?

As long as people want extra content without paying for it, this thread will live.

Extra?  Don't make me laugh. 

If you didn't notice...there is only one teammate with full biotic abilities, Liara.   A lot of people won't have Kaidan in their playthrough.  So, for a lot of people, if they want to use a biotic that's not liara or shepard, they have to buy the DLC. 

In contrast, you have 3 tech teammates plus Kaidan, and 2 combat teammates.  So no, Prothy is not extra content.  A lot of the squad composition actually was planned around him. 

How would you know?

Datamining from the demo.  Lots of his stuff is in the demo.  Including some of his audio files as a teammate.  There are a few posts in the other sections.

If this is true, than I have to reevaluate your argument. 

That said think about this: 

Collector Edition of Comics have extra panels. Collector Edition of Movies have uncut material. Why can't Collector Edition of Games not have additional content to play with that's not on regular editions? 

The only people who would see this as a huge character are long-time fans of the series. It's free in the edition for long-time fans.

I HAVE preordered a CE.  I'm NOT cancelling it.  But I find bioware's business practices questionable here, especially in my eyes prothy is not "extra" content. 

A few guns, skins, pets, avatars, those are extra.  They really don't affect the gameplay that much, if at all. 

However, this teammate was not extra.  He is not some "extra" biotic teammate.  As I said, bioware planned the squad composition around him, to some extent.  He is the reason why a standard game doens't have more than two biotic users, and a lot of people will end up only having one (becuase kaidan is dead). 

This is really rubbing me in the wrong way for some reason. 

Do you have any evidence of this?

[macdadams2]

mushoops86anjyl wrote...

kingsims wrote...

Thats the problem with DLC its price never goes down. You can buy Mass Effect for $15 from Amazon and Mass Effect 2 for $15 (these are the PC digital versions which do not take up shelf space)

Thats dirt cheap and such a bargain price, yeat the DLC still costs $2-$10. There lies the problem. In 6 months time you could grab it for $30-40 USD brand new and guess what the DLC price does not go down.

It's. Optional.

Your. Missing. The. Point.  

I might add that I have the CE.  Even as someone who will get the DLC free, I still believe this is not right.  Customer perception is everything, and this comes off as shady shady.

[Daywalker315]

Travie wrote...

Daywalker315 wrote...

Travie, Jessica Merizan just said this afternoon in the Reddit chat (paraphrase) that if this wasn't done as DLC then it wouldn't have happened at all. There was never a "let's rush and get it in the game" thing. The time and resources were budgeted in addition to making the core game. They felt the extra work that was put in to this PLANNED DLC (which has been advertised as a bonus to CE buyers for 9 months) should be available to everyone but at a price that helps them make money for their extra time spent making the content. It is their right and prerogative and to be honest, I respect them for working hard even after the game went off to certification to finish this so we can all enjoy it (if we want to) on our first playthrough.

Well I'm glad you can still have faith in them after all this. I honestly envy you that. 

When it comes to EA after all this time and all this PR spin, I can't bring myself to give them the benefit of the doubt anymore.

While I may not be completely sold on EA as a whole these days, I still have faith in BioWare because despite whatever else, they still deliver games I enjoy playing. That's the bottom line for me in all this. ME1 and ME2 have been a continuation of a story (much of my choosing, which is unique) that is quite possibly my favorite of any game or series I've ever played. I expect the 3rd game to be the culmination of all that enjoyment and entertainment.

That is enough for me and truth be told it should be enough for any real fan of the series IMO.

Modifié par Daywalker315, 24 février 2012 - 06:09 .

[Heimdall]

macdadams2 wrote...

mushoops86anjyl wrote...

kingsims wrote...

Thats the problem with DLC its price never goes down. You can buy Mass Effect for $15 from Amazon and Mass Effect 2 for $15 (these are the PC digital versions which do not take up shelf space)

Thats dirt cheap and such a bargain price, yeat the DLC still costs $2-$10. There lies the problem. In 6 months time you could grab it for $30-40 USD brand new and guess what the DLC price does not go down.

It's. Optional.

Your. Missing. The. Point.  

I might add that I have the CE.  Even as someone who will get the DLC free, I still believe this is not right.  Customer perception is everything, and this comes off as shady shady.

How so?

[CommanderCoffee]

nepaliguru wrote...

TheGoddess0fWar wrote...

We can start a "CE Owners who DGAF group"

Oh oh oh! I want to join. I tried to GAF at the start of this whole thing, but for the sake of my sanity / health I wont anymore and will enjoy my CE when it comes

Come on in! 
http://social.biowar...oup/6978/#group 

[royard]

mushoops86anjyl wrote...

royard wrote...

Kevin Lozandier wrote...

royard wrote...

Kevin Lozandier wrote...

royard wrote...

CommanderCoffee wrote...

TheGoddess0fWar wrote...

So...when will this thread die again?

As long as people want extra content without paying for it, this thread will live.

Extra?  Don't make me laugh. 

If you didn't notice...there is only one teammate with full biotic abilities, Liara.   A lot of people won't have Kaidan in their playthrough.  So, for a lot of people, if they want to use a biotic that's not liara or shepard, they have to buy the DLC. 

In contrast, you have 3 tech teammates plus Kaidan, and 2 combat teammates.  So no, Prothy is not extra content.  A lot of the squad composition actually was planned around him. 

How would you know?

Datamining from the demo.  Lots of his stuff is in the demo.  Including some of his audio files as a teammate.  There are a few posts in the other sections.

If this is true, than I have to reevaluate your argument. 

That said think about this: 

Collector Edition of Comics have extra panels. Collector Edition of Movies have uncut material. Why can't Collector Edition of Games not have additional content to play with that's not on regular editions? 

The only people who would see this as a huge character are long-time fans of the series. It's free in the edition for long-time fans.

I HAVE preordered a CE.  I'm NOT cancelling it.  But I find bioware's business practices questionable here, especially in my eyes prothy is not "extra" content. 

A few guns, skins, pets, avatars, those are extra.  They really don't affect the gameplay that much, if at all. 

However, this teammate was not extra.  He is not some "extra" biotic teammate.  As I said, bioware planned the squad composition around him, to some extent.  He is the reason why a standard game doens't have more than two biotic users, and a lot of people will end up only having one (becuase kaidan is dead). 

This is really rubbing me in the wrong way for some reason. 

Do you have any evidence of this?

I don't.  But can you provide any other reason why you get 1 biotic teammate plus kaidan but 3 tech teammate plus kaidan?  

[KBomb]

Travie wrote...


Actually, if you take a look the people who are actually discussing this has changed every hour or so throughout the day.

That might be true if you look back at ONLY the last 10-20 pages, but as things stand you're view is too narrow.

Edit: grammar 

 
Nah. First team has probably went to sleep while the second team took over. The shifts will switch soon. Look back further and you'll see the pattern. Same people, same argument. Just different pages.

[LOST SPARTANJLC]

WizenSlinky0 wrote...

mushoops86anjyl wrote...

kingsims wrote...

Thats the problem with DLC its price never goes down. You can buy Mass Effect for $15 from Amazon and Mass Effect 2 for $15 (these are the PC digital versions which do not take up shelf space)

Thats dirt cheap and such a bargain price, yeat the DLC still costs $2-$10. There lies the problem. In 6 months time you could grab it for $30-40 USD brand new and guess what the DLC price does not go down.

It's. Optional.

So? The price of the DLC should still scale with the game. It only makes logical sense.

If you pick up the game in 2 years for $10, does it make any sense at all that a piece of DLC can cost as much as you paid for the game, despite being 2 years old and no where near the length of the full game? It's illogical. DLC should be priced as a percentage of the average cost of a new copy (or something similar).

I think  a permanant half off would  work as long as that was the stopping point.This could be done within a few months/year being out.It's would be an incentive .

[CitizenSnips]

macdadams2 wrote...

mushoops86anjyl wrote...

kingsims wrote...

Thats the problem with DLC its price never goes down. You can buy Mass Effect for $15 from Amazon and Mass Effect 2 for $15 (these are the PC digital versions which do not take up shelf space)

Thats dirt cheap and such a bargain price, yeat the DLC still costs $2-$10. There lies the problem. In 6 months time you could grab it for $30-40 USD brand new and guess what the DLC price does not go down.

It's. Optional.

Your. Missing. The. Point.  

I might add that I have the CE.  Even as someone who will get the DLC free, I still believe this is not right.  Customer perception is everything, and this comes off as shady shady.

No, I'm not. You do not have to buy the DLC. It is optional. As a product ages is it customary to lower the price? Sure. But it is not required.

[gabe2gg]

CommanderCoffee wrote...

TheGoddess0fWar wrote...

So...when will this thread die again?

As long as people want extra content without paying for it, this thread will live.

Oh good lord, have you not been reading this thread or anything outside of these forums? A Majority of us against this DLC thing have no problem paying for DLC as long as it has good content and value. However, having DLC being released at the same thing as the acutaly game truly makes no sense and charging for it when the previous two games had DLC on day one for free. DLC is a blessing when done right, and also a curse as seen here. The days of quality expansion packs are long gone. I just dont like the route EA has taken in the past couple years. Anything  from online passes for every game and "there has to be multiplayer in every game". 

[CitizenSnips]

royard wrote...

mushoops86anjyl wrote...

royard wrote...

Kevin Lozandier wrote...

royard wrote...

Kevin Lozandier wrote...

royard wrote...

CommanderCoffee wrote...

TheGoddess0fWar wrote...

So...when will this thread die again?

As long as people want extra content without paying for it, this thread will live.

Extra?  Don't make me laugh. 

If you didn't notice...there is only one teammate with full biotic abilities, Liara.   A lot of people won't have Kaidan in their playthrough.  So, for a lot of people, if they want to use a biotic that's not liara or shepard, they have to buy the DLC. 

In contrast, you have 3 tech teammates plus Kaidan, and 2 combat teammates.  So no, Prothy is not extra content.  A lot of the squad composition actually was planned around him. 

How would you know?

Datamining from the demo.  Lots of his stuff is in the demo.  Including some of his audio files as a teammate.  There are a few posts in the other sections.

If this is true, than I have to reevaluate your argument. 

That said think about this: 

Collector Edition of Comics have extra panels. Collector Edition of Movies have uncut material. Why can't Collector Edition of Games not have additional content to play with that's not on regular editions? 

The only people who would see this as a huge character are long-time fans of the series. It's free in the edition for long-time fans.

I HAVE preordered a CE.  I'm NOT cancelling it.  But I find bioware's business practices questionable here, especially in my eyes prothy is not "extra" content. 

A few guns, skins, pets, avatars, those are extra.  They really don't affect the gameplay that much, if at all. 

However, this teammate was not extra.  He is not some "extra" biotic teammate.  As I said, bioware planned the squad composition around him, to some extent.  He is the reason why a standard game doens't have more than two biotic users, and a lot of people will end up only having one (becuase kaidan is dead). 

This is really rubbing me in the wrong way for some reason. 

Do you have any evidence of this?

I don't.  But can you provide any other reason why you get 1 biotic teammate plus kaidan but 3 tech teammate plus kaidan?  

You made the claim. The burden of proof is on you.

[Travie]

If these quote tunnels go on much longer its going to be 2 posts a page, lol.

[royard]

Daywalker315 wrote...

Travie wrote...

Daywalker315 wrote...

Travie, Jessica Merizan just said this afternoon in the Reddit chat (paraphrase) that if this wasn't done as DLC then it wouldn't have happened at all. There was never a "let's rush and get it in the game" thing. The time and resources were budgeted in addition to making the core game. They felt the extra work that was put in to this PLANNED DLC (which has been advertised as a bonus to CE buyers for 9 months) should be available to everyone but at a price that helps them make money for their extra time spent making the content. It is their right and prerogative and to be honest, I respect them for working hard even after the game went off to certification to finish this so we can all enjoy it (if we want to) on our first playthrough.

Well I'm glad you can still have faith in them after all this. I honestly envy you that. 

When it comes to EA after all this time and all this PR spin, I can't bring myself to give them the benefit of the doubt anymore.

While I may not be completely sold on EA as a whole these days, I still have faith in BioWare because despite whatever else, they still deliver games I enjoy playing. That's the bottom line for me in all this. ME1 and ME2 have been a continuation of a story (much of my choosing, which is unique) that is quite possibly my favorite of any game or series I've ever played. I expect the 3rd game to be the culmination of all that enjoyment and entertainment.

That is enough for me and truth be told it should be enough for any real fan of the series IMO.

Well, I'm still buying the game, CE no less.  However, I might be am less inclined to buy a future one.  I feel like bioware is trying to hold me up here (by offering stuff I want at a high price), and I don't like this feeling.  Maybe it's just me, but i don't think so. 

[LOST SPARTANJLC]

And I await the chaos of this topic being 300-500 pages long tomorrow/later today.

[WizenSlinky0]

LOST SPARTANJLC wrote...

I think  a permanant half off would  work as long as that was the stopping point.This could be done within a few months/year being out.It's would be an incentive .

Really, that'd be fine. I'm not picky. Just always stuck me as odd that DLC never goes down in costs despite the game doing so. Especially considering DLC often costs less to develop and has no manufacturing costs. You really should not be able to reach a point where it costs you more to get 1-2 pieces of 1-2 hour DLC than it does to get the 20-30 hour game itself.

[nevar00]

Evilelf007 wrote...

nevar00 wrote...

I can't believe that the Bioware team truly believed a living Prothean was not vital or important enough to the whole lore and story of the Mass Effect universe to be anything more than a thrown-together DLC add-on.  

There's at least disappointment I can understand.  I agree, it would have been nice had a Prothean character been a little more important... but they decided to go a different direction after toying with that idea early on.  In the absence of that, I am at least glad they did make the little add-on just for coolness factor though.

Better a Prothean with a bit part, than no Prothean at all. 

Are you the guy who I've talked back and forth with before?  If so I think the difference between the two of us is how much we consider the Protheans important.  Given how the Protheans were built up throughout the first two games, I think that a living Prothean, even if it has absolutely no impact on the Reaper plotline, brings overall enough change and backstory to the Mass Effect universe that it should be huge enough to have been in the game in the first place.  This is something that has been built up as quite important during the first two games: finding a living one, even if it is useless, should be huge.  You seem to think this should only be the case had Prothy been intertwined in the overall main storyline.

I just cannot see any way a living Prothean could be minor enough to be brushed to the side as DLC in the first place.  Imo the fact that he is alive is big enough to have been a definitive moment in the main game.  I think this is what some people are missing: had this been another Zaeed or Kasumi, there would have been no complaints outside of the same old 'day 1 DLC' grumblings.  And before anyone cries of self-entitlement, I'm getting the CE.  I still think this was either a really slimy business move planned a while ago, or a huge oversight on the part of Bioware.

As for your last comment, I'm not sure I completely agree.  I'd rather they put time in effort into him and not cheapen the moment.  But hey, I'm still excited either way. 

Modifié par nevar00, 24 février 2012 - 06:16 .

[Kevin Lozandier]

royard wrote...

Kevin Lozandier wrote...

royard wrote...

Kevin Lozandier wrote...

royard wrote...

CommanderCoffee wrote...

TheGoddess0fWar wrote...

So...when will this thread die again?

As long as people want extra content without paying for it, this thread will live.

Extra?  Don't make me laugh. 

If you didn't notice...there is only one teammate with full biotic abilities, Liara.   A lot of people won't have Kaidan in their playthrough.  So, for a lot of people, if they want to use a biotic that's not liara or shepard, they have to buy the DLC. 

In contrast, you have 3 tech teammates plus Kaidan, and 2 combat teammates.  So no, Prothy is not extra content.  A lot of the squad composition actually was planned around him. 

How would you know?

Datamining from the demo.  Lots of his stuff is in the demo.  Including some of his audio files as a teammate.  There are a few posts in the other sections.

If this is true, than I have to reevaluate your argument. 

That said think about this: 

Collector Edition of Comics have extra panels. Collector Edition of Movies have uncut material. Why can't Collector Edition of Games not have additional content to play with that's not on regular editions? 

The only people who would see this as a huge character are long-time fans of the series. It's free in the edition for long-time fans.

I HAVE preordered a CE.  I'm NOT cancelling it.  But I find bioware's business practices questionable here, especially in my eyes prothy is not "extra" content. 

A few guns, skins, pets, avatars, those are extra.  They really don't affect the gameplay that much, if at all.  (The extra guns suck, by the way.)

However, this teammate was not extra.  He is not some "extra" biotic teammate.  As I said, bioware planned the squad composition around him, to some extent.  He is the reason why a standard game doens't have more than two biotic users, and a lot of people will end up only having one (becuase kaidan is dead). 

This is really rubbing me in the wrong way for some reason. 

So Bioware has to draw a limit how cool DLC can be for long-time fans of the series considering that it's the final game in the trilogy, likely? 

Bioware has made great content in their collector's edition that is arguably uncontested except Witcher 2 arguably. Story-wise was being able to wear Collector's armor in ME2 should have had the same affect on fans given people's logic about this.  Also the fact that you had to buy another bioware game to have the best armor in the game (Blood Dragon Armor) should have rubbed people the wrong way as well in ME2. Or the fact you had to pre-order a game from a specific vendor to get arguably one of the best heavy weapons in ME2 as well (Gamespot and the Grav gun). 

All I'm saying people speak with their dollars have every right to be mad about this. However, their arguments are flawed considering previous Bioware Collector's Editions and extra content implementations that were welcomed with open arms.... 

IMO, they could have made it Collector Edition only, and honestly would have made the value of such edition VERY valuable to fans to if not sell for a lot of $$$, but they wanted it to be available for all fans if they choose to have it. Years ago, this would be scrapped /only in the CE. 

Modifié par Kevin Lozandier, 24 février 2012 - 06:21 .

[Evilelf007]

Daywalker315 wrote...

While I may not be completely sold on EA as a whole these days, I still have faith in BioWare because despite whatever else, they still deliver games I enjoy playing. That's the bottom line for me in all this. ME1 and ME2 have been a continuation of a story (much of my choosing, which is unique) that is quite possibly my favorite of any game or series I've ever played. I expect the 3rd game to be the culmination of all that enjoyment and entertainment.

That is enough for me and truth be told it should be enough for any real fan of the series IMO.

Agree, Bioware has too good of a track record when it comes to games with depth of story.  That above all else sells me on games!  Bioware is 2nd to none!

[LOST SPARTANJLC]

WizenSlinky0 wrote...

LOST SPARTANJLC wrote...

I think  a permanant half off would  work as long as that was the stopping point.This could be done within a few months/year being out.It's would be an incentive .

Really, that'd be fine. I'm not picky. Just always stuck me as odd that DLC never goes down in costs despite the game doing so. Especially considering DLC often costs less to develop and has no manufacturing costs. You really should not be able to reach a point where it costs you more to get 1-2 pieces of 1-2 hour DLC than it does to get the 20-30 hour game itself.

I think it's a great idea , and with that I'm off.

[Yuoaman]

nevar00 wrote...

Evilelf007 wrote...

nevar00 wrote...

I can't believe that the Bioware team truly believed a living Prothean was not vital or important enough to the whole lore and story of the Mass Effect universe to be anything more than a thrown-together DLC add-on.  

There's at least disappointment I can understand.  I agree, it would have been nice had a Prothean character been a little more important... but they decided to go a different direction after toying with that idea early on.  In the absence of that, I am at least glad they did make the little add-on just for coolness factor though.

Better a Prothean with a bit part, than no Prothean at all. 

Are you the guy who I've talked back and forth with before?  If so I think the difference between the two of us is how much we consider the Protheans important.  Given how the Protheans were built up throughout the first two games, I think that a living Prothean, even if it has absolutely no impact on the Reaper plotline, brings overall enough change and backstory to the Mass Effect universe that it should be huge enough to have been in the game in the first place.  This is something that has been built up as quite important during the first two games: finding a living one, even if it is useless, should be huge.  You seem to think this should only be the case had Prothy been intertwined in the overall main storyline.

I just cannot see any way a living Prothean could be minor enough to be brushed to the side as DLC in the first place.  Imo the fact that he is alive is big enough to have been a definitive moment in the main game.  I think this is what some people are missing: had this been another Zaeed or Kasumi, there would have been no complaints outside of the same old 'day 1 DLC' grumblings.  And before anyone cries of self-entitlement, I'm getting the CE.  I still think this was either a really slimy business move planned a while ago, or a huge oversight on the part of Bioware.

As for your last comment, I'm not sure I completely agree.  I'd rather they put time in effort into him and not cheapen the moment.  But hey, I'm still excited either way. 

This. A Prothean, any Prothean, shakes up the status quo of the universe in a monumental way - it's silly to limit who gets to experience such a huge thing.

[heart again]

TheGoddess0fWar wrote...

heart again wrote...

TheGoddess0fWar wrote...

CommanderCoffee wrote...

TheGoddess0fWar wrote...

Alright someone go make the group. Let's do this. Settle in with your glasses and popcorn and watch everyone else scream bloody murder around you.

http://social.bioware.com/group/6978/ 

I love you for this <3

yesssss


now we need a sig/banner

Making one.

Looking forward to it:lol: