13369 réponses à ce sujet

[CitizenSnips]

macdadams2 wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...

macdadams2 wrote...

mushoops86anjyl wrote...

macdadams2 wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...

macdadams2 wrote...

mushoops86anjyl wrote...

kingsims wrote...

Thats the problem with DLC its price never goes down. You can buy Mass Effect for $15 from Amazon and Mass Effect 2 for $15 (these are the PC digital versions which do not take up shelf space)

Thats dirt cheap and such a bargain price, yeat the DLC still costs $2-$10. There lies the problem. In 6 months time you could grab it for $30-40 USD brand new and guess what the DLC price does not go down.

It's. Optional.

Your. Missing. The. Point.  

I might add that I have the CE.  Even as someone who will get the DLC free, I still believe this is not right.  Customer perception is everything, and this comes off as shady shady.

How so?

This was in the cards since the CE was announced 9 months ago. It could have made it in the game. Or at the least could have been in the game as an "online pass" situation a la zaeed when ME2 came out to discourage used game sales, which can at least be sort of justified.

However to come up with content that is EXTREMELY important lore wise, with the intent of releasing it at the same time as the "complete" game is shady. A 60$ dollar game just because 70$. And non discerning consumers say "well its optional." Well yes of course it is.  At the expense of loyal fans who may be on a budget.  Hell, it's disrespectful even to those who aren't. 

So content that costs money for those who buy the CE should be free for those who buy the SE? How "discerning."

Once again I've got to go back to Zaeed. Pretty much makes my point on its own. Most people who reserved the CE back in the fall didn't realize that they were getting extra in game content, beyond bonus weapons and pets.  I strongly believe that the CE has been more about the "feelies."  Physical bonuses in the box.  Why should I get a more complete game? 

Even if you don't agree with me, there is a very large amount of people who do.  I think that Bioware should tread a little more lightly with how they are percieved.  They have a lot of long time fans that remember times when things were different.

You don't get  more complete game, you get a complete game with extras.

Extras would be skins, weapons, etc.  This is incredibly important to the ME universe and the story experience the player recieves. I don't understand whats so hard about this. Maybe I just come from a different generation or something. 

Can I gaze into your crystal ball too?

[Kevin Lozandier]

macdadams2 wrote...

Kevin Lozandier wrote...

Yuoaman wrote...

nevar00 wrote...

Evilelf007 wrote...

nevar00 wrote...

I can't believe that the Bioware team truly believed a living Prothean was not vital or important enough to the whole lore and story of the Mass Effect universe to be anything more than a thrown-together DLC add-on.  

There's at least disappointment I can understand.  I agree, it would have been nice had a Prothean character been a little more important... but they decided to go a different direction after toying with that idea early on.  In the absence of that, I am at least glad they did make the little add-on just for coolness factor though.

Better a Prothean with a bit part, than no Prothean at all. 

Are you the guy who I've talked back and forth with before?  If so I think the difference between the two of us is how much we consider the Protheans important.  Given how the Protheans were built up throughout the first two games, I think that a living Prothean, even if it has absolutely no impact on the Reaper plotline, brings overall enough change and backstory to the Mass Effect universe that it should be huge enough to have been in the game in the first place.  This is something that has been built up as quite important during the first two games: finding a living one, even if it is useless, should be huge.  You seem to think this should only be the case had Prothy been intertwined in the overall main storyline.

I just cannot see any way a living Prothean could be minor enough to be brushed to the side as DLC in the first place.  Imo the fact that he is alive is big enough to have been a definitive moment in the main game.  I think this is what some people are missing: had this been another Zaeed or Kasumi, there would have been no complaints outside of the same old 'day 1 DLC' grumblings.  And before anyone cries of self-entitlement, I'm getting the CE.  I still think this was either a really slimy business move planned a while ago, or a huge oversight on the part of Bioware.

As for your last comment, I'm not sure I completely agree.  I'd rather they put time in effort into him and not cheapen the moment.  But hey, I'm still excited either way. 

This. A Prothean, any Prothean, shakes up the status quo of the universe in a monumental way - it's silly to limit who gets to experience such a huge thing.

You as a fan see this highly valuable obviously; however, if you only played ME2, you wouldn't reallly care about a prothean squadmate I think. Why can't Collector Edition of games be awesome to have content that will make a long-time fan excited, why can't Uncut content not be in a Collector's Edition or Special edition in a package that long-time fans would appreciate?

The Prothean, a mission where the original game began, addition skins that are likely tribute to earlier conceptions of squadmates (from earlier games or the art book) are perfect content for long-time fans to relish in a CE. 

Especially the Eden Prime part, would only make sense to ME1 players which isn't even on PS3, mind you. 

This is stupid.  You are basically implying that the long time fans should be taken advantage of.

How? This is CE that is obviously targeted for long-time fans (Who else is more rational to buy a Collector's Edition of a game?). It has tremendous value and its in-game content actually make you say 'oh ****, I always wanted to have a prothean as a squadmate or what they look like'.....  This is the final game, and for a final game I personally haven't heard of a better Collector's Edition. 

[Raxxman]

Lord Aesir wrote...
You don't get  more complete game, you get a complete game with extras.

Complete

having all parts or elements; lacking nothing; whole; entire; full: a complete set of Mark Twain's writings.
Stop with the complete nonsense, you don't know the meaning of the word.

Core is the word you're looking for

Core

the central, innermost, or most essential part of anything.

The state of eduction these days...

Modifié par Raxxman, 24 février 2012 - 06:37 .

[Daywalker315]

macdadams2 wrote...

Kevin Lozandier wrote...

Yuoaman wrote...

nevar00 wrote...

Evilelf007 wrote...

nevar00 wrote...

I can't believe that the Bioware team truly believed a living Prothean was not vital or important enough to the whole lore and story of the Mass Effect universe to be anything more than a thrown-together DLC add-on.  

There's at least disappointment I can understand.  I agree, it would have been nice had a Prothean character been a little more important... but they decided to go a different direction after toying with that idea early on.  In the absence of that, I am at least glad they did make the little add-on just for coolness factor though.

Better a Prothean with a bit part, than no Prothean at all. 

Are you the guy who I've talked back and forth with before?  If so I think the difference between the two of us is how much we consider the Protheans important.  Given how the Protheans were built up throughout the first two games, I think that a living Prothean, even if it has absolutely no impact on the Reaper plotline, brings overall enough change and backstory to the Mass Effect universe that it should be huge enough to have been in the game in the first place.  This is something that has been built up as quite important during the first two games: finding a living one, even if it is useless, should be huge.  You seem to think this should only be the case had Prothy been intertwined in the overall main storyline.

I just cannot see any way a living Prothean could be minor enough to be brushed to the side as DLC in the first place.  Imo the fact that he is alive is big enough to have been a definitive moment in the main game.  I think this is what some people are missing: had this been another Zaeed or Kasumi, there would have been no complaints outside of the same old 'day 1 DLC' grumblings.  And before anyone cries of self-entitlement, I'm getting the CE.  I still think this was either a really slimy business move planned a while ago, or a huge oversight on the part of Bioware.

As for your last comment, I'm not sure I completely agree.  I'd rather they put time in effort into him and not cheapen the moment.  But hey, I'm still excited either way. 

This. A Prothean, any Prothean, shakes up the status quo of the universe in a monumental way - it's silly to limit who gets to experience such a huge thing.

You as a fan see this highly valuable obviously; however, if you only played ME2, you wouldn't reallly care about a prothean squadmate I think. Why can't Collector Edition of games be awesome to have content that will make a long-time fan excited, why can't Uncut content not be in a Collector's Edition or Special edition in a package that long-time fans would appreciate?

The Prothean, a mission where the original game began, addition skins that are likely tribute to earlier conceptions of squadmates (from earlier games or the art book) are perfect content for long-time fans to relish in a CE. 

Especially the Eden Prime part, would only make sense to ME1 players which isn't even on PS3, mind you. 

This is stupid.  You are basically implying that the long time fans should be taken advantage of.

I disagree. It's long-term fans who are willing to give a little extra back to BioWare getting rewarded with this. Most people on here are trying to say that the CE shouldn't have this and that the physical items and other things besides the DLC are worth the extra $20 as it is, so they should cut out the DLC. That's just ridiculous. It's been advertised as a bonus for CE for 9 months. I bought it in large part due to that. The other in-game CE items are decent but the character and mission sold me on it.

I'm not saying that all serious or long-term fans ordered a CE but I agree with BioWare's stance that MANY of us did. Tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands of CEs I'm sure were preordered. That constitutes "many", I think. To the rest who would like to dive more into the lore or find it important to have, they can order it for half what we paid extra for our complete CE package, which seems like a fair deal to me.

Modifié par Daywalker315, 24 février 2012 - 06:41 .

[macdadams2]

Kevin Lozandier wrote...

macdadams2 wrote...

Kevin Lozandier wrote...

Yuoaman wrote...

nevar00 wrote...

Evilelf007 wrote...

nevar00 wrote...

I can't believe that the Bioware team truly believed a living Prothean was not vital or important enough to the whole lore and story of the Mass Effect universe to be anything more than a thrown-together DLC add-on.  

There's at least disappointment I can understand.  I agree, it would have been nice had a Prothean character been a little more important... but they decided to go a different direction after toying with that idea early on.  In the absence of that, I am at least glad they did make the little add-on just for coolness factor though.

Better a Prothean with a bit part, than no Prothean at all. 

Are you the guy who I've talked back and forth with before?  If so I think the difference between the two of us is how much we consider the Protheans important.  Given how the Protheans were built up throughout the first two games, I think that a living Prothean, even if it has absolutely no impact on the Reaper plotline, brings overall enough change and backstory to the Mass Effect universe that it should be huge enough to have been in the game in the first place.  This is something that has been built up as quite important during the first two games: finding a living one, even if it is useless, should be huge.  You seem to think this should only be the case had Prothy been intertwined in the overall main storyline.

I just cannot see any way a living Prothean could be minor enough to be brushed to the side as DLC in the first place.  Imo the fact that he is alive is big enough to have been a definitive moment in the main game.  I think this is what some people are missing: had this been another Zaeed or Kasumi, there would have been no complaints outside of the same old 'day 1 DLC' grumblings.  And before anyone cries of self-entitlement, I'm getting the CE.  I still think this was either a really slimy business move planned a while ago, or a huge oversight on the part of Bioware.

As for your last comment, I'm not sure I completely agree.  I'd rather they put time in effort into him and not cheapen the moment.  But hey, I'm still excited either way. 

This. A Prothean, any Prothean, shakes up the status quo of the universe in a monumental way - it's silly to limit who gets to experience such a huge thing.

You as a fan see this highly valuable obviously; however, if you only played ME2, you wouldn't reallly care about a prothean squadmate I think. Why can't Collector Edition of games be awesome to have content that will make a long-time fan excited, why can't Uncut content not be in a Collector's Edition or Special edition in a package that long-time fans would appreciate?

The Prothean, a mission where the original game began, addition skins that are likely tribute to earlier conceptions of squadmates (from earlier games or the art book) are perfect content for long-time fans to relish in a CE. 

Especially the Eden Prime part, would only make sense to ME1 players which isn't even on PS3, mind you. 

This is stupid.  You are basically implying that the long time fans should be taken advantage of.

How? This is CE that is obviously targeted for long-time fans (Who else is more rational to buy a Collector's Edition of a game?). It has tremendous value and its in-game content actually make you say 'oh ****, I always wanted to have a prothean as a squadmate or what they look like'.....  This is the final game, and for a final game I personally haven't heard of a better Collector's Edition. 

And now you are implying that the prothean squad mate was common knowledge.

[_symphony]

TheGoddess0fWar wrote...

Hop in the band wagon CE people!
http://social.biowar...arch=&p=2#group

didn't the mod pointed out that this is offtopic? is starting to irk me people rubbing off in everybody faces their CE buys

[macdadams2]

Raxxman wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...
You don't get  more complete game, you get a complete game with extras.

Complete

having all parts or elements; lacking nothing; whole; entire; full: a complete set of Mark Twain's writings.
Stop with the complete nonsense, you don't know the meaning of the word.

Core is the word you're looking for

Core

the central, innermost, or most essential part of anything.

The state of eduction these days...

Well said.

[Heimdall]

Raxxman wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...
You don't get  more complete game, you get a complete game with extras.

Complete

having all parts or elements; lacking nothing; whole; entire; full: a complete set of Mark Twain's writings.
Stop with the complete nonsense, you don't know the meaning of the word.

Core is the word you're looking for

Core

the central, innermost, or most essential part of anything.

The state of eduction these days...

No, I mean complete.  Mass Effect 3 is a whole experience, with no missing pieces.

From Dust, is a an extra piece you can glue to the side of the puzzle.

[Kevin Lozandier]

Raxxman wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...
You don't get  more complete game, you get a complete game with extras.

Complete

having all parts or elements; lacking nothing; whole; entire; full: a complete set of Mark Twain's writings.
Stop with the complete nonsense, you don't know the meaning of the word.

Core is the word you're looking for

Core

the central, innermost, or most essential part of anything.

The state of eduction these days...

No. You're going beyond what complete is to assert for yourself a property you don't own or know its end that specific content is extra or not. Personally, I think people should realize not everything that is potentially really, really awesome actually makes the final game or the main game. 

Could this have been an after-the-game bonus? It could have been, heck that happened back-in-the-day. '

But at the same time, I keep saying again and again with no good answers: Collector Edition of
Comics have extra panels. Collector Edition of Movies have uncut material. Why can't Collector Edition of Games not have additional content to play with?  Why it has to feel cheap or make a long-time fan excited to have it? 

Modifié par Kevin Lozandier, 24 février 2012 - 06:43 .

[AlanC9]

[quote]Evilelf007 wrote...
In the original script the Prothean was an integral part of the main plot, I gather.  But he was so important he overshadowed shepard, so he was cut.  The team decided it was too cool a concept to give up completely, so they worked on him as DLC and gave him a very minor role so as not to overshadow shepard.
[/quote]
Yes, nobody is permitted to overshadow Sheppard!  This is Sheppard's story afterall, not anyone else's![/quote]

Could you source that? I'm not doubting it -- it's quite consistent with Bio design principles -- but I'd like to see the specifics.

[Daywalker315]

Novate wrote...

Unfortunately I will still be buying ME3 because I wanted MY Shepard to have his full story.
But BIOWARE has forever lost me as an consumer. After what they did with SWTOR, and now with ME3, its just really bad practice. It just seems that they no longer cared about their consumer, but rather how much they can get from each fan before their fans realize whats happening.
I have no problems with CE editions contains an special squadmate or additional missions. Because they are usually not that important to the game as an whole. But A Prothean, really, how can it not be an Impact to the Universe that practically circles around them being such an Myserious beings.
Its just like when speculations of ME universe will contain Multiplayer, how many fans stood up and defended Bioware on how they will never add Multiplayer.
Its just the same now that everyone is defending Bioware saying that its not gonna be an important character at all. Well, they already got our money, regardless of whether or not this Prothean Squadmate is important and have a whole plot around him, we are the suckers because we will still pay for it. And all those that boycott the game will still buy it and pay $10 dollars.

Just imagine, if it was just another human or another alien that has no impact to the game, and because this is the last of the Trilogy, who would buy it. No wonder they cut this Character from the Core game and added it as an DLC. Just you wait, soon they will have another DLC with some Missions that should have been added, but oh, they didn't have enough time to finish, and probably will add more lore to the game and another extra ending.

What exactly did they "do with SWTOR"? It's a pretty fun game IMO. 1.7 million subscribed people would probably disagree that they "did something" bad or evil with SWTOR.

[Heimdall]

macdadams2 wrote...

And now you are implying that the prothean squad mate was common knowledge.

For those following the game closely, especially on these boards, it wasn't easy to miss...

[Kevin Lozandier]

macdadams2 wrote...

Raxxman wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...
You don't get  more complete game, you get a complete game with extras.

Complete

having all parts or elements; lacking nothing; whole; entire; full: a complete set of Mark Twain's writings.
Stop with the complete nonsense, you don't know the meaning of the word.

Core is the word you're looking for

Core

the central, innermost, or most essential part of anything.

The state of eduction these days...

Well said.

No. Unless you come after movie studios who make Director's Cut edition of movies as cash grabs, or come after authors who make additional editions of their books that may be based on content that they couldn't find a reason to add to the original until the new edition, this is very flawed.

Bioware made a decision that was bound to irk some people. After all, some people hate DLC period and feel like it should just be scrapped. If they made a decision now to scrap it, it would devalue the CE edition. That compunds the problem, not help it. 

Honestly, business-wise this content fits perfectly with what a CE of a game should be: Have additional in-game content would want  people want to play, that would appeal to long-time fans, and make it desired more than the Standard Edition of the game. 

Modifié par Kevin Lozandier, 24 février 2012 - 06:51 .

[Cyr8]

This is bull****, and the people at Bioware are liars.Just like with Shale in Dragon Age Origins you claim it was done after the complete game was done. Yet Shale had complete dialog options and interactions with other characters as well, meaning the dialog was written during development. But yet it was supposed to be created completely outside of the main game. I bet the same is true for this character, right?

At least Zaeed in Mass Effect 2 was put in the Cerberus Network to entice us to buy the game new. That's good, as it was available to everyone who bought the game new. But in order to get this character, who is integral to the story (he is a Prothean, the kind of character integral to the whole story), only people who buy the Collector's Edition and pay 20 dollars more can get it. And lo and behold it's sold out and you can only get it online. So if we don't want to get it online, we're screwed. So not everyone can get the game, even ones who bought new, only the ones who want to lay down $80 on the game.

Screw you guys, this is underhanded and unfair. I didn't preorder because I wanted to see what crap you guys would pull this time. I was correct to do that, and I'll probably wait until the Complete Edition finally rolls out in a year. Ever since you've been bought by EA you've made bad decision after bad decision.

[Acidrain92]

Lord Aesir wrote...

macdadams2 wrote...

And now you are implying that the prothean squad mate was common knowledge.

For those following the game closely, especially on these boards, it wasn't easy to miss...

For me it was hard just to keep AWAY from people spoiling who the squad mate would be =/

[AlanC9]

Raxxman wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...
You don't get  more complete game, you get a complete game with extras.

Complete

having all parts or elements; lacking nothing; whole; entire; full: a complete set of Mark Twain's writings.
Stop with the complete nonsense, you don't know the meaning of the word.

Core is the word you're looking for

Core

the central, innermost, or most essential part of anything.

The state of eduction these days...

So a "complete" car includes the full option package? A "complete" film is the director's cut with all the deleted scenes back in?

I can live with that definition. But then we don't have a right to expect a "complete" game when we buy a game, because other products don't necessarily come complete either.

[heart again]

Lord Aesir wrote...

macdadams2 wrote...

And now you are implying that the prothean squad mate was common knowledge.

For those following the game closely, especially on these boards, it wasn't easy to miss...

Seriously...

[_symphony]

Lord Aesir wrote...

macdadams2 wrote...

And now you are implying that the prothean squad mate was common knowledge.

For those following the game closely, especially on these boards, it wasn't easy to miss...

it is easy to miss, especially if you're trying to avoid spoilers, and there was no confirmation whatsoever until a few days ago.

[AlanC9]

Cyr8 wrote...

This is bull****, and the people at Bioware are liars.Just like with Shale in Dragon Age Origins you claim it was done after the complete game was done. Yet Shale had complete dialog options and interactions with other characters as well, meaning the dialog was written during development. But yet it was supposed to be created completely outside of the main game. I bet the same is true for this character, right?

Dude, nobody ever said that Shale was created completely outside of the main game.

[Evilelf007]

Daywalker315 wrote...

I disagree. It's long-term fans who are willing to give a little extra back to BioWare getting rewarded with this. Most people on here are trying to say that the CE shouldn't have this and that the physical items and other things besides the DLC are worth the extra $20 as it is, so they should cut out the DLC. That's just ridiculous. It's been advertised as a bonus for CE for 9 months. I bought it in large part due to that. The other in-game CE items are decent but the character and mission sold me on it.

I'm not saying that all serious or long-term fans ordered a CE but I agree with BioWare's stance that MANY of us did. Tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands of CEs I'm sure were preordered. That constitutes "many", I think. To the rest who would like to dive more into the lore or find it important to have, they can order it for half what we paid extra for our complete CE package, which seems like a fair deal to me.

In otherwords, people thought the dlc would be something like Kasumi, and thus didn't want to spend the extra.  Now that they know it's a Prothean, not only do they want the extra, they feel they shouldn't have to pay for it because... well... it's a Prothean!

[fatalmaverick]

 My video talks about this in depth:
www.youtube.com/watch

[Heimdall]

_symphony wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...

macdadams2 wrote...

And now you are implying that the prothean squad mate was common knowledge.

For those following the game closely, especially on these boards, it wasn't easy to miss...

it is easy to miss, especially if you're trying to avoid spoilers, and there was no confirmation whatsoever until a few days ago.

I've known for months and that was quite by accident.

[Sleepdribble]

Raxxman wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...
You don't get  more complete game, you get a complete game with extras.

Complete

having all parts or elements; lacking nothing; whole; entire; full: a complete set of Mark Twain's writings.
Stop with the complete nonsense, you don't know the meaning of the word.

Core is the word you're looking for

Core

the central, innermost, or most essential part of anything.

The state of eduction these days...

No. Lord Aesir is right.

According to your own 'educated' google classification of the word, the standard versionof  ME3 is the very definition of  'COMPLETE' (ie: whole; entire; full, etc).

The DLC, however, is defined as EXTRA. You can google the definition of that word too, if you like.

Modifié par Sleepdribble, 24 février 2012 - 06:51 .

[AlanC9]

_symphony wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...

macdadams2 wrote...

And now you are implying that the prothean squad mate was common knowledge.

For those following the game closely, especially on these boards, it wasn't easy to miss...

it is easy to miss, especially if you're trying to avoid spoilers, and there was no confirmation whatsoever until a few days ago.

Easy to miss? Last summer I could not visit this board without seeing a thread about the prothean squadmate.

In the thread title.

Yes, it sucked.