13369 réponses à ce sujet

[Argors]

rainasa wrote..
.



bioware never said that you where not a "true fan" because you didnt buy the CE, they said many long time fans would buy that version. hell its that reason why they didnt make javick exclusive to the CE for a month or so and then released him, so that people who didnt buy the CE could have the OPTION to getting him.

No that is want they said My PC is down am using my phone so am not writing a book. If you think spitting a fan base is ok then that you. Not me. I said how it made me feel that's all. I am a true fan or long time fan take your pick. I wasn't buying a CE after DA2. If you don't think this split the fan base just look at this one thread 200+ pages in what a day.-

The Collectors Edition has been advertised from the beginning as containing a bonus character/mission, but we were not at liberty to provide the details. The Prothean is optional content that is certainly designed to appeal to long-time fans, which is why he is part of the CE offering (the version many fans would be likely to purchase).  Mass Effect 3 is a complete – and a huge game - right out of the box

Modifié par Argors, 24 février 2012 - 04:33 .

[harvestboygoobus]

MissOuJ wrote...

BaronIveagh wrote...

MissOuJ wrote...

In all fairness, he apparently had a bigger role in the earlier drafts and was later dropped, and then (probably) picked up again by the guys working on the DLCs. Still doesn't make him "essential part of the core game", tho.

BTW, here's an interesting post on the Escapist by a developer who's familiar with the industry. It's a really interesting read, and explains a bit how DLC works. It's old, but still topical.

The problem is that's how it used to work, not how it works anymore.  I know the company I work atm for is watching this very closely, with plans to start making things like the endings of their games DLC if EA can get away with this.

Umm... no? Since the Prothean is an extra squadmate and not the magical space Deus Ex Machina that is required to complete the game. A truly incomplete game wound't pass certification, and ME3 went gold like a week ago. This is extra. I paid extra to get it, and for other people to get it for free seems a bit unfair to me. Sure, if I get a €10 refund and everyone bying the game new suddenly get it for free, then it'd be fine.

I'm sorry, but since when do CE owners get the Prothean for free? We're paying $20 more than SE owners to get our bonuses. Now, are the remaining bonuses after the Prothean only worth $10? That's debatable and quite subjective. However, the fact remains that we're paying extra as well.

That being said, I think the overreaction to this is absurd. People just don't want to listen to reason (or, you know, facts about how game development actually works). Bioware isn't ripping anyone off. They're offering a previously CE exclusive character to everyone. Why should SE owners get him for free when CE owners have to pay extra for our bonuses? But when it comes down to it, that's all he is. A bonus.

[Sylvianus]

GnusmasTHX wrote...

Sylvianus wrote...

Those who are happy about that, because you've got your CE edition, you are ridiculous. I have got mine, and I can understand why people are upset.

Run it down for me.

They're upset because they can buy the same thing we bought?

It is a prothean, you know what that means ? it should be in the game and the story for everyone. The CE edition, has many other things.

[HiroVoid]

rainasa wrote...

nitefyre410 wrote...

So Bioware spent the time, money and extra mans  hours to make and exclusive mission back and DLC  that was never intended to be for public use...

Okay... seems legit.

for the love of all that is holy, do you know how the certification process works???
once a game begins it, it CANNOT be altered in any way. it was druing the time the DLC TEAM started to work on *gasp* DLC!!! this is not hard to understand, it was made to be extra for CE owners and people who bought the DLC, it was NEVER meant to be in the actual ME3 game.

Putting aside everything else, this is naieve.  You really think they ever had any intentions of having this as CE exclusive?  That's not even greedy.  That's just bad business sense.

[Blarty]

Why has no one asked the real question at the heart of this matter: Has the idiot from XBL whose incompetence started this storm been fired yet?

[GnusmasTHX]

Sylvianus wrote...

GnusmasTHX wrote...

Sylvianus wrote...

Those who are happy about that, because you've got your CE edition, you are ridiculous. I have got mine, and I can understand why people are upset.

Run it down for me.

They're upset because they can buy the same thing we bought?

It is a prothean, you know what that means ? it should be in the game and the story for everyone. The CE edition, has many other things.

Sorry, but that is a strange train of thought... Wanting less of a bargain.

And I do know what it means. He's a Prothean, just that.

A long time ago a handful of these Protheans got together and set in motion a very fortunate chain of events for our generation.

Was this Prothean involved? Well...

Modifié par GnusmasTHX, 24 février 2012 - 04:28 .

[MissOuJ]

Sylvianus wrote...

Those who are happy about that, because you've got your CE edition, you are ridiculous. I have got mine, and I can understand why people are upset.

People would be more upset if it was CE exclusive, and then I'd be campaigning to make him DLC for everyone to have, because that's just fair - not everyone can get the CE, after all, and making cool extras available for everyone is just playing fair. But wanting something extra people have worked really hard for after the core game has gone to certification for free is just silly.

I'm paying €90 for the CE, and I put my pre-order in before I knew about the Prothean squadmate. I could have gotten something completely inconsequental, a la Zaeed 2.0. But now that the extra content is actually worth paying for, people are complaining about not getting him for free. <_<

Modifié par MissOuJ, 24 février 2012 - 04:29 .

[Rdubs]

rainasa wrote...

Rdubs wrote...

Are any of those features important to you, and the salesman told you this car would have all the important features you want? 
People trying to weasel to Bioware's defense are both LOL'ing and killing me here.  The issue isn't is it "complete" as in does it have every possible little thing.  The issue is, does it have all of the important pieces of content and lore.  New version of shotgun: No.  Prothean: Yes.  Again think of if good dialogue and squad mate Legion was only offered as DLC the day you bought the game.

exept it has been stated repeatedly that you can get the infomation that you get from Javick and his mission elsewhere in the actual game so that argument really doesnt work.

Again, two faults:
1) "It has been stated repeatedly" may be true for people who hawk the forums, but what about the big fans who don't read forums or spoilers?  Did Bioware intend to screw them for not doing so?
2) It's not about the information, it's about the experience.  Everything Legion told me about the Heretics and Nazara or whatever I could have read in an email or codex, but it was FRIKKIN AWESOME experiencing hearing that coming from a Geth.  I don't know what the Prothean will tell me as a squad member, but I sure as hell want to hear it from him instead of Liara or a codex.

[rainasa]

HiroVoid wrote...


Putting aside everything else, this is naieve.  You really think they ever had any intentions of having this as CE exclusive?  That's not even greedy.  That's just bad business sense.

uh, my point was that it was never developed to be in the actual game, not that it was only going to available to people who bought the CE

Modifié par rainasa, 24 février 2012 - 04:29 .

[Dovahzaan]

Sylvianus wrote...

It is a prothean, you know what that means ? it should be in the game and the story for everyone. The CE edition, has many other things.

Prothean? Never heard of it, so it can't be THAT important. You know what? **** you, haters, I just bought 3 copies of Mass Effect 3, to show some support. What kind of gamer are you, if you are not willing to buy some DLC and give BioWare your money?

[Rdubs]

rainasa wrote...

Rdubs wrote...

Here we have the crux of the issue.  Fans of the series would consider "learning more about the guys who died out 50,000 years ago" to be a CRITICAL part of the lore and story.  I can see why people who only got into it with the PS3 might think otherwise.  But there should be a rule, if you didn't play the original ME, don't chime in on Prothean content being an integral part of the story.

and the prothean's stoped being actually relevent at the end of ME1 as well, they where thrown into 2 just to make a cameo and to prove the point of how big and mean the repears are. you do not deserve extra and optional content to be free because you are throwing a temper tantrum.

Again, confusing plot with the story / experience.

[AkiKishi]

Sylvianus wrote...

Those who are happy about that, because you've got your CE edition, you are ridiculous and pathetic. I have got mine, and I can understand why people are upset. The prothean should be in the game, compared to the Mass effect's story.

You would think they would take the option that made things easiest for Bioware being such big fans and all.

Not all CE owners are like that many who have posted on this thread share your view.

[Blarty]

Rdubs wrote...

Daywalker315 wrote...

^No he doesn't, and neither do you. He said "denying players a squad member". Wrong. No one is denying anybody anything. You can buy it as DLC. That is not being denied something. That is just being asked to pay extra for extra content that is non-essential to the main story of ME3, which is killing reapers, not "learning more about the guys who died out 50,000 years ago".

Here we have the crux of the issue.  Fans of the series would consider "learning more about the guys who died out 50,000 years ago" to be a CRITICAL part of the lore and story.  I can see why people who only got into it with the PS3 might think otherwise.  But there should be a rule, if you didn't play the original ME, don't chime in on Prothean content being an integral part of the story.

But does it NEED to be a Prothean squadmate - do you need to have that knowledge imparted by a playable character? Do you even know if that lore is just coming from the Prothean individual, do you even know if the Prothean is in the game, but not available to be used as a squadmate who don;t have the From Ashes DLC....

In other words, just how are you qualifying and quantifying this supposed loss to this extent? 

[Kamil Black Fox]

GnusmasTHX wrote...

Sylvianus wrote...

Those who are happy about that, because you've got your CE edition, you are ridiculous. I have got mine, and I can understand why people are upset.

Run it down for me.

They're upset because they can buy the same thing we bought?

Nope, they ran out early Janurary. Even if they did reserve it early... there still would be a shortage.

[AkiKishi]

 

Dudes over half a million hits in a couple of days and now girls with revealing tops are getting in on the act.

Modifié par BobSmith101, 24 février 2012 - 04:32 .

[BaronIveagh]

rainasa wrote...

for the love of all that is holy, do you know how the certification process works???
once a game begins it, it CANNOT be altered in any way. it was druing the time the DLC TEAM started to work on *gasp* DLC!!! this is not hard to understand, it was made to be extra for CE owners and people who bought the DLC, it was NEVER meant to be in the actual ME3 game.

Yeah, you can send a game in for cert, say it's complete, and then change it heavily with patches and DLC afterward, just as ratings boards can change the game's rating after certification. (I'm assuming the game's rating is the certification you are referring to, as it's not entirely clear)

Some information I have not seen myself indicates that, yes, early on the Prothean character was part of the main game. This was changed during the design phase, or so I'm led to believe. Take it with a grain of salt.

The problem here is that the Protheans and Reapers are so central to the story that most people will have a hard time buying that a live Prothean has no impact on the game, much as a reaper party member would have no impact on the game.

[Blarty]

GnusmasTHX wrote...

Martin the Warrior wrote...

ROFL. You know what I just thought of? 

The scene in Futurama that shows how Fry got into the stasis pod in the first place. Imagine if that happened to the Prothean.

Yes I do believe that Javick is just his Codename, he's really called Prothy J Fry.

[rainasa]

Rdubs wrote...



Again, two faults:
1) "It has been stated repeatedly" may be true for people who hawk the forums, but what about the big fans who don't read forums or spoilers?  Did Bioware intend to screw them for not doing so?
2) It's not about the information, it's about the experience.  Everything Legion told me about the Heretics and Nazara or whatever I could have read in an email or codex, but it was FRIKKIN AWESOME experiencing hearing that coming from a Geth.  I don't know what the Prothean will tell me as a squad member, but I sure as hell want to hear it from him instead of Liara or a codex.

those are opinions, as for 1. it was said by the developer on reddit last night, and by the ones on this topic and is propably going to be brought up when they post the trailer.
2. thats a personal proplem and just because you feel you need it doesnt mean they should give you content that is designed to be EXTRA and OPTIONAL.

[Relix28]

rainasa wrote...

nitefyre410 wrote...

So Bioware spent the time, money and extra mans  hours to make and exclusive mission back and DLC  that was never intended to be for public use...

Okay... seems legit.

for the love of all that is holy, do you know how the certification process works???
once a game begins it, it CANNOT be altered in any way. it was druing the time the DLC TEAM started to work on *gasp* DLC!!! this is not hard to understand, it was made to be extra for CE owners and people who bought the DLC, it was NEVER meant to be in the actual ME3 game.

Still doesn't justify charging your customers extra ON RELEASE DAY. Just look at how Zaeed and/or Shale were handled. Probably the exact same situation you described above, except everyone got it for "free" just by buying th game new.
And about this "never meant to be in the main game" BS. Frankly, this point is moot. They could have just as easily included dlc codes for the prothean in every new version of the game, and there would have been 10 time less complaining about it. Because that way it would have been perceived as an incentive to buy the game new, and not as a blatant consumer milking move.

Modifié par Relix28, 24 février 2012 - 04:35 .

[Blarty]

rainasa wrote...

GnusmasTHX wrote...

Martin the Warrior wrote...

ROFL. You know what I just thought of? 

The scene in Futurama that shows how Fry got into the stasis pod in the first place. Imagine if that happened to the Prothean.

i vaguely remember the mod making that same joke back in the 100's

aah the 100s - those heady carefree days....good times

[DenizYe]

MissOuJ wrote...

Sylvianus wrote...

Those who are happy about that, because you've got your CE edition, you are ridiculous. I have got mine, and I can understand why people are upset.

People would be more upset if it was CE exclusive, and then I'd be campaigning to make him DLC for everyone to have, because that's just fair - not everyone can get the CE, after all, and making cool extras available for everyone is just playing fair. But wanting something extra people have worked really hard for after the core game has gone to certification for free is just silly.

I'm paying €90 for the CE, and I put my pre-order in before I knew about the Prothean squadmate. I could have gotten something completely inconsequental, a la Zaeed 2.0. But now that the extra content is actually worth paying for, people are complaining about not getting him for free. <_<

Yes true. I live in Germany and I'm paying 90 Euros for the CE. Well that's 30 Euro more than the SE. So I think that this DLC is included in the price because in the USA, the CE "only" costs 20 dollars more.


30 Euro = 40 Dollar
20 Dollar = 15 Euro 
:/ I'm confused but yea. I don't think that they will change the plan for this DLC , maybe we all get some more free stuff afterwards because they feel sorry or whatever. But on point: I can't play the game and DLC and love the idea of a living prothean...

[rainasa]

BaronIveagh wrote...

Yeah, you can send a game in for cert, say it's complete, and then change it heavily with patches and DLC afterward, just as ratings boards can change the game's rating after certification. (I'm assuming the game's rating is the certification you are referring to, as it's not entirely clear)

Some information I have not seen myself indicates that, yes, early on the Prothean character was part of the main game. This was changed during the design phase, or so I'm led to believe. Take it with a grain of salt.

The problem here is that the Protheans and Reapers are so central to the story that most people will have a hard time buying that a live Prothean has no impact on the game, much as a reaper party member would have no impact on the game.

javick was a main part of the first leaked script (one that was very, very old) and was cut completely by the second for various reasons.

but instead of just removing him completely they made him an optional squadmate with very little impact on the main story to be released as part of the CE and as DLC. the dev's have said that he was NEVER going to be in the game itself, and if they had not released him as DLC then you simply would never have gotten him at all.

[MissOuJ]

Rdubs wrote...
2) It's not about the information, it's about the experience.  Everything Legion told me about the Heretics and Nazara or whatever I could have read in an email or codex, but it was FRIKKIN AWESOME experiencing hearing that coming from a Geth.  I don't know what the Prothean will tell me as a squad member, but I sure as hell want to hear it from him instead of Liara or a codex.

It was also somewhat relevant to the (future?) plot. Which is why Legion is in the game.

Hearing Zaeed whine about the Blue Suns might be interesting to some people (certainly wasn't for me, but I hate his guts so I'm a bit biased), but it wasn't relevant to the plot. Thus, if you buy your game used, you have to pay extra for Zaeed. Again, he comes with an extra mission and new gun and so on, but he's not relevant to the plot.

Same with Kasumi (whom I love): Comes with a mission and a new gun, some interesting stuff about black boxes and ME technology, but again, having/not having her is not going to make any difference in the long run.

[Rdubs]

spectralpulse wrote...

I woulden't be so irritated if i could still order the CE. After ME3 Bioware has nothing on the horizon i'm interested in. Looks like this might be the end of the line for Bioware and me.

THAT'S how you know this whole "many fans will buy the CE" is a weak cop-out attempt at damage control, because if their intent was to enable every big fan to be able to experience the Prothean there would have been:
1) A lot more availablity of the CE, you wouldn't be like "oh too bad for you loyal fan we ran out"
2) A lot better informing the public that if they want important backstory to the ME universe they'd better be sure to order the CE!

The more likely thread connecting the above is they figured all along that customers would be more than willing to pay for the important backstory experience so planned that from the start, but screwed up because it leaked early and now they are in damage control mode and not "framing the message" mode like they had been planning.

[Sylvianus]

MissOuJ wrote...

Sylvianus wrote...

Those who are happy about that, because you've got your CE edition, you are ridiculous. I have got mine, and I can understand why people are upset.

People would be more upset if it was CE exclusive, and then I'd be campaigning to make him DLC for everyone to have, because that's just fair - not everyone can get the CE, after all, and making cool extras available for everyone is just playing fair. But wanting something extra people have worked really hard for after the core game has gone to certification for free is just silly.

I'm paying €90 for the CE, and I put my pre-order in before I knew about the Prothean squadmate. I could have gotten something completely inconsequental, a la Zaeed 2.0. But now that the extra content is actually worth paying for, people are complaining about not getting him for free. <_<

It isn't extra, it is something that should be already in the game. The prothean squadmate will learn you many things about his people, ( What nobody knows but want to learn since the beginning ) there will be party banter, he will go on Eden Prime and you 'll learn some things important about the story, probably. That pretty much concerns the universe of Mass effect.  That means those who won't buy the DLC will never understand some things.

Extras, what is it ? Weapons, alternative outfit, robot dog, etc etc. That's what I call extra and we will get them, even an artbook. M3 should be a complete game for everyone at the very least.

The squadmate should have been someone else. And Bioware didn't even say who would be the squadmate, when there were CE editions.

and you are naive, bioware released that because they understood that it would have been worse otherwise. Still, it is bad.

Modifié par Sylvianus, 24 février 2012 - 04:40 .