13369 réponses à ce sujet

[Blarty]

See I just thought that the Prothean would be acting as a stand-up comedian who would be a bit of a minor celebrity who would often be the voice of reason for the rest of the characters.... Oh.... Wait... That's Seinfeld.... Damnit Bioware you have misappropriated my expectations and thus because you cannot give me my 'From Seinfeld' DLC, I have no other option but to cancel my Preorder. Good Day, Sir!!!

[MissOuJ]

Yuoaman wrote...

The chart is inaccurate, though, considering modern game development.

True, but it is less inaccurate than the Mona Lisa macro that gets spammed.

TBQH, I'd rather not see either of them again in this thead. And maybe I can stop the tides as well, while I'm at it...

[AkiKishi]

MageCeridan wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

blueruin wrote...

It's not a hidden cost.  You can buy it, or you can not buy it.  The choice is up to you.  And you totally missed the point of the chart.

Does it say on the box "Prothean £10" ? 
No ?
Then it's a hidden cost.

Is it mandatory?
No? 
Then it's NOT an hidden cost.

Is the game complete without it ? No.

Hidden cost.

[_symphony]

commandoclone87 wrote...
Just pointing this out, but wasn't the DLC originally going to be Collector's Edition only?

I only saw advertisements that said it was included with the CE edition and nothing saying that it could be purchased separately.

It either said anything about being exclusive.

[Genshie]

commandoclone87 wrote...



And for the people that cancelled their CE pre-orders, you guys were getting the content anyways. This in no way affected you and you cancelled what is likely to be the best game of 2012? I do feel sorry for you, but maybe now my brother can get yoour copy of the CE edition instead of the standard game.

That is a thing that alot of the cancelled peeps with CE pre-orders don't realize is that they aren't doing a thing to hurt Bioware since alot of people are just dying to pick up a CE version themselves. I just normally go on saying you just made another person really happy.

[ArkkAngel007]

commandoclone87 wrote...

Just pointing this out, but wasn't the DLC originally going to be Collector's Edition only?

I only saw advertisements that said it was included with the CE edition and nothing saying that it could be purchased separately.

And what if you couldn't find or afford the CE edition, then you weren't getting the DLC.

In honesty, they don't have to sell the DLC separate. They never advertised it as such and maybe they could have kept it for CE owners only.

But, they didn't, instead they are now offering everyone who couldn't find the CE edition (my brother included) a way to purchase the exclusive content separately. IMO (and I may catch some flak for this,) by doing this, Bioware is actually making a move that should be pleasing people, but some are just too thick headed and prone to anger to think in a logical manner.

And for the people that cancelled their CE pre-orders, you guys were getting the content anyways. This in no way affected you and you cancelled what is likely to be the best game of 2012? I do feel sorry for you, but maybe now my brother can get yoour copy of the CE edition instead of the standard game.

That's where it originally was advertized.  There was no solid indication that it was exclusive though.

And some of those who cancelled their CE did it to not support the handling of the DLC.  Still an exaggerated gesture, but they are entitled to display their displeasure it whatever form they see fit (legally of course ).

[fropas]

BobSmith101 wrote...

MageCeridan wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

blueruin wrote...

It's not a hidden cost.  You can buy it, or you can not buy it.  The choice is up to you.  And you totally missed the point of the chart.

Does it say on the box "Prothean £10" ? 
No ?
Then it's a hidden cost.

Is it mandatory?
No? 
Then it's NOT an hidden cost.

Is the game complete without it ? No.

Hidden cost.

that depends on your definition of complete (BW believes it is complete without)

[Genshie]

_symphony wrote...

commandoclone87 wrote...
Just pointing this out, but wasn't the DLC originally going to be Collector's Edition only?

I only saw advertisements that said it was included with the CE edition and nothing saying that it could be purchased separately.

It either said anything about being exclusive.

You meant "neither" but I got ya. One could easily guess that it was since it was never mentioned to come with the SE version of the game at all. Even on websites it didn't say that the SE version was going to get anything special unless you pre-ordered it of course.

[BiO]

BobSmith101 wrote...

MageCeridan wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

blueruin wrote...

It's not a hidden cost.  You can buy it, or you can not buy it.  The choice is up to you.  And you totally missed the point of the chart.

Does it say on the box "Prothean £10" ? 
No ?
Then it's a hidden cost.

Is it mandatory?
No? 
Then it's NOT an hidden cost.

Is the game complete without it ? No.

Hidden cost.

inb4protheanisnotessential

[blueruin]

MageCeridan wrote...

blueruin wrote...

MageCeridan wrote...

MissOuJ wrote...

blueruin wrote...

Yuoaman wrote...

blueruin wrote...

http://i.imgur.com/m77S3.png

If that chart is true, then I guess I understand. It's still annoying and I still hate EA, but I understand.

It isn't quite true in modern game development - things are more iterative and less of a waterfall nowadays.

That's very vague and uninformative.

I think this is what Yuoaman is talking about. (if I'm wrong, please correct).

Yes that's what he was talking about.
Modern game developpers prefer Iterative development models because it's easier(and cheaper) to catch and fix mistakes done at design time since the software will pass through the development phases multiple times.

Oh okay.  So are you saying that them developing Day 1 DLC has nothing to do with keeping their people paid and employed?

No, I'm talking stricky about software development.

In this case, They are probably moving the analysis/design team to work on the DLC near the end since you don't do mutch design/analysis in the later iterations (aka; while they might have "PROTEAN CHARACTER" as a general concept during the brainstorming of iterative phase 1, but they only decided to flesh it out while the game was in the later stage nearing the release date and therefore decided to use that as the DLC character+mission promissed to CE/DDE buyers.)

Ahah.  I don't know anything about game development, I was just trying to figure out if you were saying that because modern game companies use an iterative model it debunks the arguments the chart was making.

[Blarty]

BobSmith101 wrote...

MageCeridan wrote...

Is it mandatory?
No? 
Then it's NOT an hidden cost.

Is the game complete without it ? No.

Hidden cost.

Can the game be completed without it? Yes

[ArkkAngel007]

BobSmith101 wrote...

MageCeridan wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

blueruin wrote...

It's not a hidden cost.  You can buy it, or you can not buy it.  The choice is up to you.  And you totally missed the point of the chart.

Does it say on the box "Prothean £10" ? 
No ?
Then it's a hidden cost.

Is it mandatory?
No? 
Then it's NOT an hidden cost.

Is the game complete without it ? No.

Hidden cost.

The game itself is complete without it.  But since you feel that you need it because you want it, it's now incomplete without it?  Sorry, that's not how it works.  If the retail copy of the game is complete as is, then it is complete as is.  Additional content, no matter how much it means to you on a personal level or how you feel it should be applied, is still additional content.

[Warlegendz]

MageCeridan wrote...

Warlegendz wrote...

Well to be honest I believe The Prothean should have been part of the original game instead of dlc cause Zaeed and Kasumi really had no dialogue aside from their quests, I love talking to my squad mates after a mission, to see their insight on things and such. But either way I'm excited, lets see what happens

Wrong, they had some dialog outside of their quest. Just not on the Normandy.

They did your right but it wasn't much like having those convos with your crew on the Normandy

[stargatefan1990]

BobSmith101 wrote...

MageCeridan wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

blueruin wrote...

It's not a hidden cost.  You can buy it, or you can not buy it.  The choice is up to you.  And you totally missed the point of the chart.

Does it say on the box "Prothean £10" ? 
No ?
Then it's a hidden cost.

Is it mandatory?
No? 
Then it's NOT an hidden cost.

Is the game complete without it ? No.

Hidden cost.

actually it is complete this game is about the invasion of the reapers not about a race that was supposedly wiped out thousands of years ago, The Dlc is for people who want to see the lore of the universe open so yes it is complete and the DLC is optional with a clear price so no hidden cost

[commandoclone87]

No, but it never said anything about you being able to get it in the standard game and it was advertised as part of the Collector's Edition.

[Genshie]

fropas wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

MageCeridan wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

blueruin wrote...

It's not a hidden cost.  You can buy it, or you can not buy it.  The choice is up to you.  And you totally missed the point of the chart.

Does it say on the box "Prothean £10" ? 
No ?
Then it's a hidden cost.

Is it mandatory?
No? 
Then it's NOT an hidden cost.

Is the game complete without it ? No.

Hidden cost.

that depends on your definition of complete (BW believes it is complete without)

Can you play the game and beat the game without the dlc? The answer is yes and by most logical people that is considered a completed game. You didn't need Kasumi's stolen memories, Lair of the Shadow Broker, Zaeed's dlc, or Project Overlord/Arrival, to complete ME2. Please people stop misusing words that you don't understand. Complete game is something that you can run from beginning to end.

[fropas]

ME2 is incomplete without LotSB! Pre-order cancelled!

Modifié par fropas, 24 février 2012 - 06:35 .

[MageCeridan]

BobSmith101 wrote...

MageCeridan wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

blueruin wrote...

It's not a hidden cost.  You can buy it, or you can not buy it.  The choice is up to you.  And you totally missed the point of the chart.

Does it say on the box "Prothean £10" ? 
No ?
Then it's a hidden cost.

Is it mandatory?
No? 
Then it's NOT an hidden cost.

Is the game complete without it ? No.

Hidden cost.

errrm do you know the meaning of the word Mandatory? is it a too big word for you? Ok then let me rephrase that.

Can you complete the game without it?
Yes?
There it's not an hidden cost.

[MissOuJ]

BobSmith101 wrote...

MageCeridan wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

blueruin wrote...

It's not a hidden cost.  You can buy it, or you can not buy it.  The choice is up to you.  And you totally missed the point of the chart.

Does it say on the box "Prothean £10" ? 
No ?
Then it's a hidden cost.

Is it mandatory?
No? 
Then it's NOT an hidden cost.

Is the game complete without it ? No.

Hidden cost.

Since it was finished after the core game went into certification, it is an extra, and not mandatory. Ergo, SE is a complete game without it.

As someone who played DAO without any extra content whatsoever (Stone Prisoner, Soldier's Peak, anything) I can guarantee from my experience that BioWare games without Day-1 DLC (or, in fact, the new buyer's free bonuses) are still very much complete games.

If this changes at any point, I'll hop the fence and rally with you guys for sure.

Modifié par MissOuJ, 24 février 2012 - 06:40 .

[Squallypo]

a game is complete when its burn and send to x quantity of game retailers, but that doesnt mean that game itself could have been made complete just because it has already *gone gold* do you understand that ? also understand that developers they never gonna tell you the real truth behind their own words and what they do about the game they develop. its a pretty nasty enviroment.

[ArkkAngel007]

commandoclone87 wrote...

No, but it never said anything about you being able to get it in the standard game and it was advertised as part of the Collector's Edition.

I'm just imparting the reasoning.  Whether the reasoning is valid or not really isn't my concern.  My concern is making sure the facts are accurate.

[_symphony]

MageCeridan wrote...
errrm do you know the meaning of the word Mandatory? is it a too big word for you? Ok then let me rephrase that.

Can you complete the game without it?
Yes?
There it's not an hidden cost.

This is rubbish, you can also complete ME with only two squadmates. The important thing about prothy is that he's a prothean, that's the issue, nobody would be making this fuss if it was another Zaeed or Kasumi.

Modifié par _symphony, 24 février 2012 - 06:39 .

[fropas]

Squallypo wrote...

a game is complete when its burn and send to x quantity of game retailers, but that doesnt mean that game itself could have been made complete just because it has already *gone gold* do you understand that ? also understand that developers they never gonna tell you the real truth behind their own words and what they do about the game they develop. its a pretty nasty enviroment.

Developers lie? Unlike consumers who are trying to get content they haven't paid for?

[KBomb]

RiouHotaru wrote...

Oh get off your high horse.  Calling us "Biodrones" or the BDF doesn't help your case.  Insulting the opposition makes you look just as bad.

 
To be fair, there is a lot of high riding on both sides. Insulting the opposition makes both sides look bad. Not saying this to you personally, mind you. In general I have seen both sides act like spoiled children. Calling someone a biodrone is incendiary, there is no doubt about that. It's also incendiary to tell someone how “fighting for Bioware is righteous and anyone else is wrong”. It's also incendiary to have banners bragging about owning the CE and NGAF. It's incendiary to tell someone that their way of handling their money—whether it's canceling pre-orders or boycotting is wrong or dumb. There is a lot of self-congratulatory back patting and provoking on both sides.

Modifié par KBomb, 24 février 2012 - 06:43 .

[eoinnx02]

Hey Chris(If you are seeing this)!

Is there a trailer today?