13369 réponses à ce sujet

[Daywalker315]

Lorfean wrote...

ZX12r Ninja wrote...

Yeah and what did Zaeed or Katsumi have to add to the lore?

Very little. But this guy, by his very nature, obviously does. I'm pretty sure I'm not the only guy who's been interested in finding out more about the Protheans ever since I heard about them in ME1. Or who is intrigued by the prospect of re-visiting Eden Prime.

He doesn't OBVIOUSLY add a lot to the lore. You haven't played it. If it's non-essential then it won't add anything to the main story of ME3, which is the point here. The game isn't missing anything without him. If you want to see Eden Prime again and learn more about the Protheans, that's your prerogative and you'll have that opportunity.

They spent 2+ years developing this game and cramming in a huge main storyline. This didn't work out to be essential to that main story once they got the script worked out, so they decided to do it as DLC instead. I have no problem with it, especially considering I paid extra for CE in very large part due to seeing the bonus character and mission part of the CE package.

[Shadowrun1177]

Lorfean wrote...

ZX12r Ninja wrote...

Yeah and what did Zaeed or Katsumi have to add to the lore?

Very little. But this guy, by his very nature, obviously does. I'm pretty sure I'm not the only guy who's been interested in finding out more about the Protheans ever since I heard about them in ME1. Or who is intrigued by the prospect of re-visiting Eden Prime.

Which is your opinion and doesn't make it a fact, what Bioware chooses to do with him and how they fit him into the story is fact.

[Errationatus]

GnusmasTHX wrote...


Because text never hurt anyone's feelings, right? Especially in recent days.

I'm sorry, I thought that words like "moron" and "d!ckhead" were meant to be insults but I suppose that's because I allow them to be too.

You don't decide what the words mean, but how they affect you.

I, personally, find it amusing when people I don't care about get "that way" with me, and break down when it's a friend or family member. Simply how it is. It's the internet, you signed on for stuff like this. And even then, it's a far cry from a personal attack. 

All I was attempting to do was distill the arguments so far down and put a different spin on it in an attempt to look at it differently.  I called the arguments - as is readily discernible to anyone who actually read the thing - out, not anyone specifically.  Saying "you'll look like a d!ckhead" is not calling anyone a d!ckhead.

Also, reason on this particular thread is the first thing people skim over, so I make it a little bitey, and little hyperbolish. At least you read it, and got the thrust of my gist (O.O sounds dirty....), so mission accomplished.

Some folks are just a taaaad too sensitive (or sees their own argument being shown as nonsense) for their own good. I, however, am only responsible for my own content, not what people read into it.  The way I say something - proving the message is legit - should be irrelevant.  You don't like my style, fine.  But you can't deny I have legitimate points.

Get over yourselves.  Sheesh.  What are y'all - children?

This isn't 1956 and if you worry about offense, you should probably get off the internet - and especially out of BSN!  

Modifié par JakeMacDon, 24 février 2012 - 02:44 .

[kongenial]

Evilelf007 wrote...

What did Kasumi and her mission add? Did you miss all of the astonishing stolen objects in that vault? That's some serious lore about the ME universe!

Zaeed was basically an origin story of one of the largest crime syndicates in the galaxy...

Yeah, they didn't provide any ME lore at all...

Besides (I think I repeat myself) putting in a living Prothean is plain ridiculous, I think it was sad that you actually don't got more lore on Zaeed and his Blue Suns. But to mee the whole Zaeed/Kasumi DLC sounded rushed, as you don't get even dialogue wheels to conversate with then. They just say their lines without any further options.

[Rdubs]

ZX12r Ninja wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

Evilelf007 wrote...

You shouldn't HAVE to pay for dlc on day one? Nobody said you did HAVE to in the first place!

Though if you WANT the Prothean and mission, you will then HAVE to pay for it, just as those who paid for the CE did.

We already chose to pay for it, you can still say screw it and do without and not have any affect on game completeness.

You do if you want the complete game. As in everything available in day 1.

You never paid for it. It was listed as "bonus" you only paid for those items listed as "exclusive"

You have no right to say what is or is not complete.That's down to either the definition of the word or the legal interpretation of the word. Now the legal one I'm not sure of I'm pursing it. However. 

[color=#333333">having all parts or elements]lacking[/color] nothing; [color=#333333">whole]entire;[/color] [color=#333333">full: a complete set ]of[/color] Mark Twain's writings.

By that definition ME3 SE is not complete.


Sorry about that either have to going to highlight or look up your own definition of complete.

By your logic a car which isn't fully optioned is not complete, a house without a pool is not complete, a computer without an SSD and highend graphics card is not complete, a console without all it's accesories is not complete, a meal without desert is not complete, etc. etc. etc. etc.

If you didn't get what is advertised then it's not complete, else it is!

Wrong, again bringing in what Dilbert calls "Bizarre absolutes."  It doesn't need to be FULLY optioned.  It just has to have the IMPORTANT options, critical to the game story.  I would argue that a frikkin Prothean qualifies as important to the game / story / lore, for any serious player.  Others might not.  Which is fine, but they are missing out by starting with the PS3 version, it would be worth it for them to play Mass Effect either on the PC or xbox.

[f4rris]

 In my opinion a Prothean squad-mate / "story-line" should NOT be freaking optional ><

If EA/BW feels the damn need to make it a DLC (wich they shouldn't) make it free for ALL pre-orders (like Back 2 karkand with BF3) and not just only for the N7 edition.

Fine I have the N7 pre-orderd via Gamersgate.co.uk (before i knew anything about the DLC, since I had more money spare this month) but I still think it's quite Insane to make this a DLC, and make it "optional" .....

[fresh101]

What's next Bioware??? Should we pay EXTRA to see Liara in ME3???

[obie191970]

Lorfean wrote...

obie191970 wrote...

Lorfean wrote...

obie191970 wrote...
You got the Stone Prisoner, but they did the same thing with Warden's Keep which was included in the CE and $7 for everyone else as day 1 DLC.  Not only had the precedent been sent by Bioware, they told everyone that the bonus character and mission would be available as Day 1 DLC to those who didn't purchase the CE.

Warden's Keep didn't include a recruitable squad member -- it was a short mission that was seperate from the main story and didn't effect the overall experience of the game; a big difference compared to The Stone Prisoner DLC that included Shale who was part of your team for the rest of the entire game. Don't you see the difference between offering a side-mission, that you finish and then move on, and offering a squad member? These games are build around the player's crew -- they are such a big part of the experience. And this is a Prothean! A member of an immensly interesting and mysterious race. That's why I have a problem with not everyone getting this guy by default.

And what exactly *are* we getting with our standard version? We got The Stone Prisoner with DA:O and The Cerberus Network with ME2... BioWare set that precedent, too. So, what are we getting with ME3? The multiplayer component. Right.

So you expect to be showered with free gifts and extras for spending $60 on a video game?  Not only that, but you get to choose which extras you deem worthy?  I'm not a supporter of Day 1 DLC but it is pretty much standard practice in the industry now and it surely isn't going away.

I don't expect to be "showered with gifts" at all, but I expect BioWare to understand that denying players a squad member because they chose to buy the standard version of the game instead of one of the fancy pimped up versions is a stupid-ass move. I don't care if CE buyers get extra weapons, hoodies, dogs that follow them around... I could even accept a side mission or two of some kind, but squad members are an integral part of the game and this guy is extremely interesting lore-wise and his mission has great nostalgic potential for any longtime fan of the series. *That* is what I have a problem with. Everything considered, the content sounds like it definitely *should* be part of the full experience, but it isn't.

Nothing is being denied to you.  It's actually been offered to you.  The CE was adevertised to include a bonus mission and squad member which you could have purchased but chose not to, but now that he is a Prothean, you demand Bioware to give him to you for free.  I just don't understand the mentality behind that.  If it was Vega that was the DLC would you feel differently?

[OdanUrr]

JakeMacDon wrote...

All I was attempting to do was distill the arguments so far down and put a different spin on it in an attempt to look at it differently.  I called the arguments - as is readily discernible to anyone who actually read the thing - out, not anyone specifically.  Saying "you'll look like a d!ckhead" is not calling anyone a d!ckhead.

Also, reason on this particular thread is the first thing people skim over, so I make it a little bitey, and little hyperbolish. At least you read it, and got the thrust of my gist (O.O sounds dirty....), so mission accomplished.

Some folks are just a taaaad too sensitive (or sees their own argument being shown as nonsense) for their own good. I, however, am only responsible for my own content, not what people read into it.  The way I say something - proving the message is legit - should be irrelevant.  You don't like my style, fine.  But you can't deny I have legitimate points.

Get over yourselves.  Sheesh.  What are y'all - children?

This isn't 1956 and if you worry about offense, you should probably get off the internet - and especially out of BSN!  

I'm just trying to keep things civil, but it feels like I'm fighting an uphill battle.

[aksoileau]

Can it be the 6th yet? So people will be playing instead of complaining?

[kongenial]

obie191970 wrote...

Nothing is being denied to you.  It's actually been offered to you.  The CE was adevertised to include a bonus mission and squad member which you could have purchased but chose not to, but now that he is a Prothean, you demand Bioware to give him to you for free.  I just don't understand the mentality behind that.  If it was Vega that was the DLC would you feel differently?

I would feel differently. Why would I need an John Doe of the alliance if I have the Spectre Kaiden/Ashley by my side? He is a soldier so what. The other one is the only/one of the few survivers of an ancient civilization.

To me the pick is not difficult at all.

[Raxxman]

aksoileau wrote...

Can it be the 6th yet? So people will be playing instead of complaining?

March 10th release here mate.

Whole new ball game to complain about

[heart again]

Lorfean wrote...
]Squad members directly effect any player's overall experience of the game -- whether their mission is essential or non-essential to the main story is irrelevant. An extra squad member provides the player with unique options that last the entirety of the game and every player, regardless of which version of the game the choose to buy, should have the same options when it comes to squad members.

Really? Cause no one said a word when it was announced that the CE would include a bonus character and mission months and months ago.  I don't recall demands that Kasumi be free either, at least not ones with any merit.

Modifié par heart again, 24 février 2012 - 02:52 .

[Dorwrath]

So the Collectors Edition People are paying for the DLC + Character and the Standard Edition users want the content for free. Makes perfect sense.

So heres the solution, give it free to all and then refund $10 to the people that bought the Collectors Edition.

Just going to go buy the DLC, still cheaper than the Collectors Edition. No I don't think I'm special and deserve something for free.

[Dreskar]

kongenial wrote...

obie191970 wrote...

Nothing is being denied to you.  It's actually been offered to you.  The CE was adevertised to include a bonus mission and squad member which you could have purchased but chose not to, but now that he is a Prothean, you demand Bioware to give him to you for free.  I just don't understand the mentality behind that.  If it was Vega that was the DLC would you feel differently?

I would feel differently. Why would I need an John Doe of the alliance if I have the Spectre Kaiden/Ashley by my side? He is a soldier so what. The other one is the only/one of the few survivers of an ancient civilization.

To me the pick is not difficult at all.

Agreed with Kong here... if it was Vega I could care less, the fact its a prothean makes me care. Like I keep saying if it had been any other joe from any other race it would have been fine. But to make it a prothean, one of the most mystical races in the ME lore aside form the Reapers themselves, is just stupid, making it only because it will appeal to fans is even worse, then adding ontop of it that it will not be signifinant to the story... which the entire point of the Prothean mythos is how significant to stopping the reapers they are... just rubs salt in the wound.

[obie191970]

heart again wrote...

Lorfean wrote...
]Squad members directly effect any player's overall experience of the game -- whether their mission is essential or non-essential to the main story is irrelevant. An extra squad member provides the player with unique options that last the entirety of the game and every player, regardless of which version of the game the choose to buy, should have the same options when it comes to squad members.

Really? Cause no one said a word when it was announced that the CE would include a bonus character and mission months and months ago.

That's before everyone knew the DLC would include the most important character in the Mass Effect universe.

[Exia001]

obie191970 wrote...

heart again wrote...

Lorfean wrote...
]Squad members directly effect any player's overall experience of the game -- whether their mission is essential or non-essential to the main story is irrelevant. An extra squad member provides the player with unique options that last the entirety of the game and every player, regardless of which version of the game the choose to buy, should have the same options when it comes to squad members.

Really? Cause no one said a word when it was announced that the CE would include a bonus character and mission months and months ago.

That's before everyone knew the DLC would include the most important character in the Mass Effect universe.

Actually we've known that for 6 months or more too

[GnusmasTHX]

obie191970 wrote...

heart again wrote...

Lorfean wrote...
]Squad members directly effect any player's overall experience of the game -- whether their mission is essential or non-essential to the main story is irrelevant. An extra squad member provides the player with unique options that last the entirety of the game and every player, regardless of which version of the game the choose to buy, should have the same options when it comes to squad members.

Really? Cause no one said a word when it was announced that the CE would include a bonus character and mission months and months ago.

That's before everyone knew the DLC would include the most important character in the Mass Effect universe.

A DLC about Shepard! Can I have myself in my squad?!

[Renegade133]

Dorwrath wrote...

So the Collectors Edition People are paying for the DLC + Character and the Standard Edition users want the content for free. Makes perfect sense.

So heres the solution, give it free to all and then refund $10 to the people that bought the Collectors Edition.

Just going to go buy the DLC, still cheaper than the Collectors Edition. No I don't think I'm special and deserve something for free.

This

o and yeah this was pretty much announced when the collectors was announced

Modifié par Renegade133, 24 février 2012 - 02:56 .

[Rdubs]

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

Rdubs wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

OdanUrr wrote...

That's one way to look at it.

Well it's the way to look at it. I read that the way he said it, that it's old text that's being removed, and when they revealed the new text:



It fell in line perfectly with what Chris Priestly said. It's old text that got removed.

If you read that as them denying the prothean's existence then you need to learn how the English language works.

This is what makes this so funny.  Chris issues a cover statement reacting to a leak which really isn't a cover statement in that it isn't really retracting the content but rather the leak text itself, but phrased in such a way that it would seem to apply to the content and not the text which was removed, which results in multitudes of people in the forums quoting him as having denied or "debunked" the Prothean rumor.  So he issues a statement of the obvious about the obvious, but when people are like "he must be talking about the content, because no one would make such an obvious statement about the text" he just lets that ride.  That's pretty sad if you ask me, that people would defend him by saying you should have interpreted him literally full well knowing that no one did have, or would have.

So all the multitudes of people who responded to or started forums titled things like "THERE IS NO PROTHEAN DLC CHARACTER" are all stupid.  I bet Killer Angel must feel pretty foolish for not interpreting Chris literally when she started this thread, but maybe it's because she "needs to learn how the English language works."
http://social.biowar...index/7600487/1

Exactly.

Anyone that read DLC prothean/mission and "oh that's old text that's getting removed" is somewhat foolish or not a native english speaker.

Anyone that read DLC prothean/mission and "oh that's old text that's getting removed", then read the new DLC character/mission text a few days later and didn't think it was a prothean is a bloody idiot.

Reading one or the other and not realising it is fine. Reading both just makes you incredibly dense.

Actually, since we're being literal let's explore that.  The OP was asking SPECIFICALLY about the Prothean squad member.  The thread was titled "Prothean Squad Member Speculation Thread" and the squad member was highlighted.  To which Chris replied, in full:

"Sorry, that was a mistake from old text. It is being removed."

Notice how you try to phrase his reply as "that's old text that's getting removed."  Except that is NOT what he said.  He replied "That", as in "that was a mistake".  This means that the pronoun "that" applies to the topic being discussed, which would be the "Prothean Squad Member Speculation" and NOT the actual text itself.  The fact that everyone reading that discussion understood that seems logical, as it does when people started questioning about it on other threads and those threads were locked down.

Your trying to weasel a defense is highly reminiscent of Bill Clinton trying to defend himself during his impeachment trial when he said "there's nothing going on between us", which he then later clarified meant "is not" not "was not" which he knew everyone would interpret it as.  This resulted in the infamous "it depends what the meaning of the word 'is', is" quote whereby the USA became a global laughingstock.

Regardless, the original reason this came up was looking at history of statements Bioware PR put out to handle leaks and what kind of meaning was CONVEYED (how about that), which history has shown to be of either poor or misleading quality.

[heart again]

GnusmasTHX wrote...

obie191970 wrote...

heart again wrote...

Lorfean wrote...
]Squad members directly effect any player's overall experience of the game -- whether their mission is essential or non-essential to the main story is irrelevant. An extra squad member provides the player with unique options that last the entirety of the game and every player, regardless of which version of the game the choose to buy, should have the same options when it comes to squad members.

Really? Cause no one said a word when it was announced that the CE would include a bonus character and mission months and months ago.

That's before everyone knew the DLC would include the most important character in the Mass Effect universe.

A DLC about Shepard! Can I have myself in my squad?!

That's what I was thingking.<3

[Dorwrath]

heart again wrote...

Lorfean wrote...
]Squad members directly effect any player's overall experience of the game -- whether their mission is essential or non-essential to the main story is irrelevant. An extra squad member provides the player with unique options that last the entirety of the game and every player, regardless of which version of the game the choose to buy, should have the same options when it comes to squad members.

Really? Cause no one said a word when it was announced that the CE would include a bonus character and mission months and months ago.  I don't recall demands that Kasumi be free either, at least not ones with any merit.

Nope, nobody said a thing about the added mission and character. Nobody cared, nobody said nothing. Yet once it gets announced who the character is, then they say something.  They say it's the principle of day 1 DLC, but if thats the case why didn't they say anything when the DLC was announced.  What it boils down to is they are mad about what the content is and don't want to pay like the Collectors Edition people are paying.

[ZX12r Ninja]

Lorfean wrote...

ZX12r Ninja wrote...

Yeah and what did Zaeed or Katsumi have to add to the lore?

Very little. But this guy, by his very nature, obviously does. I'm pretty sure I'm not the only guy who's been interested in finding out more about the Protheans ever since I heard about them in ME1. Or who is intrigued by the prospect of re-visiting Eden Prime.

Okey, so YOU have some personal expectations which I can respect, but seem a bit ignorant too be honest. What do you expect to find on Eden Prime and second what do you expect to learn about the Protheans?

The Protheans were a race who lived 50.000 years ago, they didn't build the mass relays and they didn't buld the citadel, their technology was mostly based of things left behind from other races in other cycles, they were the last victims of the Reapers, they got attacked 50.000 years ago but because of problems harvesting them they were repurposed as collectors and finally in ME2 they got wiped out by Shepard.

What else do you need to know about the Protheans?

[Rdubs]

NoxJuked wrote...

I think almost everyone would agree day 1 DLC that comes out and was worked on while the core game was being worked on is bad. Bioware came out and said that this DLC was worked on while the core game was trying to go gold already, which means they worked on it after. As for the 9 month ago leaks, was most likely just the idea pitched in the office etc it doesn't mean they were working on it unless you have proof? Right none of us do so anything that goes against what Bioware said about the DLC so far feels like a conspiracy theory about how EA/Bioware is trying to milk the consumer for more money.

Do I fully believe either side though, no. I will hold rage until after the game is out and determine if they really swindled me for money, if they did oh well 10$ can't ****ing regret it I won't buy another game but this scenario is very doubtful as they have provided great DLC, multiplayer, and 3 fantastic games I have bought from them ME1, 2, and Dragon Age: Origins.

PLEASE stop repeating everything you hear from a Bioware PR person as fact without checking.  Here is proof that this was more than just a concept pitched during a management meeting a couple months ago.  Look at the date and understand that for something like this to make it into marketing materials, it had to have been approved at some level.
http://social.biowar...index/7551111/1