13369 réponses à ce sujet

[Nathan Redgrave]

Redzhül wrote...

Amikae wrote...

- The content in “From Ashes” was developed by a separate team (after the core game was finished) and not completed until well after the main game went into certification.

Complete BS.

Not to mention that the leaked scripts of early Mass Effect 3 dialogue INCLUDES THE PROTHEAN. So obviously it wasnt after the game was completed. Why do you guys at Bioware enjoy lying and alienating your fanbase?

To play Devil's Advocate for a moment here, I'd like to point out that writing the DLC and recording the voicework for it aren't necessarily the same thing as making the DLC itself; they may well have planned it to be part of the main game, decided at some point to relegate it to DLC status, and then left the actual game aspect of it for later.
I point to ME2, which contains some voicework pointing toward an expanded Shadow Broker plotline with Liara in the original game data, which wasn't actually given to us until much later--when BioWare released Lair of the Shadow Broker. Not quite the same case, but still evidence that "it was planned" and "voice clips were in the game already" does not necessarily mean "it was already done at the time."

[neubourn]

Candidate 88766 wrote...

matt-bassist wrote...

HiroVoid wrote...

If it was developed after the core game, how come there are dialogue files for the Prothean in the leaks?

I would love to see a Dev response to this valid question...

There was a fair chunk of Kasumi dialogue, and stuff from LotSB, in ME2. 

Correct. And just like ME2, LotsB and Kasumi's mission were both pretty good DLCs, and neither one were "crucial" to the story line. So maybe BW DOES know what they are doing. 

Im guessing that pretty much everyone raging about this are ones that did not get the ME3 CE for whatever reason. 

[Aedan333]

Now I think the main issue is that people are buying a full game for 60 dollars and this dlc doesnt seem like an addon to the game but rather a piece missing from the game which they are trying to sell as a separate entity as anything that was made before the release of the game that could justifiably be considered part of the game like a squad mate should be in the game.

I do not think that the prothean will affect the story at all besides from a few lines of dialogue as he is still interactive in the game but as a NPC but to everyone buying the game and having to pay more it feels like the developer decided that they want to sell the game for a higher price but no one will buy a full game that is not aesthetically enhanced (custom skins, robopooch) for more than 60 dollars so they cut a piece away and say hey you can play the game but it won't have that complete feeling unless you pay this extra 10 dollars for a little more fun.

The worse part is that EVEN IF its made after the game went gold it is being released at launch which means it has also been given the green light to go as a complete and (hopefully unglitched) game piece. Now people bought the game which is they believe is complete but the complete game at launch would require the From Ashed DLC to be complete.

[Aargh12]

Candidate 88766 wrote...
There was a fair chunk of Kasumi dialogue, and stuff from LotSB, in ME2. 

Those were cut early in the game development and weren't finished (weren't even close to that state, actually) BEFORE game went gold.

[Paragon Auducan]

A Prothean should be super important to the story and it definately shouldn't be day 1 paid removed from Disk DLC.

I don't know what's worse, the fact he might not be important or that we have to buy such an important part of the ME myythos.

[Qunu]

So Michael, as a potential consumer, why should i believe you? The funny thing is, i was going to buy the collectors edition of this game because I'm a huge fan, but now I'm starting to rethink this decision. And the best part is i don't have to pirate this game in order to hurt your bottom line. I can buy this game -gasp- Second Hand. Which means, you never see a cent. Because now its all about how i can hurt Bioware and EA.

So now the question for you is what can you do to encourage me to buy your game new so you'll get your money back. Because the idea of buying this game and all your game used makes giddy like a schoolboy, because i know if enough people do it, we'll bleed you dry, legally. And now that my friend is pure irony.

[element eater]

I will probably buy this it does seem expensive though. Although given the massive mark up on the digital ce version in the uk this still works out much cheaper in terms of obtained content

thank you for posting its details I was getting bored of reading posts from people who who were either ridiculously sympathetic to bioware or bashing it without really thinking why .

For the record I consider day 1 dlc a pretty awful practice and most likely will not support any further practice of this kind should bioware continue to do so. That said I consider it worse disqualifying players from notable content just because they weren't willing to buy an overpriced CE

Michael Gamble wrote...
We pulled out all of the stops to make Mass Effect 3 the best game ever, and we can't wait for you all to experience it.
 

 

im sorry but if this was the case it would be free or at least cheaper than it is now 

Modifié par element eater, 22 février 2012 - 11:07 .

[S.ilver]

 I'm not sure what all this outrage is for. We've know since EA accidentally leaked "The Prothean" as a bonus with the CE that this guy would be just that, a bonus. Even after they removed that little gaffe, the CE reveal video still shows "bonus character and mission". If people wanted him so badly at that point, they should have gone out and gotten a CE.
Now it's going to be released as DLC so EVERYONE can get their hands on it. If I hadn't preordered my CE, I'd be ecstatic that I'd be able to get my hands on this content that I previously thought might be exclusive.

For those saying that the Prothean is a major part of the story; he's not. He can't be compared to someone like Sovereign (big bad), or even Vigil (provides MacGuffin). Some audio file spoilers that are floating around confirm this, so really he's just a walking codex entry for the Protheans (and only a very small segment of them as well). Liara probably knows more about the Protheans than this guy does.

[Daywalker315]

Candidate 88766 wrote...

matt-bassist wrote...

HiroVoid wrote...

If it was developed after the core game, how come there are dialogue files for the Prothean in the leaks?

I would love to see a Dev response to this valid question...

There was a fair chunk of Kasumi dialogue, and stuff from LotSB, in ME2. 

Exactly. It has to do with when they can schedule voice actors for sessions and things like that most likely. They may have the script, or part of it, done at a certain point and have the VA come in to do that and it gets mastered. They do more later when it's finished and re-record anything that's changed, and so on.

[Genshie]

Nathan Redgrave wrote...

Redzhül wrote...

Amikae wrote...

- The content in “From Ashes” was developed by a separate team (after the core game was finished) and not completed until well after the main game went into certification.

Complete BS.

Not to mention that the leaked scripts of early Mass Effect 3 dialogue INCLUDES THE PROTHEAN. So obviously it wasnt after the game was completed. Why do you guys at Bioware enjoy lying and alienating your fanbase?

To play Devil's Advocate for a moment here, I'd like to point out that writing the DLC and recording the voicework for it aren't necessarily the same thing as making the DLC itself; they may well have planned it to be part of the main game, decided at some point to relegate it to DLC status, and then left the actual game aspect of it for later.
I point to ME2, which contains some voicework pointing toward an expanded Shadow Broker plotline with Liara in the original game data, which wasn't actually given to us until much later--when BioWare released Lair of the Shadow Broker. Not quite the same case, but still evidence that "it was planned" and "voice clips were in the game already" does not necessarily mean "it was already done at the time."

Also like to mention Kasumi. She had dialogue in game before her dlc was released.

[Razorsedge820]

Dramatics. Dramatics everywhere.

[Hero_Shep]

I was going to post this in the angerier thread but for some reason it got closed down before I could but I kinda want to vent here, so there's your fair warning. This was also a reply to Cheez. Also I didn't want to make a new topic and this is the DLC thread soooooooooooo.....

AdmiralCheez wrote...

So was there this much outcry against Sebastian? He only came free with the Signature Edition, IIRC.

I
agree day one DLC might as well just be packaged and sold as part of
the vanilla game (they should at least have the tact to hold onto it for
a few months, as this sort of nickel-and-diming is insulting), but at
least this guy also comes with the Collector's Edition. So really, if
you don't want all the other BS in the CE, think of it as getting $10
off the full game for not wanting the fancy tin.

I wish I knew
production costs and salaries so I could actually make a call on whether
or not any of the prices are fair. Then again, I'd just go on another
one of my anti-capitalism wangstfests.

On average junior
game artists (3D modelers, texture artists, Particle Effects) make
roughly $35,000 a year, animators a couple grand more and programmers
make the most (around $47,000 but they burn out fast). I dont know for
sure what the senior guys make. Either way any AAA game cost as much as a
hollywood production, seeing how a workstation GPU is $2000. Also you
need to account for advertisement, and that pretty CGI trailer probably
cost some good coin. That all in all is a **** ton of money, and the
costs are going to escalate as inflation keeps rising.

 While I don't approve of the buisness stance EA/Bioware has recently taken with the Day one DLC, I
must support it. Because it is a currently nessessary evil used to
balance out alot of the bullcrap that is going on right now. First off,
lets look at the fact that Gamestop is forcing the selling of used
games, Do the artists that make as much as a MC Donalds " Team Leader"
get to see any profit for that? NO we don't. Do we see any profit from
those who rampantly pirate games because they dont want to pay $10 for
day one DLC? No we don't. I don't know about you guys but I wouldn't
mind having a little more moolah so I can pay off debts.

Oh and
another point, unless you plan to work your way up from QA, you need a
Post-Secondary education to work in the industry, do you know how much
that costs? Over $60,000 and if you want a to do a supplimanetary course, the student debt can go up to $100,000.    

Which brings us to this, a lot of you are angry because deep down you all expected this extra content for free, and I dont blame you.
Because, we have all this inforation called the internet for free, not
only that this information is unregulated , we have services like
youtube where you can watch user generated (and bootlegged) video
entertainment which can be better then most crap on the TV anyhoo. On
top of that there is little to no concequence for downloading a song, or
a movie, or heaven forbid a video game. ON forums we can be whoever we
want because we can hide behind a fake avatar.  This is a consequence free internet much like the wild west of old, 
and the side effect is that we have bandits and robbers too, those who
give us what we want for a better deal (like alcohol during the
prohabition) then what the establishment is giving us.

Bottom
line is Both parties are in the wrong, but I have have invested far too
much time, money, and emotion just to throw away the ending that not
only I deserve, but that those in the game industry who work their asses
off sacrificed their time, blood, sweat, and tears to give this
conclusion that we all deserve. 

To those who are
boycotting ME3, I salute you for your courage. But if your going to do
it, do it right, dont watch any gameplay/story vids on Youtube, dont
pirate the copy, and send a bloddy letter to the devs in proper english
grammer as possible mind you to tell them how unacceptable you think
this is. You guys try and change the industry from the outside, I'll do
what I can in the inside when I get there.

As for the 4chan
trolls who cant form an intelligle sentance, and make themselves
slightly racist while doing so. I can't wait for the day when the is no
such thing as anonymity on the internet, seriously if your going to
troll do it with some class no?    [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/angry.png[/smilie]

Hero_Shep

Note that the numbers I got for the artists are from gamasutra and the fact that my school has a sheet with the info. 

[hitorihanzo]

DJBare wrote...

And so begins damage control, hope you guys are on the ball, I think you got a big mess to clean up.

Have you ever seen a AAA developer have to do so much damage control in the span of a few years? First, DA2 pisses a lot of people off, them Mike Laidlaw comments on it pissing people off and it gets worse. Then, the problems with SWTOR Marketing and people being upset at not being told certain info, then the Beta/ script leak, then Deception is a mess, now this.  Whew. 

[mechstone]

To the devs I think most peoples problem isn't that there is a character just for CE but rather choosing to make such an important character that could change the entire prespective of the mass effect universe and reducing them them to dlc and therefore pissing away a chance to do something interesting just to bleed money from loyal fans.

[Draconis6666]

Amikae wrote...

Draconis6666 wrote...

JosephCurwen wrote...

Eain wrote...

I really want people to understand what's going on. I realise that there are some children around here (and with that I mean actual children and thus people inexperienced in the ways of corporations, not intended as an insult in any way) who are simply trying to defend the people who produce their favourite games, but it's up to the rest of us who are older to explain how things are going to unfold.

If we allow EA to do this to us, then there will come a time where we pay 60 dollars for a barebone launch title and then fork out another 25 to 40 dollars for Day One DLC that gives us content that's been withheld from the launch disk for no other reason than that we allowed it.

Publishers don't care for the people buying their games, they care for the wallets their money is coming from. If you do not believe that, you are fooling yourself and I mean that in the least offensive way I possibly could. We all fool ourselves every now and then, and sometimes we run into something we enjoy so much that we just want to pretend there's nothing wrong, but trust me EA's head honcho's and shareholders are laughing themselves all the way to the bank if we let them.

Draw the line.

One game, one sale.

Very well put.

Then be prepared to pay $70 to $80 for the standard version of the game, Games take a tremendous amount of money to develop now days and their sale price has stayed remarkably low when you take inflation and the increasing price of other luxury goods as a comparison.

You seem to forget, that gaming has the largest growing and most profitable market out there. It's not like 10 years ago. They sell millions of copies. So your argument is completely invalid. They will sell millions of copies of ME3, that will make them hundrets of millions of dollars in profits. And that's without counting all the DLC's they will flood us with for 5-10$ each. Poor EA/BioWare.

Its not invalid, Inflation is never invaldi. Growing markets do not make up for the decreased value of the dollar, in order to continue to increase revenue and be a profitable business, companies have to increase prices or find other ways to bring in additional revenue. Just because you make $10 million this year and you only made $8 million last year doesnt mean you actually made more money. The nominal value of your money is greater but its value could be less.

[El Ejcovero]

DJBare wrote...

EA/Bioware, what you have done is confused a lot of people, we learn that Prothy is in game just not as a squad member, people learned back some time ago he was going to be in, then your marketing tells us he is going to be DLC, naturally people assume he is not in the actual game unless they get the DLC, it's extremely poor marketing.

EA is good at poor marketing, and managing forums, so is
Bioware... This is getting ridiculous... If only they had a committee to warn
them when they are about to start a fire… Since they are good at starting
fires at crucial moments…

[saturos2]

Draconis6666 wrote...

saturos2 wrote...

ACSSolver wrote...

- The content in “From Ashes” was developed by a separate team (after the core game was finished) and not completed until well after the main game went into certification.

Interesting. I wonder whether this includes a different writing team, too. While I think it will be fascinating to talk to a Prothean, my one concern is that his appearance should be consistent with the rest of the story - the Protheans have been extinct for 50 thousand years, so this guy's appearance needs some good writing.

you actually beleive what he said?

Yes because unlike most people I have some concept of how game design and production actualy works

And me, unlike you, know that Bioware actually put the prothean in the game during developmen and took it out to make it dlc to make a quick buck.

[RainyDayLover]

I have the Collectors Edition pre-ordered but I honestly don't support this at all. This is a truly horrible practice. If the content along with the CE is designed to appeal to long-time fans, why are the copies of CE so limited? Those fans who didn't get a chance to pre-order early will now end up paying $70 to get all the content these "long-time" fans deserve. I'd understand if it was a character like Zaeed/Kasumi but this character sounds too important to the story to be DLC.

I really liked what they did with Shale and Dragon Age: Origins in order to get people to buy the game brand new; I fully supported that move but this is taking it too far.

[devil_foetus]

You can only get away with so much before the fans react.

[essplode]

Paragon Auducan wrote...

I don't know what's worse, the fact he might not be important or that we have to buy such an important part of the ME myythos.

Exactly! 

[Shadowrun1177]

I'm really looking forward to seeing more about this dlc, like other's have mentioned I kind of hope they show us what weapon comes with it and maybe the alternate outfits. I've got the CE preordered so interesting to hear that there is more alternate outfits since the CE has some that are exclusive to it and the dlc has some also.

[Genshie]

neubourn wrote...

Candidate 88766 wrote...

matt-bassist wrote...

HiroVoid wrote...

If it was developed after the core game, how come there are dialogue files for the Prothean in the leaks?

I would love to see a Dev response to this valid question...

There was a fair chunk of Kasumi dialogue, and stuff from LotSB, in ME2. 

Correct. And just like ME2, LotsB and Kasumi's mission were both pretty good DLCs, and neither one were "crucial" to the story line. So maybe BW DOES know what they are doing. 

Im guessing that pretty much everyone raging about this are ones that did not get the ME3 CE for whatever reason. 

Nope it is because of one youtuber who so happens to be really damn popular. I like him too but he is clearly flustered in this video and is missing out on alot of information and has already made huge assumptions toward ME3. 

[AxisEvolve]

Michael Gamble wrote...
The Prothean is optional content 

 

Can someone from Bioware clarify this? 

Some people thought "From Ashes" just puts him in your squad and that he was in the main game as a character to some extent.

So without the DLC he is not seen or heard in the game no matter what, correct?

Modifié par AxisEvolve, 22 février 2012 - 11:04 .

[packardbell]

Bioware, I love you but there is absoutely no reason for this not to be included in the main game for ALL purchases of the game, why couldn't you just include it as an option for people who redeemed their online pass? Not everyone cares about multiplayer.

[JosephCurwen]

suntzuxi wrote...

I really do not like how EA/Bioware handles business. Why develop a character so sensitive in the lore and make it optional.

If it wasn't such an important part of the lore it wouldn't allow them to nickel and dime people half as well.