13369 réponses à ce sujet

[Xannerz]

Woah, this thread is on fire.

As someone who pre-ordered the CE fully aware it came with a bonus character, I still find this move pretty cheap. It strikes me as greedy. I don't know if it's Bioware or EA's idea, but I'm never going to be a fan of Day 1 DLC. It's, like, why?

The Cerberus code + Zaeed thing in ME2 was perfect, IMO. It offered a great incentive to purchase a new copy of the game and bonus squadmates are always good news. But what's happening in ME3... just doens't feel right. I gotta agree with TotalHalibut on Youtube on this one. 

Now, I'm sticking with my CE. I'm not gonna pull a "cancelling my pre-order," but I think people have every right to be bothered by this. I'm not sure if not boycotting the game makes me a hypocrite, but I care about Mass Effect far too much to jump off the boat now, heh. I hate to type this. Generally, I'm optimistic. I like to put my trust in Bioware because their games are, simply put, awesome.  It's not just a matter of the $10, but the principle of it. Businesses need money - I get it - but such a blatant grab for cash is just... what. 

[ArkkAngel007]

Commodore Q wrote...

If Bioware hadn't of bothered to make this accessible to everyone, and just kept it as the N7 exclusive, no one would have cared.

Yes they would have, and more-so.  And they still would have demanded it to be free DLC to them.

Edit:  BioWare/EA should have just done the whole Cerberus Network thing again if they wanted it available to everyone. I'm all for the devs getting payed for their work, but this was a bad idea when it comes to fans.

Modifié par ArkkAngel007, 23 février 2012 - 01:11 .

[Paragon Auducan]

Sargerus wrote...

to all you ppl saying "OMG its unethical, disgusting, etc."

Welcome to the business world.

Because that's the way to look at it right

African children die everyday, it's just the way the world is right?

[aksoileau]

GnusmasTHX wrote...

aksoileau wrote...

The prothean is probably a minor character because only Shepard should understand him because of the beacon. They can't hook a translator to a language no one knows. Plus everywhere you'd go npc's would be wide eyed. I doubt theyd write all that in the game. It would be legion walking around ME2 times a million. It's probably a private mission with just Shepard.

Why would they need to? The Prothean's can speak English and therefore every language in the galaxy, the people don't need to speak Prothean.

Where do the Protheans speak English?  No one speaks English except Humans.  All of the Aliens have built in translators that converts it to English.  I think this was in the ME1 codex. 

For example in ME2 "bosh'tet" is not translated because its not in the translator software... much like the Prothean language.

Correct me if I am wrong guys?

[Darji]

Ok lets even say he has nothing to do with the story and he is just a soldier. Finding a prothean would be as special as finidng now a survivor of Atlantis on Earth in real life. It would be a HUGE event and deal

[OdanUrr]

Ah, BSN, you never let me down.

The problem is that there's no easy solution here. The Protheans were an integral part in shaping the events of ME1, though they were somewhat relegated in ME2, so this DLC is kind of a throwback to the "good old days" of ME1, an homage if you will. Returning to Eden Prime would certainly give that "full circle" sensation, even more so if we were to encounter the Prothean there.

Michael Gamble said this is optional content designed to "appeal to long-time fans, which is why it's part of the CE offering (the version many fans would be likely to purchase)." This is truish, in the sense that many long-time fans will undoubtedly buy the CE, but not everyone who buys the CE is a long-time fan. So, really, this is optional content designed for the CE. If the "From Ashes" content were designed for long-time fans, a possible solution would be to make it free DLC for everyone who has a copy of ME1 and ME2. Certainly that seems more reasonable if the target are the "long-time" fans. Those who are not owners of ME1 and ME2 already, likely first timers to the ME universe, could still pay the $10 and thus get some insight on the Protheans without having to actually play ME1 (I'd highly recommend it though).

Of course, turning the "From Ashes" into free DLC would probably ****** off those who have already pre-ordered their copies of the CE with good reason. If the "From Ashes" DLC was offered as free bonus content with the CE, any measure that offers the same content as free outside of the CE won't exactly be welcomed with open arms. Still, maybe they'd take to the solution proposed above with less hostility, who knows (especially if the CE never specified what the bonus content actually was).

Then there's the question of, what's the value of the DLC in terms of content? If we can talk to the Prothean and actually gain insight on their culture, technology, history, etc., then, to my mind, it's criminal not to include it as part of the core game! Yes, maybe you don't need him to win the war at all, but it's a huge nod to the saga's roots. I should think long-time fans would most definitely want to talk to a real, live Prothean. On the other hand, if he's nothing more than a henchmen whose only usefulness is to shoot at enemies, the long-time fans and owners of the CE probably won't take it very well. "$10 for a guy who shoots people? Really? I can do that already!"

The bottom line is, no matter what you do now, you'll end up pissing people off. The issue is that it didn't have to be this way. If the "From Ashes" DLC truly targets long-time fans, you're better off with the solution posted above and then design additional bonus content especially for the CE. This is the more efficient solution by far for your proposed objective and will make people feel good about their previous purchases of ME1 and ME2, especially considering the limited amount of physical CE copies.

What's unfortunate is that you didn't come to this realisation on your own.

Modifié par OdanUrr, 23 février 2012 - 01:12 .

[Draconis6666]

Takamori The Templar wrote...

Draconis6666 wrote...

Vasiliii wrote...

You cut a Prothean from the game and then tried to sell it as on launch DLC?


How is this even ethical? I'm not buying ME3 and I won't pirate it (that would just give you more ammo against the PC gamers wouldn't it?).

What a way to end a franchise, by milking the fans.

perfectly ethical, its no different from selling you a CD player for your car as extra, its arguably just as important to your ability to drive the car as having a prothean in game is to your ability to play ME 3

You mean selling the car without the protecting glass.

HEY YOU CAN RUN THE CAR WITH NO PROBLEM SIR.

Logical Fallacy argument that procludes that the Prothean will actualy impact your ability to play the game and complete it which it wil not.  The prothean is not the key to defeating the reapers or even a major component, the fact that he might have interesting backstory to the overall history of the game universe does not make him a key important part of the game it makes him an accessory.

[V1per7]

RiouHotaru wrote...

Oh, I decided to adjust the "DLC chart" to properly reflect what's actually happening:

[img]
http://imgur.com/Rfio9[/img]

you are just blinded by their words.

i always thought bioware fans are smarter....i guess not...

[Paragon Auducan]

Bluumberry wrote...

suntzuxi wrote...

Fiery Phoenix wrote...

This DLC, in a nutshell, is ME3's equivalent of Shale, Zaeed, and Sebastian. Hardly a new thing, so I don't really see the issue. But whatever.

it's different. Shale, Zaeed, and Sebastian are all free to download and not really that important in lore and story.  But this protheam makes me feel like cutting Zevran from Origins or Merril from Dragon Age II and asking you to pay more money.

Sebastian was not free.

He was if you bothered to preorder.

[kelton312]

So, what.. Are we supposed to go through EA's horrible customer service, CANCEL our existing orders and pre-order the collectors edition? This is information that should have been released a long time ago... Oh wait it was and was declared a typo.

[Tyrannotaur]

 

Texaboose wrote...

CDRSkyShepard wrote...

Wardka wrote...

CDRSkyShepard wrote...

Then what did I pay for? A bunch of new guns, AA packs, a robodog, a digital soundtrack, an art book, etc? I bought the CE thinking, "Dang! I got a bang for my buck because I get this superficial stuff AND a DLC character! Cool!" You make him available to everyone, you take away one of the biggest reasons I bought the CE in the first place. He was advertised as being part of the CE, you can't expect BioWare to go back on themselves and go, "Just kidding guys, that guy we were gonna include as part of the CE? Yeah, everyone can have him now!"

You tell me?

I'm not clamoring for this to be changed so everyone gets it for free, because I'm well aware that Bioware under EA would never do that. EA's entire business model revolves around DLC. I'm saying that I find this business practice disgusting, and that I feel for everyone that got the raw end of this deal - which I believe includes you. I think that you paid for what should've been given to you for free, and I'm sad that people are so willing to let EA push them around.

I can see where y'all are coming from to some extent, except for one thing:

This was advertised to be part of the CE from the beginning. It's not like BioWare made some decision down the line to cut something from the main game and sell it. You can't say that everyone deserves to have it for free when we have known for a while now that a DLC squadmate would be available to CE buyers and separately for a price to SE buyers. If you didn't get the CE, you brought it upon yourself to buy it separately if you wanted it. I didn't get any raw end of any deal because I knew what I was getting into and what was included when I bought my CE. It was even part of my decision to buy the CE over the SE in the first place. It shouldn't be free content because it was never advertised as such. If people were going to make a stink over the CE getting a DLC squaddie as part of their package, they should have done it back when the CE was first announced.

Well said.

Maybe start a petition to ask Bioware not to release this as DLC, since it's causing so much grief

Pretty much all of this. I didn't read this entire thread, just jumped around a bit. But it seems to me that the fact that the character is a Prothean and is being offered for 10 dollars on day one is whats causing the uproar. I am curious to what people would think if EA decided that this would be a timed exclusive. That people who buy the CE would get him for free right away and everyone else would have to wait until say April to get him for 10 dollars. Would that solve the problem? Or would it still be a matter of "cutting content" to make a quick buck? It seems to me that this is bonus content that won't drastically affect the ending. That remains to be seen however, the character is a Prothean which holds significance to the plot. 

I paid off my collector's edition already and have no intention of canceling it. Call me a sucker for the system or whatever you like. I love the series too much to care honestly if I am supporting a corrupt system. I can certainly see why others will be avoiding this game however. I am curious to know if those people who have decided to cancel their preorders or wait for a GOTY version would change their minds on doing so if EA held off on putting "From Ashes" on XBL/Origin/PSN until April and left it as a timed exclusive for the CE owners. Would you purchase ME3 if the Prothy was a timed exclusive? or would you still refrain from supporting the game because "content was cut"? 

[TLK Spires]

am i the only one who's major gripe with the from ashes announcement is that i wanted the bonus character and mission to be a surprise? i imagine it has to do with me having pre ordered the CE.

Modifié par TLK Spires, 23 février 2012 - 01:11 .

[Takamori The Templar]

Draconis6666 wrote...

Takamori The Templar wrote...

Draconis6666 wrote...

Vasiliii wrote...

You cut a Prothean from the game and then tried to sell it as on launch DLC?


How is this even ethical? I'm not buying ME3 and I won't pirate it (that would just give you more ammo against the PC gamers wouldn't it?).

What a way to end a franchise, by milking the fans.

perfectly ethical, its no different from selling you a CD player for your car as extra, its arguably just as important to your ability to drive the car as having a prothean in game is to your ability to play ME 3

You mean selling the car without the protecting glass.

HEY YOU CAN RUN THE CAR WITH NO PROBLEM SIR.

Logical Fallacy argument that procludes that the Prothean will actualy impact your ability to play the game and complete it which it wil not.  The prothean is not the key to defeating the reapers or even a major component, the fact that he might have interesting backstory to the overall history of the game universe does not make him a key important part of the game it makes him an accessory.

Fallacy?You can still run the car sir!
Oh Protheans those bloody bastards that just revealed the Reaper plans to Shepard, no one important, of course.

[nevar00]

Draconis6666 wrote...

Vasiliii wrote...

You cut a Prothean from the game and then tried to sell it as on launch DLC?


How is this even ethical? I'm not buying ME3 and I won't pirate it (that would just give you more ammo against the PC gamers wouldn't it?).

What a way to end a franchise, by milking the fans.

perfectly ethical, its no different from selling you a CD player for your car as extra, its arguably just as important to your ability to drive the car as having a prothean in game is to your ability to play ME 3

Nope, it's more like selling you a car with no doors or windshield and still paying the full price.  Sure you can still drive it but that doesn't mean you aren't missing the whole experience.

Modifié par nevar00, 23 février 2012 - 01:12 .

[Gibb_Shepard]

Sargerus wrote...

to all you ppl saying "OMG its unethical, disgusting, etc."

Welcome to the business world.

You don't know **** about business.

Just thought i'd team in and reiterate that Bioware is the King AND Queen of nickel and diming, and that this is one of the most feral business practises i've seen in the gaming industry.

Hats off to you, you money grubbing bastards.

[Ravenmyste]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Okay, so let me get this straight:

- “From Ashes” includes the Prothean squad mate, an adventure on Eden Prime, a new weapon, and an alternate appearance for every squad mate. Note that these alternate appearances are in addition to the ones already advertised in the CE.

Is ALL OF THIS STUFF still in the N7 edition?

yes admrial cheese it is  the only dlced character and mssion.

Modifié par Ravenmyste, 23 février 2012 - 01:12 .

[GalacticTHOR]

GnusmasTHX wrote...

padawanmage wrote...
True...I remembered these statues, looked at the Collectors and went...'HUH?"  

It's in the Mass Effect Universe art book that it's basically a retcon.

It's not a retcon exactly, the Propheans will state that they are an old species that survived the reapers and passed the message on to the Propheans or something, they are the original inhabitants of Ilos.

[Reever]

Yuoaman wrote...

RiouHotaru wrote...

Eterna5 wrote...

Why are they making a Prothean such an unimportant character?

Because him being a Prothean doesn't make him important.  He wasn't one of the researchers on Ilos.  He didn't design Vigil, he didn't sabotage the Keepers.  He's just a soldier.

So?

THat has nothing to do with the fact that he is still a goddamn PROTHEAN, you know... the species that is wildly important to the series and supposedly extinct? Yeah, those guys.

So?
It doesn´t mean squat if he doesn´t have any info on the Reapers. So he could be any given character. We obviously don´t know enough about him...
I do get what everyone is whining about, it´s more or less legitimate. But don´t overestimate his importance! I doubt he´s the one to give us the hint as to how we can defeat the Reapers...

I would have loved to have a Raloi in the team. As a matter of fact, is their appearance in the game comfirmed?

I don´t really have a say in this whole debate, because I pre-ordered the CE. But I´d like to believe what the Devs tell us about DLC. Of course, if the time comes when they exaggeate, then we shouldn´t buy more.

[AdmiralCheez]

RiouHotaru wrote...

Yes, N7 and CE are one in the same, Cheez.

But it implied that there was even more swag.

I need all the swag, man.  This DLC business?  My fault.  I am the quintessential sucker.

[V1per7]

Xannerz wrote...

Woah, this thread is on fire.

As someone who pre-ordered the CE fully aware it came with a bonus character, I still find this move pretty cheap. It strikes me as greedy. I don't know if it's Bioware or EA's idea, but I'm never going to be a fan of Day 1 DLC. It's, like, why?

The Cerberus code + Zaeed thing in ME2 was perfect, IMO. It offered a great incentive to purchase a new copy of the game and bonus squadmates are always good news. But what's happening in ME3... just doens't feel right. I gotta agree with TotalHalibut on Youtube on this one. 

Now, I'm sticking with my CE. I'm not gonna pull a "cancelling my pre-order," but I think people have every right to be bothered by this. I'm not sure if not boycotting the game makes me a hypocrite, but I care about Mass Effect far too much to jump off the boat now, heh. I hate to type this. Generally, I'm optimistic. I like to put my trust in Bioware because their games are, simply put, awesome.  It's not just a matter of the $10, but the principle of it. Businesses need money - I get it - but such a blatant grab for cash is just... what. 

well said. 

[XqctaX]

Draconis6666 wrote...

saturos2 wrote...

Draconis6666 wrote...

They should just remove the ability for people who didn't get the collectors edition to even buy it at all since everyone is so ungrateful that they have the ability to get it.

Lol, if they do this, im definatly canelling my preorder.

I wouldnt blame you but it seems to be what everyone is arguing about 

"How dare you charge me for something that was an incentive for other people to pay more, I demand it for free because I feel entitled to stuff. You obviously took it out of the game just so you could charge me more because I cant accept that I dont get everything I want in the main game for the cheapest price possible"

Best ive read sofar in this thread and it describes the complainers very well. there mad becouse they have to pay for something that we also had to pay for. when really they should be thankfull for getting it at all, oh and by the way. also for not having to wait for it, but accually beeing able to get it from day 1.

complaining cus you dont get something for free, something that others paid for!!! is just selfish and greedy.

[Draconis6666]

Most importantly its not up to you to decide whats key to the game or its plot or even the overall Mythos, It is not your game or your Mythos it belongs to Bioware and they have created a game that allows you to experience it is the height of arrogance to think that because you make the decision to pay for something they have taken time to create for you, that it is up to you to decide what Is and is not of enough importance to include into the game.

The argument of "not having a prothean in the main game" is criminal because it deprives you of your ability to find out interesting backstory that has little or no relevance at all to the plot of the actual game you have purchased but only to flesh out the overall mythos is exactly what they are talking about when they mention entitlement.

[Texaboose]

kelton312 wrote...

So, what.. Are we supposed to go through EA's horrible customer service, CANCEL our existing orders and pre-order the collectors edition? This is information that should have been released a long time ago... Oh wait it was and was declared a typo.

Bwah? That's why the DLC is being offered in the first place, so you don't HAVE to preorder the CE if you missed out. Or was there sarcasm there that I missed?

[RiouHotaru]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

RiouHotaru wrote...

Yes, N7 and CE are one in the same, Cheez.

But it implied that there was even more swag.

I need all the swag, man.  This DLC business?  My fault.  I am the quintessential sucker.

Well, I myself have been tempted to get the figurines.  Not for the MP DLC, but because they're figurines.

So I feel your pain.