13369 réponses à ce sujet

[Time Victim]

Eden Prime and more alternate costumes? I'm getting giddy over here.

[TheOptimist]

Draconis6666 wrote...

Bioware already won this fight because they will make millions on the game from people who never even knew the fight existed.

That's pretty much it in a nutshell.

[Calians]

Draconis6666 wrote...

Calians wrote...

Not buying it, this game is the absolute last game I buy from Bioware and anything EA

Have fun with activision and its $80 games then or I guess you can wait 4+ years between decent releases from developers not owned by one of the two.

Activision? I don't  buy games made by them you...lol nvm not gonna say it.

[Daywalker315]

gabe2gg wrote...

Cirocco wrote...

Copy of the Email I just sent to contact@bioware.com

Dear Bioware.

You seem to know who I am, you've sent me enough email over the years. I am one of your long time customers, I've bought Baldurs Gate 1 and 2 and the expansions, Neverwinter Nights and the content packs for it, Dragon Age and the DLC's for it, Mass Effect one and two and the DLC's, and many other games you've developed.

As someone with a disability I am on a tight budget, if I intend to purchase new games when they first come out then I have to specifically set aside money to pay for them, they are expensive items in my budget, I had set aside the money to pay for Mass Effect 3 and I had pre-orrded the game via Amazon, in the past I have purchased Collectors Editions of games, as a writer and artist I enjoyed looking at the Art Books that came with those games and the other physical items that where included, the cosmetic content that was unlockable in the game was a bonus but not really my reason for purchasing collectors editions.

Today it came to light that you are planning to release a downloadable content pack on the day of release of Mass Effect 3, the same pack is apparently included as part of the Collectors Edition, and is seeming much more than simply the cosmetic extras that are normal practise in a Collectors Edition, and that you intend to charge extra for this already produced content that you included in the Collectors Edition.

In response to our concerns you have made this statement in your forum.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://social.biowar...index/9403705/1

"As most of you know, yesterday there was a leak that revealed the upcoming DLC “ME3:From Ashes” on the
Xbox LIVE Marketplace. This leak took place before we were prepared to make an announcement about the details of that pack (slated for this Friday).

There has been a lot of discussion about the DLC offering but we wanted to clarify a few things...

- “From Ashes” includes the Prothean squad mate, an adventure on Eden Prime, a new weapon, and an alternate
appearance for every squad mate. Note that these alternate appearances are in addition to the ones already advertised in the CE.

- The Collectors Edition has been advertised from the beginning as containing a bonus character/mission, but we were not at liberty to provide the details. The Prothean is optional content that is certainly designed to appeal to long-time fans, which is why he is part of the CE offering (the version many fans would be likely to purchase). Mass Effect 3 is a complete – and a huge game - right out of the box.

- The content in “From Ashes” was developed by a separate team (after the core game was finished) and not completed until well after the main game went into certification.

- The Collectors Edition has been sold out in most places for some time now, and is becoming very hard to find (many players prefer not to purchase the digital version). As such, we wanted to make this content available so that SE buyers could also incorporate the Prothean into their game.

We’ll be releasing someimages and video about this pack in the coming days.

As always, we are extremely thankful for all of your support. We pulled out all of the stops to make Mass Effect 3 the best game ever, and we can't wait for you all to experience it.

Mike"
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In effect you are telling us that this was late game development and developed separately, in order to justify charging money for it on the day of release. This is contradicted by the fact that this was known about almost a year ago. This can be demonstrated by this post from that time .. http://social.biowar...3/index/7551111
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"In the N7 Collector's Edition "Features" caption there's this:

Get the ultimate Mass Effect 3 experience with the N7 Collector's Edition! This exclusive and limited package includes:

• Exclusive N7 fabric patch
• Art book, 70 pages
• Dark Horse ME Series 3 issue 1, with alternate cover art

A full collection of in-game content that can’t be found anywhere else!

• N7 arsenal pack – N7 Sniper Rifle, Shotgun, Pistol and SMG
• Squad-mate alternate appearance pack
• Normandy mechdog companion
• Shepard casual appearance– N7 hoodie
• Exclusive extended soundtrack
• Exclusive 4x6 lithograph
• Day 1 DLC – the Prothean (Adventure/Character)
• XBL Normandy Avatar
• Exclusive forum, social avatars, badges and perks

So.....
Reactions? Thoughts?"
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

and the reply from you ..

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Sorry, that was a mistake from old text. It is being removed. Hate to be a killjoy.

Oh wait... no I don't. smilie
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So , this was obviously not late game content that was developed separately when you had some time to spare after the Game had gone gold, this was something you had planned to be released on day one and charge extra for, with lore and storyline relevant content that your most loyal customers, who had played the previous two games, would most want, and planned for some considerable time in what seems to be a very cynical corporate decision to get extra money from your most loyal customers for something that should and could have been included in the game itself or offered as a code to those who bought the new version of the game instead of buying second hand.


I dislike companies that cynically try and milk extra cash from the cows (Before you joined up with EA I think we used to be referred to as the community, now we seem to be cows with $ signs painted on the sides), for things that could easily have been included as part of the, already very expensive, game, and I *reallly* dislike companies that blatantly lie to their customers or trick their own employees into making false statements by withholding information from them.

On reflection, despite my desire to see the conclusion of this saga, I have regrettably cancelled my order and will almost certainly no longer buy any future products from your company, entangled as you have become with the cynical Corporate practices of Electronic Arts, something you and they explicitly promised would not happen, when the merger happened we as a community where told that EA would treat Bioware differently, this has obviously not been the case.

If you are wondering if there is anything that can be done to retain my business, I would consider purchasing the game if you release the DLC freely, as something that should have been in the game already, this is the only way you can regain my custom and go slightly towards regaining my trust in you as a company separate from EA.

Yours Regretfully.

A customer since the beginning of your Company.

atleast someone sees the light.

OP, just because they said a year ago that you'd get a Prothean squad mate with a collector's edition doesn't mean that the actual CONTENT was done then. Character model, all dialogue, Eden Prime mission design and dialogue, and so on. I fully believe that the main game on the discs was completed and sent for certification before the final touches were made to the DLC content. Sure, it's probably been worked on for a while but it's likely it's one of the last things that got fully completed and polished since it wasn't needed until much nearer to launch, rather than 6 weeks or so before launch for certification.

So, in short, KNOWING about DLC and actually having it completed are two entirely different things, so your argument isn't as strong as you seem to think it is. If it were me, I'd certainly wait to finish up the DLC until after the main game and not waste resources and time on something that doesn't have to be done for a month or so after the deadline for the rest of the game. Then again, that makes way too much sense, so I'm sure most people here won't agree.

[Kroepoek]

TheOptimist wrote...

Takamori The Templar wrote...

But w/e let the company sink, just like TORtanic.
The old fans tried to advice , but they won't listen anyway.

Yeah, the TORtanic, look at how badly that flopped.

http://www.pcworld.c...es_records.html

Oh, right.  But I'm sure if they'd listened to YOUR infinite wisdom, they'd have shattered those records even MORE.

Hm. That explains the server populations dropping then.

[TK EL_]

Seriously now, I think enough pre-orders have been cancelled to actually nullify the 'pre-order cancelled' meme lol

[Sargerus]

ow please do not include SWTOR into this. Just go to the SWTOR official forums if u want to whine

[PaulSX]

AlphaJarmel wrote...

suntzuxi wrote...

This I have to disagree. Bioware is never a good game developer beyond Baldur's Gate days. their games are all about storytelling and characters, and to be fair they are incompetent to design good gameplay that will appeal to everyone. That's why they keep changing the gameplay elements and I am personally fine with it, especially I liked dragon age 2 somehow.

I would disagree KOTOR had good gameplay and Jade Empire too to a certain extent.

Not to me, Jade empire and mass effect 1 are kinda awful in gameplay, at least I had trouble playing these two games. KOTOR, DAO and Mass Effect 2 are good though.

[BillsVengenace]

Michael Gamble wrote...

 The content in “From Ashes” was developed by a separate team (after the core game was finished) and not completed until well after the main game went into certification.

 

BS.  The game only went gold two weeks ago.

This prothean character has been known for 3/4 of a year now.  Are you telling me that a character, a mission and a couple of rinky-dink skins take 3/4 of a year to complete? 

This type of terrible, disingenuous  PR is exactly why hate campaigns towards BioWare are started.  Not that I condone them, but they are to be expected.

Any content complete and near complete by the time the game is ready to ship should be free DLC for ALL purchasers of the game, or the game should be delayed to complete them for the disc. 

This is a vile and disgusting practise and you have no doubt lose many sales due to it. 

[wolfman391]

When I look over the last 60 pages of this. It all comes down to should this be in free or do you pay for it. I say if you did not buy the CE then yes you should pay for it as someone said this as been know for some time and its only what $10 Its not like some of the DLC out there $10+ for crap hell look at COD 1200 msp for 4 map x 4 over a year I got all the DLC for ME2 and had more fun than I did with all the maps that COD had in a year.

[Fedorcyclops]

Niemack Saarinen wrote...

RohanDaKitty wrote...

V1per7 wrote...

RohanDaKitty wrote...

Niemack Saarinen wrote...

Ignotis wrote...

Spending 60$ on a less then amazing singleplayer game? Pushing it.

Tacking on day one 10$ DLC on top of a inflated price for a mediocre single player game when it could be patched in? Too far

Valve released TF2, one of the best shooters of this decade for no more than 30$ or part of the orange box, another incredible deal. They then make it cheaper, enable free weekends for people to play it, make it LESS THAN A DOLLAR AT ONE POINT, then eventually make the game free.

Seeing what bioware is doing, they must be out of touch with the current market. Inflated prices coupled with excessive dlc isn't the rage these days, nor is subscription based MMO's. B2P, f2p, developers patching a game as a duty TO the fanbase is. The more incredibly greedy your business model gets the more you are only going to shoot yourself in the foot.

Because Valve is making ALOT off of Hat DLC.

Exactly. Off of hats

BioWare and EA took a the goodwill and affection players have for their universe and puts a $10 price tag on it.

hey idiot, does HATS part of an epic race? does the hat effect how the game played? does the hat create a whole new prespective on the whole TF universe? does the hat add any additional game?!?!

if they released a content for Shepard to wear a hat on release and i dont get it, I DONT CARE!!

this DLC is about a Prothean! an extinct race that faced the end of time by the reaper!!! its not just a HAT!!!

Wow, you're way off the mark there buddy! That was exactly my point!

Valve's idea of DLC, is Hats. Silly Hats and Weapons. What EA and BioWare did, was take a big part of the Mass Effect lore, the Prothen's, and place a $10 price tag on it.

That's what I meant in my original post. Ea and BioWare are cashing in on players affection for their universe.

Valve cash in on peoples affection for fashionable headwear.

And Valve charges 9.99 for this:   



people are getting a greater deal off hours of content for the same price. 

Does it affects the gameplay in any siginificant way?
Does it takes away certain asepct of the game (like story?)

[HighFlyingDwarf]

TheOptimist wrote...

Takamori The Templar wrote...

But w/e let the company sink, just like TORtanic.
The old fans tried to advice , but they won't listen anyway.

Yeah, the TORtanic, look at how badly that flopped.

http://www.pcworld.c...es_records.html

Oh, right.  But I'm sure if they'd listened to YOUR infinite wisdom, they'd have shattered those records even MORE.

TORtanic sunk after that article was posted, that's before they went to the 1.1 patch

[Draconis6666]

FlameChucks wrote...

Looking at the thread it's hard to believe that there isn't any real attempt on Bioware's part to turn down the fires that are raging here over this announcement.

When i found out that the extra character was going to be a Prothean, i couldn't believe it. This is ultimately the source of overall rage in regards to this DLC announcement. So far all DLC's offered have been extra weapons or armor's, which is acceptable as a DLC construct. However, this new character being Prothean is one of the more offensive things you can hold back from a customer who is purchasing the game new. This is a character who has so much lore into the overall series that cutting him out is essentially making him/her nothing more than just another character almost in the same vein as Kasumi or Zaeed.

When you consider that this character, his race, is the basis to why Shepard knows so much about the Reapers is almost like pouring salt into the wound. Up until now we had no real idea what the Protheans looked like or if they were still alive, and just out of nowhere here is one just ready to be your squad mate.

My biggest problem now is that i have this game pre-ordered, and it's the CE edition. While this shouldn't give me any reason to really complain, then what about everybody else? The fact that this character was announced months ahead of time could only signify that he is an almost essential part of the story. Bioware plays it off like it's no real problem stating that there's already a lot of game in the retail release, While this may be true, it doesn't seem fair or righteous to hold such a prestigious and mysterious character from all those who own't be able to grab a CE copy. Ultimately you are making people feel like fools for either investing in either Regular or CE edition of the game because ultimately, you are making someone such as myself feel like i paid 80 or 60 dollars for an incomplete product.

Now, i hope they don't come out and say that he has no real relevance to the story, because at that point i may as well cancel the game. The protheans are the very reason why everything that has been happening in the last two games has occurred, but not only that, they give context to the situation. The reapers are finally attacking earth and here we have maybe the last prothean in the galaxy. Again, it's all speculation as far as how this character plays into the story, but personally, i find it real shameful to place this kind of character in that type of category of just being an addition to the game.

Just image in you will, a character like Legion was held back from the game and instead of Kasumi being the DLC it was Legion that would be purchasable. Legion is a Geth..............the geth have been one of your primary enemies since the beginning, and not only that, given the tension between the Geth and the Quarians, the overall complications of having him in your squad with Tali are nearly drama gold.

Either way.....i know it's too late down the pipeline for Bioware to really do anything at this point. Then again, this isn't something that EA would tell them to hold back. Bioware could have created a completely separate character from a different race and still could have gotten away with it, but being that this character is prothean...........well...........it just changes the overall dynamic of the game as well as it's overall value to a regular consumer.

Your points are also why the entire outrage is rediculous, no one would have cared if it wasnt a Prothean because people have convinced themselves that because its a Prothean the game is somehow not complete without it and that they cant enjoy the game without it so how dare EA and Bioware charge them extra so they can have the whole game because obviously the entire game will fail make no sense and be terrible without this one DLC.

[Zu Long]

Farbautisonn wrote...

Draconis6666 wrote... I guess you can wait 4+ years between decent releases from developers not owned by one of the two.

-you do realize thats what we did in the old days with bioware too?

Yeah, but I kind of like getting my games every year or so. It would have sucked waiting four years for each ME installment.

[_symphony]

nevar00 wrote...

I gave this some more thought, and honestly I'm just still really disappointed with these guys.  I figured I'd vent in one last post (before going back to my ME 2 playthrough, ironically enough).

Those who are saying a Prothean is not important aren't fooling anyone, and I find it hard to beleive they are even fooling themselves.  The fact that there is a living Prothean: that alone is massive enough to warrant being in the game.  Protheans have been a massive part of the lore and backstory of the Mass Effect universe and of each of the games; for them to write this off as minor enough to be a small DLC is rediculous.  

Now of course you could play through the game with the Prothean.  Just like you could have Mass Effect 1 without Wrex, Star Wars without Darth Vader, Batman without Joker, Watchmen without Rorschach, and King Henry IV without Falstaff.  You could remove a lot of fluff from a lot of games, movies, and books.  That doesn't mean you should.  Having a Prothean as DLC just hugely undermines the significance of the species built up in the past two games. 

Now I really find it hard to believe that they thought of throwing in a Prothean at the last minute and decided to use it as DLC as opposed to altering the finished product, but regardless that shouldn't matter.  Pack it with the new copies of the game.  I mean really, did they write the story and then think to themselves "oh I know, let's have a Prothean as a downloadable character!"  Did they really think a living Prothean could be written in such a way that it could be taken to be as insignificant enough to warrant its position as a DLC character?  Please.  Nobody complained about Kasumi, nobody complained about Zaeed.  They weren't that special.  They weren't that important.  They were fun to have but you were not missing a large chunk of the story and lore without them.  Yes, I realize that you can complete the story without the Prothean: this does not make him insignificant.  The fact that he's a living member of a thought-to-be extinct race in significant enough.  And if he isn't significant enough to warrant a position on the main game, then I really have to question the competency of Bioware's ME 3 writing staff.

That said I doubt I'll cancel my CE preorder.  Partially because I still want to see the series to the end... and partially because I paid for it over BestBuy online with a pre-paid credit card and I'm not even sure if I could get my money back now without a huge hassle.  But if this is what it has come to, I'll be sure that ME 3 will be the last Bioware product I buy.

exactly this.

[Shatterhand1701]

Takamori The Templar wrote...

But w/e let the company sink, just like TORtanic.
The old fans tried to advice , but they won't listen anyway.

Wow.

I am so very embarrassed for you right now.

[nitefyre410]

Farbautisonn wrote...

Draconis6666 wrote... I guess you can wait 4+ years between decent releases from developers not owned by one of the two.

-you do realize thats what we did in the old days with bioware too?

 

also that I'm still waiting from my Kindgom Hears 3 and Final Fantasy 13  Versus...

Oh yeah and Blizzard...

"Its done when we say its done and it will be released with we say it ready."

Remeber Starcraft 2... that took 10 years.

[ArkkAngel007]

Mycrosys wrote...

I really don't think we are getting far here.

My opinion is, first day DLC is wrong if you have to pay for it. Some may say it is an extra for CE, but from what I read so far, I cannot believe that the addition of a Prothean won't have any meaningful impact on the story, knowing that they are a vital part of the story since Mass Effect 1. It needs to be in the full game. If you develop content after the game is released, fine, but don't cover it with that fake reasoning of "another team was working on it".

What do you think we are? Stupid? Do you honestly believe that we will take this and just say "ah well, if it was ANOTHER PART of Bioware that developed it, than it is alright to pay the extra money on day 1! Have my money Bioware please please take it!!"?

I have played ME1 at least 3-4 times and ME2 as well, but I think I'll pass on ME3 due to this. I just canceled my preorder. Personally I could care less for the money, I would even pay 100€ if the game is really good, but there're people out there who are on a lot tighter budget and if they give you their 50-60€, they should be able to see the whole game without things being cut out - no matter how big the game already is.

I do not know if a lot of people will join TotalBiscuit with his reasoning, but I assure you - he is not alone.

No, we're not getting anywhere.  People are too busy insulting eachother, going on pointless tangents, and trying to be clever with stupid memes and logical fallacies instead of actually discussing the issue directly to get anywhere.

And people need to stop saying it was cut.  It was developed to be DLC from the beginning.  Whether you believe it or not that it should have been included is irrelevent to the issue.  

The Prothean is also not really important in Mass Effect 3.  At a lore standpoint, of course it is significant, but so was the First Contact War, the death of the Prothean Empire, the Rachni Wars, etc.  Should he had been more available to the fans if he was "fan service"?  Yes.  That I do not and won't argue in concept.

I haven't listened to TB personally, and I'm sure he has some valid points.  But people should think for themselves instead of using one liners, memes, and someone's opinion on YouTube to shape their arguments (general to the forum, not you).

[Daywalker315]

Time Victim wrote...

Eden Prime and more alternate costumes? I'm getting giddy over here.

Yeah, me too. Lost in the shuffle of all this bickering about nonsense is the fact that we get to go back to Eden Prime with Prothy, more alternate costumes, and a new gun. I'm already thinking up all the possibilities.

[RiouHotaru]

>Everyone assumes they were working on the Prothean the entire way during ME3 development

>Casey states they finished working on ME3 in January

>DLC finished within the month or so

>Assume they were holding back the entire time

>Trying to greentext on the BSN

I'm bored, so sue me.

[GMyster]

I'm really not liking this...I'm actually starting to hate DLC

[StElmo]

I think day one DLC is very unfair to charge for new customers.

Modifié par StElmo, 23 février 2012 - 03:04 .

[Farbautisonn]

Zu Long wrote...
Yeah, but I kind of like getting my games every year or so. It would have sucked waiting four years for each ME installment.

-Not if the story was as epic and fulfilling as the games we got then was. Then those years was well worth the wait.

[Draconis6666]

BillsVengenace wrote...

BS.  The game only went gold two weeks ago.

This prothean character has been known for 3/4 of a year now.  Are you telling me that a character, a mission and a couple of rinky-dink skins take 3/4 of a year to complete? 

This type of terrible, disingenuous  PR is exactly why hate campaigns towards BioWare are started.  Not that I condone them, but they are to be expected.

Any content complete and near complete by the time the game is ready to ship should be free DLC for ALL purchasers of the game, or the game should be delayed to complete them for the disc. 

This is a vile and disgusting practise and you have no doubt lose many sales due to it. 

Yes delay a game thats already over its original deadline and spend more money so that I can have stuff I feel I am entitled to for Free that isnt required to enjoy the game

Thats what your entire argument is, you want them to delay the game further spend more money so that they can give you stuff you dont actualy need to enjoy the game because you dont want to pay for it when your in no way obligated to pay for it now.

[Yuoaman]

HighFlyingDwarf wrote...

TheOptimist wrote...

Takamori The Templar wrote...

But w/e let the company sink, just like TORtanic.
The old fans tried to advice , but they won't listen anyway.

Yeah, the TORtanic, look at how badly that flopped.

http://www.pcworld.c...es_records.html

Oh, right.  But I'm sure if they'd listened to YOUR infinite wisdom, they'd have shattered those records even MORE.

TORtanic sunk after that article was posted, that's before they went to the 1.1 patch

I'm going to need more than your word... like statistics and actual data.