13369 réponses à ce sujet

[Darth_Trethon]

From Ashes is N7 CE content, the end. Be VERY grateful that you are allowed the opportunity to obtain it without the CE. The content is NOT cut from the game since it very much IS part of the game included in the box with CEs so I really see no point to all this complaining. I cannot imagine how anyone that cares about the complete ME3 experience would not buy the CE....but even if you do care now it's too little too late....you should have thought about that months ago when the CE was still up for sale. But no, you decided you did NOT care about having the complete ME3 experience and that missing on the CE was acceptable so now the knowledge of what you missed stings you bad....good, that's how it should be. I would feel VERY miserable if I had missed on the CE but I would NOT blame anyone other than myself. You are not entitled to anything but the bare bones game in the regular edition and the ability to buy the CE is a privilege only truly afforded to the true fans that follow the game long before release and bother to preorder months ahead. You had the opportunity to have the complete game experience and you passed it so now it's time to forever hold your peace. I cannot fathom why you would not be grateful for being granted the opportunity to have at least a piece of the CE content....of course it's not going to be free but by all rights it should never be on sale since it IS N7 CE content and then you would be begging for the opportunity to buy it separately.

Modifié par Darth_Trethon, 25 février 2012 - 06:27 .

[CommanderCoffee]

Yuoaman wrote...

CommanderCoffee wrote...

Yuoaman
Just because someone records a video with them playing a character doesn't make it "mocking", just felt like mentioning that.

How about his actual video on the matter?

 

Again, just because his original video wasn't serious doesn't mean he was mocking anyone.

Even though the schtick of that character is to mock people. Makes perfect sense. 

[LOST SPARTANJLC]

jpzgoku wrote...

BaronIveagh wrote...

The problem is this DLC business is getting out of control. Where do you draw the line? Now? Or when we *have* to pay for DLC because half the game has been chopped off to make DLC?

Thats what it will come to if the consumer allows it to go so far.

But it won't.You micro-transction an mmo , iyou can't do the same thing with any other regular game.Develpers push their luck , but even they aren't stupid enough to do this.A few might buy the games , but the vast majority would abandon games for older titles/indie games.

[Yuoaman]

ArkkAngel007 wrote...

Really, I think the only main issue, outside of people not understanding why those who oppose this do so, is that people still believe it's cut content from the main game.

Go to the Spoiler group, torrent the script or have someone PM them to you, read the TLK files in the demo, and line it all up with the tweets and statements with developers over the course of development. It was never a part of the main game during the game's production.

The first full draft detailed a Prothean that was the center of the plot, as well as many different elements not present in the final game. While the reveal was awesome, the rest of the Prothean's involvement was very cliche and practically made the player inconsequential to the game. So, he and many other concepts were dropped. At this stage, the game is still in pre-development. Only concept art and the testing of new mechanics, programs, and equipment are being done in addition to the drafting process.

Script 2, no Prothean at all, and is a similar, if incomplete, version of what would become the final script. This is still pre-production.

Script 3 and the final one in the TLK file that I have on hand. The script is mostly complete, from beginning to end, with virtually all the dialogue and cutscene descriptions of the game. In there, there is a handful of lines of someone called Javik, and it is strongly implied that he is a Prothean. However, nothing else is given. There is no recruitment descriptions, skills description, mission description...I don't even think Eden Prime is listed with the planets in ME3 (Eden Prime is listed in the part that takes from your save import though from ME1). There is nothing but a few lines of dialogue for VO purposes.  This version was the one used for production purposes.


VO work and markers, just like with Kasumi and Zaeed with ME2, are on the retail disc, but that's it. All the essential work was done outside of the main game development, with a team cordoned off as main development wrapped up to do the level design, programming, modeling, etc. Once the main game was off to certification, those free to do so joined in the development of the DLC. This was all done with probably a separate budget (after all, EA makes more that way, though I admit that last bit is a guess), as budgets are also pre-planned.

Again, I'm here to help your guys' argument against this DLC. I'm not trying to dupe and mislead you. I'm just imparting the little bit I can share with you without getting gagged so that you can understand the fact.

Please don't have me type this again.

This post, this post.

This post.

Whether the DLC was cut from the game or not has no bearing on this situation (even though it wasn't cut out), it has to do with its distribution.

[Renegade133]

BaronIveagh wrote...

Renegade133 wrote...

Kotor did have DLC i think it was higher res movies i cant really recall Jade Empire did have a special edition for pc which came with a few extra styles............ that im pretty sure of

Yeah, but it didn't come with the tien style that xbox users could dl.  I remember that now.

hehe yeah conicidentally they have been my favourite games for the PC ( im mainly a pc player not a leetest tho )

[jpzgoku]

GuyIncognito21 wrote...

BaronIveagh wrote...

The problem is this DLC business is getting out of control. Where do you draw the line? Now? Or when we *have* to pay for DLC because half the game has been chopped off to make DLC?

Exactly, and that's why I wish people wouldn't be so quick to accept the company line that "we had a separate team develop it, and we waited until the game was in certification," and whatever else.

If people accept that, then it will become SOP to take important content, pack it off to a "separate" team, and wait until the rest of the game is "finished" to put it together.

I don't think companies should be given the benefit of the doubt on that model, certainly not when the nefarious specter of EA is hovering over this process like a storm cloud. 

Yes

[LOST SPARTANJLC]

Darth_Trethon wrote...

From Ashes is N7 CE content, the end. Be VERY grateful that you are allowed the opportunity to obtain it without the CE. The content is NOT cut from the game since it very much IS part of the game included in the box with CEs so I really see no point to all this complaining. I cannot imagine how anyone that cares about the complete ME3 experience would not buy the CE....but even if you do it's too little too late....you should have thought about that months ago when the CE was still up for sale. But no, you decided you did NOT care about having the complete ME3 experience and that missing on the CE was acceptable so now the knowledge of what you missed stings you bad....good, that's how it should be. I would feel VERY miserable if I had missed on the CE but I would NOT blame anyone other than myself. You are not entitled to anything but the bare bones game in the regular edition and the ability to buy the CE is a privilege only truly afforded to the true fans that follow the game long before release and bother to preorder months ahead. You had the opportunity to have the complete game experience and you passed it so now it's time to forever hold your peace. I cannot fathom why you would not be grateful for being granted the opportunity to have at least a piece of the CE content....of course it's not going to be free but by all rights it should never be on sale since it IS N7 CE content and then you would be begging for the opportunity to buy it separately.

^This , they could have never planned to release it outside CE's.But they did think rationally about and decided not to leave non-CE's out in the cold.That's got to count for something. 

[AdmiralCheez]

BaronIveagh wrote...

The problem is this DLC business is getting out of control. Where do you draw the line? Now? Or when we *have* to pay for DLC because half the game has been chopped off to make DLC?

For me?  Later.  When the inevitable happens, I'll have a good stockpile of old games I can play again and again until the industry straightens itself out.

ME3 is probably going to be the last new game I buy for a very long time, anyway.  There's a seriously long list of older stuff I never got into.  Like, seriously.  You wouldn't believe the stuff I haven't played yet.

If ME3 really is the game that crosses the line, I'll probably make just one post explaining why, then quit the fandom.  No point in wallowing in my grief.

[GuyIncognito21]

RDSFirebane wrote...

There you go again  *cut* "Why is it ok too you cut content and sell it for $10 extra?" *cut*  you have no proof it was cut. when you have some I'll address it.

I think you're interpreting "cut" a little too literally.  Whether the content was actually on the disc at some point and then excised is just semantics to me.

My definition of "cut" is:

A) this content is complete before launch; and

 this content is important enough that it would be in the game even if they could only charge $60 for the whole package."

If both those prongs are met, then to me it becomes "cut content." 

[jpzgoku]

RDSFirebane wrote...

jpzgoku wrote...

RDSFirebane wrote...

GuyIncognito21 wrote...

Plus, and this is the key point, we aren't talking about ADDITIONAL content.  We're talking about core content that should by all rights be in the game to begin with.

Not to jump between you two. But ^ why? It's always been about Shep. Stopping the Reapers with the Pro. just being the race that gave him the chance to do it they have always played a back seat role in the story as Shep. was doing everything the fact one is alive and breathing isnt really changeing much other then the fact he might be able to clear some stuff up. you act like he has a hidden god mode on him or something.

Be careful with what you are saying because it sounds like you are justifing (this is an extreme example and perhaps a stretch) of making Sheppard the only playable character. If you want Tali, Garrus, ect. they cost $10 extra each, because, in what you are implying, the story is about Sheppard.

*cut*

There you go again  *cut* "Why is it ok too you cut content and sell it for $10 extra?" *cut*  you have no proof it was cut. when you have some I'll address it.

haha:D

[Insaner Robot]

RDSFirebane wrote...

How many of thouse games u just listed had CE that had DLC as part of them? No really I don't know.

Jade Empire had a CE with exclusive characters in it for the player to choose during creation/selection.

[_symphony]

WeWant wrote...
I know, that's why I said "content that has been developped so far."  There is no clear definition of when a game is complete or not. I'f you are a developer and you care about perfectioning your game, what should matter to you is putting as much content as possible in order to enhance it, instead of just filling some DLC quota prerequisited by EA.

No, a good developer doesn't put as much content as possible, if that's the case then you will get a game with a Duke Nukem Forever development cycle.

At some point you have to stop, make a "feature freeze", and you don't make any significant changes in the game content, none, you only tweak things and make everything work. Then you get into the "code freeze" stage, at that point you don't change anything unless is bug fixing. These stages can take a lot of time depending of the complexity of the software.

If you don't follow stages like those during the development of any software, you get something that's imposible to debug and maintain.  You will miss deadlines or release a software full of bugs.

Modifié par _symphony, 25 février 2012 - 06:32 .

[BaronIveagh]

LOST SPARTANJLC wrote...

But it won't.You micro-transction an mmo , iyou can't do the same thing with any other regular game.Develpers push their luck , but even they aren't stupid enough to do this.A few might buy the games , but the vast majority would abandon games for older titles/indie games.

Really?
http://www.escapistm...Coming-To-China

Activision would seem to disagree with you.  They've been pushing microtransactions in the asian market for years and it's finally reaching itno games other than mmos. 

Modifié par BaronIveagh, 25 février 2012 - 06:32 .

[nitefyre410]

LOST SPARTANJLC wrote...

Darth_Trethon wrote...

From Ashes is N7 CE content, the end. Be VERY grateful that you are allowed the opportunity to obtain it without the CE. The content is NOT cut from the game since it very much IS part of the game included in the box with CEs so I really see no point to all this complaining. I cannot imagine how anyone that cares about the complete ME3 experience would not buy the CE....but even if you do it's too little too late....you should have thought about that months ago when the CE was still up for sale. But no, you decided you did NOT care about having the complete ME3 experience and that missing on the CE was acceptable so now the knowledge of what you missed stings you bad....good, that's how it should be. I would feel VERY miserable if I had missed on the CE but I would NOT blame anyone other than myself. You are not entitled to anything but the bare bones game in the regular edition and the ability to buy the CE is a privilege only truly afforded to the true fans that follow the game long before release and bother to preorder months ahead. You had the opportunity to have the complete game experience and you passed it so now it's time to forever hold your peace. I cannot fathom why you would not be grateful for being granted the opportunity to have at least a piece of the CE content....of course it's not going to be free but by all rights it should never be on sale since it IS N7 CE content and then you would be begging for the opportunity to buy it separately.

^This , they could have never planned to release it outside CE's.But they did think rationally about and decided not to leave non-CE's out in the cold.That's got to count for something. 

 

So ... I should be begging... Bioware... to take my money and feel grateful that Bioware was sooo kind to want to take my money...

 

Modifié par nitefyre410, 25 février 2012 - 06:33 .

[Yuoaman]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

BaronIveagh wrote...

The problem is this DLC business is getting out of control. Where do you draw the line? Now? Or when we *have* to pay for DLC because half the game has been chopped off to make DLC?

For me?  Later.  When the inevitable happens, I'll have a good stockpile of old games I can play again and again until the industry straightens itself out.

ME3 is probably going to be the last new game I buy for a very long time, anyway.  There's a seriously long list of older stuff I never got into.  Like, seriously.  You wouldn't believe the stuff I haven't played yet.

If ME3 really is the game that crosses the line, I'll probably make just one post explaining why, then quit the fandom.  No point in wallowing in my grief.

Hey, I'm not going to send you a perfectly good pool of grief and not have you wallow in it, young lady.

[LOST SPARTANJLC]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

BaronIveagh wrote...

The problem is this DLC business is getting out of control. Where do you draw the line? Now? Or when we *have* to pay for DLC because half the game has been chopped off to make DLC?

For me?  Later.  When the inevitable happens, I'll have a good stockpile of old games I can play again and again until the industry straightens itself out.

ME3 is probably going to be the last new game I buy for a very long time, anyway.  There's a seriously long list of older stuff I never got into.  Like, seriously.  You wouldn't believe the stuff I haven't played yet.

If ME3 really is the game that crosses the line, I'll probably make just one post explaining why, then quit the fandom.  No point in wallowing in my grief.

This is the way I'm feeling , the titles Iike to play have been getting smaller and smaller.Off the top of my head Batman:? . MGS:R , (try it DmC) , DMC:C , Bayonetta 2 and  Halo 4.After those that's it , because I'm not even sure I'll want ME4.

Modifié par LOST SPARTANJLC, 25 février 2012 - 06:33 .

[AlanC9]

WeWant wrote...
More proof?

Bioware pre-EA:

KOTOR - no Day One character DLC
Jade Empire - no Day One character DLC
Mass Effect - no Day One character DLC

Was anyone else doing day 1 DLC back then? Not a very convincing argument if it hadn't been invented yet. 

Note that Bio invented paid DLC themselves. Before EA.

[RDSFirebane]

Insaner Robot wrote...

RDSFirebane wrote...

How many of thouse games u just listed had CE that had DLC as part of them? No really I don't know.

Jade Empire had a CE with exclusive characters in it for the player to choose during creation/selection.

Did they ever sell thouse to the SE guys?

[LOST SPARTANJLC]

AlanC9 wrote...

WeWant wrote...
More proof?

Bioware pre-EA:

KOTOR - no Day One character DLC
Jade Empire - no Day One character DLC
Mass Effect - no Day One character DLC

Was anyone else doing day 1 DLC back then? Not a very convincing argument if it hadn't been invented yet. 

Note that Bio invented paid DLC themselves. Before EA.

They did , I don't get why people like to blame that on EA.

[BaronIveagh]

LOST SPARTANJLC wrote...
This is the way I'm feeling , the titles Iike to play have been getting smaller and smaller.Off the top of my head Batman:? . MGS:R , (try it DmC) , DMC:C and  Halo 4.After those that's it , because I'm not even sure I'll want ME4.

Yes, it's someone else's problem, I don't need to stand up and fight, let the government/army/local band of heroes deal with it.

I used to deal with stuff like this once, and then I took a DLC to the knee.

[WeWant]

RDSFirebane wrote...

WeWant wrote...

Oh come on, don't be so naive. Since it was planed to be released with the CE, there was not any doubt that the content would have been ready for the game release date. Also, want more proof? Feel free to read the leaked script if you like. More proof?

Bioware pre-EA:

KOTOR - no Day One character DLC
Jade Empire - no Day One character DLC
Mass Effect - no Day One character DLC

EA: ASSUMING DIRECT CONTROL:

ME2 - Day One character DLC
DA:O - Day One character DLC
DA2 - Day One character DLC
ME3 - Day One character DLC

How many of thouse games u just listed had CE that had DLC as part of them? No really I don't know.

What's that supposed to change? I told you, I don't care about the CE, I care about the game only. 
Why should I (the "average" consumer) should deal with the consequences of the fact that they didn't have any better incentive for the "long term fan" to get the CE other than an exclusive character and content?
Not my problem man.

[LOST SPARTANJLC]

RDSFirebane wrote...

Insaner Robot wrote...

RDSFirebane wrote...

How many of thouse games u just listed had CE that had DLC as part of them? No really I don't know.

Jade Empire had a CE with exclusive characters in it for the player to choose during creation/selection.

Did they ever sell thouse to the SE guys?

I'm willing to bet no , because it would have been near impossible to add back then.

[CommanderCoffee]

RDSFirebane wrote...

Insaner Robot wrote...

RDSFirebane wrote...

How many of thouse games u just listed had CE that had DLC as part of them? No really I don't know.

Jade Empire had a CE with exclusive characters in it for the player to choose during creation/selection.

Did they ever sell thouse to the SE guys?

When it went to the PC, yes. Not for the original XBox format, but definitely for the PC. So, half the formats it was released on.

[nitefyre410]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

BaronIveagh wrote...

The problem is this DLC business is getting out of control. Where do you draw the line? Now? Or when we *have* to pay for DLC because half the game has been chopped off to make DLC?

For me?  Later.  When the inevitable happens, I'll have a good stockpile of old games I can play again and again until the industry straightens itself out.

ME3 is probably going to be the last new game I buy for a very long time, anyway.  There's a seriously long list of older stuff I never got into.  Like, seriously.  You wouldn't believe the stuff I haven't played yet.

If ME3 really is the game that crosses the line, I'll probably make just one post explaining why, then quit the fandom.  No point in wallowing in my grief.

If you have play Catherine  add that to you list... I have feeling you might enjoy it...

Sad  I have to agree with you on this but I have too .. hate to see you go though.  One of the few voices of reason.

[jpzgoku]

LOST SPARTANJLC wrote...

jpzgoku wrote...

BaronIveagh wrote...

The problem is this DLC business is getting out of control. Where do you draw the line? Now? Or when we *have* to pay for DLC because half the game has been chopped off to make DLC?

Thats what it will come to if the consumer allows it to go so far.

But it won't.You micro-transction an mmo , iyou can't do the same thing with any other regular game.Develpers push their luck , but even they aren't stupid enough to do this.A few might buy the games , but the vast majority would abandon games for older titles/indie games.

Lets hope so. But the next step, of cutting content and making it available only to people who buy collectors editions or who dish out an extra $10 along with their $60 purchase, looks like it might succeed and become a norm. First too the very popular games. Then that will become so normal that most other games adopt this practice. Lets hope we don't allow that to happen.

Plus companies like Ubisoft who require you to play online at all time for some of their games to work could very well adopt microtransactions policies if they put it out there and if we don't resist it.